the friend theory

[no_mystery]

The Intruder Theory and the Burke Theory don't fit, and many pieces of the John/Patsy Theory don't fit, either.
But why?

If John and or Patsy did not kill JonBenet, we'd have to explain:
-Why was the letter almost certainly written by Patsy? The handwriting, upon visual inspection, is almost an exact match for her left-hand sample.
-The only prints on the letter were from Patsy and its LE handlers. It is highly improbable, if not impossible, for the writer to have not left fingerprints on the papers while writing.
-The garotte had a handle made from a missing chunk of one of Patsy's paintbrushes.
-Fragments consistent with a piece of the paintbrush were found in her vaginal canal indicating foreign object assault.
-Why have they both walked back statements, especially John, and been uncooperative with police in the past, while willing to speak to the media?
-Why has John seemingly never asked any important questions? When asked why Fleet White turned against him- and even threatened his wellbeing (re: his brother saying "get out your gun, Fleet is coming") John says he "forgets" why this happened. When asked about the remaining DNA and why it hasn't been tested, he says he has never asked.
-Why did he say Burke got up again that night, and even told this to Dr. Phil, only to deny it later and claim having no knowledge of this?

But if they did kill JonBenet, we'd have to ask this:
-Why? It wasn't premeditated. Accident? Possible.
-Why was the suspicious underwear DNA not linked to them?
-Why are some pieces of the crime scene missing? The other third of the paintbrush used in JonBenet's assault cannot be found. The source of the rope cannot be found. A matching boot to the boot print cannot be found. Other evidence seems to be missing, re: the cloth used to wipe JBR's vaginal area, potentially the weapon that caused the head trauma, etc.

If Burke did kill JonBenet, besides the obvious (children HAVE killed before, but it is more rare than parents killing their kids), we'd have to explain:
-Why did they not find his DNA on her?
-Why was she sexually assaulted, not only around the time of death but potentially prior, as well? If we believe he killed her in a fit of rage, it is even less believable that he'd also be sexually violent at his age, or that their parents would go through with such horrible acts to cover up a murder.
-If he had a track record of harming JBR, why did she sneak out of her room to sleep in his extra bed so often? Children forgive their caregivers, not their siblings- not like that.
-Where is the proof he was violent? (Tangible proof)

I think none of the pieces fit into any puzzle because all of it, and none of it, is entirely true.

What if the Ramseys didn't kill her themselves, but they had molested her before, and perhaps allowed a friend to do so, too?
This would explain why the evidence of an intruder is extremely minimal, but the DNA found on JBR matches an unknown male, and DNA under her fingernail matches an unknown female, too.
What if there was an accident of some sort when JBR was being molested by one of these "friends" of her parents, and they had to cover it up?
That would explain the ransom note almost certainly being written by Patsy, and it would explain why the paintbrush JBR was abused with came from the home.
If the perp(s) left after she died, and perhaps around the time of the cover-up, that explains why some of the materials used in her killing are gone. It would explain the mystery boot print, too.

What if they shielded Burke and made him so antisocial and so emotionally numb because he did see, know, or suspect something- something the Ramseys + "Friend" did? In his 2016 Dr. Phil interview, Dr. Phil presses him about not getting up when his mom and a cop came into his bedroom freaking out that morning. He says "I didn't want to know/I felt safer there (in bed)." That doesn't say guilty to me, it says bad home life. Not "you didn't want to know because you did it" but that he didn't want to know because there was a pattern of frightening behavior on his parents/family friends part re: JBR, and he felt powerless and scared.

But who on Earth would do such a thing? Sicko parents.
Which of their friends would do such a thing? I don't know, but consider the following:

- John lied/misled re: seeing the Stines that night (last stop before home)
- John insisted that the Stines were not close friends, despite Susan being close with Patsy.
- They did not call the Stines when they found the ransom note, but they did call many other families they had visited the day prior. The Stines had seen them last and would be the most helpful of the group. If they're truly not close, that could make sense, but if they're not close...
-Why did the Ramseys stay with the Stines after the murder?
-Why did the Stines go to Georgia [permanently] shortly after the Ramseys?
-Why did Susan Stine involve herself so deeply in matters considering the Ramseys?
-Why did Susan not allow the police inside after the "accidental" 911 call on December 23, 1996?
-WHY DID SUSAN STINE IMPERSONATE THE BOULDER POLICE CHIEF TO PUSH THE INTRUDER THEORY?

re: The Whites.
-John insisted they were close, but they fell out very quickly after the murder. In fact, it got so bad that John's brother kicked him out of his home in Georgia, and made the "get a gun" comment.
-John won't say what happened; he only shifts blame to Fleet White in the Ashley Flowers interview. "Fleet was a suspect..."
-Why did Fleet call 911 on December 23?
-Why did the Whites become convinced the Ramseys were involved in the murder of JBR?

Additionally, something very interesting I noticed in the Ashley Flowers interview: when discussing Fleet White and his "freakout" so to speak, Ashley Flowers inquires more. First, John- for no clear reason- says that Fleet was "a better sailor than [him]." Ashley points out that he- John- was also a Navy sailor, to which John says "that doesn't matter."
- Does he want us to connect the knot on the garrote with Fleet and his Navy experience?
Just moments later, John explains that Fleet's horrible reaction following JBR's murder was because he handled stress poorly, and says that he had to take over a sailboat from Fleet due to his freaking out about sailing conditions. Immediately after claiming he was a better sailor than he.

And finally....

The Grand Jury indicted both John and Patsy on counts related to allowing the endangerment of JBR leading to her death.

John Ramsey has a very sly way of slyly deflecting bits of blame onto other people, and planting seeds of questionable doubt of his guilt.
John claims he knows who killed his daughter. But John also allows the theory of Intruder, Burke, and even his friends and Patsy be considered...re: he talks about the doll Patsy got that was "identical" to JBR and how it looked like a dead JBR in a casket. Why would you say that?

None of it makes sense, but I believe, truly, that there is no way in hell John and Patsy don't know what happened to JBR. And that means knowing where the missing items went, who the DNA belongs to, and who killed her, if not themselves, with or without others.

 

[Skully]

Good post! I don't think the family did this, but it's not a popular theory here. I remember Mark Lunsford and how the press and public crucified him over his daughter Jessica. Everyone was convinced he killed his daugther and or his dad was involved. It killed him. They got the guy, it was a SO living across the street in a trailer, not registered and he took her out of her bedroom, while grandpa was home, SA her, and buried her next to the trailer, alive. I never judge it now. You have to have proof. Solid proof. I have known other cases, one I personally help work that what we thought was not what happened and in the end we got the right guy.

 

[Marysmith]

Good post! I don't think the family did this, but it's not a popular theory here. I remember Mark Lunsford and how the press and public crucified him over his daughter Jessica. Everyone was convinced he killed his daugther and or his dad was involved. It killed him. They got the guy, it was a SO living across the street in a trailer, not registered and he took her out of her bedroom, while grandpa was home, SA her, and buried her next to the trailer, alive. I never judge it now. You have to have proof. Solid proof. I have known other cases, one I personally help work that what we thought was not what happened and in the end we got the right guy.

I will never forget Jessica and Mark Lunsford. That broke him. And is one of the most nightmare crimes ever committed.
I don't think the Ramsey's killed their daughter or sister either for what it's worth.

 

[Styngyn]

The Intruder Theory and the Burke Theory don't fit, and many pieces of the John/Patsy Theory don't fit, either.
But why?

If John and or Patsy did not kill JonBenet, we'd have to explain:
-Why was the letter almost certainly written by Patsy? The handwriting, upon visual inspection, is almost an exact match for her left-hand sample.
-The only prints on the letter were from Patsy and its LE handlers. It is highly improbable, if not impossible, for the writer to have not left fingerprints on the papers while writing.
-The garotte had a handle made from a missing chunk of one of Patsy's paintbrushes.
-Fragments consistent with a piece of the paintbrush were found in her vaginal canal indicating foreign object assault.
-Why have they both walked back statements, especially John, and been uncooperative with police in the past, while willing to speak to the media?
-Why has John seemingly never asked any important questions? When asked why Fleet White turned against him- and even threatened his wellbeing (re: his brother saying "get out your gun, Fleet is coming") John says he "forgets" why this happened. When asked about the remaining DNA and why it hasn't been tested, he says he has never asked.
-Why did he say Burke got up again that night, and even told this to Dr. Phil, only to deny it later and claim having no knowledge of this?

But if they did kill JonBenet, we'd have to ask this:
-Why? It wasn't premeditated. Accident? Possible.
-Why was the suspicious underwear DNA not linked to them?
-Why are some pieces of the crime scene missing? The other third of the paintbrush used in JonBenet's assault cannot be found. The source of the rope cannot be found. A matching boot to the boot print cannot be found. Other evidence seems to be missing, re: the cloth used to wipe JBR's vaginal area, potentially the weapon that caused the head trauma, etc.

If Burke did kill JonBenet, besides the obvious (children HAVE killed before, but it is more rare than parents killing their kids), we'd have to explain:
-Why did they not find his DNA on her?
-Why was she sexually assaulted, not only around the time of death but potentially prior, as well? If we believe he killed her in a fit of rage, it is even less believable that he'd also be sexually violent at his age, or that their parents would go through with such horrible acts to cover up a murder.
-If he had a track record of harming JBR, why did she sneak out of her room to sleep in his extra bed so often? Children forgive their caregivers, not their siblings- not like that.
-Where is the proof he was violent? (Tangible proof)

I think none of the pieces fit into any puzzle because all of it, and none of it, is entirely true.

What if the Ramseys didn't kill her themselves, but they had molested her before, and perhaps allowed a friend to do so, too?
This would explain why the evidence of an intruder is extremely minimal, but the DNA found on JBR matches an unknown male, and DNA under her fingernail matches an unknown female, too.
What if there was an accident of some sort when JBR was being molested by one of these "friends" of her parents, and they had to cover it up?
That would explain the ransom note almost certainly being written by Patsy, and it would explain why the paintbrush JBR was abused with came from the home.
If the perp(s) left after she died, and perhaps around the time of the cover-up, that explains why some of the materials used in her killing are gone. It would explain the mystery boot print, too.

What if they shielded Burke and made him so antisocial and so emotionally numb because he did see, know, or suspect something- something the Ramseys + "Friend" did? In his 2016 Dr. Phil interview, Dr. Phil presses him about not getting up when his mom and a cop came into his bedroom freaking out that morning. He says "I didn't want to know/I felt safer there (in bed)." That doesn't say guilty to me, it says bad home life. Not "you didn't want to know because you did it" but that he didn't want to know because there was a pattern of frightening behavior on his parents/family friends part re: JBR, and he felt powerless and scared.

But who on Earth would do such a thing? Sicko parents.
Which of their friends would do such a thing? I don't know, but consider the following:

- John lied/misled re: seeing the Stines that night (last stop before home)
- John insisted that the Stines were not close friends, despite Susan being close with Patsy.
- They did not call the Stines when they found the ransom note, but they did call many other families they had visited the day prior. The Stines had seen them last and would be the most helpful of the group. If they're truly not close, that could make sense, but if they're not close...
-Why did the Ramseys stay with the Stines after the murder?
-Why did the Stines go to Georgia [permanently] shortly after the Ramseys?
-Why did Susan Stine involve herself so deeply in matters considering the Ramseys?
-Why did Susan not allow the police inside after the "accidental" 911 call on December 23, 1996?
-WHY DID SUSAN STINE IMPERSONATE THE BOULDER POLICE CHIEF TO PUSH THE INTRUDER THEORY?

re: The Whites.
-John insisted they were close, but they fell out very quickly after the murder. In fact, it got so bad that John's brother kicked him out of his home in Georgia, and made the "get a gun" comment.
-John won't say what happened; he only shifts blame to Fleet White in the Ashley Flowers interview. "Fleet was a suspect..."
-Why did Fleet call 911 on December 23?
-Why did the Whites become convinced the Ramseys were involved in the murder of JBR?

Additionally, something very interesting I noticed in the Ashley Flowers interview: when discussing Fleet White and his "freakout" so to speak, Ashley Flowers inquires more. First, John- for no clear reason- says that Fleet was "a better sailor than [him]." Ashley points out that he- John- was also a Navy sailor, to which John says "that doesn't matter."
- Does he want us to connect the knot on the garrote with Fleet and his Navy experience?
Just moments later, John explains that Fleet's horrible reaction following JBR's murder was because he handled stress poorly, and says that he had to take over a sailboat from Fleet due to his freaking out about sailing conditions. Immediately after claiming he was a better sailor than he.

And finally....

The Grand Jury indicted both John and Patsy on counts related to allowing the endangerment of JBR leading to her death.

John Ramsey has a very sly way of slyly deflecting bits of blame onto other people, and planting seeds of questionable doubt of his guilt.
John claims he knows who killed his daughter. But John also allows the theory of Intruder, Burke, and even his friends and Patsy be considered...re: he talks about the doll Patsy got that was "identical" to JBR and how it looked like a dead JBR in a casket. Why would you say that?

None of it makes sense, but I believe, truly, that there is no way in hell John and Patsy don't know what happened to JBR. And that means knowing where the missing items went, who the DNA belongs to, and who killed her, if not themselves, with or without others.

Good summary. Well researched.

One question: Where does this come from?
WHY DID SUSAN STINE IMPERSONATE THE BOULDER POLICE CHIEF TO PUSH THE INTRUDER THEORY?

 

[penelopemcswain]

The Intruder Theory and the Burke Theory don't fit, and many pieces of the John/Patsy Theory don't fit, either.
But why?

If John and or Patsy did not kill JonBenet, we'd have to explain:
-Why was the letter almost certainly written by Patsy? The handwriting, upon visual inspection, is almost an exact match for her left-hand sample.
-The only prints on the letter were from Patsy and its LE handlers. It is highly improbable, if not impossible, for the writer to have not left fingerprints on the papers while writing.
-The garotte had a handle made from a missing chunk of one of Patsy's paintbrushes.
-Fragments consistent with a piece of the paintbrush were found in her vaginal canal indicating foreign object assault.
-Why have they both walked back statements, especially John, and been uncooperative with police in the past, while willing to speak to the media?
-Why has John seemingly never asked any important questions? When asked why Fleet White turned against him- and even threatened his wellbeing (re: his brother saying "get out your gun, Fleet is coming") John says he "forgets" why this happened. When asked about the remaining DNA and why it hasn't been tested, he says he has never asked.
-Why did he say Burke got up again that night, and even told this to Dr. Phil, only to deny it later and claim having no knowledge of this?

But if they did kill JonBenet, we'd have to ask this:
-Why? It wasn't premeditated. Accident? Possible.
-Why was the suspicious underwear DNA not linked to them?
-Why are some pieces of the crime scene missing? The other third of the paintbrush used in JonBenet's assault cannot be found. The source of the rope cannot be found. A matching boot to the boot print cannot be found. Other evidence seems to be missing, re: the cloth used to wipe JBR's vaginal area, potentially the weapon that caused the head trauma, etc.

If Burke did kill JonBenet, besides the obvious (children HAVE killed before, but it is more rare than parents killing their kids), we'd have to explain:
-Why did they not find his DNA on her?
-Why was she sexually assaulted, not only around the time of death but potentially prior, as well? If we believe he killed her in a fit of rage, it is even less believable that he'd also be sexually violent at his age, or that their parents would go through with such horrible acts to cover up a murder.
-If he had a track record of harming JBR, why did she sneak out of her room to sleep in his extra bed so often? Children forgive their caregivers, not their siblings- not like that.
-Where is the proof he was violent? (Tangible proof)

I think none of the pieces fit into any puzzle because all of it, and none of it, is entirely true.

What if the Ramseys didn't kill her themselves, but they had molested her before, and perhaps allowed a friend to do so, too?
This would explain why the evidence of an intruder is extremely minimal, but the DNA found on JBR matches an unknown male, and DNA under her fingernail matches an unknown female, too.
What if there was an accident of some sort when JBR was being molested by one of these "friends" of her parents, and they had to cover it up?
That would explain the ransom note almost certainly being written by Patsy, and it would explain why the paintbrush JBR was abused with came from the home.
If the perp(s) left after she died, and perhaps around the time of the cover-up, that explains why some of the materials used in her killing are gone. It would explain the mystery boot print, too.

What if they shielded Burke and made him so antisocial and so emotionally numb because he did see, know, or suspect something- something the Ramseys + "Friend" did? In his 2016 Dr. Phil interview, Dr. Phil presses him about not getting up when his mom and a cop came into his bedroom freaking out that morning. He says "I didn't want to know/I felt safer there (in bed)." That doesn't say guilty to me, it says bad home life. Not "you didn't want to know because you did it" but that he didn't want to know because there was a pattern of frightening behavior on his parents/family friends part re: JBR, and he felt powerless and scared.

But who on Earth would do such a thing? Sicko parents.
Which of their friends would do such a thing? I don't know, but consider the following:

- John lied/misled re: seeing the Stines that night (last stop before home)
- John insisted that the Stines were not close friends, despite Susan being close with Patsy.
- They did not call the Stines when they found the ransom note, but they did call many other families they had visited the day prior. The Stines had seen them last and would be the most helpful of the group. If they're truly not close, that could make sense, but if they're not close...
-Why did the Ramseys stay with the Stines after the murder?
-Why did the Stines go to Georgia [permanently] shortly after the Ramseys?
-Why did Susan Stine involve herself so deeply in matters considering the Ramseys?
-Why did Susan not allow the police inside after the "accidental" 911 call on December 23, 1996?
-WHY DID SUSAN STINE IMPERSONATE THE BOULDER POLICE CHIEF TO PUSH THE INTRUDER THEORY?

re: The Whites.
-John insisted they were close, but they fell out very quickly after the murder. In fact, it got so bad that John's brother kicked him out of his home in Georgia, and made the "get a gun" comment.
-John won't say what happened; he only shifts blame to Fleet White in the Ashley Flowers interview. "Fleet was a suspect..."
-Why did Fleet call 911 on December 23?
-Why did the Whites become convinced the Ramseys were involved in the murder of JBR?

Additionally, something very interesting I noticed in the Ashley Flowers interview: when discussing Fleet White and his "freakout" so to speak, Ashley Flowers inquires more. First, John- for no clear reason- says that Fleet was "a better sailor than [him]." Ashley points out that he- John- was also a Navy sailor, to which John says "that doesn't matter."
- Does he want us to connect the knot on the garrote with Fleet and his Navy experience?
Just moments later, John explains that Fleet's horrible reaction following JBR's murder was because he handled stress poorly, and says that he had to take over a sailboat from Fleet due to his freaking out about sailing conditions. Immediately after claiming he was a better sailor than he.

And finally....

The Grand Jury indicted both John and Patsy on counts related to allowing the endangerment of JBR leading to her death.

John Ramsey has a very sly way of slyly deflecting bits of blame onto other people, and planting seeds of questionable doubt of his guilt.
John claims he knows who killed his daughter. But John also allows the theory of Intruder, Burke, and even his friends and Patsy be considered...re: he talks about the doll Patsy got that was "identical" to JBR and how it looked like a dead JBR in a casket. Why would you say that?

None of it makes sense, but I believe, truly, that there is no way in hell John and Patsy don't know what happened to JBR. And that means knowing where the missing items went, who the DNA belongs to, and who killed her, if not themselves, with or without others.

Sorry, you honestly think a mother of a young child would go so far as to write a several page ransom note to protect a friend she'd been allowing to molest and now murder? For what? What would Patsy be getting out of it? Why wouldn't she just turn on the "friend" and turn them in?

 

[penelopemcswain]

I think we can honestly only come to two conclusions here: either this was done by an unknown person (who probably was waiting in the house while the Ramseys were gone) and that all of the weirdness with the Ramseys & co. is just meaningless weirdness, or that a lot of the evidence is incorrect somehow, and they did it.

In any case, I do think a lot of the "evidence" the public has gotten has been wrong / sensationalized / misinterpreted as is often the case.

 

[ekc]

Sorry, you honestly think a mother of a young child would go so far as to write a several page ransom note to protect a friend she'd been allowing to molest and now murder? For what? What would Patsy be getting out of it? Why wouldn't she just turn on the "friend" and turn them in?

no finger prints on the paper were not found..but you cannot write a note that long without laying the side of your hand on it...i dont think. touch or contact dna.
but that note took some thinking and plotting it correctly ample time allotted so were there any rubber gloves around...just a thought