Syringe in bottle contained traces of chloroform

[The Eunice Burns]

I know what I'm trying to say, but not quite how to say it, but here goes: As high water receeds, debris doesn't usually float back whence it came and settle there. Instead, it tends to accummulate, esp. where there's some sort of obstruction like vines, or a larger piece of debris.

I have no opinion as to how the syringe, et al, came to be near Caylee's remains, or if there's any relevance to the items. Just tryin' to answer your question.

That makes perfect sense to me. Thanks, Friday!

 

[Valhall]

Thank you, but the link is already in my original post.

That's what I figured, so I am looking at the right document. Thanks for clarifying that.

Now, look at page 12,332 - no DNA detected for 238 or 240.1

12365 and 12375 have nothing to do with 238 or 240.1

12355 has nothing to do with 238 or 240.1. It concerns Q304 - swabs taken from the handle of a comb found in the backpack.

So...I guess whatever you think you found, isn't there. Because now I've read this part three times...and it's just not there. There were no allele returns, no amelogenin returns, nothing on the DNA tests for either 238 or 240.1

P.S. But thanks for helping me correct an error in my notes. I had Q240 as the disney bag instead of the "syringe bag".

 

[lizzysf]

Someone who wanted a memento of his major role in this case. MO is that Kronk is an odd character in this unending list of odd characters connected to this case, but I don't think he had anything to do w/ Caylee's death or the disposal of her remains. I think he put some thoughts together and went on a mission......and sometimes I wish it had been a more "average Joe" citizen who had found Caylee.

Me too..but I think in the end Kronk will turn out to be a minor hurdle.

 

[TakeNote]

That's what I figured, so I am looking at the right document. Thanks for clarifying that.

Now, look at page 12,332 - no DNA detected in 238 or 240.1

12365 and 12375 have nothing to do with 238 or 240.1

12355 has nothing to do with 238 or 240.1. It concerns Q304 - swabs taken from the handle of a comb found in the backpack.

So...I guess whatever you think you found, isn't there. Because now I've read this part three times...and it's just not there. There were no allele returns, no amelogenin returns, nothing on the DNA tests for either 238 or 240.1

P.S. But thanks for helping me correct an error in my notes. I had Q240 as the disney bag instead of the "syringe bag".

if im reading what quitestorm said....its 238.1 ....not 238....

im still trying to open up the file.....not sure if i will know what im looking at...but im trying

 

[QuietStorm]

That's what I figured, so I am looking at the right document. Thanks for clarifying that.

Now, look at page 12,332 - no DNA detected in 238.1 or 240.1.1.

12365 and 12375 have nothing to do with 238.1 or 240.1.1.

12355 has nothing to do with 238.1 or 240.1.1. It concerns Q304 - swabs taken from the handle of a comb found in the backpack.

So...I guess whatever you think you found, isn't there. Because now I've read this part three times...and it's just not there. There were no allele returns, no amelogenin returns, nothing on the DNA tests for either 238.1 or 240.1.1.

Page 12330 says Q238.1 was used for amplification.

 

[Valhall]

Page 12330 says Q238.1 was used for amplification.

Of course it was. You have to perform the PCR amplification whether you know you've got something or not. In this case, they didn't.

 

[BondJamesBond]

QS: Good to see you again. :wave:

D2M: Like to hear if/when you've got a handle on concentrations. I only scanned through once and IIRC the ethanol peak was off chart. I didn't get anything on the water concentration, which is big piece o' the puzzle. Assuming you have your scissors and scales out 'bout now

 

[USARDOG]

I actually think there is NO connection between the bottle, the syringe and Caylee. Just to be clear.

I was positing the potential cleaner as the source of the Terpenes in the bottle to remain open minded that there MAY be a connection.

I still don't think there is.

Interesting perspective. Chloroform is not something that would be commonly found on a syringe. "Uppers, downers, some kind of narcotic, but not chloroform. To find it in close proximity to the body, to find high concentrations in kc's car, and to find internet searches on her computer about how to make it.... Sure looks like a smoking gun to me.

I have a friend who is getting older and has various problems, one of the things his doctor is treating him with is Testosterone. Makes me wonder right away if someone in the A's house is also being treated with testosterone, which could be the sorce of the syringe and traces of testosterone.

 

[Baxter]

Well, considering I've read the whole document twice now and can't find where it states there was DNA in the bottle, I'm guessing you're reading a document I'm not reading.

So I'll respectfully request a link so that I can get on the right page...and the right document.

Did you look at these documents? They are the DNA results of the items in the pontiac and the gatorade bottle.

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/15087491/DNA-Reports-on-Pontiac-Items-Gatorade-Bottle

 

[Valhall]

if im reading what quitestorm said....its 238.1 ....not 238....

im still trying to open up the file.....not sure if i will know what im looking at...but im trying

The DNA test was done on 238. The swab from 238 was labeled 238-1.

 

[Valhall]

Did you look at these documents? They are the DNA results of the items in the pontiac and the gatorade bottle.

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/15087491/DNA-Reports-on-Pontiac-Items-Gatorade-Bottle

I guess I can re-read this document from 12 different sources, but I don't think the words in the pdf are going to change are they? I'm not meaning to come of snippy, it's just the words say one thing, and the posts say another. And that would be the only point I'm trying to make here.

 

[debbie0604]

If KC used the syringe to fatally inject Caylee, and then put it inside a plastic bottle which then is put into a Disney bag... why on earth would you leave all of that sitting next to the body? It doesn't make any sense. Your fingerprints and DNA are all over that stuff. Why wouldn't you simply discard the Disney bag with the killing gear somewhere on the other side of town?

Well.... I've been asking the same question as to why didn't she dump the body somewhere else other than a few houses down from her own residence? The answer to that IMHO is that she just only thinks for the moment. IMO she really thought that she could blame everything on the "imagined" nanny and nothing would be tied to her. She would be able to lie out of everything. She thinks she is omniscient and will come out of this whole situation unscathed.

 

[spqr]

The DNA test was done on 238. The swab from 238 was labeled 238-1.

Hey Val,

I know this is confusing for everyone. I read 238.1 was the liquid from the gatorade bottle. Did I misread or are there two differant reports?

TIA

 

[debbie0604]

It's like rain on your wedding day!

:rolling::rolling:

 

[BondJamesBond]

Interesting perspective. Chloroform is not something that would be commonly found on a syringe. "Uppers, downers, some kind of narcotic, but not chloroform. To find it in close proximity to the body, to find high concentrations in kc's car, and to find internet searches on her computer about how to make it.... Sure looks like a smoking gun to me.

I have a friend who is getting older and has various problems, one of the things his doctor is treating him with is Testosterone. Makes me wonder right away if someone in the A's house is also being treated with testosterone, which could be the sorce of the syringe and traces of testosterone.

...am interested in the concentration found.

FWIW, reading that ethanol is used to stabilize chloroform, however, if that were related to the source/use in this case then I would expect the ratio of ethanol:chloroform to be different than what is shown in the doc.

Also, FWIW, it seems this form of testosterone is preferred for body building vs. HRT. We read 'bout Cindy's 'flashes' in her partial email, but, this seems to be less likely type of testosterone than what would be used for Cindy.

BTW...you prolly encountered some ppm/ppb levels of chloroform in your hot shower this morning...if you use a chlorinated city water supply.

 

[QuietStorm]

Of course it was. You have to perform the PCR amplification whether you know you've got something or not. In this case, they didn't.

Well, why don't you just beat me up and shake me silly?

 

[QuietStorm]

*respectfully snipped for space*

QS, good to see you back.

I've read your post and while I'm no genetic specialist by any means what you have written appears to make sense and if correct is a VERY good thing IMO.[/QUOTE]

Thanks, but ignore.

 

[TakeNote]

ok...im confused now.....
i read it as the package the bottle was sent in or came in was 238.
then when they took the bottle out they labled it 238.1

i did see in the dna report....it said....Q307/308
i did not see a page like that though that read Q238.1
only a page with the differnt dna's for each, ca ga la kc caylee that didnt have anything across for the Q238.1

im not sure that makes since.....LOL....but i tried

there has to be more reports ran for the Q238.1 like the one for Q307/308

 

[QuietStorm]

oh QuiteStorm.......if its true that caylee and kc dna is in that bottle or on it......that would link kc to the crime scene!!!!!

i was so afraid as i was reading your post....that it was going to turn up to be someone other then kc.....and that would have given defense team someone to throw under the bus......im not going to name a name.....but we all know who.....

great job!!!

i missed you!!

Sorry to say this isn't panning out. Missed everyone too!

 

[Imbackon]

Thanks! I had not seen this. The best I could find was the narratives in the incident reports filed by the various LE who worked the crime scene. Would you happen to have a link to the doc it came from so that I can read everything that was with this table?

Thank you again!

Why yes I can

This subject kept coming up so I asked Harmony2 to put the info she had gathered about this together, and she put it here.

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4402107&postcount=112"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - 2009.11.06 More docs released THIS THREAD FOR GENERAL OVERVIEW AND REFERENCE[/ame]