Terry Hobbs & Pam Hicks on Opperman Report

[Ausgirl]

Welcome, Ed.

I'm curious as to what is was, exactly, that tipped you toward guilt? I've always been a fence sitter, as I do believe the case was badly investigated and badly prosecuted at the cost of the truth, and I think there's too many instances everywhere, where facts are skewed in order to fit theories, on BOTH sides of the debate.

So I'm neither a non or a supporter, here - and I am really curious about those supporters who have changed their minds toward guilt, especially ones with investigative backgrounds and the like.

 

[OppermanReport]

:wagon:

So glad to see you here!!

Would like to know more about some of the harassment Terry Hobbs experienced, he mentioned some of it during your show, am sure he has a tale of horror to share, sadly!

Yea Terry Hobbs is under a lot of attack. I've spent a lot of time talking to Terry on the phone in chats on Facebook and in interviews. I have worked for thousands of criminal defendants. In my opinion TH could not have pulled this off. No way.

Not just TH but almost anyone and everyone involved in this case as a prosecution witness has come under attack. There was a multi million dollar defense fund

 

[Mrs G Norris]

That's just so wrong, I really feel for the parents in this case who have suffered so much.

 

[OppermanReport]

Welcome, Ed.

I'm curious as to what is was, exactly, that tipped you toward guilt? I've always been a fence sitter, as I do believe the case was badly investigated and badly prosecuted at the cost of the truth, and I think there's too many instances everywhere, where facts are skewed in order to fit theories, on BOTH sides of the debate.

So I'm neither a non or a supporter, here - and I am really curious about those supporters who have changed their minds toward guilt, especially ones with investigative backgrounds and the like.

Learning the real facts of the case. The multiple confessions. Even some to supporters that are not common knowledge. Jessie confessed to his GF around 2002.
But another factor is seeing the type of people the supporters are, almost all are liars and in it for fame and fortune.
I believe that everyone at the top of the support and awareness funds are very well aware of the guilt of these three.

I've worked a lot of criminal defense cases and theres no doubt in my mind that the three did it.

 

[OppermanReport]

BTW the real reason why I registered here was to tel you there are a couple of "after show" conversations we recorded that will be going up on youtube shortly.I forgot to mention that in the first post.

 

[OppermanReport]

That's just so wrong, I really feel for the parents in this case who have suffered so much.

Peter Jackson, Producer: The Lord of the Rings put up millions to a defense fund. Plus who knows how many millions were donated by others. There is no accounting.
I know Jessie Misskelly's GF was donating 700 to 900 every month to the commissary fund.

So there was a ton of money donated to these confessed , convicted child killers. No argument about that.
Some of those millions were paid to investigators that were extremely aggressive toward the prosecution witnesses and the victims families.

I worked on the defense for some of NYCs biggest organized crime cases. The Pizza Connection case and the Commission case and others. I have never seen this kind of aggressive pursuit of prosecution witnesses and jurors as I have seen in this case.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

Once it became a money spinner it seems that all bets were off as far as creating the narrative went, and nobody had the money to take on the defense team. I'm sure the filmmakers know the truth, I for one would love to see the footage that never made it to the final edit of PL1. Personally it was some of the interviews with Damien in the first films that made me dig deeper in this case.

 

[OppermanReport]

Welcome, Ed.

I'm curious as to what is was, exactly, that tipped you toward guilt? I've always been a fence sitter, as I do believe the case was badly investigated and badly prosecuted at the cost of the truth, and I think there's too many instances everywhere, where facts are skewed in order to fit theories, on BOTH sides of the debate.

So I'm neither a non or a supporter, here - and I am really curious about those supporters who have changed their minds toward guilt, especially ones with investigative backgrounds and the like.

From my perspective these three confessed convicted killers got a better investigation and trial than about 90% of the trials I've been involved in.
I'm a DEFENSE guy. I'm almost always working for the defense or have a client that's a crime victim and I'm fighting the DA to get my client help.

 

[Ausgirl]

Learning the real facts of the case. The multiple confessions. Even some to supporters that are not common knowledge. Jessie confessed to his GF around 2002.
But another factor is seeing the type of people the supporters are, almost all are liars and in it for fame and fortune.
I believe that everyone at the top of the support and awareness funds are very well aware of the guilt of these three.

I've worked a lot of criminal defense cases and theres no doubt in my mind that the three did it.

Thanks for your reply. The comment respectfully bolded by me above - I am sure there's some folks like that (and on both sides of this), but it's a bit much to tar ALL supporters that way, I think. I am sure none of the supporters here are liars that are after fame or fortune. Or did you just mean the celebrity ones?

I too find the multiple confessions very interesting, and these are also factors in why I am on the fence. I have never found any documentation of Jessie's girlfriend's account of his confession to her, though -- if anyone knows where I can find that, I would be grateful for a link.

 

[gheckso]

I believe that everyone at the top of the support and awareness funds are very well aware of the guilt of these three.

Sorry, but that is just absurd.

 

[UdbCrzy2]

Welcome to the board. It's nice to have you here.

I'm looking forward to hearing more information about the case.

I think that it's a shame that supporters are trying to bully Mr. Hobbs. They did the same thing to Mr. Byers.

I will listen to the videos you posted as well and thank you for doing so.

 

[OppermanReport]

Sorry, but that is just absurd.

My belief based on my information and direct interaction with these people is absurd? That's interesting.
How is my belief based on first hand personal experience "absurd"? Do you know more about my personal experiences than I do?

I'd love to hear about it.

 

[Ausgirl]

From my perspective these three confessed convicted killers got a better investigation and trial than about 90% of the trials I've been involved in.
I'm a DEFENSE guy. I'm almost always working for the defense or have a client that's a crime victim and I'm fighting the DA to get my client help.

I respect that this your (expert) point of view. But I also see the original trial as pretty obviously flawed, and the investigation probably moreso. I think it's clear that some deep flaws existed in both - do you think there was none?

I get frustrated by the unwillingness of people on both sides to admit to things that don't support their cause. Like - the investigation was flawed. So was the trial. Jessie's initial confession was a massively coerced farce. And facts like Echols' obsession with blood, and unusual acts of violence toward others. These are things I've seen flat out denied, though they exist and documents exist to prove they exist.. It's like the Emperor's new clothes at times... and none of it is helping, as far as I can see, in proving who killed those little boys.

Ah, having a little vent there. My apologies. Looking forward to your links.

 

[OppermanReport]

Thanks for your reply. The comment respectfully bolded by me above - I am sure there's some folks like that (and on both sides of this), but it's a bit much to tar ALL supporters that way, I think. I am sure none of the supporters here are liars that are after fame or fortune. Or did you just mean the celebrity ones?

I too find the multiple confessions very interesting, and these are also factors in why I am on the fence. I have never found any documentation of Jessie's girlfriend's account of his confession to her, though -- if anyone knows where I can find that, I would be grateful for a link.

I believe that everyone at the top of the support and awareness funds are very well aware of the guilt of these three.

BTW I also sais specifically "almost all" so I don't know why you'd argue "ALL supporters" when I specifically said almost all. But be well.

 

[OppermanReport]

I respect that this your (expert) point of view. But I also see the original trial as pretty obviously flawed, and the investigation probably moreso. I think it's clear that some deep flaws existed in both - do you think there was none?

I get frustrated by the unwillingness of people on both sides to admit to things that don't support their cause. Like - the investigation was flawed. So was the trial. Jessie's initial confession was a massively coerced farce. And facts like Echols' obsession with blood, and unusual acts of violence toward others. These are things I've seen flat out denied, though they exist and documents exist to prove they exist.. It's like the Emperor's new clothes at times... and none of it is helping, as far as I can see, in proving who killed those little boys.

Ah, having a little vent there. My apologies. Looking forward to your links.

Do you know that Jessie Misskelly confessed to relatives before he was ever questioned by police. Do you know that e confessed in the presence of his lawyers? Do you know his lawyer testified that his client confessed to him? I',m sorry but it is proven. Go to your local court house for a couple of weeks and watch trials. This was an above average trail for 3 defendants where 1 defendant confesses.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

Has Jessie ever stopped confessing? He has confessed so many times it's nearly impossible to keep track!

 

[Ausgirl]

Do you know that Jessie Misskelly confessed to relatives before he was ever questioned by police.

I actually did not know that. If anyone can point me in the general direction of a (eta: reliable) source for that information, I again would once more be grateful.

 

[Ausgirl]

Do you know that e confessed in the presence of his lawyers? Do you know his lawyer testified that his client confessed to him?

Yes, I did know these things. I am actually right now weighing up the content and nature of Jessie's various confessions (the ones I have found documentation for) with studies on the phenomenon of false confession (there are some very interesting relatively recent ones), particularly where interrogation protocol is compromised and in cases of youths with low IQs. I do it see it as very possible that compulsive false confession might be a factor, as well as flat out guilt. Any information on both sides is welcome to me.

eta also: no need to be 'sorry' that it's proven that Misskelley confessed, I am not disputing that he did so, at all.

I ahve attended various trials in my time (none so famous as this, by a long shot). I still think the trials were flawed.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

http://callahan.8k.com/wm3/b_lucas_interview.html

RIDGE - OKAY, WHAT DID HE TELL YOU HE DO?

LUCAS - WE.... HE TOLD ME THAT UH, THAT HE GOT IN A FIGHT, THAT'S WHAT HE TOLD ME AT FIRST

RIDGE - OKAY

LUCAS - I SAID DAMIEN AND JASON THEY HELPED YOU? HE SAID UM-YEA AND EVERYTHING SO I SAID WELL DID YOU ALL HURT ANYBODY? AND HE SAID YEA, I DIDN'T THINK IT WAS THOSE 8 YEAR OLD KIDS OR ANYTHING, SO I TURN AROUND AND COME TO FOUND OUT THAT JASON HE WAS WITH JASON AND DAMIEN WHEN THEY SACRIFICED THEM LITTLE KIDS. I WAS COME AND TELL YOU ALL

RIDGE - OKAY

LUCAS - AND HE SAID NO I'LL DO IT

.......

RIDGE - AND WHAT DID HE TELL YOU HE WAS IN TROUBLE OVER?

LUCAS - THAT HE REALLY, HE SAID UM, WE HURT, UH.... UH WE HURT A COUPLE OF BOYS, THAT JASON AND DAMIEN KILLED

RIDGE - OKAY

LUCAS - COUPLE, I SAID WAS YOU INVOLVED? HE SAID YEA, I SAID WHAT DID YOU DO? I FINALLY GOT IT TALKED OUT OF HIM WHAT DID HE DO, HE SAID I HIT UH, A COUPLE IN THE BACK OF THE HEAD

RIDGE - OKAY, AND

LUCAS - AND EVERYTHING TO KEEP THEM FROM RUNNING AND EVERYTHING

RIDGE - AND THAT'S WHAT HE TOLD YOU?

LUCAS - YES SIR

RIDGE - AND THIS IS ON THURSDAY MORNING?

LUCAS - UH-HUH

RIDGE - OKAY.

LUCAS - THE TWO SHOES HE GAVE ME, AND EVERYTHING

RIDGE - DID HE GIVE YOU SOME SHOES ON THAT THURSDAY MORNING?

LUCAS - UH-HUH

.......

more at link above ..

 

[gheckso]

Could you also provide evidence to support your belief that all top members of support and awareness funds are fully aware of the guilt of the 3?
I have never heard that claim before.