Sidebar Discussion #5

[Bravo]

I'm sure with some in the legal community this verdict was embraced. Not a Lawyer but i have a degree and i have common sense. It was never a brilliant Defense (In fact there were days i felt embarrassed for Baez). It only "became brilliant" when he won. Sad day for Lady Justice and every victim who doesn't get Justice.

 

[krkrjx]

I'm sure within some in the legal community this verdict was embraced. Not a Lawyer but i have a degree and i have common sense. It was never a brilliant Defense (In fact there were days i felt embarrassed for Baez). It only "became" brilliant" when he won. Sad day for Lady Justice and every victim who doesn't get Justice.

Yes, I agree the verdict was embraced as all "wins" are. However, this was not a win by brilliance; it was more a win by jury default. Maybe the defense attorneys' peers should be embracing the jurors in this case instead. That is, if it is even true that the "team" was embraced. I have reasonable doubt.

 

[Bravo]

Yes, I agree the verdict was embraced as all "wins" are. However, this was not a win by brilliance; it was more a win by jury default. Maybe the defense attorneys' peers should be embracing the jurors in this case instead. That is, if it is even true that the "team" was embraced. I have reasonable doubt.

It was the" perfect storm" as to what the jury was presented and then there was "the 12".

 

[Pattymarie]

Actually, most of the defense bar embraced Baez and Mason as conquering heroes after the verdict.

As a matter of fact, several prominent Florida defense attorneys proposed having Jose Baez and Cheney Mason be the keynote speakers at the 50th Anniversary Meeting of the Florida Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers.

I can't believe this. Are there any quotes, writings you can supply to support this? If this is true, it is just one more slap in the face of this horrible verdict and the tragiocomedy Baez and Mason put on to save their lunatic client.

 

[Ricki]

If JB and Masons peers embrace them and hold them up as heroes the average law abiding citizen should be frightened. If they speak on how their tactics work to free criminals, then more criminals will walk. That's all we need....criminals being set free to walk the streets and offend again and again. There is enough of them already. Makes me feel safe. Not! I guess it is not about keeping people safe. It is all about winning. Sad

 

[Well Done 99]

LOL - why do you think I am also lurking in here - sitting on hands and mumbling to self - I will not lose my temper, I will not lose my temper...:what:

:innocent:

 

[Marshmallow]

Actually, most of the defense bar embraced Baez and Mason as conquering heroes after the verdict.

As a matter of fact, several prominent Florida defense attorneys proposed having Jose Baez and Cheney Mason be the keynote speakers at the 50th Anniversary Meeting of the Florida Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers.

I guess my definition of a hero and the defense atty. community's definition vary greatly. I think I'll stick with my dictionary.

 

[heidisams]

If JB and Masons peers embrace them and hold them up as heroes the average law abiding citizen should be frightened. If they speak on how their tactics work to free criminals, then more criminals will walk. That's all we need....criminals being set free to walk the streets and offend again and again. There is enough of them already. Makes me feel safe. Not! I guess it is not about keeping people safe. It is all about winning. Sad

Yep...according to def attorney, Mark Eiglarsh, who gave us a schooling on defense 101 throughout and after the trial
(HLN legal correspondent)... That it's all about winning, getting their client off. Period.
Before this trial I knew that was their ultimate goal, but I never knew how blatant and in your face they could be. I was shocked that their ethics were acceptable, and I really thought the jury would put them in their place with the right verdict....boy, was I wrong. To me if was a double tragedy...no justice and kc walks, and the second tragedy was the defense was not held accountable for the mockery they made of our whole system. Some even turned them into heroes... JMO

 

[Ricki]

How can they sleep at night. Money and glory seem to be the factors that motivate them to defend these people even though they know they have wronged society. I guess I am cut from a different cloth, thank God. The protection and safety of others is important to me. I guess that is not the defenses job. Their job is to win know matter what. That's my opinion now anyway. I do not look up to those that won this case. Nobody won. Caylee is deceased and her mother can start all over. That's just not right.

 

[Noddy]

I am so angry that the wind of some defense lawyers could change so happily because JB and CM got away with a complete disregard for the court. The gamesmanship sucks and I can see that justice and the law are two completely separate animals. I have to post this picture again because it displays exactly what the defense thought of the court and it's procedures.

It happened during LDB's questioning of CA.

:maddening: :maddening: :maddening:

 

[logicalgirl]

Actually, most of the defense bar embraced Baez and Mason as conquering heroes after the verdict.

As a matter of fact, several prominent Florida defense attorneys proposed having Jose Baez and Cheney Mason be the keynote speakers at the 50th Anniversary Meeting of the Florida Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers.

Nice Richard, very nice. After all of your comments about how poorly both were performing during the trial? So the Defense lawyer community thinks "winning" erases everything? The defense community is echoing Charlie Sheen?

Just the thought of it makes my skin crawl.

 

[zippitydoda]

Actually, most of the defense bar embraced Baez and Mason as conquering heroes after the verdict.

As a matter of fact, several prominent Florida defense attorneys proposed having Jose Baez and Cheney Mason be the keynote speakers at the 50th Anniversary Meeting of the Florida Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers.

Oh, so they are going with a comedy theme this year...

As if there is anything to laugh about here. She was two, and her name is Caylee. It honestly hurt to read this. When does it end? Or does it ever?

 

[com n sense]

Actually, most of the defense bar embraced Baez and Mason as conquering heroes after the verdict.

As a matter of fact, several prominent Florida defense attorneys proposed having Jose Baez and Cheney Mason be the keynote speakers at the 50th Anniversary Meeting of the Florida Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers.

:banghead: What is the world coming too?
lease: So sad....

 

[Just Jayla]

I can't believe this. Are there any quotes, writings you can supply to support this? If this is true, it is just one more slap in the face of this horrible verdict and the tragiocomedy Baez and Mason put on to save their lunatic client.

I can believe it.

If lawyers are trained like doctors, they are drilled, criticised, drilled, cristicized, yelled at, then drilled some more. To build discipline. To build eye of the tiger.

Except on pro bono misdemeanor cases Then somehow a plea becomes the sought after default technique.

Anyway, If they went to law school with the intent of becoming a defense attorney, they already have the proclivity to draw the defensable from the indefensable. Their training then guides them to beat the state in the chess game and SOMETIMES they even protect Americans from the state/State. Though let's not forget that the attorneys for the state were likewise trained and if they are ethical, they are not the hand of Big Brother. Right now, Jeff Ashton is contending that Lawson Lamar did overstep in seeking the death penalty. So if defense lawyers want to applaud the fact that JB got her out of the needle room, I can appreciate that, not to write that I can stomach it. It's gross to me.
If they applaud her not serving time for the other charges, for instance neglect, which was well-proven and even offered by the defense, then they are playing the "win at all costs" chess game. And it is still founded for them, because they will say the jury has spoken and the state did not prove it.
Yes, even when there is little to prove because a murderer admits their crime, and the whole world knows she did it, they are trained, drilled, and believe in abiding what happens legally. They are very aware of the moral ramifications, they are that smart. They are not celebrating murder, well, most of them...unless they are off the reservation like Andrea Lyon and believe that everyone is a victim of circumstance and no one is accountable for their actions because some higher, unseen power is to blame.

All the same it is not shocking that the defense bar feels coocoo for KC's Cocoa Puffs. It is also not shocking that it makes sensible people angry, citizens disappointed, and victims' rights advocates stay awake at night wondering how we can change things. The good news is that citizens have more power than defense attorneys, state attorneys, and judges.

The good news is that if we want to change the way that these things go down, we can vote, we can lobby, we can change the rules of the chess game entirely. If it disgusts us that the defense bar is happy about this, then maybe Floridians ought to throw more obstacles their way and make it harder for them to celebrate the murder of a two year old. JB and CM have no great powers, they simply navigated through the situation. They didn't make the holes that got them through to the end-the people did, (Hey Floridians, maybe pass a statute changing the method of jury selection), perhaps the judge did (elected official) or perhaps Lawson Lamar did (elected official).

My personal feelings for JB, CM, DS, LKB and especially AL are in no way reflected in this post. TOS prohibit me from going there. So please don't arse-sume I am being a helper to RH. Just stating what's obvious to me so we can get on with making KC's life miserable by watching Princess Dark Triad like a hawk.

 

[Turtlepace]

Yes, I agree the verdict was embraced as all "wins" are. However, this was not a win by brilliance; it was more a win by jury default. Maybe the defense attorneys' peers should be embracing the jurors in this case instead. That is, if it is even true that the "team" was embraced. I have reasonable doubt.

The jurors did what they were instructed to do. They looked for evidence that proved that Casey killed or abused Caylee. There were only suspicions that proved nothing, and the jurors could not even determine how to prove that Caylee was killed by anyone.

 

[Turtlepace]

I am so angry that the wind of some defense lawyers could change so happily because JB and CM got away with a complete disregard for the court. The gamesmanship sucks and I can see that justice and the law are two completely separate animals. I have to post this picture again because it displays exactly what the defense thought of the court and it's procedures.

It happened during LDB's questioning of CA.

:maddening: :maddening: :maddening:

I'm glad that Casey's trial was real and not just a popularity contest. I have no doubt that Casey is unpopular, but that does not prove she murdered or abused Caylee.

 

[Turtlepace]

How can they sleep at night. Money and glory seem to be the factors that motivate them to defend these people even though they know they have wronged society. I guess I am cut from a different cloth, thank God. The protection and safety of others is important to me. I guess that is not the defenses job. Their job is to win know matter what. That's my opinion now anyway. I do not look up to those that won this case. Nobody won. Caylee is deceased and her mother can start all over. That's just not right.

Casey faced a death penalty trial for something she didn't do and she was acquitted. Caylee's being dead does not prove that Casey killed her. If she is not allowed to "start over" after facing the suspicions that didn't prove anything, what is the justice system for anyhow? A popularity contest?

 

[GracieLu]

Yep...according to def attorney, Mark Eiglarsh, who gave us a schooling on defense 101 throughout and after the trial
(HLN legal correspondent)... That it's all about winning, getting their client off. Period.
Before this trial I knew that was their ultimate goal, but I never knew how blatant and in your face they could be. I was shocked that their ethics were acceptable, and I really thought the jury would put them in their place with the right verdict....boy, was I wrong. To me if was a double tragedy...no justice and kc walks, and the second tragedy was the defense was not held accountable for the mockery they made of our whole system. Some even turned them into heroes... JMO

Yes, ME did "school" us about that didn't he. It is all about winning. The other attorney (forgot her name, whom I hated, who was on the show before NG w/the host lady who is an ex-alcoholic and animal lover, LOL, I can't remember her name either) "schooled" us as well. She was the one who stated "we don't care if your guilty or not, we don't want to know, we just want to win the case!" This makes me sad! I'm with most of you, very disgusted! JB&CM did not win this case in a way I would want to win if I were an attorney. IMO they got "lucky" with a not very smart, unwilling to work, jury... I was embarrassed for them during the trial and continue to be embarressed for them today. If other attorneys or orginazations wan't to embrace them today, I am embarressed for them as well... What a joke! Poor Caylee, she never had a chance....

I'll never forget Dorothy S's little dance at the bar after the NG verdict. She danced on Caylee's grave, imo....

 

[2goldfish]

I will say absolutely that I wont debate OCA's "innocence" on this or any forum. in my very humble opinion, if someone's looked through all evidence and watched the trial and has their conclusions, so they do. if they have NOT read all evidence and did NOT watch the trial, they should do these things before commenting in ignorance. if they DONT want to look at evidence and watch the trial, then no debate is even possible.

 

[GracieLu]

Casey faced a death penalty trial for something she didn't do and she was acquitted. Caylee's being dead does not prove that Casey killed her. If she is not allowed to "start over" after facing the suspicions that didn't prove anything, what is the justice system for anyhow? A popularity contest?

Had the jury done their job, CA would be i jail today, hopefully for the rest of her life! Caylee's being dead does not prove that Casey killed her but Casey's actions before and after the fact, prove it to me... What mother "loses" her daughter one day and goes off without a care in the world for the next 30 days?

And, yes, in my eyes Casey should not be given the chance to "start over!" I have a 7yo daughter and she gets to have wonderful birthday parties, easter bunnies, santa's, hugs from mom and dad, kisses, pets, love, love, love... All Caylee got was a toss in a garbage heap!

and if the "suspicions" prove nothing, maybe millions of notes to local prisons would be appropriate, because there are a lot of people out there convicted on far less... Let all the baby killers go free then! BARF!