The Anthony Family: Who Might be the First to Tell the Truth?

[Solace]

I'll have to go back and watch that hearing again, but I am pretty sure that Cindy was caught in a lie on the stand... I know I caught it because I was like... whoa...whoa... whoa. She had said one thing earlier in her testimony and then said something completely different when she was asked about it by JB. I'm going to go re-watch it and I'll be back...

Oh, and she said that Caylee was alive! If that isn't a bold-faced lie, I don't know what is!

ETA: Anyone know where I can find the video of Cindy testifying at this hearing? I've looked everywhere and I can only seem to find clips of her testifying?

Lola,

I understand what you are saying. I am talking about her having to admit that George said it smelled like decomposition in the car. She has not admitted that until this courtroom appearance. As far as her saying Caylee is alive, all three are saying that and it is their opinion so really doesn't count. They are going to try and lie as much as possible. My post was meant to say they are going to be held to the truth in the areas where it is undeniable.

 

[RR0004]

I'm thinking if there was the right price tag attached (obviously long after the appeals are exhausted), they'd all be willing to tell the truth. Personally, they would need to be hooked up to a lie detector for me to believe a word of it...but if they're patient, that's where the real money can be made.

 

[justthinkin]

I know I'm fully in the minority here, and that's OK, but I think Casey will be the one to cave. I suppose when we're talking about "cracking" what we're really talking about is "breaking." They all are cracking, for various reasons, in various ways, and will most likely for years to come. Cracking is where the rampant emotions are seen in a limited and uncontrolled state but are forcefully throttled back and the exposing cracks and chasms filled in with any multitude of defense mechanisms, sealed once again against analysis and public disection. A "breaking" is where the wall, the shell, the facade, are not just shattered beyond repair, but beyond any care of repair. The internal pressures required to do this are, fortunately, beyond most people's understanding as it goes far beyond the emotional. The inner workings of the mind of a narcissistic sociopath is obviously not what anyone would call "normal," - neither is what breaks them. Casey is safe within herself as long as SHE sees herself, and her secrets, as hidden and controlled. She's done this, because she's been allowed to, all her life. Casey is not a super-human, more intelligent, or an emotional fortress without a conscience, - she's simply doing as she's always done, envisioned a reality and image of, and for, herself and ignored everything and everyone else that went against it. If she becomes aware that all of her dark and hidden corners are being being fully lit up and exposed to everyone, where she knows that everyone "sees" her, I expect her to shatter like cheap glass on a hard floor. I suspect, for this reason, for the prosecution to rip her apart from day one of the trial, but little to nothing before. I don't think Casey's ego, erected self-image, or soul, will hold out till the end.

I would love to be able to agree with you, but I cannot. Going back to a hearing with Judge Strickland, the day Ashton gave Casey a taste of laying out how Caylee might have died, Casey's reaction was of pure rage, and Jose and company had to get her under control quickly. I'm terrible with remembering people's names, but it was the first death penalty lawyer that grabbed her, and pulled her close. Later when Ashton wouldn't quit what he was saying, Casey could be heard to plead, "make him stop." You see, I believe, she knew Aston knew she was guilty, and she knows it of course, but she seemed so clueless as to believe if those in charge of her case are convinced of her innocence, it merits something--getting off. So her change in tune was directed for effect to her attorneys, just yet another group of suckers in her mind that she has to con.
This girl has ice in her veins period. Everything else is just for show.

 

[logicalgirl]

I'm thinking if there was the right price tag attached (obviously long after the appeals are exhausted), they'd all be willing to tell the truth. Personally, they would need to be hooked up to a lie detector for me to believe a word of it...but if they're patient, that's where the real money can be made.

I'm still thinking it's kind of a two pronged thing. As long as Cindy doesn't admit ICA is guilty, then she never has to finally admit at soul level that Caylee is truly dead and gone.

I am not a Cindy supporter. But it is my nature to look at someone who behaves like Cindy and think to myself "Why?" What is going on with you when the evidence clearly points to ICA.

Cindy has some definite character flaws, no doubt. But I sat myself down and wondered how long it would take me to accept that my daughter killed her child, my grand daughter, duct taped her nose, mouth and eyes, threw her in the trunk of her car, drove around with her until she was well into the decomposition process, then put her in three bags and threw her off the road like a piece of garbage. How long would that take me?

If I was a less stable person than I am, would I say anything, do anything, support anyone so I never had to admit our beautiful child was never coming back? Would I go with a kidnapping, a nanny or any other damn thing rather than picture how terrified little Caylee must have been and what a cruel way she was killed. If I could remember how she smelled, and how the shape of her little head felt when I stroked her hair, and when she put her hands on my face and told me everything would be all right, just like I used to do to her - how long would it take for me to finally shatter into a million pieces and finally accept ICA was guilty and Caylee was gone forever?

Could I ever do that?

 

[Mrs G Norris]

IMO it took Cindy about two days to accept the truth, ever since that day she has been lying her a$$ off. Also I still think it is possible that Casey might come out with the truth as a final assault against her mother, Cindy has positioned herself just perfectly for the truth from Casey to have maximum impact.

 

[logicalgirl]

IMO it took Cindy about two days to accept the truth, ever since that day she has been lying her a$$ off.

Cannot agree with you - maybe in that interview she did in November - when she looked so comatose however. But part of the equation is accepting that ICA did the deed - and there is no way this side of he77 she loves ICA that much.

Cindy is still hearing only what she wants to hear from Baez et al, however things will get pretty ugly during the trial. The circle will slowly close.

 

[justthinkin]

Cindy's bassakwards logic has changed course, and moved to the Caylee Marie is not dead because my daughter is not a murderer. Go figure. It's nuts.

Is it even possible this woman truly believes what she says about Caylee being alive? I really don't think so. I've seen way too much of Cindy that tells me she is closer in behavior to Casey, with the exception of murder, than she could ever hope to be to a normal human being. She is totally ruthless. She will do and say anything to save her , gag me, precious daughter who could give a flying flip about any of them. Poor Caylee. Between these two women, her death has never been about her, it's been about ICA and CA.

 

[seeing_eye]

Cindy's bassakwards logic has changed course, and moved to the Caylee Marie is not dead because my daughter is not a murderer. Go figure. It's nuts.

Is it even possible this woman truly believes what she says about Caylee being alive? I really don't think so. I've seen way too much of Cindy that tells me she is closer in behavior to Casey, with the exception of murder, than she could ever hope to be to a normal human being. She is totally ruthless. She will do and say anything to save her , gag me, precious daughter who could give a flying flip about any of them. Poor Caylee. Between these two women, her death has never been about her, it's been about ICA and CA.

IMO, Cindy does not believe Caylee is alive. She said she does because of an ulterior motive. She thinks it will help her daughter beat the rap. It's all about "reasonable doubt." (Doesn't matter that her belief does not provide any doubt, reasonable or otherwise, but she thinks it does.)

 

[RR0004]

I'm still thinking it's kind of a two pronged thing. As long as Cindy doesn't admit ICA is guilty, then she never has to finally admit at soul level that Caylee is truly dead and gone.

I am not a Cindy supporter. But it is my nature to look at someone who behaves like Cindy and think to myself "Why?" What is going on with you when the evidence clearly points to ICA.

Cindy has some definite character flaws, no doubt. But I sat myself down and wondered how long it would take me to accept that my daughter killed her child, my grand daughter, duct taped her nose, mouth and eyes, threw her in the trunk of her car, drove around with her until she was well into the decomposition process, then put her in three bags and threw her off the road like a piece of garbage. How long would that take me?

If I was a less stable person than I am, would I say anything, do anything, support anyone so I never had to admit our beautiful child was never coming back? Would I go with a kidnapping, a nanny or any other damn thing rather than picture how terrified little Caylee must have been and what a cruel way she was killed. If I could remember how she smelled, and how the shape of her little head felt when I stroked her hair, and when she put her hands on my face and told me everything would be all right, just like I used to do to her - how long would it take for me to finally shatter into a million pieces and finally accept ICA was guilty and Caylee was gone forever?

Could I ever do that?

If she could sell herself as the victim in all this along with Caylee- and she may very well have a right to own that- then, yes...I think 10 years down the road she could sell the truth.
jmo

 

[logicalgirl]

Cindy's bassakwards logic has changed course, and moved to the Caylee Marie is not dead because my daughter is not a murderer. Go figure. It's nuts.

Is it even possible this woman truly believes what she says about Caylee being alive? I really don't think so. I've seen way too much of Cindy that tells me she is closer in behavior to Casey, with the exception of murder, than she could ever hope to be to a normal human being. She is totally ruthless. She will do and say anything to save her , gag me, precious daughter who could give a flying flip about any of them. Poor Caylee. Between these two women, her death has never been about her, it's been about ICA and CA.

I wish I could agree with you for most of what you said but I sure agree with the first part I've bolded.

But the rest of it should be easy for me to accept, and I know it is the feeling of most of the posters, but it just doesn't settle easy into my brain.
People are creatures of habit, even how we react emotionally. Under great stress, we react the same - only magnified. Change the circumstances, the location, the people, but we follow the same patterns in how we react.

And there is nothing in Cindy's behavior that has demonstrated she will support ICA before Caylee. In fact, the opposite was true, which was what the animosity between the two women was all about.

Cindy has thrown a switch or something - there is nothing logical about this. Yes, you can tell me emotion isn't logical, but they actually are, and once we know what the patterns are - they are predictable. So I still don't think Cindy's behavior is all about saving ICA - something else is going on. I just can't quite "get it".

I'm going to be fascinated to watch her during the trial. I wouldn't be at all surprised if whatever "switch" has locked suddenly unfreezes and she throws herself at ICA and tries to tear her apart one day.

No, I'm not really crazy - this is just part of my "mulling" process. Because Cindy is not "in pattern."

 

[scotslass]

My first guess would be GA but only if they separate/divorce. I actually think Cindy will accept the truth once it is all laid out at trial or when KC is convicted and she will finally be able to grieve properly for Caylee. I'm not sure she will publicly tell the truth though, it is not in her previous nature.

Oddly enough as much CA repulses me with her antics, I think I can almost understand her. I can see why she has been in denial about KC for so many years and swallowed the BS she was spoon fed even when it was more than clear to anyone else that KC was a compulsive liar/thief/manipulator. Kc wasn't always like this not in her early years she was CA beautiful baby girl/little girl and that is the KC that CA remembers clings to and yearns for. It is this early bond that ties CA to KC and where all the emotions stem from. This is where KC has the power over her mom she just has to show her a glimpse of that child she once was and Cindy will do anything to have her back. It is this child that CA sees now and she can't see her doing any wrong and now only sees she is losing her. One day however CA will be strong enough to accept the truth and KC for what she has become..perhaps...jmo

 

[LancelotLink]

Seeing Eye
Yep. Why else would she send her "people" to the remains site to find Caylee on the same morning of the hastily thrown together meet and greet? These people are so transparently single minded.

 

[LancelotLink]

CA went into the interviews with LE and as they were trying to build a timeline, she was talking about Zanny as if she were real. She was in Tampa, they were at the Hardrock, the car wreck, talked about Jeff Hopkins, etc as if it was all real! She knew better. Besides knowing that the car was towed on June 30, dumped on the 27th, she knew Casey was lying on July 3 when she sent Lee to find her in Orlando, not Jax. And yet she tried to steer the investigation. She is not in denial, IMO. She should be in jail! I honestly think CA thinks she should be at he defense table, controlling this whole trial!

 

[tygomuk]

A year or two down the road (after May) one of the three free remaining A's will end up on Dr Phil and bygone it I have confidence he can crack one of them. When the GVS's, NG's, JVM's, GR's, etc. have all taken a pass on this strange family, Dr Phil will be happy to help drag them out of their funk and give them some more quality face time. :sick:

 

[LolaMoon08]

I want to stress one of the most telling lies Cindy has told during the past two and a half years. In Cindy's State Deposition Pt. 2 (starting on page 289), Cindy begins to tell the SA that she did not know anything about Dominic Casey being out in those woods, in November 2008, until AFTER Caylee's remains were found. She makes sure to tell the SA, at least a couple of times, that it was AFTER Caylee's remains were found.

In Lee's State Deposition (starting on page 351), Lee states that Cindy did know, prior to December 11th, 2008, that Dominic Casey had searched those woods. He knows this for fact because Cindy told him about it (in the Anthony kitchen). He again verifies that Cindy did know, prior to Dec. 11th, 2008, that DC had been out there in those woods after the State asks him "so definitely before December 11th?" and Lee replies "Yeah.... and so on..."

It is my opinion, that this PROVES that Cindy KNEW Caylee was out in those woods as early as November 2008. The video tape ALONE proves that DC KNEW that Caylee was in a black trash bag! I also think that at 5:43 on the DC video... if you pause it... the canvas laundry bag is right there underneath the pavers. That or some sort of beige fabric...

Makes me sick!

 

[OneLostGrl]

I wish I could agree with you for most of what you said but I sure agree with the first part I've bolded.

But the rest of it should be easy for me to accept, and I know it is the feeling of most of the posters, but it just doesn't settle easy into my brain.
People are creatures of habit, even how we react emotionally. Under great stress, we react the same - only magnified. Change the circumstances, the location, the people, but we follow the same patterns in how we react.

And there is nothing in Cindy's behavior that has demonstrated she will support ICA before Caylee. In fact, the opposite was true, which was what the animosity between the two women was all about.

Cindy has thrown a switch or something - there is nothing logical about this. Yes, you can tell me emotion isn't logical, but they actually are, and once we know what the patterns are - they are predictable. So I still don't think Cindy's behavior is all about saving ICA - something else is going on. I just can't quite "get it".

I'm going to be fascinated to watch her during the trial. I wouldn't be at all surprised if whatever "switch" has locked suddenly unfreezes and she throws herself at ICA and tries to tear her apart one day.

No, I'm not really crazy - this is just part of my "mulling" process. Because Cindy is not "in pattern."

How can you say she is not in pattern? She pretended she didn't know her daughter was pregnant for 7 months when it was crystal clear to everyone that saw the girl that she was pregnant. She allowed herself to be taken advantage of by not only Casey but by her husband for years, they lied to her.. they stole from her, they had no regard for her as a human being what-so-ever. But still she covered up for them, played along with their games for years. Under this stress she is clearly reacting the same.. making excuses for Casey's behavior, living in denial because the truth is just too painful to deal with. The circumstances haved changed (this time is much worse, someone has died) but she's still enabling the same person- which has quite clearly become her habit... her instinct.

I agree with you on two things though, her behavior is not about saving Casey (it's about saving herself from the truth- the pain- reality) and that if she ever lets the truth penetrate, Casey had better hope she's behind bars because she will probably tear that girl apart.

 

[LolaMoon08]

See, I see it as something much more simple... It is my opinion that Cindy has not only accepted that Casey has killed Caylee... but has also forgiven Casey for killing Caylee.

I think she is so angry and defensive because she believes that everyone should just leave it alone and let her deal with Casey like she always had. I think if Cindy had taken the time to calm down on July 15th, 2008... I believe she would have never, ever called 911. This is the same woman who was removing things from a car that smelled like there had been a damn dead body in the trunk, and washing them. She knew Casey had done something horrible... I don't think she would allow herself to completely associate that smell in Casey's car to Caylee... but she knew something was very wrong... and she NEEDED to see that it wasn't Caylee. I think as soon as Casey admitted that Caylee HAD been missing... she went into SHEER panic and it HIT HER... Caylee was dead. Casey had killed her. I think had she allowed Casey to sit down and calmly talk about it... we would have never heard about Caylee... at least not until SOMEONE... ANYONE... noticed that she was gone... there's no telling how long that would have been and what they would have come up with?

Yes, I do believe Cindy is capable of doing this!

 

[Leila]

I would love to be able to agree with you, but I cannot. Going back to a hearing with Judge Strickland, the day Ashton gave Casey a taste of laying out how Caylee might have died, Casey's reaction was of pure rage, and Jose and company had to get her under control quickly. I'm terrible with remembering people's names, but it was the first death penalty lawyer that grabbed her, and pulled her close. Later when Ashton wouldn't quit what he was saying, Casey could be heard to plead, "make him stop." You see, I believe, she knew Aston knew she was guilty, and she knows it of course, but she seemed so clueless as to believe if those in charge of her case are convinced of her innocence, it merits something--getting off. So her change in tune was directed for effect to her attorneys, just yet another group of suckers in her mind that she has to con.
This girl has ice in her veins period. Everything else is just for show.

I don't think Jose Baez has been forthright with Casey about her chances. Nor do I think the defense team has shared with Casey all the evidence the prosecution has. Casey believes (her pen-pal letters) that she will be acquitted and soon be basking on the beach in Miami. The one member of the defense team, Andrea Lyon, who I think would have counseled Casey on her chances, is no longer a member of the team. So I think Casey sits in that courtroom with very little knowledge of what's ahead.

I think we got a glimpse of what to expect at trial when Jeff Ashton made his comments about what might have been Caylee's last moments. Andrea Lyon put her arm around Casey and held her in check. Cindy left the courtroom.

When the trial gets underway (after jury selection) the prosecution will present their case, beginning with an opening statement, outlining what they believe happened and what evidence they'll present to support their belief.

For Casey, it will all be downhill from there. Each witness that takes the stand will be presenting evidence of what happened and her guilt. In addition to numerous police, the medical examiner, and forensic experts, many of Casey's former friends will be testifying about Casey's behavior. Casey will have to sit there and listen to Tony, Ricardo, Amy, Annie, Christina, and many others describe her activities, lies, and behavior. Casey's parents and brother will also testify.

Casey is not going to like what she hears. The defense will either have to have a doctor prescribe tranquilizers for Casey and hope that keeps her in check, or someone on the defense team will have to be prepared to muzzle Casey if she reacts emotionally towards any testimony or witnesses. I would think the defense would be preparing Casey for what to expect, but I have doubts about JB and CM's attention to details like this.

 

[Cabin girl]

I don't think any of them will "crack" and spill the truth, but I do think, while on the stand they will trip over their own lies exposing the truth that they are all liars.

 

[logicalgirl]

How can you say she is not in pattern? She pretended she didn't know her daughter was pregnant for 7 months when it was crystal clear to everyone that saw the girl that she was pregnant. She allowed herself to be taken advantage of by not only Casey but by her husband for years, they lied to her.. they stole from her, they had no regard for her as a human being what-so-ever. But still she covered up for them, played along with their games for years. Under this stress she is clearly reacting the same.. making excuses for Casey's behavior, living in denial because the truth is just too painful to deal with. The circumstances haved changed (this time is much worse, someone has died) but she's still enabling the same person- which has quite clearly become her habit... her instinct.

I agree with you on two things though, her behavior is not about saving Casey (it's about saving herself from the truth- the pain- reality) and that if she ever lets the truth penetrate, Casey had better hope she's behind bars because she will probably tear that girl apart.

Okay, I can see what you as saying as having value for me in trying to make sense of this mess, but we need to decide which one it is - because we are talking about opposites.

Is she Cindy the all controlling, or is she Cindy the doormat that everyone took advantage of? Those two are polar opposites. This is way beyond passive/aggressive behavior.

We have one statement from Brother Rick to say Cindy hid this pregnancy - this from a brother she obviously had an abrasive relationship with. Yet pictures of ICA/Caylee's bedroom shows pictures of ultrasounds taken pre-birth hanging on the wall. So do we know for sure the pregnancy was hidden for 7 months or do we know one MYOB statement to a nyah-nyah brother?