Sheri Coleman, sons Garett and Gavin murdered 5-5-09, Columbia, IL. Pt9

[Kimster]

Locals:
When CC was growing up does anyone know what the general attitude towards mental illness/mental health car was in the ministry?
What are those attitudes today?

For example, are people with mental health issues shamed for their illness or for seeking medical help?

Thank you for your answers!

That's a loaded question! LOL!!!

Since I have a son with Asperger's Syndrome, I was confronted with this problem a lot as he was growing up. I learned to try my best to follow the Bible's principals in raising him - and it didn't seem to work at the time, but I kept raising him that way. However, today my son says that it DID work, and the Bible taught him how to understand society. One way of describing the Bible's method would be "behavior therapy", or making him accountable. This is also what saved Helen Keller.

The problem I had was using medication. My son literally could not attend school without using Risperdahl. I had some people, who were just trying to help, say it was not right to give him such a powerful drug. Once my son was out of high school, he chose to stop taking it and he started working on his meltdowns without it. However, when he was younger, neither one of us feels he would have been able to understand how to deal with a meltdown. Even today he suffers from them once in awhile and can't stop.

Basically, most Christians that have issues with mental illness only have a problem when the behavior from the illness is "excused" by society and consequences are not enforced. I think most people on WS feel the same way.

 

[analytical]

What about CC's lawyer, is he a "follower" of JMM or any of the related churches in that area?

No, he isn't.

 

[Kimster]

No, I wouldn't think so, but who knows. I don't really know him, just met him a few times, but he didn't appear to be a drug user. He just seemed like a normal, nice guy. QUOTE]

<snipped>

This has got to be surreal for you!

 

[Bluenotes]

Locals:
When CC was growing up does anyone know what the general attitude towards mental illness/mental health car was in the ministry?
What are those attitudes today?

For example, are people with mental health issues shamed for their illness or for seeking medical help?

Thank you for your answers!

I'm a few years younger than CC, but it seemed almost every kid I knew was on Ritalin, Adderall or some anti-anxiety drug. Doctors sure like to give out the meds. I can't answer as to how churches like the Coleman's church would respond, I've never been to one. I was raised Catholic, converted to Lutheran when I married, and my friends that went to church went to mainline churches.

 

[Bluenotes]

What about CC's lawyer, is he a "follower" of JMM or any of the related churches in that area?

I think he is Jewish.

 

[rollinon86]

Anyone know if D. Doiron was at the hearing to support CC and/or CC's mom and dad. DD was CC's best friend an Associate Pastor at Grace.

Here's a link to his picture and little bio:
d

If he was absent I think that makes a statement.

I'm pretty sure he was....this guy was sitting in the second row(two rows ahead of us and to the right) in the row with the CC supporters and he was sitting with a pretty burly looking guy...kinda big with long dark curly hair. The girl sitting next to me who was from Sparta said that he was indeed the youth pastor from the church. I asked her if that his name was DD and she said yes.

 

[rollinon86]

Thinking about the posting earlier today and also about Chris Hayes notes:

>>The girlfriend reported Coleman saying he planned to divorce Sheri May 5th. Officers found no evidence that was real Joyce Meyer does not employ people who get a divorce."

[Ron Coleman and his wife looked at each other at this point, smiling and shaking their heads in such away that they thought this was ridiculous.]<<

I'm sure that all of those who were in court could not write down everything that they heard/saw and still keep up with things if they had no laptop in court.

I'm wondering if any of those who were at the prelim saw heads bow, or tissues come out, or people start trembling on the CC side of the audience as they heard things like the time of death mentioned, the rigor status of Sheri, the ligature marks on all of them, their appearance when found, and the evidence found on Gavin. Did they show any reaction when they learned that the first threat evolved from CC's computer and was sent via his air card? Did they get shookup when they heard that the neighbor's video surveillance didn't see anyone else going to or coming from that house. Or about the hand writing samples were probably the same as that on the wall. Or about the abrasion lie?

Was the evidence so overwhelming, or their desire for delusion so high, that they "mocked" at this one, possibly questionable, divorce point?

Did they smile and shake their heads in disdain when they heard that there was no way that Sheri was alive and sleeping when Chris left at 5:43AM as he told LE?

Any of our people who were at the prelim have any comments on their behaviors during the black and white stuff?

I pretty much kept my peepers on the CC, Chief of Police, and SA with an occasional glance at RC and Connie C. I couldn't see them as well as my daughter could and I don't think she could see CC as well as I could.

I can mainly tell you that as far as CC was concerned, there were no reaction to any of the testimony. He was very unemotional. The only thing that he did was wrote on a legal pad when the Chief of Police or the SA spoke, taking notes. His attorney had handed him a legal pad and pen when he sat down at the defense table after he was uncuffed.

Any time I did get a glimpse of RC, he was paying attention to the proceedings, but I, myself never saw any emotion when they described the scene or the method of homicide. And I must say, that as I think about my grandkids and daughter-in-law(whether we were close or not)...had I heard that they had been strangled by ligature(not that it is any new revelation) and how they were found, the fact that someone had spray painted obscenities atop the beds, and that there was other evidence found atop Gavin's body, I'd have been brought to tears at that point. When I heard the the TOD is at a period that he was home, that being by his own admission, I would have crumbled. I did not see that of RC. My daughter said that he dropped his head during some parts of the testimony. I did not see that. But my vantage point, as I said, was not the best with them and my focus was mainly on CC. She also mentioned that CC's brother teared up at one point but I believe that may have been when CC was brought into the courtroom or shortly thereafter.

CC, at NO TIME, even so much as looked at those who came to support him. He only looked at the SA, the witness(Police Chief), the judge and his attorney. And I repeat: There was no emotion in this man at all. When you looked at his face, his eyes appeared what I would call "hollow", cold, emotionless and he seemed, in my assessment to be somewhat "spooky".

His lack of recognition of his family bothers me. Surely you would acknowledge your parents, brother, best friend and other family members in some small way at the very least--a nod of the head, a wave--something. But there was nothing. Why?

Well....perhaps he REALLY was concerned with helping to build his defense against all the "false accusations" and "bogus charges" that have been lodged against him and simply couldn't take a second to acknowledge all these family members and friends? Somehow... I think NOT.

Or...perhaps he's embarrassed that his family and friends are hearing things they weren't aware of prior to the hearing that point to his guilt. Perhaps it's much like a kid who got caught with his hand in the cookie jar after he was told to stay out of it because it would spoil his dinner. If I did something horrible, and I had to have my parents and family and friends hear it in a public venue and the evidence being offered really could not be refuted, I will tell you that there's no way I could look my family or friends in the eye either!

 

[overburnz]

I just posted some Chris Coleman updates on the website.
http://www.chipandco.com/?p=1035
Also KMOV found alot of pictures of Sheri. Most of them were from Sheri's Facebook.
I posted the link in another post
http://www.chipandco.com/?p=1040

Hope that helps

 

[MCDRAW]

Let's give it a couple more days but so far no one has come up with any reasonable doubt.

Think hard people, let's look at it from all angles.

I honestly can not get past time of death. I'll keep trying.

 

[SleuthyMama]

Imo I'm thinking he was not thinking of them as his kids, but as SC's kids. It just seems everything that was done was with such anger towards her. It does not take long to think of much easier, gentler ways if a person wants to kill their families. A lot less drama, many things could appear to be an accident, why did this have to be so over the top with threatning letters etc? Were the letters also meant to instill fear into her months ago so he could feel like a cat playing with a mouse?

VB

I'm not debating that CC is a very very sick individual to have murdered his entire immediate family but I truly think the threats were nothing more than something he thought he could use to to cover his azz. Meaning that in the course of working for JM I'm sure he did see her receive death threats and the like. As a narcissistic sociopath, which I truly believe he is, he saw these threats coming down the pike and I think it sparked a thought in him that he could take that same idea, apply it to his situation and use that to blame the murders on some "crazy psycho" who threatened his family.

He's a user. He reminds me of Casey Anthony. Anything that presented itself into his life that could be used to further his agenda was used. JMO, it's that simple.

 

[Blackwatch]

That's a loaded question! LOL!!!

Since I have a son with Asperger's Syndrome, I was confronted with this problem a lot as he was growing up. I learned to try my best to follow the Bible's principals in raising him - and it didn't seem to work at the time, but I kept raising him that way. However, today my son says that it DID work, and the Bible taught him how to understand society. One way of describing the Bible's method would be "behavior therapy", or making him accountable. This is also what saved Helen Keller.

The problem I had was using medication. My son literally could not attend school without using Risperdahl. I had some people, who were just trying to help, say it was not right to give him such a powerful drug. Once my son was out of high school, he chose to stop taking it and he started working on his meltdowns without it. However, when he was younger, neither one of us feels he would have been able to understand how to deal with a meltdown. Even today he suffers from them once in awhile and can't stop.

Basically, most Christians that have issues with mental illness only have a problem when the behavior from the illness is "excused" by society and consequences are not enforced. I think most people on WS feel the same way.

I appreciate your answer and commend you on your success with your son. However, you did not answer the question concerning how the ministry/church (I presume) feels about mental illness.

Originally Posted by daisy.faithfull
Locals:
When CC was growing up does anyone know what the general attitude towards mental illness/mental health car was in the ministry?
What are those attitudes today?

For example, are people with mental health issues shamed for their illness or for seeking medical help?

Thank you for your answers!

My experience was quite different. Since I was ten-years old I suffered from bipolar disease, but at that age I just thought I was "different", I didn't have any idea what really was wrong with me. When I did find out, in my forties, ministers in the "church" told me to pray, God would heal me. I heard this from more than one, Baptist, Methodist, some evangelical types. Well, I listened to the doctor and took medication despite what "men of the cloth" said. I did get well because God gave us people who discovered medications to help/cure diseases. If I had listened to "ministers" I may not have been here today. So, in ANSWER to that question, the "ministry" was not for medical intervention in mental illness, it was a stigma - they just about insisted one pray to God for healing and if He didn't, well, you were in sin of some sort. And THAT is my experience with the ministry and mental illness of any sort.

 

[Kimster]

Okay Pres, can YOU come up with anything for the defense? LOL! I keep racking my brain and I still can't think of anything! <gasp!>

 

[Kimster]

Blackwatch,

I am so sorry for how you were treated by the church! And my apologies for not being more specific on what my church family did to counsel me with my son. (BTW, his meltdowns are absolutely scary when they happen - VERY serious)

Like I said, a loaded question. The reason for that is because the church is divided on the topic. There are many who advise like you were advised, and some in my fellowship do the same. The reason is that so many drugs are administered to kids and adults that just don't want to take responsibility for their actions, and so they just "drug them" into a state where they can't make choices. But, if I would have not used meds, my son wouldn't have been able to attend school. He was that bad. And there was a time when he was on meds that made him VERY dopey. However, I did pray and ask God what to do and He led me to find other meds in smaller doses. They didn't stop the meltdowns completely, but they allowed my son to have less of them and be able to still be creative and use his amazing talents. There are some in my fellowship who don't necessarily agree with that, I'll be honest with you. But they love me and my son and respected that I earnestly sought the Lord and now the results have shown that my heart was in the right place. I didn't just want to dope him up and make it easier on myself, in other words.

Honestly, there isn't a black and white way of looking at meds in the Bible. There is a passage about drugs mentioned one time in the Old Testament and the way I read it is we are not to use them to the point of altering our minds so that we can't use the gift of choice that God gave us. Obviously you aren't doing that or you wouldn't be able to make such thoughful posts here!

The lowdown on Christianity is that we are to read the Bible everyday to see what God has for OUR lives. It is between ME and MY GOD and not anyone else. I do hope that helps...ask me more questions if you'd like! :blowkiss:

 

[Wrinkles]

Greetings Who Knew

... Oh, and WRINKLES!!! Tch...Tch...Tch - CC's nether parts? But then, of course, if we're unlucky, we'll all get to see them. After all, he was sexting - I'm sure LE has retrieved those pictures.uke:

Ugh... What a sadness to think about it... Everyone is going to be exposed to those things ... The pain of his letting this go to trial is going to be immense, not just because of those photos, but of Sheri and the children's final humiliation perpetrated by him. There will be so much more destruction.

I seriously wonder if anyone has made it clear to Chris what taking this to trial is going to cause in terms of continuing this tragedy. For what? So that he doesn't get the death penalty? So he doesn't get life without the possibility of parole? So that he gets off? Does he possibly think the latter is possible -- has his attorney convinced him that he can get him off?

After all is said and done, he will be convicted, but the wake that he will leave due to this going to trial, will only make matters far worse.

 

[Wrinkles]

Greetings JohnRodz

... I believe it was stated before that the paint was used to spray a target on the hay bales for archery. JMO

Actually, that was thrown out there by me as a possibility. I don't know that there is any truth to that for sure. It was just a thought.

 

[Kimster]

BTW, the thing about praying and not being healed means you have some unresolved sin is just hogwash!!! Paul himself, author of most of the New Testament, was not healed of his affliction. The book of Job covers this topic and anyone in the church who believes this needs be enlightened cuz it is pure hogwash!

Okay, off my soapbox now. LOL

 

[who knew?]

Greetings Who Knew



Ugh... What a sadness to think about it... Everyone is going to be exposed to those things ... The pain of his letting this go to trial is going to be immense, not just because of those photos, but of Sheri and the children's final humiliation perpetrated by him. There will be so much more destruction.

I seriously wonder if anyone has made it clear to Chris what taking this to trial is going to cause in terms of continuing this tragedy. For what? So that he doesn't get the death penalty? So he doesn't get life without the possibility of parole? So that he gets off? Does he possibly think the latter is possible -- has his attorney convinced him that he can get him off?

After all is said and done, he will be convicted, but the wake that he will leave due to this going to trial, will only make matters far worse.

BBM

I don't think he has the ability to care about anyone but himself - that includes sc's family, tl and his own family. He knows he did it - but he is so empty inside that he doesn't seem to have compassion for those left behind. I can't imagine how his family and supporters felt when he entered the courtroom and didn't acknowledge a single person there - especially his mom.

I don't think he believes he's going to get off - I'm starting to think he doesn't really care whether he does or doesn't. He's such a failure at everything in life. The only thing he WAS good at was fooling other people (conning) into believing he was someone he wasn't.

IMO, he is wacko, but these murders were not due to insanity - they were because of his selfishness. He probably does have a mental illness - but not the type that would MAKE him murder his family. It's almost like he has been living a "mountain-top" high for the last couple of years - and now that he's no longer portrayed as Mr. Perfect and all his secrets are out, he has descended into his own hell..........

 

[dgfred]

I agree completely, excellent post who.

 

[SleuthyMama]

Greetings Who Knew



Ugh... What a sadness to think about it... Everyone is going to be exposed to those things ... The pain of his letting this go to trial is going to be immense, not just because of those photos, but of Sheri and the children's final humiliation perpetrated by him. There will be so much more destruction.

I seriously wonder if anyone has made it clear to Chris what taking this to trial is going to cause in terms of continuing this tragedy. For what? So that he doesn't get the death penalty? So he doesn't get life without the possibility of parole? So that he gets off? Does he possibly think the latter is possible -- has his attorney convinced him that he can get him off?

After all is said and done, he will be convicted, but the wake that he will leave due to this going to trial, will only make matters far worse.

This sick excuse for a human being didn't care enough to let his family live. Do we really have any hope that he'll "care" enough to save everyone else the horror and harm that will come out at trial?

Again, he's a user. So if he thinks airing all his dirty laundry (and it's about to get a lot dirtier) out will help HIM in even the slightest bit.....he will allow it. And not give a rats azz what it does to anyone else.

 

[johnrodz]

Greetings JohnRodz



Actually, that was thrown out there by me as a possibility. I don't know that there is any truth to that for sure. It was just a thought.

Thank you for clarifying that, Wrinkles, I knew I had read it, but could not remember the context.