Syringe in bottle contained traces of chloroform

[DogMom2JoeAndWillie]

To keep me from feeling bad about failing Chemistry?

Ohmygoodness... DON'T feel bad about failing Chemistry. It takes a REAL LOSER to dedicate their life to this crap BELIEVE me, I KNOW! Kidding... I actually have a life... kind-of.

 

[BondJamesBond]

Short answer

Trace

This isn't the smokin gun imho

 

[RubyB]

I could be wrong, but I think what DM2 is telling us is that the qualifying doc's are present but the quantifying doc's aren't. LOL Previews of coming attractions?

 

[DogMom2JoeAndWillie]

the suspense is killing me..........:nerves:

Sorry...didn't mean to make you wait
Bad news is that I still don't know. I can't seem to find the information that I need. If you can point me to where they list their results (quantitative) I will be able to help. I'm still digging and I still only have qualitative answers... I'm working on it though, I promise! This is EXACTLY what I've been trying to figure out this whole time!

ps. Just got off the phone with Tricia (OMG, is she not the best?!) and gotta e-mail her a few docs and she will have me all officially confirmed and everything! WOOHOO!

 

[TakeNote]

yippppeee dogmom2joeandwillie :hug: tricia is the best

no rush.....

 

[USARDOG]

BBM

testosterone that was found is a class III drug...so yes it is in essence a street drug. Sold and obtained by illicit/illegal means. and it was packaged with items that constitute paraphernalia for the above illegal drugs.

However, not so if GA has a perscription for Testosterone, then it is legal, and also another link back to KC.

 

[DogMom2JoeAndWillie]

Arrrrgh. Flyin down the istate on bb and can't chime in much. Dogmom simplify and assume say 4 biggest peaks equal 100% then approx areas and normalize then note we dunno how much water

Um, I could do this but it wouldn't tell us any more than we already know. I don't know what their injection volume was and don't know the total volume of the samples (hell, I don't even know which sample is which...just the sample numbers they listed on the chromatographs and mass specs....haven't matched them up, yet). Any answer I gave you from doing this would be wrong, IMO.

 

[Tricia]

Sorry...didn't mean to make you wait
Bad news is that I still don't know. I can't seem to find the information that I need. If you can point me to where they list their results (quantitative) I will be able to help. I'm still digging and I still only have qualitative answers... I'm working on it though, I promise! This is EXACTLY what I've been trying to figure out this whole time!

ps. Just got off the phone with Tricia (OMG, is she not the best?!) and gotta e-mail her a few docs and she will have me all officially confirmed and everything! WOOHOO!

Dear DogMom2JoeandWillie,

Thank you for the lovely talk. You are truly a person who is passionate about justice and truth.

Tomorrow I will be confirming Dogmom's credentials and if everything checks out, like I am sure it will, then we will have a real life chemist on our board. Someone who can explain things to me that I should have learned in 8th grade chemistry but did not.

Welcome DogMom and thank you for going the extra mile to help us understand this complex case.

 

[Wudge]

But for balance you can always tune to Geraldo who will give the Official Defense point of view each time, in equally sensational a manner and with much less accuracy. He also has a huge audience, so they will be impacted and 'taken advantage' of also.

Geraldo is no 'balance' against those who earn a living demonizing and espousing all types of incredibly hurtful and/or erroneous garbage against people who are simply unfortunate enough to have gotten caught in the floodlights of crimetainment. Geraldo is another pack member who has fed themselves by wrongfully villifying and helping to ruin the lives of poor people who did nothing wrong. For example, what he did to the Ramseys (Jon Benet murder case) was just hideous by my measure.

Come judgment day, I believe he will have to answer for that. He was a force in ruining lives. He helped to further destroy a truly nice family that was down on its luck and under a massive and wrongful seige. Geraldo literally fed off of it.

I come from a time in America when it was well understood what bearing false witness meant even if a person was not a lawyer. However, Geraldo is a lawyer. Like Nancy Grace, he's sensationalizes for his own personal gain.

Crime reporters/analysts like Nancy and Geraldo give their audience what it wants, and their audience largely wants 'guilty' -- must feed the beast.

FWIW

 

[shellsbells]

Honestly, there's no such thing as a "smoking gun" unless whomever murdered Caylee were so daft as to make a videotape of them doing it and then attached a yearbook photo of them.

Yes, this whole "OMG Bombshell!" stuff is an issue, but, IMO, a different one. NG has ratings to get, and personally I think everyone should just toss their TV out the window, but we have to piece together what we have and not what people wish we had.

That said, the absence of some things (ie, fingerprints on the syringe and gatorade bottle), especially considering we know chloroform does dissipate and we don't know (AFAIK) how loose the bottle lid and syringe packaging was, it seems impossible to say either "this is a smoking gun" or "this is totally unrelated". YKWIM? I'm not gonna argue semantics with Nancy Grace as I don't watch her and her voice makes me want to run up the walls, but on the other end, we can't deny that (IMO, AFAIK, YMMV) there appears to be chloroform traces on the syringe, which somehow ended up next to a dead body that also seems to have been contained in a car trunk that also had detectable amounts of chloroform.

So.. I guess as a person who doesn't watch TV and pretty much relies on document dumps and WS to keep me straight vis a vie this stuff.. I am grateful for people who can make heads or tales of the data graphs, and I would encourage those who take more umbrage with the machinations of Nancy Grace to take it to a thread specific to her.

 

[Friday]

Dear DogMom2JoeandWillie,

Thank you for the lovely talk. You are truly a person who is passionate about justice and truth.

Tomorrow I will be confirming Dogmom's credentials and if everything checks out, like I am sure it will, then we will have a real life chemist on our board. Someone who can explain things to me that I should have learned in 8th grade chemistry but did not.

Welcome DogMom and thank you for going the extra mile to help us understand this complex case.

8th grade?? You must have attended a school for baby brainiacs, Tricia. LOL

 

[lizzysf]

BBM

testosterone that was found is a class III drug...so yes it is in essence a street drug. Sold and obtained by illicit/illegal means. and it was packaged with items that constitute paraphernalia for the above illegal drugs.

Schedule III drugs are controlled substances...not illegal..(unless sold on the street)
It would include narcotics, depressants, stimulants etc. ALSO Anabolic Steroids..which do have legal therapeutic uses. Testosterone also class III.

 

[Valhall]

Um, I could do this but it wouldn't tell us any more than we already know. I don't know what their injection volume was and don't know the total volume of the samples (hell, I don't even know which sample is which...just the sample numbers they listed on the chromatographs and mass specs....haven't matched them up, yet). Any answer I gave you from doing this would be wrong, IMO.

Dogmom - is this statement correct?

Are ALL the samples of a given test method going to be the same volume? So for HS-GC-MSD, will all samples volumes of the various tests be the same?

 

[notthatsmart]

Do you know Casey's choice of drink habits? What makes you look at other people to find the source of the Gatorade ? - it was found with her child, who was decomposing in her car.

Possible Soddi. TL group was a new group in Kc's life. Dont know them. Dont know much about them.

 

[DogMom2JoeAndWillie]

Dogmom - is this statement correct?

Are ALL the samples of a given test method going to be the same volume? So for HS-GC-MSD, will all samples volumes of the various tests be the same?

It depends on the method and how "clean" or dilute your sample is. You can inject varying amounts of sample into your instrument. I don't know what they did in this case, so I can't say one way or the other. Sorry I'm not more helpful...I would rather say that I don't know that end up giving everyone wrong information.

When they started their run they could have done manual injections or used an autosampler (more accurate, no human error). They could have injected 10microL, 50 microL, 1mL....varying amounts depending on several factors.

 

[Tricia]

8th grade?? You must have attended a school for baby brainiacs, Tricia. LOL

OH Lord No. I just remember my science class we had beakers and little Coleman stove things and we were suppose to do some sort of chemistry experiment.

I literally broke the beaker, my girlfriend started to laugh so hard that I started to laugh until the teacher kicked us out of class. We loved it. Today, you don't get kicked out you get sent to some adult in an office who calls your parents.

That is my chemistry knowledge or lack thereof.

Sorry to be totally off topic but in no way did I want to give the impression I was a brainiac. LOL

Back On Topic​

So, after all this information we do not really have a smoking gun do we.

It is the amount of evidence, of coincidences, the things, the total sum of all this that, in my opinion, points to Casey as the culprit.

 

[Wudge]

Honestly, there's no such thing as a "smoking gun" unless whomever murdered Caylee were so daft as to make a videotape of them doing it and then attached a yearbook photo of them.

Yes, this whole "OMG Bombshell!" stuff is an issue, but, IMO, a different one. NG has ratings to get, and personally I think everyone should just toss their TV out the window, but we have to piece together what we have and not what people wish we had.

That said, the absence of some things (ie, fingerprints on the syringe and gatorade bottle), especially considering we know chloroform does dissipate and we don't know (AFAIK) how loose the bottle lid and syringe packaging was, it seems impossible to say either "this is a smoking gun" or "this is totally unrelated". YKWIM? I'm not gonna argue semantics with Nancy Grace as I don't watch her and her voice makes me want to run up the walls, but on the other end, we can't deny that (IMO, AFAIK, YMMV) there appears to be chloroform traces on the syringe, which somehow ended up next to a dead body that also seems to have been contained in a car trunk that also had detectable amounts of chloroform.

So.. I guess as a person who doesn't watch TV and pretty much relies on document dumps and WS to keep me straight vis a vie this stuff.. I am grateful for people who can make heads or tales of the data graphs, and I would encourage those who take more umbrage with the machinations of Nancy Grace to take it to a thread specific to her.

Finding Caylee's blood or DNA on the syringe's needle would have qualified as a bombshell. Finding Casey's DNA or fingerprints on the syringe or Gatorade bottle would at least have been physical evidence that could have been used to place Casey at the location where Caylee's body was found.

However, as I read through the report, I couldn't locate any such evidence, which set my malarkey antenna to high buzz mode, yet again.

Unlinked to the death of Caylee or to Casey's person, this alleged blockbuster evidence could well be but true trash and should be considered such.

 

[Tuffy]

It depends on the method and how "clean" or dilute your sample is. You can inject varying amounts of sample into your instrument. I don't know what they did in this case, so I can't say one way or the other. Sorry I'm not more helpful...I would rather say that I don't know that end up giving everyone wrong information.

When they started their run they could have done manual injections or used an autosampler (more accurate, no human error). They could have injected 10microL, 50 microL, 1mL....varying amounts depending on several factors.

To be clear, you are saying that without knowing how much sample was injected, there is no way to know whether there was a high concentration of chloroform, or merely trace amounts?

Sorry to be so dense, just wanna make sure I'm understanding properly.

 

[MD MOMMY]

But for balance you can always tune to Geraldo who will give the Official Defense point of view each time, in equally sensational a manner and with much less accuracy. He also has a huge audience, so they will be impacted and 'taken advantage' of also.

Yeah it kinda works both ways it seems. NG is pro prosecution and GR is pro defense, IMO. Then we have Baez et al, shouting off the roof tops erraneous information. It all just makes a tangled web..every last bit of it. Actually all of the above is what actually made me seek out Websleuths to begin with.:banghead:

 

[okiedokietoo]

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0911/06/ng.01.html
NANCY GRACE
Chloroform Traces Found in Syringe Near Caylee`s Body
Aired November 6, 2009 - 20:00:00 ET

Above is the link to the "Nancy Grace" show that talked about chloroform
and a syringe. I believe she reports the facts of the case. If those facts are horrific and not in KC's favor, well then it is the nature of the beast
IMO