Suffolk homicide chief: New look at Gilgo - Newsday article 3/9/12

[NJGuy]

Essentially, if you are a pimp, gang member, trafficker, coyote, mafia, etc. You most likely would not be posting on those review sites, and if you did, you most definitely would not be posting how a girl will be taken care of.

 

[Samantha Spade]

Thanks for the reply NJguy and your insights. Amber was working in a business that did expose her to a lot of dangerous types of men, unfortunately. And it is very possible that her death had nothing to do with the LIErotic threat. I wonder if LE were ever able to identify that John and find out just who his buddies were.

 

[KPCrimeNY]

Originally Posted by NJGuy
"Except dead women are of no use to traffickers. Traffickers make money off of girls working and selling and transporting. If you think this is a trafficking angle, you're way off base"

But NJGuy, According to reports I've read 3 of the girls found in burlap (Maureen, Melissa, and Megan)and including Shannan Gilbert, stated to family and friends, that they wanted out of the business. Human traffickers (also known as pimps and romeo pimps) tend to see "their girls" as their possessions. And have been known to go to extreme measures to keep them as their possessions, dead or alive. Am I wrong? Personally, I have no emotions invested in whether the killer is an sk or a sadistic pimp. I'd be happy to be wrong as long as they get him and lock him up forever.

Samantha,
I've been struggling with this link for a while myself.

First of all when this all came to light and the families, lawyers and groups showed up the first one on the scene if I remember correctly was someone working against sex trafficking, working with SG's family. This stuck out to me when it happened for some reason. Maybe the prostituion is the obvious link but, it stuck out.

Also, a couple of the girls GB4 & SG had at one point worked with a agency and went solo. I know what we have heard and who has said what but, without knowing it from the girls themselves I don't believe the guys and the so called "relationships"

SG,PAK & AD
SG's part is obvious.
PAK we know his history and they worked together for a known agency. They both leave and he is her driver. AD he's just a BF that got mad and broke her jaw one night. Sorry not buying girl working independent and not buying some people wouldn't be mad.

MW and AC.
Obvious and Obvious.
Not obvious. Was it really independent? Was AC not answering to nobody? If he was running his own, did he work for someone else before? Are there now people out there that may be mad at him or his business?

AC and DS.
AC we know from A&E started with a business and went out on her own.
DS I'm not buying as Pimp per say. But, he was not innocent and I am sure he benefited one way or another. AC had made enemies online and had she left aagency. Again people left behind to be mad.

Just my opinions and thoughts. Drawing blank on the other two girls

 

[Samantha Spade]

KPCrimeNY,

Yes. That woman you recall is Dottie Laster.
Here is a link to MS mag. There is an article about her and her mission to fight Human Trafficking here. I recall she did mention that she thought there was a connection, at least pertaining to Shannan Gilbert's disappearance (they hadn't found her yet at the time.)
http://msmagazine.com/blog/blog/tag/dottie-laster/

 

[Samantha Spade]

Here's a snippet from that MS article that mentions Dottie: "But Department of Justice-certified human-trafficking consultant Dottie Laster is not so sure that a sexually motivated serial killer is behind the murders. She worries that officials may be misidentifying the handiwork of sex traffickers. Laster, who has trained more than 5,000 police officers on recognizing and combating trafficking, was hired as part of a team to assist the Waterman family in locating their daughter, Megan, whose body was found in the marsh in December. She has since starting working with the family of Shannan Gilbert, whose disappearance in Long Island last May is believed to be connected with the murders.

According to Laster, Gilbert and Waterman have the characteristics of trafficking victims–those who are forced or scammed into the service of another for labor or commercial sex. If they were, it could offer another explanation for the murders: Traffickers operate through threats of violence and even murder, which they may follow through on to set an example, especially when victims try to get away.

“We have women from different parts of the Northeast who were drawn there through the same mechanism–posting on Craigslist for prostitution. Like a funnel that brought them there,” says Laster.

Beyond shared geography, there are other red flags that suggest human trafficking. First, says Laster, both Waterman and Gilbert had “boyfriends” who fit the model of “Romeo pimps,” men who target women for prostitution using the guise of a romantic relationship. Both women had boyfriends who isolated them from friends, appeared to be benefiting from their sex work, and used violence to keep them prostituting:


Megan’s young daughter reports witnessing Megan being beaten, and being threatened and beaten in order to keep Megan prostituting. Traffickers often threaten a loved one because it works. What we perceive as normal doesn’t apply in this world. Megan didn’t have control of her safety or her daughter’s safety."

 

[Seaslug44]

NJguy,
Understood and you make a good point. Though have you considered a connection to Amber Costello's murder and the LongIslanderotic post by a man who said that he had friends who would take care of her. Then poof, she was gone. That coincidence makes me hang on to the belief that these girls (atleast the girls found in burlap: Maureen, Melissa, Megan, AND AMBER) were killed by a man or a group of men, who made it known that he took care of the women that got out of line. I know, it could be just a coincidence that that LIerotic poster threatened Ambers life and then she disappears and is found dead in burlap months later. But I'm finding it very hard to accept that it's just a coincidence. And her death is definitely connected in some way to the other three if just by the burlap and location of her remains alone. Please let me know your thoughts on that. I am very open to all theories, even those that strongly differ from mine. Many times people bring up points I never even considered and which blow my theory right out of the water.

This angle is certainly worth a second look...

The online threats first started on July 11 2010 when a message board member using the name Humiliatrix69 raged that he had been ‘suckered’ by Miss Costello in the alleged incident at her home in West Babylon, New York.
‘Seemed really friendly,’ his angry post read. ‘Provided the donation. She slipped away and got comfortable, and so did I. Then there was a knock at the door.’

Humiliatrix69 claimed two men, one of whom said he was Miss Costello’s boyfriend, rushed at him armed with baseball bats before fighting with him on the front lawn.
‘I made it clear that it wasn't over, so after posting this... I gotta go handle this,’ he wrote.
Shortly after, a fellow member called italyrider asked for her address and posted: ‘No one from this board needs to be involved. I have friends who can take care of this s**t.’Humiliatrix69 replied with Miss Costello's address, a description of her home, and her phone number.
He also shared raunchy pictures that he had taken from her advert on newyorkbackpage.com where she advertised herself as a ‘Southern girl’ named ‘Carolina’, who was ‘short, sexy & a lot of fun’.

Humiliatrix69 wrote on the forums: ‘I want to be spiteful and get revenge, I will go by there tonight.
‘I could seriously do some time for the things I want to do to this provider and her boyfriend.’
But he then admitted to having cold feet and said revenge would not be worth it.

Three days later, another member using the nickname Morrie wrote: ‘A friend of ours told me today that “You won't hear from those 2 girls anymore!”’

Humiliatrix69 replied: ‘Thanks for all the help.’

On January 24, the message board exploded with talk about Miss Costello again after Suffolk County Police announced the identities of the ‘Craigslist ripper’ victims.
Humiliatrix69 wrote: ‘Hey, I posted my experience in frustration and anger cause I got ripped off, but I wouldn't wish death on no one.’
He added, ‘Hate to say it, karma is truly a b****.’
The homepage of Longislanderotic.com lists it as a place for ‘escorts, adult entertainment, massage parlors, strip clubs, sex.’
Joseph Palminteri, 63, who lived across the street from Miss Costello’s home, told a U.S. newspaper that the police were called to the home ‘too many times to count’.
‘It was always something. Lots of screaming, lots of yelling, lots of drugs,’ he told the Daily News.
‘Sometime last July a naked man was banging on my door at 10 at night. He came from [Miss Costello's] house. He was screaming, “Don't let them kill me! He's going to kill me!”’

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...s-killed-Craigslist-ripper.html#ixzz1paTfpbGT

 

[Samantha Spade]

Thank you for posting that information SeaSlug.

NJGuy said, "Essentially, if you are a pimp, gang member, trafficker, coyote, mafia, etc. You most likely would not be posting on those review sites, and if you did, you most definitely would not be posting how a girl will be taken care of. "


NJGuy, You got me thinking. Maybe Italyrider is the "John" who killed Amber. He asked for her address. Who knows if he passed that info onto others or is really the SK responsible for not only Amber's death, but Megan's, Maureen's and Melissa's. The SK was knowledgeable enough to avoid getting caught using cellphones. Maybe he was knowledgeable enough to avoid being tracked down on the computer by using an anonymous proxy server.

 

[Samantha Spade]

And isn't italyrider some type of motorcycle?
Don't they have motorcycle meets near Oak Beach along Ocean Parkway?

 

[Redbird]

Thank you for posting that information SeaSlug.

NJGuy said, "Essentially, if you are a pimp, gang member, trafficker, coyote, mafia, etc. You most likely would not be posting on those review sites, and if you did, you most definitely would not be posting how a girl will be taken care of. "


NJGuy, You got me thinking. Maybe Italyrider is the "John" who killed Amber. He asked for her address. Who knows if he passed that info onto others or is really the SK responsible for not only Amber's death, but Megan's, Maureen's and Melissa's. The SK was knowledgeable enough to avoid getting caught using cellphones. Maybe he was knowledgeable enough to avoid being tracked down on the computer by using an anonymous proxy server.

If Italyrider was the killer of Amber, how did he know to put her body with the other girls and wrap her in burlap?

 

[NJGuy]

Thank you for posting that information SeaSlug.

NJGuy said, "Essentially, if you are a pimp, gang member, trafficker, coyote, mafia, etc. You most likely would not be posting on those review sites, and if you did, you most definitely would not be posting how a girl will be taken care of. "


NJGuy, You got me thinking. Maybe Italyrider is the "John" who killed Amber. He asked for her address. Who knows if he passed that info onto others or is really the SK responsible for not only Amber's death, but Megan's, Maureen's and Melissa's. The SK was knowledgeable enough to avoid getting caught using cellphones. Maybe he was knowledgeable enough to avoid being tracked down on the computer by using an anonymous proxy server.

Samantha, now you got me thinking. I believe it is possible that the SK trolled the review sites etc. and stumbled upon Amber's run in with 'Italyrider' and went off and his own to set something up with Amber and then kill her like th rest. I think, it is at least conceivable the SK independently killed Amber after reading the review site and complaints against her. Personally, I'm not sure I believe this, but I think it's worth a look

 

[NJGuy]

More human remains found today. Two things of interest, besides the obvious. 1. This came from a 911 call/tip and 2. Investigators cited an ongoing investigation, which could mean this is an isolated ongoing investigation, or possibly, part of a larger investigation.

http://www.newsday.com//long-island/suffolk/police-911-caller-reported-human-remains-1.3613176

 

[KPCrimeNY]

More human remains found today. Two things of interest, besides the obvious. 1. This came from a 911 call/tip and 2. Investigators cited an ongoing investigation, which could mean this is an isolated ongoing investigation, or possibly, part of a larger investigation.

http://www.newsday.com//long-island/suffolk/police-911-caller-reported-human-remains-1.3613176

Right along the side of a highway that has already been searched in this case and leads where if you go south? Just saying.......

 

[Just K]

Newsday: If you are not a member it can't be viewed.

11:00 AM, here is another link:
http://www.longislandpress.com/2012/03/20/commack-human-remains-911-call-under-investigation/

 

[NJGuy]

Articles states a utility worker found the remains, however, it is unclear who made the 911 call.

 

[Just K]

http://www.mapquest.com/maps?city=Commack&state=NY
Yep, it's a straight shot to Oak Beach

 

[Just K]

Articles states a utility worker found the remains, however, it is unclear who made the 911 call.

It will be interesting to see if there is a utility service road there.

 

[KPCrimeNY]

It will be interesting to see if there is a utility service road there.

It's a wooded area between very busy roads, service roads and a codo complex. From what I see the utilities are out on a pole by the road. I am thinking that the body was dumped not far from the road. Sorry I don't know how to link maps.

It's right off an exit for the Sunken Meadow/ Sagtikos parkway which runs south straight to Babylon, Robert Moses Bridge and OB.

Also I'll throw out there that its a stones throw from a popular LI Strip Club as well as some fine Hotel establishments.

 

[KPCrimeNY]

LIPA tree trimmers found the body.
Has been there for a few months from what they can tell.
Unidentifed Male no signs of trauma.

 

[Samantha Spade]

Redbird asked, "If Italyrider was the killer of Amber, how did he know to put her body with the other girls and wrap her in burlap?"


Redbird, Well, according to my theory (well one of them, as I have many. So many that my brain is about to explode) he knew because he had also killed and disposed of the others in the exact same way.
Either Italyrider IS the killer of all 4 (and maybe the others) or one of the friends he promised would take care of Amber. Does anyone know if authorities have identified ItalyRider yet? I believe that would be a case for the FBI computer crimes unit.

 

[Redbird]

If he were a serial killer I don't think he would be bragging about it on a sex guide forum. There was a comment by one of the "hobbyists" there that they had received visits from LE and were questioned about their comments about Amber and her sister. To me the idea is so farfetched I don't really want to discuss it any more.