The Front Door!

[Goody]

I have to discount her really having anything to hold over his head though. There is nothing as bad as murdering her children and once she was convicted, enough time had passed that he could then just say, she is desperate and making stuff up. And, if she gets serious about pointing fingers at him, that is exactly what he will say. A dead woman walking will say anything.

I agree, Cowgirl, and said as much in my last post.

 

[Goody]

I agree 100%! And I love this line... "so the minute he saw trampy, I mean Darlie, he fell in "love"... Soooo true. The only thing I might change is substituting "lust" for "love". When you look at Darin's mom (Sarilda?), and then you look at Darlie, you are light years apart in appearance. I bet he felt like he had married a movie star when he "won" his prized Darlie. And, as you said, once her chest was supporting melons, he never had a clear thought again. The whole story is just so strange and sad that, even after all these years, I still want to hear one of them tell the truth. Won't ever happen! But I would love to hear it nonetheless.

I really don't think Darlie was a tramp. Vamp might be more like it. I think she was insecure and terrified of losing Darin. Many insecure people who feel inadequate want to be famous and dream of becoming movie stars or singers. They think that they themselves have nothing to offer but if only they were famous and loved by millions, they would prove their self worth and truly have something to offer. I think Darlie's aspirations support just how insecure and inadequate she really felt.

Did you know that Darlie was already quite busty before the implants? According to one book author, a relative of Darin's said that he was the one who wanted the breast implants.

I do believe though that he thought Darlie was star quality. In many ways she was his trophy wife. That must have added to her feelings of inadequacy. It is so apparent in many of the things he says.

 

[Goody]

Goody has spoken about Darlie liking pretty things, quiet things. Remember those silly pix of the boys posing like dolls in their white tuxes? How much longer do you think she'd be able to talk them into taking a photo like that again? Most likely never! The poor things. They weren't children to her or maybe Darin either. They were something to show off, "see how pretty my boys are?" There's your theory right there Heart, the boys were disposable. They weren't quiet and pretty anymore, they were growing up, especially Devon.

Did you see that photo where the boys are sticking out their tongues? I think that she sent a lot of mixed messages to the kids as young parents often do without realizing it. On her "up" days, she expected one thing from them, and on her "down" days, it was something else altogether. In one way, they were praised for bad behavior (like in the photo) and in others, bad behavior was met with anger and temper bursts (as in the emptying of the hot tub). I think Darlie was having a much worse time of it in parenting than they want us to believe.

 

[Goody]

Beesy, I agree re them having similar words during their fight earlier in the evening. I believe I've even outlined a similar scenario on another thread. I still think there was some kind of talk after Darin came downstairs, no matter how brief... something to the effect of, "omygawd, Darlie, how could you have done this... what are we going to do now... oh geez, we've got to make it look like someone else did this to you and the boys." And it went from there, no matter how ill thought out their plan was.

I agree, Heart. I think Darin is much more involved than most think.

 

[HeartofTexas]

I didn't mean trampy in the literal sense... but in the figurative, as in cheap looking, dressing like a hooker (IMO). From what I hear, she was faithful to Darin... so, no, she wasn't a tramp. I think the only security Darlie had was in her appearance... but even that wasn't enough because she kept having to "up the ante" so to speak... dying her hair not just blonde, but bleached blonde. And I'm not sure who requested the melons, but surely there is something not quite right about someone who chooses either DD or EE for the breast augmentation size. Geez, that is huge. Beyond huge. So, whether he requested them, or she did, they're both nuts IMO. They are beyond garish! And, again IMO, I never saw her on TV that she wasn't flaunting them like they were her prized possessions. I read somewhere today that she wasn't sexually molested but, in my experience, she screams out that someone took advantage of her while growing up. She has all the classic signs and symptoms. As you said, she's a very insecure woman. Very.

 

[justice2]

OK, guys, ms. newbie here. What's the hot tub story and/or where can I find it.


I can't see Darlie really leaving Darin. What would she do? For a job, a place to live, no child support, assuming the business was about to bust. Live with momma Darlie? I can see her threatening, but I would think Darin would know she was just munipulating him. I can't see him leaving her either, not at all.

 

[Goody]

They are beyond garish! And, again IMO, I never saw her on TV that she wasn't flaunting them like they were her prized possessions. I read somewhere today that she wasn't sexually molested but, in my experience, she screams out that someone took advantage of her while growing up. She has all the classic signs and symptoms. As you said, she's a very insecure woman. Very.

There is one story about Darlie's stepfather (Dana's father) molesting Darlie once when she was in her early teens or preteens. It is said that he fondled her. It is a weak accusation, imo. I am not even sure I believe it happened or that if it did, it wasn't just one of those accidental touches that got blown out of porportion. I think it would take a lot more than that to cause the kind of damage you are talking about though.

Darlie wasn't promiscuous, which I think is usually the symptom girls who have been sexually abused demonstrate, but some reason she believed she had to do something or be something special in order to be accepted and loved. I think those feelings could come from many different dysfunctional problems growing up. Girls from divorced homes and girls from poor families have also demonstrated such inferior feelings. I think she just learned early that sex could be her ticket to the nice things in life she wanted. And she may have believed that she had nothing else to offer but a beautiful body.

 

[Goody]

OK, guys, ms. newbie here. What's the hot tub story and/or where can I find it..

It is in the trial testimony. I think both Darlie and Darin addressed it, each saying the other was the one upset by it. The boys had apparently gotten into it that afternoon or early evening and splashed half the water out of it. Patricia Springer, I think, addressed it in her book, saying the neighbor heard Darlie cussing the boys through the fence. She called them little MFers and said they were really going to get it now. I imagine the cost of refilling it was a big deal.

I can't see Darlie really leaving Darin. What would she do? For a job, a place to live, no child support, assuming the business was about to bust. Live with momma Darlie? I can see her threatening, but I would think Darin would know she was just munipulating him. I can't see him leaving her either, not at all.

I agree. Neither of them would leave the other unless the whole relationship just blew apart, and there is no evidence of that at all. They had their differences, but I don't think the so called "separation request" even existed. And if it did, it was probably just part of their "dramatic BS" as Darin says.

 

[HeartofTexas]

Not all sexually abused girls become sexually promiscuous... there isn't a fixed rule on it but generally you either become very sexually active or you pretty much abstain. It's the way she uses her body that makes me think there is abuse in her background... not just her appearance. It's the movements she makes. No matter what the cause, though, I think it's rather sad when a woman thinks her sexuality is her only selling point... and, for all I know, Darin encouraged that in her (I think you suggested he was the one who asked for the breast implants?). That would be the sign of a true trophy wife, and I find all of that mentality pretty appalling. And goodness only knows it's damned prevalent here in the Dallas area.

 

[Goody]

Not all sexually abused girls become sexually promiscuous... there isn't a fixed rule on it but generally you either become very sexually active or you pretty much abstain. It's the way she uses her body that makes me think there is abuse in her background... not just her appearance. It's the movements she makes. No matter what the cause, though, I think it's rather sad when a woman thinks her sexuality is her only selling point... and, for all I know, Darin encouraged that in her (I think you suggested he was the one who asked for the breast implants?). That would be the sign of a true trophy wife, and I find all of that mentality pretty appalling. And goodness only knows it's damned prevalent here in the Dallas area.

Patricia Springer claimed (Flesh and Blood) that a relative of Darin's told her (but did not want to be identified) that Darlie had gotten pregnant between Damon and Drake, that she did not want the baby and had asked Darin for an abortion. According to the story, Darin would only agree to the abortion if Darlie would agree to getting the implants. Darlie supposedly showed up at Darin's brother's wedding sporting the DD's and indicated that she was proud of them, chuckling about the bargain made. Since we don't know who said it, there is no way to verify it, but when Darin was on the stand, he indicated that the implants were his idea and even chuckled a little himself when asked about it. So I have a feeling, it is true. Or darned close to it.

I agree that it is sad when women think their only asset is how sexy they appear, but it is an old misconception that has haunted the female gender for generations and generations. Even these TV shows that show women in roles with great careers portray her as being very attractive and sexy, surrounded by guys trying to hit on them. So it shouldn't be too much of a surprise.

 

[justice2]

It is in the trial testimony. I think both Darlie and Darin addressed it, each saying the other was the one upset by it. The boys had apparently gotten into it that afternoon or early evening and splashed half the water out of it. Patricia Springer, I think, addressed it in her book, saying the neighbor heard Darlie cussing the boys through the fence. She called them little MFers and said they were really going to get it now. I imagine the cost of refilling it was a big deal.

She called her kids MFers?!? WOW. That's pretty bad. Kinda crosses a line doesn't it. Not the same as just swearing. WOW. I will find it in the transcipts. Thanks

 

[beesy]

I think something unknown caused the attack on Devon and that Damon slept thru it. Little boys can sleep thru earthquakes. Darlie desperately tries to clean up but blood has a mind of its own. It goes everywhere.
Darin discovers the scene and argues with her, maybe they even struggle over the knife. They talk for 45 minutes or so. During that time Darin decides to help Darlie cover up the crime. He quickly points out that cleaning up the crime scene won't work, that they have to stage it and make it look believable. They work together coming up with a story, even walking quickly toward the UR door and only staging what they feel would have been disturbed. That is why so few things are staged, why they didn't overdo it as many criminals do when trying to hide the truth. (The vacuum and the wine glass were big mistakes though)

Very good theory that Devon was killed so much before Damon was attacked. How long does it take for blood to clot? I think you know I believe Devon fought with Darlie though. If nothing else but to lift his legs up and kick at her, remember the nick. I think somebody asked before if Darlie liked everything clean why pick stabbing? There are only so many ways to kill a person for one thing. And another, Devon was on a pallet type sleeping bag. Darlie most likely thought the stabbing would be quick and the blood would end up on the pallet. Strangling somebody takes a long time, as does beating someone to death and the Routiers didn't own a gun. Stabbing it was.
Was there screaming while Darlie stabbed Devon? Possibly...however it happened, Darin woke up and ran downstairs. I think his first reaction is real. He says he sees blood everywhere and doesn't understand what's going on. He's worried that danged glass table had fallen on Devon. That rings very true. Then as you said, they talked, blah blah. I still think either Darlie threatened to hurt the boys or Devon, and Darin "dared" her to do it, or he made her so upset by something during the fight, that he felt responsible for the stabbing. Then believing himself to be as guilty as Darlie, jumped right in there with her.

Damon becomes the sacrificial lamb. How are they going to explain why one child is murdered and the other left unharmned?
Damon is still sleeping and wakes when he is stabbed in the back. They think he will die as quickly as Devon did, but he doesn't. At some point during the staging, they realize Damon has crawled to the other side of the room. Darlie steps up and over the couch, braces herself on the little glasstop table behind the couch and catches up to Damon. She stabs him again.
Only one bloody fingerprint is left on the little table, probably because she has something in her hand that protects or prevents the other fingers from making contact with the tabletop. (The knife maybe?) Maybe it is during this leap over the couch that she accidentally stabs her right arm with the knife her
left hand is holding in possibly an odd grip.

This fits very well too Goody, but the timeline is off. I think the last and final attack on Damon takes place while she is on the phone. How do you fit your theory into the timeline? Damon lived 8-9 mins after the fatal wound, as you know. If she stabbed him the last time before cutting her throat and calling 911, you run out of time.

Darin doesn't tell her to cut her throat. It was probably her idea, but he tells her how to avoid her windpipe and vocal chords, warns her not to go deep. She cuts her throat, but before she does, she goes into the UR where her arm drips. She pulls the UR door open with a bloody hand leaving the blood there. She leans into the garage to look at the screen or to call out to Darin, assuming he is the one out there (although she could have cut it herself during their staging before Damon's second attack.) When she leans out to look, she may have transferred a speck of blood onto the garage floor.
Darin makes the sock run. When he returns, they go to their prearranged positions --he with Devon and she to the phone to call 911. And the drama

begins.

That "Darin" on the tape which is transcribed as "Karen" I believe was when Darlie called for Darin, making sure he was going to finish up before the cops came. You know I think she was injured in some way and that's why she had to put herself in the attack. Doing that made everything very complicated. It'd be easier to say she went up to sleep with Darin after the boys fell asleep. Darlie certainly wouldn't have felt bad about leaving the boys alone downstairs.
The cut on her arm bothers me. It's in a very awkward position and I doubt she did it to help stage an attack. It doesn't really add anything to her story.
Have they been able to tell if the stab wounds to Devon were made by a right-handed person? If not, she could have held the knife in her left hand and then maybe Devon kicked the knife up into her arm.

 

[beesy]

dying her hair not just blonde, but bleached blonde. And I'm not sure who requested the melons, but surely there is something not quite right about someone who chooses either DD or EE for the breast augmentation size. Geez, that is huge. Beyond huge. So, whether he requested them, or she did, they're both nuts IMO. They are beyond garish! And, again IMO, I never saw her on TV that she wasn't flaunting them like they were her prized possessions.

I believe they were 38 DDD's, there's a great pic in MTJD of her and Darin. It's at Xmas and she has an evening gown on. Her leg is turned a little so it peeks out thru the skirt. Her hair is big and bleached and her are beyond huge. Way out there! Oh yeah and her 2 inch fake nails and heavy makeup top the look.

 

[HeartofTexas]

I've seen that picture... it's been highly publicized! I read somewhere else that they were double E' (EE), and read in another place they were double D's, so wasn't sure which source to believe. Double anything is insane, IMO. Thanks for clarifying.

 

[beesy]

I've seen that picture... it's been highly publicized! I read somewhere else that they were double E' (EE), and read in another place they were double D's, so wasn't sure which source to believe. Double anything is insane, IMO. Thanks for clarifying.

You're right, I've heard different sizes also. Patricia Springer in her book Flesh and Blood says they are 38 DD's as per Darin in the family waiting room at the hospital. He bragged about Darlie's giant and how beautiful she was. Det. Forsch and Det. Patterson were awed by Darin. They knew right then that he'd do anything for her. She was everything to him.
I lean more towards trusting Springer's account of the murders, etc. She used transcripts, photos and she interviewed the LE involved in the case. Springer seems to have less mistakes. Don Davis' and Bararba Davis' books are filled with them. And you know there's no use in counting MTJD in there.

 

[HeartofTexas]

I'm pretty sure Springer's book is the one I read... and I remember some of the stories from it that have been quoted on here as being from her book. I never read the rest of the books, partially because I've never found them. Part of me would like to see the pix in MTJD but another part of me thinks I would be pretty freaked out (and I've heard repeatedly that it's not worth reading!).

 

[Cowgirl]

I don't know if they have bra sizes that really address those kinds of but the army navy stores make hammocks for them...

I have to say, the most attractive I have seen Darlie look was after her own hair started to grow out and she wasn't looking like the typical Tammy Faye Baker makeup girl. We like things big in Texas, but not trampy. The prettiest women here, including myself (or so I am told!), use just a little makeup and a little hair styling. My nails grow quite nicely on their own and I wear clear polish unless it is a special occasion. Less is more.

 

[Goody]

I'm pretty sure Springer's book is the one I read... and I remember some of the stories from it that have been quoted on here as being from her book. I never read the rest of the books, partially because I've never found them. Part of me would like to see the pix in MTJD but another part of me thinks I would be pretty freaked out (and I've heard repeatedly that it's not worth reading!).

If you are going to wade through the evidence to make your own determinations, MTJD is almost a must. Much better than those enhanced photos at the Darlie site. The other books don't offer too much and they do have some errors in them, but if you want to get a feel for what it was like to attend the trial and how all the players appeared to others at the time, the three other books are a good read. The one by Don Davis, which I think is still in print, gives a good look at a lot of the behind the scenes stuff as well as a few comments by others who knew the Routiers. Accurate trial info though can be found in the trial transcripts and court oinions posted at the forDarlie site and the justicefordarlieroutier site. O, let me not forget to tell you that you can find the out of print books ocassionally on ebay or the used Amazon books online.

 

[Goody]

I don't know if they have bra sizes that really address those kinds of but the army navy stores make hammocks for them....

hahahahahahaha! I don't think the state provides hammocks for inmates though.

I have to say, the most attractive I have seen Darlie look was after her own hair started to grow out and she wasn't looking like the typical Tammy Faye Baker makeup girl. We like things big in Texas, but not trampy. The prettiest women here, including myself (or so I am told!), use just a little makeup and a little hair styling. My nails grow quite nicely on their own and I wear clear polish unless it is a special occasion. Less is more.

You mean sort of like Dolly Parton?

I agree that less is more for most of us, and I don't personally like Darlie's fashion/make up choices, etc., but I I can't say that I care enough to form any negative opinion of her. She didn't look like a lowlife who had been wallowing in crack houses for the last several days and wasn't skanky enough to make me think she'd been hooking at truckstops. In fact, she always looked rather neat and clean, like her costumes were carefully put together and well thought out. So I can accept that.

On the other hand, it was always obvious to me that she was not part of the traditional country club set, most of whom would out class her. In fact, I might even say that she probably didn't fit into the neighborhood she lived in that well either. I would imagine that most of them were not into the flashy attire, big hair and big look either.

I am wondering if she is still happy she got that boob job done. Carting around DDs in prison can't be all that much fun.

 

[HeartofTexas]

Carting around those double D's anywhere doesn't sound like too much fun to me! As a matter of fact, a cart might be a good way to get them where you're going! Darlie bordered on trampy to me... but that's probably just my own bias showing. But then murdering her two boys didn't exactly help my image of her. There are lots of women in Texas like her... too many jewels, hair too boofy, hair too blonde, too big... too much of everything. Kind of like the fountain in front of her house... too big for the lot, too big for the neighborhood, too big not to notice. Her appearance always seemed to scream, "see me, see me, see me" in huge, loud words, as if she was afraid she might be missed.