South Africa - Martin, 55, Theresa, 54, Rudi van Breda, 22, murdered, 26 Jan 2015 #2
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JudgeJudi
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Estelle, I couldn’t find your post but I found the quote you’re looking for. This is a lengthy interview given by Marli’s aunt, Narita du Toit, to YOU magazine. The entire article is worth reading.
“Marli was the first to arrive in November (2015) ... Martin and Teresa arrived on 1 December and Henri followed some days later. Rudi ... flew over in mid-December”. I was unaware that Marli arrived then or that her parents arrived less than 2 weeks before Rudi.
“Yes, he’d gone for a brain scan but that was because he often had headaches. It turned out to be only a spot on his brain”.
“To this day [article published on 27 August 2015] the police haven’t said Henri’s regarded as a suspect – he was always just considered as an eye-witness”.
“He was being treated as a witness and was under police guard and not allowed to speak to anyone”.
“The family rallied around when speculation that Henri was involved in the attack started”.
“The part of the brain that controls emotions was injured but the analytical side escaped unharmed”.
https://www.pressreader.com/south-africa/you-south-africa/20150827/283046938218654
The next article was published on 7 February 2015, less than 2 weeks after the murders.
“Henri’s uncle, Andre van Breda, said that his nephew was “heartbroken” and had engaged a legal team.
Though a friend said police were reluctant to let him attend, Henri was at the service but was kept well away from the media.
Mr van Breda told The Times: “For obvious reasons Henri is very heartbroken, and we will support him as the family. We as a family are here for him, we will not disappoint him... I promise Henri I won’t drop him.”
Aunt Narita sure knows how to spell a good yarn. Um, why would HvB hire a legal team so quickly if he wasn’t a suspect, and why would Uncle Andre van Breda “promise I won’t drop him”. This smacks of Uncle Arnold and Aunt Lois all over again.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/marli-van-breda-girl-brain-damaged-5120480
Estelle, I couldn’t find your post but I found the quote you’re looking for. This is a lengthy interview given by Marli’s aunt, Narita du Toit, to YOU magazine. The entire article is worth reading.
“Marli was the first to arrive in November (2015) ... Martin and Teresa arrived on 1 December and Henri followed some days later. Rudi ... flew over in mid-December”. I was unaware that Marli arrived then or that her parents arrived less than 2 weeks before Rudi.
“Yes, he’d gone for a brain scan but that was because he often had headaches. It turned out to be only a spot on his brain”.
“To this day [article published on 27 August 2015] the police haven’t said Henri’s regarded as a suspect – he was always just considered as an eye-witness”.
“He was being treated as a witness and was under police guard and not allowed to speak to anyone”.
“The family rallied around when speculation that Henri was involved in the attack started”.
“The part of the brain that controls emotions was injured but the analytical side escaped unharmed”.
https://www.pressreader.com/south-africa/you-south-africa/20150827/283046938218654
The next article was published on 7 February 2015, less than 2 weeks after the murders.
“Henri’s uncle, Andre van Breda, said that his nephew was “heartbroken” and had engaged a legal team.
Though a friend said police were reluctant to let him attend, Henri was at the service but was kept well away from the media.
Mr van Breda told The Times: “For obvious reasons Henri is very heartbroken, and we will support him as the family. We as a family are here for him, we will not disappoint him... I promise Henri I won’t drop him.”
Aunt Narita sure knows how to spell a good yarn. Um, why would HvB hire a legal team so quickly if he wasn’t a suspect, and why would Uncle Andre van Breda “promise I won’t drop him”. This smacks of Uncle Arnold and Aunt Lois all over again.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/marli-van-breda-girl-brain-damaged-5120480
JudgeJudi
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And starts late, sometimes very late like today.
JudgeJudi
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Oh Tortoise, dontcha know, he had a couple of mozzie bites and his fingernail caused the microscopic scratches.
JudgeJudi
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There's an interesting comment at the foot of the article.
https://www.enca.com/south-africa/forensic-analyst-battles-to-link-van-breda-to-attack-on-sister
https://www.enca.com/south-africa/forensic-analyst-battles-to-link-van-breda-to-attack-on-sister
Very interesting, but his comment is still annoyingly vague! Why wouldn't he have been given the opportunity to explain his findings during his evidence in chief, if not under cross-exam? I was not impressed by him, and I don't think he should be commenting on news articles either, it just seems to be a matter of a wounded ego there.
I had actually wondered myself if he'd cut his hair but also queried how likely it was that he would know a hair was in Marli's fist, and if he did, he could have just removed it.
I've transcribed the first part of the plea explanation. I'm going to stick my neck out and say there are clues in here that he was seriously resentful of his whole family and disliked everything about his life. I've bolded the parts that stick out as showing his resentment and distance from family. It's difficult to explain why but it's like it is stilted and his coldness, disdain and judgement comes across, as if he felt he wasn't a consideration in his parents' lives.
Also interesting to note that he finished school in 2013 but didn't start uni for another whole year (unless terms are different in Aus to the UK), and dropped out of uni after the first year. I take from this that he couldn't hack the course and could have been resentful of Rudi for not having the same problems with his degree. I've no idea if 17/18 is normal for matriculation.
His use of the word 'temporarily' and 'gap year' for halting his studies is a deception, because he upped and moved continents, and then said his intentions were to do a scuba diving course, avoiding saying anything further about his studies. I think he's totally made up the part about scuba diving (based on his deceptive personality and because he felt a need to say there was a plan and life was good) and he had no idea what he was going to do. Physics to scuba-diving seems to me like chalk and cheese - someone who is saying I can play now because my family isn't here to judge me.
----
My oldest brother Rudi was born on 10[SUP]th[/SUP] July 1992. Subsequently two further children were born from the union. I was born on 1[SUP]st[/SUP] November 1994 and my sister Marli on 12[SUP]th[/SUP] October 1998. All three of us were born in Pretoria. I commenced my schooling at Woodhill College, Pretoria during January 2001 [age 6]. In the beginning of 2006 [age 11] our family emigrated to Perth, Australia. Here I was involved as a grade 6 learner at the Loreto Primary School. In 2007 [age 12/13] I transferred to Scotch College where I eventually matriculated in 2012 [age 17/18].
In 2011 Rudi took up his tertiary studies at the University of Melbourne studying mechanical engineering and in 2013 [age 18/19] I enrolled at the same university to study physics. During that year our family moved from Perth to [G ?]
During January 2014 my parents and Marli moved back to South Africa where they initially resided in Gordons Bay. Rudi and I accompanied them but we only stayed in South Africa for the duration of a university break whereafter we returned to Melbourne, Australia. My parents and Marlis relocation occurred principally because my father had launched a new school project in South Africa which he labelled Edugrow. This venture had grown and was increasingly demanding his full and undivided attention. In addition, my mother missed her family and she yearned to be closer to them. At that juncture Rudi and I remained in Melbourne as we were still busy with our respective studies.
In 2014 my parents enrolled Marli at Somerset College. During about March 2014 my parents and Marli moved from Gordons Bay to 12 Goske Street, De Zalze Golf Winelands Estate. Towards the middle of 2014 I temporarily halted my studies at the University of Melbourne with a view of taking a gap year. Subsequently in August 2014 I also moved to De Zalze where I joined my parents and Marli. In December 2014 Rudi came to visit us at the family home in De Zalze for the summer holiday during his university break. He was set to return to Melbourne to recommence his studies at the end of February 2015. At that juncture I intended to attend a scuba diving course at the start of 2015 on the north coast of Natal. [Part missing...theyd? or that?] enjoyed doing things together. We especially enjoyed doing outdoor activities as a family, like shark-cage diving, boating, water-skiing and fishing.
Also interesting to note that he finished school in 2013 but didn't start uni for another whole year (unless terms are different in Aus to the UK), and dropped out of uni after the first year. I take from this that he couldn't hack the course and could have been resentful of Rudi for not having the same problems with his degree. I've no idea if 17/18 is normal for matriculation.
His use of the word 'temporarily' and 'gap year' for halting his studies is a deception, because he upped and moved continents, and then said his intentions were to do a scuba diving course, avoiding saying anything further about his studies. I think he's totally made up the part about scuba diving (based on his deceptive personality and because he felt a need to say there was a plan and life was good) and he had no idea what he was going to do. Physics to scuba-diving seems to me like chalk and cheese - someone who is saying I can play now because my family isn't here to judge me.
----
My oldest brother Rudi was born on 10[SUP]th[/SUP] July 1992. Subsequently two further children were born from the union. I was born on 1[SUP]st[/SUP] November 1994 and my sister Marli on 12[SUP]th[/SUP] October 1998. All three of us were born in Pretoria. I commenced my schooling at Woodhill College, Pretoria during January 2001 [age 6]. In the beginning of 2006 [age 11] our family emigrated to Perth, Australia. Here I was involved as a grade 6 learner at the Loreto Primary School. In 2007 [age 12/13] I transferred to Scotch College where I eventually matriculated in 2012 [age 17/18].
In 2011 Rudi took up his tertiary studies at the University of Melbourne studying mechanical engineering and in 2013 [age 18/19] I enrolled at the same university to study physics. During that year our family moved from Perth to [G ?]
During January 2014 my parents and Marli moved back to South Africa where they initially resided in Gordons Bay. Rudi and I accompanied them but we only stayed in South Africa for the duration of a university break whereafter we returned to Melbourne, Australia. My parents and Marlis relocation occurred principally because my father had launched a new school project in South Africa which he labelled Edugrow. This venture had grown and was increasingly demanding his full and undivided attention. In addition, my mother missed her family and she yearned to be closer to them. At that juncture Rudi and I remained in Melbourne as we were still busy with our respective studies.
In 2014 my parents enrolled Marli at Somerset College. During about March 2014 my parents and Marli moved from Gordons Bay to 12 Goske Street, De Zalze Golf Winelands Estate. Towards the middle of 2014 I temporarily halted my studies at the University of Melbourne with a view of taking a gap year. Subsequently in August 2014 I also moved to De Zalze where I joined my parents and Marli. In December 2014 Rudi came to visit us at the family home in De Zalze for the summer holiday during his university break. He was set to return to Melbourne to recommence his studies at the end of February 2015. At that juncture I intended to attend a scuba diving course at the start of 2015 on the north coast of Natal. [Part missing...theyd? or that?] enjoyed doing things together. We especially enjoyed doing outdoor activities as a family, like shark-cage diving, boating, water-skiing and fishing.
Interested Bystander
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Very interesting JJ and Tortoise. You know my feelings on the probability. Perhaps he gave himself a haircut with a hair trimmer. A surprising number of homes have one, including mine, and it is so simple to run the trimmer through with one of the comb attachments. If it was the same length all over I would be very suspicious but I am suspicious of everything about him.
It does sound as though the forensic guy was very miffed. Somebody ought to ask Bianca but she might well lie, I suppose. She last saw him at tea time on the evening preceding the murders. Other than the family, she must have been the last to see him. Another possibility is that Marli may remember whether his hair was very short or not. If she can recall the family meal there is a slim chance although she may well not figure in the case due to her amnesia.
JudgeJudi
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If you go to AM's Twitter a/c you can view the handwritten report by Dr Michelle Van Zyl:
Anthony Molyneaux‏ @AJGMolyneaux · 20h20 hours ago
#VanBreda This is the written report of Henri's injuries after the axe murders at his home. @TimesLIVE
https://twitter.com/ajgmolyneaux?lang=en
Anthony Molyneaux‏ @AJGMolyneaux · 20h20 hours ago
#VanBreda This is the written report of Henri's injuries after the axe murders at his home. @TimesLIVE
https://twitter.com/ajgmolyneaux?lang=en
JudgeJudi
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JudgeJudi
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Dr Marianne Tiemensma returns to the stand.
Two types of causes for fainting - one an emotional shock or trauma, the other is medical reasons, Adv Galloway says.
Fainting is a brief loss of consciousnesses, Tiemensma explains.
Emotional shock resulting in fainting is stress, lightheaded, fast heartbeat, resulting in you passing out and losing consciousness.
Average duration is a couple of seconds to a minute at most. Low blood pressure increases once you fall to the ground.
Not a serious medical condition. It corrects itself.
http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/live-van-breda-axe-murder-trial-day-16-20170523
Two types of causes for fainting - one an emotional shock or trauma, the other is medical reasons, Adv Galloway says.
Fainting is a brief loss of consciousnesses, Tiemensma explains.
Emotional shock resulting in fainting is stress, lightheaded, fast heartbeat, resulting in you passing out and losing consciousness.
Average duration is a couple of seconds to a minute at most. Low blood pressure increases once you fall to the ground.
Not a serious medical condition. It corrects itself.
http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/live-van-breda-axe-murder-trial-day-16-20170523
JudgeJudi
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Adv Botha interjects, says according to the facts, Henri didn't lose consciousness due to blood loss.
[She was referring to emotional shock not blood loss]
http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/live-van-breda-axe-murder-trial-day-16-20170523
[She was referring to emotional shock not blood loss]
http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/live-van-breda-axe-murder-trial-day-16-20170523
JudgeJudi
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Tiemensma says concussion is a mild brain injury, loss of consciousness for a couple of seconds at most. But more than 90% of concussions doesn't result in loss of consciousness, she explains.
[I'm loving this doctor. I can't see how HvB's medicos can contradict this, but Botha will try.]
Adv Botha objects, saying Tiemensma's evidence is neurology. Galloway argues it's general medical terminology.
[Hahaha, he did]
http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/live-van-breda-axe-murder-trial-day-16-20170523
[I'm loving this doctor. I can't see how HvB's medicos can contradict this, but Botha will try.]
Adv Botha objects, saying Tiemensma's evidence is neurology. Galloway argues it's general medical terminology.
[Hahaha, he did]
http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/live-van-breda-axe-murder-trial-day-16-20170523
JudgeJudi
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[So Botha is trying to suggest only a neurologist is qualified enough to explain why someone faints. He must really be desperate.]
Tiemensma says concussion will usually result in loss of consciousness for less than a minute.
If for hours or more than a few minutes, its in keeping with a more serious injury, may show through severe headache, nausea and vomiting, needs to be evaluated medically.
Concussions have grades. Sometimes symptoms last for a minute or more, sometimes up to a week. If mild, its usually short term.
Tiemensma compiled a report with notes by Dr Albertse.
She explained his mental health and emotional status as very quiet. She didn't appear to note any further concussion-like symptoms,
http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/live-van-breda-axe-murder-trial-day-16-20170523
Tiemensma says concussion will usually result in loss of consciousness for less than a minute.
If for hours or more than a few minutes, its in keeping with a more serious injury, may show through severe headache, nausea and vomiting, needs to be evaluated medically.
Concussions have grades. Sometimes symptoms last for a minute or more, sometimes up to a week. If mild, its usually short term.
Tiemensma compiled a report with notes by Dr Albertse.
She explained his mental health and emotional status as very quiet. She didn't appear to note any further concussion-like symptoms,
http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/live-van-breda-axe-murder-trial-day-16-20170523
JudgeJudi
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Reasons for describing some of his injuries as possibly self-inflicted injuries - if you look at the type of wounds, they are superficial and non-fatal. Only danger to life is if it becomes infected.
Regular and equal depth, uniform, linear, no movement in the wounds, parallel, equally deep. They don't differ in depth.
Deeper entrance and become more shallow is more typical if someone is stabbed by another person.
Self inflicted wounds usually find on chest, abdomen, arms or hands.
http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/live-van-breda-axe-murder-trial-day-16-20170523
Regular and equal depth, uniform, linear, no movement in the wounds, parallel, equally deep. They don't differ in depth.
Deeper entrance and become more shallow is more typical if someone is stabbed by another person.
Self inflicted wounds usually find on chest, abdomen, arms or hands.
http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/live-van-breda-axe-murder-trial-day-16-20170523
JudgeJudi
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[Botha will be absolutely hating this evidence]
In this instance, it took place in the bedroom, at the foot of the bed, Galloway says.
Tiemensma say two people faced each other with sharp objects in hands. Pushing and pulling. Holding on to each other would make it difficult to execute very uniform incision to another person's body.
Would expect wounds in different directions if person pulls away.
Wounds to thorax and abdomen seem to have a stabbing action, not slicing. Still very superficial. Description of how sustained doesn't fit in with the physical injury.
http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/live-van-breda-axe-murder-trial-day-16-20170523
In this instance, it took place in the bedroom, at the foot of the bed, Galloway says.
Tiemensma say two people faced each other with sharp objects in hands. Pushing and pulling. Holding on to each other would make it difficult to execute very uniform incision to another person's body.
Would expect wounds in different directions if person pulls away.
Wounds to thorax and abdomen seem to have a stabbing action, not slicing. Still very superficial. Description of how sustained doesn't fit in with the physical injury.
http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/live-van-breda-axe-murder-trial-day-16-20170523
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