Skyla Whitaker, 11, & Taylor Placker 13 - Found Murdered - #7

[cloudajo]

Only 97 of those students actually attend the school - the rest are "online" students by computer hook-up. Skyla and Tyler were in a combined class of 5th and 6th graders that was only 11 total students. Taylor was the ONLY girl in 6th grade, Skyla was one of 5 girls in the 5th grade - the combined class in 2007-2008 was 6 girls, 5 boys.

Info/Reference:
At Graham School, east of Weleetka, two grades share the same classroom. Fifth and sixth are in the same room, and physical education and computer training are the only courses outside that classroom. The students are very close.

Placker, who was the only girl in her sixth-grade class along with four boys, and Whitaker, who was in a fifth-grade class with four girls and one boy, had an incredible impact on adults

http://newsok.com/article/3255838/

The Graham School District covers 48 square miles, which includes about 600 residents. The K-12 school had 97 students last school year.

So although Graham had 97 students on campus last year, it had an average daily membership of 212 students, with some living as far away as Guymon and South Coffeyville, Chancey said.

http://newsok.com/weleetkes-no-dot-on-a-map-but-still-a-community/article/3259305/

Thanks for those additional details!

 

[Busylady]

Good point. I just can't imagine if I witnessed something like this or knew what happened I would be able to function in everyday life. The small town probably does play a role with the covering up for your own type thing. In addition to the fear of if you tell, the same thing may happen to you.

They may have, to their parents, friends, just not who they need to be talking to? Posters mentioned keeping secrets in small towns like that, covering up for their own. Also, people may be scared to even go near this if they know something. What happened to these girls is horrendous.

 

[SuziQ]

Yes. Brown said they've received offers of help from other agencies, and would contact them when necessary or something. Why wouldn't they just take those agencies up on the offer if they could add resources or specialty knowledge. They mention having to follow up on hundreds of leads and check them off the list. Why not ask for more help?

Any thoughts on why they've held off on that?

Hopefully they have asked for outside help by now and it just hasn't been reported. What I find unusual is the past few years the trend has been to bring in the FBI for resources anytime a child is murdered or kidnaped and there is no clear suspect. And this wasn't done.

 

[KR2tonenow]

I thought I read that we aren't supposed to link to another forum? It's on the In Session forum.

You can tell us what thread and number I believe.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Hearing two different weapons at the same time would most likely indicate two people. I'm interpreting her saying the first two bursts were from one weapon. Not sure of her description on the the third set.

That is my interpretation as well, Suzi. Same gun......two different times in very short order of the other.....then she seems to say it stopped and then there was another short set of gunfire.

imoo

 

[Littledeer]

Kellee:

The reports that are sent in October of each year are considered ADM's (Aka Average Daily Membership), meaning the # of students that were counted as being part of the school system for one full week in October.

It's a very complicated system that is mandated by the State Department of Education where I live. (which is not in Oklahoma). But it appears that Oklahoma is using the same criteria my state does.

They do include online students, home schooled students, even students who have not been in school that week but have a valid excuse which is in writing, etc.

THANKS FOR THE LOCAL INFORMATION!! Didn't realize how small the school population was!

 

[KR2tonenow]

Hopefully they have asked for outside help by now and it just hasn't been reported. What I find unusual is the past few years the trend has been to bring in the FBI for resources anytime a child is murdered or kidnaped and there is no clear suspect. And this wasn't done.

OSBI seems to be controlling things here.

 

[SuziQ]

Good point. I just can't imagine if I witnessed something like this or knew what happened I would be able to function in everyday life. The small town probably does play a role with the covering up for your own type thing. In addition to the fear of if you tell, the same thing may happen to you.

During my senior year of high school, I lived in town of 1000 residents. Everyone knew everyone and there was gossip. When it came to serious stuff though, people kept their mouths shut. Especially if it was about their own family. It would be too easy to track back the source of where the info came from and people don't want it tracked back to them and face the consequences.

ETA: or get their family member or friends in trouble.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Hopefully they have asked for outside help by now and it just hasn't been reported. What I find unusual is the past few years the trend has been to bring in the FBI for resources anytime a child is murdered or kidnapped and there is no clear suspect. And this wasn't done.

They usually do that though if they think the perp kidnapped the victim and took them across state lines and they were harmed or murdered elsewhere......like the FBI came into the Joesph Duncan case.

What they are usually summoned to do though is in many murder cases they assist if the fugitive is at large and could have left the state or the local police will ask for their assistance on testing the forensics found at murder scenes. The local LE and OSBI at this time must think their state forensic labs can handle this without involving the Feds.

No one can ask for their assistants but the local police who has jurisdiction over the case.

imoo

 

[Claycat]

Hi, you terrific sleuths! I have something else for you to think about. Two of the terms I got in relation to the murder were lasso and pop tarts. Those words didn't make any sense to me until today. I asked Roy, from topix, what he thought those terms might mean. (Don't discount Roy too much; he knows a lot.)

Here are his words: "in nam to lasso was to catch, pop was to kill, tarts ment kids"

"on Hill 875 , south central high lands it was a common thing to pop tarts"

I also asked him if current soldiers would use those terms. He said he didn't know. The killer, or one of the killers, might have been in the army. That would explain the use of those terms, that "he lassoed and popped the tarts"! It might also explain the weapons and the cold blooded killing. Some soldiers come back changed. (Of course, some of them might just be cold-blooded killers anyway, and that's why they went in.) I'm not down on soldiers; it's just that it could be a possibility.

 

[Annie]

Hi, you terrific sleuths! I have something else for you to think about. Two of the terms I got in relation to the murder were lasso and pop tarts. Those words didn't make any sense to me until today. I asked Roy, from topix, what he thought those terms might mean. (Don't discount Roy too much; he knows a lot.)

Here are his words: "in nam to lasso was to catch, pop was to kill, tarts ment kids"

"on Hill 875 , south central high lands it was a common thing to pop tarts"

I also asked him if current soldiers would use those terms. He said he didn't know. The killer, or one of the killers, might have been in the army. That would explain the use of those terms, that "he lassoed and popped the tarts"! It might also explain the weapons and the cold blooded killing. Some soldiers come back changed. (Of course, some of them might just be cold-blooded killers anyway, and that's why they went in.) I'm not down on soldiers; it's just that it could be a possibility.

That is quite an accusation you have made, that it was a common thing to kill kids. I don't believe it. I don't trust Roy either. He sounds just like someone I have seen on other forums after a murder is in the news, acting like he knows everything. I certainly wouldn't use his words to say something like that about our soldiers.

 

[GetSmart]

http://www.mapquest.com/maps/E1130+...2:35.376593:-96.085307:0::/io:0:::::f:EN:M:/e

mapquest.com
E1130 rd & N3890 rd
Weleetka, OK
A clearing on N3890 on the left, north of E1130 is about where the house is.
The crime occurred 400 meters north on N3890 (County Line Rd).
The bridge is about 400 meters north of the crime scene.
The bridge is not visible on the sat, but you can see where Bad Creek intesects N3890.
.

 

[Claycat]

Some soldiers are cold-blooded killers, Annie. That's a fact. They come back from war, and they kill their wives. Some have been tried for murder.

Don't forget My Lai! It does happen. There have been soldiers in Iraq who have killed children. You may not like hearing it, but it has happened.

As I stated before, I am not after soldiers, in general. I'm just wondering if the killer/killers could have been in the military.


By the way, the accusation was not mine. It was in quotes. It was what Roy, at topix, said!

 

[MissHolmes]

Thanks for that map. Would you mind pinpointing also where Bad Creek intersects? I just cant see it.

http://www.mapquest.com/maps/E1130+...2:35.376593:-96.085307:0::/io:0:::::f:EN:M:/e

mapquest.com
E1130 rd & N3890 rd
Weleetka, OK
A clearing on N3890 on the left, north of E1130 is about where the house is.
The crime occurred 400 meters north on N3890 (County Line Rd).
The bridge is about 400 meters north of the crime scene.
The bridge is not visible on the sat, but you can see where Bad Creek intesects N3890.
.

 

[FlowerChild]

That is my interpretation as well, Suzi. Same gun......two different times in very short order of the other.....then she seems to say it stopped and then there was another short set of gunfire.

imoo

If the two types of gunfire were consecutive (and not simultaneous) then it COULD BE one shooter with two weapons. Empty one gun, then go to the 2nd gun and continue shooting. Just because the ear-witness heard two distinct guns being shot, it would only indicate (for sure) two shooters if the guns were BOTH fired at the same time. Hearing one type of shots, followed by a different sounding type of shots only verifies what OSBI has said - the girls were EACH shot with two different guns.

And the sound of a shotgun is very different than a rifle or a handgun/pistol - the sound is distinctive. I haven't regularly been around guns being shot in years, but I can still tell the difference in a shot from a shotgun and a rifle or a pistol, and if I can hear the shots clearly, the difference between a rifle and a handgun or pistol.

Fully automatic weapon fire is also different - especially different if it's an AK-47 type weapon. And rapid fire from a shotgun (several shots, as in more than 2 in quick succession) isn't realistic. An automatic weapon fires multiple shots with one trigger pull without "cocking" the gun - so long as the trigger remains depressed, the gun continues to shoot until the bullets are gone - vs say a semi-automatic or a revolver, revolvers have to be manually cocked but both types shoot one bullet with each pull of the trigger until the bullets are gone. The SPEED at which the semi-automatic or automatic weapon fires each bullet depends on the gun - an AK 47 is fully automatic and also fires very fast and has a larger supply of ammunition, a revolver or standard rifle is slower with more time between each shot. A standard automatic weapon - like a pistol, usually has 6-8 bullets in a normal clip pushed upward into the barrel from the handle. A revolver has 5 or 6 held at the barrel that are manually rotated into position. An automatic rifle operates the same - it fires continuously so long as the trigger remains depressed - whereas a regular rifle must be cocked 1st (to load the bullet into firing position) before shooting.

And if OSBI is talking about bullet casings (literally) at least one of the guns had to be NOT a shotgun. Bullet casings are not found from a shotgun (shells are).

And that's all I know...
My Opinion

 

[oceanblueeyes]

If the two types of gunfire were consecutive (and not simultaneous) then it COULD BE one shooter with two weapons. Empty one gun, then go to the 2nd gun and continue shooting. Just because the ear-witness heard two distinct guns being shot, it would only indicate (for sure) two shooters if the guns were BOTH fired at the same time. Hearing one type of shots, followed by a different sounding type of shots only verifies what OSBI has said - the girls were EACH shot with two different guns.

And the sound of a shotgun is very different than a rifle or a handgun/pistol - the sound is distinctive. I haven't regularly been around guns being shot in years, but I can still tell the difference in a shot from a shotgun and a rifle or a pistol, and if I can hear the shots clearly, the difference between a rifle and a handgun or pistol.

Fully automatic weapon fire is also different - especially different if it's an AK-47 type weapon. And rapid fire from a shotgun (several shots, as in more than 2 in quick succession) isn't realistic. An automatic weapon fires multiple shots with one trigger pull without "cocking" the gun - so long as the trigger remains depressed, the gun continues to shoot until the bullets are gone - vs say a semi-automatic or a revolver, revolvers have to be manually cocked but both types shoot one bullet with each pull of the trigger until the bullets are gone. The SPEED at which the semi-automatic or automatic weapon fires each bullet depends on the gun - an AK 47 is fully automatic and also fires very fast and has a larger supply of ammunition, a revolver or standard rifle is slower with more time between each shot. A standard automatic weapon - like a pistol, usually has 6-8 bullets in a normal clip pushed upward into the barrel from the handle. A revolver has 5 or 6 held at the barrel that are manually rotated into position. An automatic rifle operates the same - it fires continuously so long as the trigger remains depressed - whereas a regular rifle must be cocked 1st (to load the bullet into firing position) before shooting.

And if OSBI is talking about bullet casings (literally) at least one of the guns had to be NOT a shotgun. Bullet casings are not found from a shotgun (shells are).

And that's all I know...
My Opinion

That is what I said. These weapons........neither one of them......are shotguns. Shotguns do not have bullets therefore they do not have bullet casings they have empty shotgun shells.

Yes, it seems to me to be one shooter. First round of rapid fire to one victim followed by another round of rapid fire to the second victim using same weapon followed by a pause then a short burst of less shots. (most likely the second weapon)

imoo

 

[ConfusedPopsicle]

I would think that the people in the area would know at least what type of shots they were hearing. Maybe I am being stereotypical and judgmental, but it seems like in the south people KNOW their guns lol. I am a west coast transplant in Texas (married a Texan) and in the 7 years that I have lived here I have learned a lot about guns. Shotguns do have a very distinctive sound, I think that even someone that didn't know anything about guns would recognize the sound of a shotgun...or at least describe it in a way that anyone that knows anything about guns would know what they were talking about. Anyways, I haven't been following this case as closely from the beginning as some of y'all have (I'm trying to catch up lol) but it sounds to me like they could have been shot first in the chest by a semi-automatic rifle or handgun, and then in the head with a handgun. Wasn't it said that they were killed with handguns? That could very well be the case, without LE saying TOO MUCH info..because if everything happened as quickly as it seems..the shots to the head would have been the ones that actually killed them even though the shots to the chest were fatal as well ( I figure). Sorry if all of this has been said before, like I said I'm still trying to catch up on everything! :loser:

 

[evelyn24]

That is what I said. These weapons........neither one of them......are shotguns. Shotguns do not have bullets therefore they do not have bullet casings they have empty shotgun shells.

Yes, it seems to me to be one shooter. First round of rapid fire to one victim followed by another round of rapid fire to the second victim using same weapon followed by a pause then a short burst of less shots. (most likely the second weapon)

imoo

Yep, you've been saying this since you heard what the ear witness said.
Thanks for all the information, because I had no idea about shotgun shells vs casings.
Also, I agree, it's one shooter. I have no idea why LE keeps saying most likely two shooters?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Some soldiers are cold-blooded killers, Annie. That's a fact. They come back from war, and they kill their wives. Some have been tried for murder.

Don't forget My Lai! It does happen. There have been soldiers in Iraq who have killed children. You may not like hearing it, but it has happened.

As I stated before, I am not after soldiers, in general. I'm just wondering if the killer/killers could have been in the military.


By the way, the accusation was not mine. It was in quotes. It was what Roy, at topix, said!

I don't put much stock in that Claycat. I would take my chances any day with a military person. In a 5 year study that was aired on CNN recently of those who have returned from Iraq, 127 have been accused of murder during that entire time. I don't remember any cases where a military man murdered a stranger child. Usually these crimes are domestic in nature.

Now how many murders have been committed in the USA by the ordinary public citizens in a 5 year time span? Thousands upon thousands!

So I think it is much more logical to think this is just another cold, unfeeling, that we have lurking in our society today.

JMO tho.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I would think that the people in the area would know at least what type of shots they were hearing. Maybe I am being stereotypical and judgmental, but it seems like in the south people KNOW their guns lol. I am a west coast transplant in Texas (married a Texan) and in the 7 years that I have lived here I have learned a lot about guns. Shotguns do have a very distinctive sound, I think that even someone that didn't know anything about guns would recognize the sound of a shotgun...or at least describe it in a way that anyone that knows anything about guns would know what they were talking about. Anyways, I haven't been following this case as closely from the beginning as some of y'all have (I'm trying to catch up lol) but it sounds to me like they could have been shot first in the chest by a semi-automatic rifle or handgun, and then in the head with a handgun. Wasn't it said that they were killed with handguns? That could very well be the case, without LE saying TOO MUCH info..because if everything happened as quickly as it seems..the shots to the head would have been the ones that actually killed them even though the shots to the chest were fatal as well ( I figure). Sorry if all of this has been said before, like I said I'm still trying to catch up on everything! :loser:

Welcome aboard, ConfusedPopsicle!

Yes even a non knowing person would have described the shots differently if it had been a shotgun. That loud BOOM usually gets people's attention quick.

I am not sure the handguns have been verified. The only one I can remember talking about it was Mark Furham and maybe he was just surmising because of the comments about lower power and higher power weapon.

imoo