The Crown v Gerard Baden-Clay, 24th June - Trial Day 9, Week 3

[PrimeSuspect]

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 33s
Prof Drummer says the usual starting dose is 50mg but can range up to 200mg. #badenclay


David Murray ‏@TheMurrayD 33s
Prof Drummer says Sertraline (Zoloft) starting dose is 50mg, can go up to 200mg #badenclay

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 40s
Prof Drummer says you can develop a tolerance to the side effects of sertraline. #badenclay

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 41s
Prof Drummer says patients can start with a low dose and doctors might increase it to achieve more of an effect. #badenclay



David Murray ‏@TheMurrayD 45s
Zoloft can make some people drowsy, others quite awake. Can develop a tolerance to side effects with time #badenclay

 

[Amee]

2:38pm: Court has resumed.

The 60th witness Professor Olaf Drummer, from the Victorian Institute of Forensic Medicine, has been called to give evidence by phone.

He examined the results of toxicology tests on Mrs Baden-Clay.

Read more: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...ay-9-week-3-20140624-3apn6.html#ixzz35WpSJ1xH

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 1m
Prof Drummer says sertraline is relatively non-toxic. #badenclay

 

[PrimeSuspect]

David Murray ‏@TheMurrayD 1m
A relatively non toxic drug but if misused can cause significant side effects - Prof Drummer #badenclay

David Murray ‏@TheMurrayD 28s
Prof Drummer: Drug acts on brain but it appears in body tissues, fat, muscles etc #badenclay


Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 49s
Prof Drummer says .1mg up to .3mg per litre of blood would be normal in someone taking sertraline. #badenclay

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 53s
Prof Drummer says those concentrations will change throughout the course of the day. #badenclay


David Murray ‏@TheMurrayD 50s
Prof Drummer explaining how Sertraline concentration increases after death #badenclay


Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 36s
Prof Drummer says the levels of sertraline in the blood will increase after death because it will move from tissues to blood. #badenclay

 

[DrWatson]

Looks like they're going to get Olaf Drummer to testify all that stuff about post-mortem redistribution and normal liver levels etc that was used at the second bail hearing to put paid to the overdose theory

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 33s
Prof Drummer says sertraline is "not particularly" a toxic substance. #badenclay


Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 31s
Prof Drummer says a sertraline overdose is very rare and usually involves other drugs or someone who is unhealthy. #badenclay

 

[BreakingNews]

There is a very select crew of folks who get the 'Alison wanted a son' thing... and each and every one of them gets this statement from Gerard.. not a single soul has Alison claiming this to anyone, at anytime.. . .. .

Sorry Trooper, but Mrs Dickie was asked this last week. She replied "What mother wouldn't want a boy after having 2 girls." It is a normal thing to want at least one of each, at least for most mothers.

 

[PrimeSuspect]

David Murray ‏@TheMurrayD 53s
Prof Drummer says Sertraline overdose cases were very rare, were all in combination with other drugs or factors #badenclay


Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 1m
Prof Drummer says there is no record he could find of someone dying from an overdose of sertraline alone. #badenclay

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 1m
Prof Drummer says the liver concentration of sertraline is usually higher than in the blood. #badenclay

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 1m
Prof Drummer says Allison had a blood alcohol level of .095. He says it could have been from post mortem changes in the body. #badenclay

 

[DrWatson]

Looks like they're going to get Olaf Drummer to testify all that stuff about post-mortem redistribution and normal liver levels etc that was used at the second bail hearing to put paid to the overdose theory

Yup - excuse me quoting myself here. But here it goes - this is all the stuff that we found and discussed right here just before the second bail hearing, and that was presented to the court by Rob Hoskins at that time. Even better to have a forensic toxicologist do it now - YEAY

This should blow away any ideas of an overdose of Zoloft...!:loveyou:

 

[PrimeSuspect]

David Murray ‏@TheMurrayD 1m
Blood alcohol level .095, very common with decomposition - Prof Drummer #badenclay


Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 1m
Prof Drummer says it is quite common to find alcohol concentrations in a body that has been exposed to the elements. #badenclay

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 1m
Prof Drummer says the concentration of sertraline in Allison's blood was on the "higher side" clinically. #badenclay


Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 57s
Prof Drummer says the levels could have been affected by the decomposition of the body. #badenclay

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 1m
Prof Drummer says the sample was from the liver. Liver readings would have been higher. #badenclay

David Murray ‏@TheMurrayD 44s
Prof Drummer is discussing Allison's Sertraline levels, says blood samples are on the higher side of clinical use #badenclay



Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 57s
Prof Drummer says he would never rule out death from sertraline alone but says it would be "very unusual". #badenclay

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 57s
Prof Drummer says he would expect much higher levels of sertraline in Allison's blood if she'd overdosed. #badenclay


Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 1m
Prof Drummer says he does not believe the levels of sertraline in Allison's blood caused her death. #badenclay

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 34s
Prof Drummer is now being questioned by the defence. #badenclay

 

[PrimeSuspect]

David Murray ‏@TheMurrayD 53s
Prof Drummer says from the sertraline levels, he doesn't believe the drug had any contribution to Allison's death #badenclay


Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 45s
Defence says if on 100mg per day, the average person would have .03mg and highest .05mg in their blood. Prof Drummer says .1. #badenclay

 

[DrWatson]

Any bets that the defence will try to argue Prof Drummer's figures or expertise?

 

[PrimeSuspect]

David Murray ‏@TheMurrayD 1m
Defence says side effects include agitation, anxiety, paranoia, abnormal thinking. He says its possible but not common #badenclay


Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 53s
Defence asks whether side effects of Sertraline are agitation, anxiety, paranoia, abnormal thinking. Prof Drummer says sometimes. #badenclay



Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 50s
Defence asks whether people on anti depressants are more likely to commit suicide. Prof Drummer says there is no "clear" link. #badenclay




Haha! Take that!

 

[PrimeSuspect]

David Murray ‏@TheMurrayD 56s
Defence asks about serotonin syndrome. Prof Drummer agrees it can cause confusion, anxiety agitation, delirium #badenclay


David Murray ‏@TheMurrayD 1m
But Prof Drummer says it wouldn't be expected from people taking normal doses of Sertraline #badenclay


Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 47s
Defence asks whether Sertraline can cause serotonin syndrome. Prof Drummer agrees it can. #badenclay

 

[Timmy]

I would love to ask GBC what his thoughts are on how Allison died.

Does he believe that
1. Allison went for her usual morning walk and decided some time during that to overdose on her depression medication? Or
2. After getting home from hairdressers, washing lunch boxes , watching some of the footy show... Does she wait until after GBC goes to bed and then kill herself somehow?

I have had 2 family members commit suicide and with both of them it was very obvious (albeit with the benefit of hindsight) to their close family that something was not right and they were in a downward spiral.