The Baby

[SeriouslySearching]

We also know they had an "intact" hand of the baby and surely DNA from his home. I think they have the evidence, but want to wait for more conclusive evidence for the record is all. Does anyone doubt the baby was his? Maybe Maria...but if she did...we will never know if she ever questioned it...however, the factual DNA will prove it all once and for all.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

We also know they had an "intact" hand of the baby and surely DNA from his home. I think they have the evidence, but want to wait for more conclusive evidence for the record is all. Does anyone doubt the baby was his? Maybe Maria...but if she did...we will never know if she ever questioned it...however, the factual DNA will prove it all once and for all.

For a long time I thought that Gabriel had to be his but now I am no longer sure.

Maria, herself, said Gabriel was not a product of rape so for her to discount that she had to have known that she had had sex with another person after then it seems to me. If not then surely she would have told them "that cannot be.... I haven't had sex with anyone after the rape allegations were made." (example)

imoo

 

[LillyRush]

Was she ever contending in her protection order or other reports that he was the father? I thought she was focusing on the rape, as far as he went, and the pregnancy was just an aside, possibly unrelated coincidence?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Was she ever contending in her protection order or other reports that he was the father? I thought she was focusing on the rape, as far as he went, and the pregnancy was just an aside, possibly unrelated coincidence?

Yes, I believe she was ...the MC said she rearranged her statement on November 5, 2007 and that is when she told them he was not a product of the rape allegations.

November 5th is also the same day she moved in with Dan Durham.

imo

 

[LillyRush]

Thanks, oceanblueeyes, that's what I thought at first. So far, Dan Durham has seem to portray himself as the friend who was just helping her out and felt bad for her situation. Interesting about the move-in date.

 

[panthera]

The last I heard is the DNA testing to determine who the father is has not been done. They said they are going to wait until Laurean returns.

Sounds real fishy to me since they can identify a deceased Marine or a soldier coming back from Iraq just from having a strand of their hair.

There is plenty of his DNA in his own home. I think they are stalling or the initial results weren't what they wanted so they are going to retest. I did find it interesting that Hudson ,I believe it was, said they would be testing potential father(s).

imoo

Hi Ocean! I think they might want to test him directly because the other test showed he wasn't the baby's father. Just MOO!

 

[STEADFAST]

The last I heard is the DNA testing to determine who the father is has not been done. They said they are going to wait until Laurean returns.

Sounds real fishy to me since they can identify a deceased Marine or a soldier coming back from Iraq just from having a strand of their hair.

There is plenty of his DNA in his own home. I think they are stalling or the initial results weren't what they wanted so they are going to retest. I did find it interesting that Hudson ,I believe it was, said they would be testing potential father(s).

imoo

The military takes samples for DNA testing during inprocessing, so they already have his DNA or the ability to test a blood sample for it. But they said they were going to wait to get a sample from him when he's brought back, so that there is no question about the source of the sample. (You can imagine what a defense lawyer could say about a blood sample taken at the same place on the same day as hundreds of others and stored for a couple of years.)

What I do not understand is why it is the military not Onslow County or the State of North Carolina that seems to be in charge of getting the DNA results. Maybe they can get results faster than the state? With all the suspicion surrounding the Marine Corps' handling of this case (which I don't necessarily share, personally) it just doesn't seem wise to have this forensic evidence coming from them.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

The military takes samples for DNA testing during in processing, so they already have his DNA or the ability to test a blood sample for it. But they said they were going to wait to get a sample from him when he's brought back, so that there is no question about the source of the sample. (You can imagine what a defense lawyer could say about a blood sample taken at the same place on the same day as hundreds of others and stored for a couple of years.)

What I do not understand is why it is the military not Onslow County or the State of North Carolina that seems to be in charge of getting the DNA results. Maybe they can get results faster than the state? With all the suspicion surrounding the Marine Corps' handling of this case (which I don't necessarily share, personally) it just doesn't seem wise to have this forensic evidence coming from them.

Hi Steadfast!

Actually DA Hudson doesn't seem to hold the same opinion as Congressman Turner and others, it seems. He has remarked that the MC did everything they were supposed to do in his opinion. Personally in NC right now I doubt any DA who has become gun shy because of the NiFong disaster would have even taken this case to a GJ based on no solid evidence to prove it BARD. I think Hudson is one of those DAs and feels there was not sufficient evidence.

I think that is one of the reasons the MC are keeping the rape allegations open so this is a technical way they can find out who the father of Gabriel is by at least doing DNA testing on CL. What is interesting is Hudson commented and used plural (fathers) when he spoke.

imoo

 

[ckhagen]

I don't typically follow this case, but FWIW ultrasounds are notoriously unreliable for weight predictions. The measurements used to determine weight are extremely finicky. I believe that after I think, 34 weeks, ultrasound weight estimates can be plus or minus 2lbs... which... with the average full term baby being around 8lbs... gives you a range of 6-10lbs... not too many babies are born outside that range anyway, so it's almost pointless to put any weight on that (pun intended, lol).

My son was predicted to be absolutely no more than 7.5 pounds on the day he was born, by the obstetrician and an ultrasound tech. He came out 10lbs 8oz.

My other observation in this thread is the factor of the baby's hand being visible. Has anyone considered that perhaps the baby's hand was actually the only part to be forced out by gasses or the fetal ejection reflex. Considering the gestational age of the baby, it could be very likely that the child was not yet in a head down position or was with an arm or arms raised, allowing the arm to be the first and subsequently only part to emerge.

 

[Crime-Dreamer]

Autopsy says sex of the baby cannot be derterminded. Read the autopsy itself and not news reports of the autopsy. Sex of the baby and paternity has not yet been released. Discription of the fetal remains are defined in the autopsy. It is on the media links thread.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Autopsy says sex of the baby cannot be determined. Read the autopsy itself and not news reports of the autopsy. Sex of the baby and paternity has not yet been released. Description of the fetal remains are defined in the autopsy. It is on the media links thread.

Yes, at the time of the autopsy the ME was unable to determine gender of the child however they will send off the fetal remains off for further testing to see if that can be determined. I think they will guesstimate the gestational age of the fetus by a 4 week window so we will never know if the January date was correct or February due date was imo.

Personally I think they have already run a preliminary test trying to determine if CL is the father and it either was inconclusive or he was not and they are waiting to get fresh DNA from him. I know if Gabriel is not his child that will be a big deal both on all the boards as well as in court.

imoo

 

[Snowlover77]

I know I have read that NCIS does not think CL is the father. I believe that is what I read anyway. I think the MC and the NCIS have completely different views of this case and what transpired through it all. It will be interesting to hear the evidence when it goes to trial. There is obviously alot that we do not know yet. Otherwise we wouldn't be having such a hard time trying to figure it all out. LOL! I do believe we are missing one huge piece of this puzzle.

 

[LillyRush]

I'm kind of surprised they haven't stated the results yet, or at least hinted at them.

How far along are they now in this process to extradite him back here?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I'm kind of surprised they haven't stated the results yet, or at least hinted at them.

How far along are they now in this process to extradite him back here?

Not one person is talking but his lawyer McNeil and he said he didn't really know that much about the extradition. He evidently doesn't know Spanish because he said there was a language barrier which I thought was strange. Surely there is someone he knows that can interpret it for him.

Personally I think they have done a test already and it either came back that Gabriel is not his or it was inconclusive and that is why they are using the excuse that they are going to wait until he comes back. McNeil says it maybe 1 to 3 years before this goes to trial.

It makes no sense they would wait all that time. His DNA was throughout his own home and they were in it the very day he left and could have easily obtained it.

I think they are stalling because they don't want the results leaked out.

imoo

 

[Crime-Dreamer]

Don't you think the state of NC already has run the DNA evidence? They have been asked that question and they don't deny it. They just say they are not trying to prove rape only murder. They do not say what the results are or if they have the results or if the results will be used to show motive. They will not answer the question. I have watched for it and listened for it because I heard they already have it and have had it for a while. Either way it could be motive for murder.

 

[Tom'sGirl]

Don't you think the state of NC already has run the DNA evidence? They have been asked that question and they don't deny it. They just say they are not trying to prove rape only murder. They do not say what the results are or if they have the results or if the results will be used to show motive. They will not answer the question. I have watched for it and listened for it because I heard they already have it and have had it for a while. Either way it could be motive for murder.

Of course they know the results, but until the trial I doubt that info. will ever be released.

It has however been speculated that the DNA of the unborn was NOT a match to CAL.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Don't you think the state of NC already has run the DNA evidence? They have been asked that question and they don't deny it. They just say they are not trying to prove rape only murder. They do not say what the results are or if they have the results or if the results will be used to show motive. They will not answer the question. I have watched for it and listened for it because I heard they already have it and have had it for a while. Either way it could be motive for murder.

I thought they said that they were waiting until Laurean returns to get his DNA? Why would they lie if they already have his DNA profile which would tell them whether he is Gabriel's father or not?

ETA: Also I am not sure the State can enter that evidence into the murder trial. Motive is not an element that has to be proven and isnt the State's burden.



imoo