SURPRISE HEARING Friday 18th August

  • #721
Yes, and there were witnesses that saw him near the crime scene.

Compassionate readers just posted on another thread regarding this.
Despite the fact that supposedly lots of people were looking for the boys starting early in the evening the only witness that supposedly saw Damien were the Hollingsworth,who we know lied about many things.
They said they saw Damien and Domini (their niece) walking with muddy clothes down the service road.Domini than turned into Jason.
 
  • #722
Being diagnosed with a mental disorder does not make one a murderer either.
I'm not going to question the diagnosis.But having been a teenager and having a teenage daughter now I don't think the way Damien acted was unusual.Teenagers who are depressed and feel misunderstood use scare tactics as a defense mechanism.

Did you see where one of the documents in evidence listed for Damien is the Lyrics of Metallica's "Fade to Black" (my favorite Metallica song by the way)
That is a song that describes depression/suicide not Murder- I find it very sad that the same type of drawings, writings and music that I have seen in dozens of teens was twisted and used to paint Damien as something evil.

He was a depressed and troubled kid searching for answers and help-he found neither.
 
  • #723
Compassionate readers just posted on another thread regarding this.
Despite the fact that supposedly lots of people were looking for the boys starting early in the evening the only witness that supposedly saw Damien were the Hollingsworth,who we know lied about many things.
They said they saw Damien and Domini (their niece) walking with muddy clothes down the service road.Domini than turned into Jason.
I believe there were preteen girls that saw him also.
 
  • #724
the pre-teen girls were in the car with Mrs.Hollingsworth.
 
  • #725
I'm just wondering, to the people who think they are guilty- what evidence do you believe proves their guilt? Purely out of curiosity.

Both sides have compelling reasons, I think, for feeling one way or another. A new poster posted his site in favor of their guilt. It is worth a read, no matter which way you think: http://wm3truth.com/the-west-memphis-three-were-guilty/psychological-profile-of-damien-echols/


Did anyone else notice that it appears someone google bombed only positive things about The Memphis Three?

Here is where to find some not-so-positive court docs (again) on DE's mental health.
http://callahan.8k.com/wm3/img/exh500.html

I was diagnosed, after one hour, by a psychiatrist, as having severe mental problems and told that I would end up with clinical depression, suicidal ideation, if I didn't use hardcore meds for the rest of my life.

It has been 15 years. I am a successful attorney, successful in my personal relationships and live a peaceful, balanced life. I never took the medication.

In my line of work, I have read hundreds of psych evals. Several that completely contradict one another, when assessing the very same person. They are subjective - psych analyses.

Echols was diagnosed with depression at first, I think some suicidal ideation - never violence. His teenaged diagnoses remind me of many troubled teens I have known. He was crying for help to get away from his screwed up family.

One young person stated that he completely destroyed a large Great Dane, clubbing it, stomping it to make it's eyeballs pop out and yanking out its intestines, etc. I find that very hard to believe. For all the reasons he was institutionalized over the years, he was not for this. How do you hide such a monstrous crime? My guess is that a lot of people came up with things Damien did after the fact, to prove how "crazy" he was.

The later, very serious diagnoses, including disassociation and psychosis, were made by an expert trying to get him off.

Damien has been on death row for 18 years without treatment. There is no way he was as troubled as the expert stated, and simply recovered with no treatment, isolated 23 hours a day. Many people understand that such isolation merely acts to make people with fragile minds or mental illnesses much, much worse. There is nothing to suggest that happened with Damien. Instead, he seemed very together, coherent, sincere, and logical at the press conference. Not a disassociated person who hears voices, cannot concentrate, and has psychotic impulse control.

I believe these guys were railroaded by small-minded people in a town that felt suspicious of non-conformity and prejudiced against certain types (like poor, troubled kids). I think a lot of the witness statements were reflective of that mentality. Reminded me of the Tonya Craft case.

Nevertheless, I am not going to say that those who are convinced of these guys' guilt are ignorant, or not doing their research, etc., because many of them have and they feel they have valid reasons for their opinion as to the WMIII's guilt. I see too much that troubles me about the prosecution and conviction of these three, they see too much that troubles them about their release.

But our conversations can only act to illuminate and further uncover the truth, one way or the other. It has been interesting reading this thread, that's for sure.
 
  • #726
Sorry to butt in but Yes I did see him do a slick flick at the media cams before the presser started. I didnt screen shot it as I didnt think quick enough to.

I promise I saw it ,also it showed me the teenag angst is still there. Or that he has some issues still ,or what ever is going on with him.

I wish I could join the cheering masses. I bet it would feel better then what I feel.

Well I would imagine he has some "issues" he has spent the last 18 years on 23 hour a day solitary confinement if it was me I'd be pretty P'Od
 
  • #727
I believe there were preteen girls that saw him also.

You mean the ones that saw him at the softball field and claimed they heard him admit to the murders but couldn't hear anything else of the conversation and could not ID any of the people they claim he was talking to?
 
  • #728
no,I think she means Hollingsworth daughter and her sons girlfriend,I think they were in the car with her when she supposedly saw her niece and Damien walking down the service road.
 
  • #729
Well I would imagine he has some "issues" he has spent the last 18 years on 23 hour a day solitary confinement if it was me I'd be pretty P'Od

I know,I posted this on another thread also.I'm so happy they are finally free but I'm also very worried.It's a lot to deal with.Imagine being locked up that long? Especially in solitary? I hope they get a lot of support.I think Jason is amazing.I'm not even worried about him.Damien is thoughtful and sensitive and I think his main issue has always been being misunderstood.I hope he can deal with this world.Jessie I worry most about.He must be so confused .I don't think he ever fully understood what happened .
 
  • #730
294360_10150344137653764_113238993763_9697371_4775803_n.jpg


Here's a picture Compassionate reader linked to in the other thread.Made me cry.He'll be fine :)
 
  • #731
Looks like he just did the conjugal deed.
 
  • #732
Right?? How about Michael Crowe?

Michael Crowe...who gave a confession to the murder of his sister Stephanie, which was later found to be false?

I'm not sure what you mean here. The example I gave was of Stefan Kiszko, who confessed and was jailed for a crime he did not commit.

The point I was making was that his confession convicted him, but it was later found to be coerced and he was a man with severe learning difficulties who basically told the police what the wanted to know, when he absolutely did not commit the crime. The real perpertrator was jailed 22 years after the murder of Lesley Molseed.
 
  • #733
And he continued taking the antidepressants until he was unjustly incarcerated. He had just picked up a refill the day of the murder. So, if the medicines were working, then his "mental illness" would not be a contributor to his actions, would it? Did you see the press conference today? Did he look or act mentally ill to you? He's off the medications now because he outgrew all that teen angst that was the root of any of his mental problems.

I didn't know you can outgrow mental illness? :waitasec:

Not being snarky but that is a strong statement you made. IMO and I'm not a psychologist nor a psychiatrist, if someone is diagnosed with mental illness especially psychosis and/or bi-polar, they should be on medication for life.

bbm...What does a mentally ill person look like?
 
  • #734
Looks like he just did the conjugal deed.

My goodness I sure hope not! I can't imagine being on death row for so many years, in an 8x10 or 8x12 cell, alone for 23 hours a day, not a sole to talk to and then being shoved out in society (however welcomed). I hope he is going to take some time to meet with a therapist first and figure out how to best integrate himself into his relationship and not just dive in head first (no pun intended).

I do look forward to his freedom story though.

MOO

Mel
 
  • #735
My heart goes out to Todd & Dana, who truly believe the right three killed Michael.

I can't even imagine the pain they feel right now
 
  • #736
The problem with deciding something based only on a confession is that sometimes (more often than you would think) those confessions are false.


my snip

riley fox's father falsely confessed to her murder which set me straight forever to believe a confession of any sort, especially when the evidence doesnt match up.

I never thought these three were guilty as charged, a terrible miscarriage of justice all this time, worse even than the pinellas 12 letting FCA go. I am SO HAPPY for them. may they enjoy the rest of their lives free with as little bitterness as possible (I believe I would be very bitter myself!!)
 
  • #737
I'm still trying to understand this plea deal. If Baldwin didn't want to go ahead with it, why did his lawyers advise him to take the deal? Couldn't they have let Echols & Misskelley plead guilty and go free and let Baldwin go ahead with the hearing and potential trial? Why was it all 3 or nothing? :waitasec:
 
  • #738
I'm not saying he "faked out" anyone,I did say I'm not one to question the diagnosis.I'm not a psych nurse.I'm saying I can relate to the way he was acting.I was in the metal scene when I was a teenager.I made a suicide pact with my boyfriend.I drank blood for shock value.I probably mentioned I wanted to kill my parents.So did my friends.Many times.I'm not proud of it but I did not kill anyone.
As long as there is nothing that links Damien to the victims or the crime scene his mental health has nothing to do with the murders of the children.
BBM

So glad you have said this.

I grew up at the time when late punk/new romantics/goth movements were popular. I saw and knew lots of people who wore black, lots of make up, (yes black nail polish too!) vampire imagery, etc etc. Not one of them I knew went on to commit serious crimes or murder people. I would say the large majority of people I knew just adopted this...I'm trying to think how best to say it...because it was almost like a fashion, or anti-fashion statement if you like, a rebellious subculture.

The people I knew were all pose and bluster. *Things were worn and said for shock value, I don't think that anyone seriously thought they were a satanist or a vampire or would have seriously considered murdering anyone. All of the people I are now in their late 30's/40's, productive people who have moved on in their lives and would no doubt look back on that time in their life with more than a little embarrassment and eye rolling at their teen angst/rebellion phase. :blushing:

I don't doubt that DE did have some mental health problems in his teens and probably still today (that is not my field of expertise) but does that make him a murderer...Not necessarily in my book. Like Claudicici has tried to do, I am just giving some background to my experience of the goth/death metal culture.

One thing I would like to add is, that I noticed at DE's trial, much was made of his books on Wicca, his writing down the name of Aleister Crowley and his saying that he would have had AE's books, if he had come across them.

Now I am not a believer of AE or any of his teachings, but if I came across them, I would read them. I am the sort of person who has an enquiring mind. If I hear a book/film etc has some fuss/furore surrounding it, I like to read it myself and see what all the notoriety is about. I probably would not believe a word that was written, but I just feel better for looked in to it and made my own mind up on the subject.

Now I am not presuming that that is what DE's was doing, or wanted to do, I am merely offering my own reason for why I would want to read something like that, which I don't believe is sinister in any way. I would also read Wicca books, just to find out what their beliefs are, for my own knowledge.

*Obviously, I am only basing my views on my own experiences, I know there have been people who followed this sort of music/fashion who have gone on and committed crimes, but I am just talking about my experiences with my circles of friends here.
 
  • #739
My heart goes out to Todd & Dana, who truly believe the right three killed Michael.

I can't even imagine the pain they feel right now

Steve Branch was also against it right? So who supported the release?

=======

In a courtroom outburst, Steve Branch, father of murder victim Stevie Branch, rose to his feet and protested the deal.

"If you go through with this, you're going to open Pandora's Box. ... You're wrong, Your Honor. You can stop it right now before you do it," shouted Branch, who believes the three defendants are guilty.

http://www.commercialappeal.com/news/2011/aug/19/west-memphis-three-free/
 
  • #740
In West Memphis, debate continues over guilt of '3'

Some residents, however, were more scared for the newly freed men. "It's going to be brutal," said Grady Burson, 53, a manager at a Family Dollar store, over his lunch at Popeye's. "People here are blunt. People will be going up to them saying straight-up, 'Why'd you do it?' I'm just glad there aren't too many bars in these parts. You don't need that with this situation."

Jeff Edwards, 34, a landscaper, was one of those blunt people. "I heard on the radio the other day a saying: 'One man's trash is another man's treasure.' Well," he said, "that's not always accurate. These men is just trash through and through. And that's all they'll be. And they knows it."

Some very strong opinions.

http://www.commercialappeal.com/news/2011/aug/19/west-memphis-debate-continues-over-guilt-3/
 

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