The Jury Hangs - Justice Delayed

[Just the Fax]

johnfear said: So, apparently the lean in this case is towards no retrial.

Well, JLY doesn't just walk. They either retry or offer him a 2nd degree plea deal like Ann Miller Kontz...imo


1) Was Gracie's height estimate based on the sticker by the door? (They have a 4-7 foot mark in there that's been there for a while, but getting crappy now, basically to give the general height in the midst of madness)

Gracie told Spivey early on he was "tall and had blondish hair" (Spivey read his notes at supression hearing). 4 1/2 years later at the supression hearing, she said "a little taller than her and not much hair". BH screwed up royally by not rehabilitating this witness by refresh her memory of what she told the cops early on. Did "little hair" mean he didn't have a shaggy mullet growing down his neck??? Why did BH not ask her about the SUV she saw him in?

2) How real is the DNA mess they didn't explain fully as far as unidentified? Feels like both sides muddied the waters there?


The unknown DNA on the camera was the biggest, imo. Very likely it was Elmer's...they need to prove that in round 2. Plus, the location was on top of the camera. JLY just yanked out the video cable and then jumped up and pushed it up toward the ceiling. The DNA on the rock had 3 markers for JLY.

3) Any truth to the 30 blows? (I have some questions about why this wasn't a bigger issue. 30 blows by an angry husband seems right. Not by a random "burglar", etc. But, without consulting a Ouija, can they tell how many were pre versus post mortem? I've been listening to someone else's diatribe about how that many blows indicates to them a woman was involved. Sound familiar?)

She had 2 skull fractures and many vicious wounds deep to her skull. Her jaw was broken so bad, it shattered and protruded from the inside out. Yes, obviously done by a very angry insider that wanted her DEAD. Lack of defensive wounds on JLY was totally expected. This was a vicious ambush of a petite pregnant woman.

4) Did the inventory of the valuables remain incomplete because of JY's lack of involvement or was it ever finalized?


He told mama exactly what was in the drawers and she told Spivey 6 months later. She added there was $500 cash in a new wallet missing from his closet.
BH should have grilled her on this BS story, as it would have shown the jury the whole thing was staged. So they wanted jewelry and money, yet totally ignored MY's purse in plain view on the kitchen floor?

5) Why has the minor child not been brought into this one (at least from a press perspective with regard to what happened. I know she can't testify or accurately recreate but she was there.) from the perspective of being a key piece of credible evidence? Footprints, 911 call, etc. Anyone know when those things were ruled on and why?

The cops screwed up by not immediately having a child psychologist interview her that day. When JLY took control, it was too late, cause he would need to give permission.,,,,obviously not gonna happen

So you guys know where I stand, I think he did it/had a hand in it/did it with someone else/paid for it to be done.


I too think the state will need to concede in opening statements there may well have been 1-2 additional people in that house at some point during or after the murder. The witness that swears she saw 2 in a minivan at 5:30AM, the size 10 shoes, unknown DNA on the box, cig butts and the hair can be immediately explained if they concede possible conspiracy. Personally, I think he acted alone, but they will need to defuse the defense main argument and hit home he is still guilty of 1st degree murder if he was in the house too...his missing size 12 HP prints go to prove that.

 

[NCEast]

HAPPY CANADA DAY Calgary123!

 

[Just the Fax]

Gotta watch this preview of the 48 hours mystery about David Temple killing his pregnant wife. Yep, he was having an affair and staged the scene to appear to be robbery motivated. Colon needs to hire Kelly Siegler as a special prosecutor to slam the door on JLY. This woman is the real deal!!!!!

http://www.kellysieglerlaw.com/templevideo01.html

Preview

http://www.kellysieglerlaw.com/khouvideo02.html

Feature

 

[tarheel8600]

Can the DA's office request a change of venue for the second trial due to the extreme publicity of the crime and the trial - especially since the foreman came out and said that there was nothing but reasonable doubt in this case?

Also, I cannot help but wonder if this jury maybe sent a message to the Wake County DA's office that they were frustrated with the previous trial and its lack of evidence. A change of venue may take the polarizing BC verdict out of the equation and allow a new jury to decide JY's guilt or innocence based only on the evidence presented in his trial. MOO.

 

[MrsWendy]

Can the DA's office request a change of venue for the second trial due to the extreme publicity of the crime and the trial - especially since the foreman came out and said that there was nothing but reasonable doubt in this case? <snip>
.

I don't think there is as much publicity about the trial as you think. I suspect that the vast majority of people in Wake County have never even heard about the trial and even those who have heard something about it probably know almost nothing.

 

[Just the Fax]

Can the DA's office request a change of venue for the second trial due to the extreme publicity of the crime and the trial - especially since the foreman came out and said that there was nothing but reasonable doubt in this case?

Also, I cannot help but wonder if this jury maybe sent a message to the Wake County DA's office that they were frustrated with the previous trial and its lack of evidence. A change of venue may take the polarizing BC verdict out of the equation and allow a new jury to decide JY's guilt or innocence based only on the evidence presented in his trial. MOO.

tarheel....you may recall Kurtz begged the judge for a change of venue in the Cooper case - naming the massive local media coverage (denied).
I doubt the state would want a change of venue. Unlike opinions during the Cooper case, nearly 100% of people I have encountered (this board included) hold the opinion JLY is guilty and think the state just did a poor job convincing the jury with their weak presentation of CE. Publicity about the trial and its shortcomings only helps the state, imo.

A time break will be good news for the state. The Cooper case had too much influence on the speed of jury selection and presentation of evidence...not to mention planned summer vacations.:banghead:

 

[No Coincidence]

Hopefully there will be a second trial, and if so that canvassed area should be enlarged to include any other gas stations JY could have used. Buying only $15 worth of gas probably wasn't all he bought, I think he got spooked by his own bad behavior and just took off because he realized it and panicked. Could easily have purchased gas somewhere else before returning to the hotel, or even on the way back to Birchleaf between midnite and 3 am.

I, too, see how easily he could have gotte gas anywhere. The prosecution really slipped up by only "suggesting" he "could" have gotten in anywhere. They would have been better off listing all the gas stations open, without cameras, or enough customers to be un noticed. A high number would have been stronger proof that he went un- noticed. That, alone, wouldn't have been enough to create reasonable doubt for me, but I can see (I guess) how it could for someone not familiar.

Also, I think the mention of gas on the way HOME is strong. Had he been caught on the way home (via a confrontation, a speeding ticket, a friend recognized him, anything), there would have been no murder yet, so he could have said I forgot something, needed XYZ, anything. Its a good suggestion to think he may have filled up on the way back, just before the murder. I wonder if they looked into that....

 

[gracielee]

Gotta watch this preview of the 48 hours mystery about David Temple killing his pregnant wife. Yep, he was having an affair and staged the scene to appear to be robbery motivated. Colon needs to hire Kelly Siegler as a special prosecutor to slam the door on JLY. This woman is the real deal!!!!!

http://www.kellysieglerlaw.com/templevideo01.html

Preview

http://www.kellysieglerlaw.com/khouvideo02.html

Feature

So many things I've just read on this page. Sorry, I have a sprained wrist, hard to type replies to everyone. I think Gracie was right on. JLY was the person she saw, her earliest statement should have been emphasized as being closest to the time of the crime, tall, blond, thin. JLY *was* angry that night, and as per his earlier fiance, he CAN get very ANGRY at females. DA should have queired the blond girl he bedded on his sofa about why her father told her to not have any more contact with JLY, IMO. I agree with the statement 'he panicked, reason he only pumped 15.00 worth of gas. He realized he 'lost it' with Gracie and thought he better get the hell out of there. Gracie comes across to me as rather quiet, not sophisticated, testifying at trial she was probably nervous as hell IMO. Scared witless. I don't think anybody but JLY was involved. Was watching a program on the ID channel last night where 'over-kill' was also an element of the crime. The killer of Michelle expressed his hatred for her by continuing to beat her after she was already unconscious or dead IMO. Also watched another of those ID programs where a young child was in the home at the time his mother was murdered. He said the name of the person who he saw, 'warren'. And low and behold, they did find a 'warren' and it was him. Cas said 'daddy' in her babbling. Why wasn't that pointed out, right along with the boo boos, the washcloth and the bandaid's? She understood the whole concept of what happened to mommy. And she repeated it in that 911 call. The jury foreman *can* influence a jury IMO.

 

[NCEast]

So many things I've just read on this page. Sorry, I have a sprained wrist, hard to type replies to everyone. I think Gracie was right on. JLY was the person she saw, her earliest statement should have been emphasized as being closest to the time of the crime, tall, blond, thin. JLY *was* angry that night, and as per his earlier fiance, he CAN get very ANGRY at females. DA should have queired the blond girl he bedded on his sofa about why her father told her to not have any more contact with JLY, IMO. I agree with the statement 'he panicked, reason he only pumped 15.00 worth of gas. He realized he 'lost it' with Gracie and thought he better get the hell out of there. Gracie comes across to me as rather quiet, not sophisticated, testifying at trial she was probably nervous as hell IMO. Scared witless. I don't think anybody but JLY was involved. Was watching a program on the ID channel last night where 'over-kill' was also an element of the crime. The killer of Michelle expressed his hatred for her by continuing to beat her after she was already unconscious or dead IMO. Also watched another of those ID programs where a young child was in the home at the time his mother was murdered. He said the name of the person who he saw, 'warren'. And low and behold, they did find a 'warren' and it was him. Cas said 'daddy' in her babbling. Why wasn't that pointed out, right along with the boo boos, the washcloth and the bandaid's? She understood the whole concept of what happened to mommy. And she repeated it in that 911 call. The jury foreman *can* influence a jury IMO.

GL, so sorry to read about your sprained wrist. Hope it's much better quickly.
The part about CY's blabbling 'daddy did it' was so clear in listening to the tape. I have been pretty down that the prosecution didn't offer it into evidence. I do not know if they had the tape 'done' in a lab. Please excuse my lack of thinking/wording/writing--have a horrible migraine. You know how they send tapes and such to labs to have the background noises either brought out or toned down? Did the State do that with this? I haven't read anything about it as being part of the evidence but surely heard it myself. When they played the tape in court I noticed several people who were in the courtroom that day turn and look at one another when CY said 'daddy did it'. So apparently they heard it too.

 

[tarheel8600]

During the past week, I have spoken with various people who live in JY's hometown, and people were and are still very surprised that there was a hung jury. Many people up here believe there was more than enough circumstantial evidence to convict.

If JY receives bond and moves back here, I don't think there will be many dads or moms who will be very accepting of JY trying to date their daughters.

When he was living up here before his arrest, he went to a party attended by people in their early 20s. A co-worker of mine was present. According to her, he acted like he was "in his element." He was flirtatious, talkative, and rather enjoying himself. I think he was living the dream he had of being a single man. What 34-year-old is interested in partying with people in their early 20s? Especially a man under scrutiny who was accused of wanting this very lifestyle.

As I have said before, the court of public opinion in Transylvania County will make life difficult for JY even if he feels he has gotten away with the murder of his pregnant wife.

In the email he wrote to his sister saying that most people in Brevard did not know about him and his circumstances is not true now - thanks to people who have openly questioned his behavior and his unwillingness to seek justice for his wife and unborn child.

 

[justbetweenus]

So, apparently the lean in this case is towards no retrial. I had wondered if they would because of the way they handled it from the beginning. If retried, they need to figure out who the real accomplice is. (And I am positive there is one. Just not sure whom. Whether it's someone paid or personally involved. This is where the mileage/gas/time/cleanup issue would be solved for a jury IMO)

I have a long weekend ahead with a few folks affiliated with it and the two things I have to pick their brain on are these:

1) Was Gracie's height estimate based on the sticker by the door? (They have a 4-7 foot mark in there that's been there for a while, but getting crappy now, basically to give the general height in the midst of madness)

2) How real is the DNA mess they didn't explain fully as far as unidentified? Feels like both sides muddied the waters there?

3) Any truth to the 30 blows? (I have some questions about why this wasn't a bigger issue. 30 blows by an angry husband seems right. Not by a random "burglar", etc. But, without consulting a Ouija, can they tell how many were pre versus post mortem? I've been listening to someone else's diatribe about how that many blows indicates to them a woman was involved. Sound familiar?)

4) Did the inventory of the valuables remain incomplete because of JY's lack of involvement or was it ever finalized?

5) Why has the minor child not been brought into this one (at least from a press perspective with regard to what happened. I know she can't testify or accurately recreate but she was there.) from the perspective of being a key piece of credible evidence? Footprints, 911 call, etc. Anyone know when those things were ruled on and why?

So you guys know where I stand, I think he did it/had a hand in it/did it with someone else/paid for it to be done. I do think the defense and pros had a hard battle. I, however, thought BH did an excellent job up to the point where she crossed JY and I thought the detectives involved here were way better (for what they had) than some of the other area representations we have seen.

I can easily see how unaffiliated parties might have found reasonable doubt. I just don't happen to have any myself.

Anything else that's just lingering?

I think I might be able to help with this question. My father was beatened to death in a home invasion/robbery and I remember someone in the know (coroner I think?) testified about the number of blows, and stated they could tell some blows came after death by abrasions that had a yellow colored like bruising. Much like the color of a bruise we have when it starts healing. I would think this is because of the lack of blood flow. Hope this helps.

PS. curious to know where I can hear this silly diatribe.

 

[justbetweenus]

During the past week, I have spoken with various people who live in JY's hometown, and people were and are still very surprised that there was a hung jury. Many people up here believe there was more than enough circumstantial evidence to convict.

If JY receives bond and moves back here, I don't think there will be many dads or moms who will be very accepting of JY trying to date their daughters.

When he was living up here before his arrest, he went to a party attended by people in their early 20s. A co-worker of mine was present. According to her, he acted like he was "in his element." He was flirtatious, talkative, and rather enjoying himself. I think he was living the dream he had of being a single man. What 34-year-old is interested in partying with people in their early 20s? Especially a man under scrutiny who was accused of wanting this very lifestyle.

As I have said before, the court of public opinion in Transylvania County will make life difficult for JY even if he feels he has gotten away with the murder of his pregnant wife.

In the email he wrote to his sister saying that most people in Brevard did not know about him and his circumstances is not true now - thanks to people who have openly questioned his behavior and his unwillingness to seek justice for his wife and unborn child.

Thanks Tarheel. Your post is very interesting.

 

[Just the Fax]

During the past week, I have spoken with various people who live in JY's hometown, and people were and are still very surprised that there was a hung jury. Many people up here believe there was more than enough circumstantial evidence to convict.

If JY receives bond and moves back here, I don't think there will be many dads or moms who will be very accepting of JY trying to date their daughters.

When he was living up here before his arrest, he went to a party attended by people in their early 20s. A co-worker of mine was present. According to her, he acted like he was "in his element." He was flirtatious, talkative, and rather enjoying himself. I think he was living the dream he had of being a single man. What 34-year-old is interested in partying with people in their early 20s? Especially a man under scrutiny who was accused of wanting this very lifestyle.

As I have said before, the court of public opinion in Transylvania County will make life difficult for JY even if he feels he has gotten away with the murder of his pregnant wife.

In the email he wrote to his sister saying that most people in Brevard did not know about him and his circumstances is not true now - thanks to people who have openly questioned his behavior and his unwillingness to seek justice for his wife and unborn child.

tarheel, I had received an e-mail from another Western NC resident discusted by JLY's bizarre behavior.....time to post, as this is a regular pattern of behavior.
No shock it is pretty much the same theme.....hanging with early 20 year old girls and this time, exposing himself again.:woot:

"Found out some disgusting news about Jason today! not long before his arrest he went to the Rod Run in TN w/ a friend. everyone there didn't know him only the friend he was with. come to find JY got them kicked out of the bar for exposing his junk and then proceeded to run around the cabin naked. My husband's and my jaw dropped when she talked about exposing himself! some of the girls there were 20 years old and him being 35ish at the time, very disgusting on his part. Needless to say the girl was horrified when seeing him on the news not long after and her observation of him was he was so weird! i guess with him some things never change"

 

[Just the Fax]

GL, so sorry to read about your sprained wrist. Hope it's much better quickly.
The part about CY's blabbling 'daddy did it' was so clear in listening to the tape. I have been pretty down that the prosecution didn't offer it into evidence. I do not know if they had the tape 'done' in a lab. Please excuse my lack of thinking/wording/writing--have a horrible migraine. You know how they send tapes and such to labs to have the background noises either brought out or toned down? Did the State do that with this? I haven't read anything about it as being part of the evidence but surely heard it myself. When they played the tape in court I noticed several people who were in the courtroom that day turn and look at one another when CY said 'daddy did it'. So apparently they heard it too.

NCEast, the court transcript excluded CY's background jibber jabber (stated so in court). The recording played to the jury had 'white noise' covering the clear "Daddy did it" while the phone was ringing to WCSO at the end. Just another piece of compelling evidence the jury was unable to hear in court.

 

[tarheel8600]

tarheel, I had received an e-mail from another Western NC resident discusted by JLY's bizarre behavior.....time to post, as this is a regular pattern of behavior.
No shock it is pretty much the same theme.....hanging with early 20 year old girls and this time, exposing himself again.:woot:

"Found out some disgusting news about Jason today! not long before his arrest he went to the Rod Run in TN w/ a friend. everyone there didn't know him only the friend he was with. come to find JY got them kicked out of the bar for exposing his junk and then proceeded to run around the cabin naked. My husband's and my jaw dropped when she talked about exposing himself! some of the girls there were 20 years old and him being 35ish at the time, very disgusting on his part. Needless to say the girl was horrified when seeing him on the news not long after and her observation of him was he was so weird! i guess with him some things never change"

Just another piece of information. When NCWanted found JY playing basketball at the TC recreation center and tried to ask him questions, they found him there due to a tip from an insider who knew he would be there on that particular night at that particular time. The young basketball player who defended JY not answering questions was new to the basketball league and didn't know JY well at all. Maybe he just wanted to appear on TV and get his 15 minutes of fame. Maybe he was young and just mouthy.

What is really interesting is that there were guys playing with him that night who did know him, and they had known him for quite some time. Those guys walked away and would not go on record defending his decision to not answer questions.

And also interesting is JY barricading himself in an office to avoid questions that, IMO, he could not answer in any way that would put him in a good light at all.

And JY continuing his antics of public nudity and stupid, immature behavior is not surprising. A tiger doesn't change his stripes. If he is released and there is not another trial, I feel we will hear of some other woman down the line who will have wished she had never crossed paths with him.

 

[tarheel8600]

NCEast and Just the Fax

I read your comments on the 911 call. I have listened to the 911 call several times and will say with certainty that after the ring tone when the dispatcher is connecting MF with a sheriff's deputy that CY said 'Daddy did it." A few seconds before CY said this MF asked her if someone had been there.

I had my husband listen to the 911 call a couple of weeks ago so he could hear it, and he picked up on something that I didn't. About 1:45 (give or take a few seconds) into the call MF asked CY what happened to Mommy - did she fall? CY can be heard answering MF saying "Daddy did it" at around 1:59 into the call.

CY not only says it once on the 911 call but twice.

I'm wondering, like NCEast, if an expert can enhance CY's statements during the 911 call to hear what else she said that is inaudible because of MF's and the dispatcher's voices being most prominent. CY seems to be talking quite a bit in the call.

These were CY's first statements after MY being found deceased, and her insight could prove to be valuable especially since MF asked her what happened without prompting her to say JY was involved.

http://www.wral.com/news/local/audio/1119462/

 

[CrimeAddict]

I talked to the guy I know in the DA's office and he thinks they will do a retrial. He also said he has submitted to get out on bail awaiting retrial or whatever. At least this gives us some hope. He said they were not prepared fir him testifying and were shocked. We all knew this I guess
Not sure if any of this is new news, but thought I would share.

 

[fran]

I've been contemplating this case since the hung jury announcement came down. What can one say when they completely disagree with the jury verdict, whether yea or nay? It's our system and it's the best we can do.

I can't fault the jury if they honestly feel the pros didn't prove JY's guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. Just because we've watched the case since the get-go, this is how they feel after not knowing anything of Michelles murder except what the def/pros told them. To be honest, I'm glad that they showed the pros they did NOT prove guilt. Now the question is, "Where from here?"

I believe this pros and LE officers involved in the investigation believe that JY is guilty, no question. They MAY feel he had help, but they don't know who it could possibly be. That would be up to JY IF and when he's found guilty, to turn them in, IF it applies.

I think where the pros went wrong is they weren't ready for JY to testify and it's obvious by the timing of his testimony, it was strategicly planned by the def to NOT let the pros have time to cross JY on some important points,because they were unprepared for him to have a different version of the 'circumstances.' Like the lock, the twig, the gas, and I may have left out a few. But, if they retry him, this pros has the rare opportunity of a 'do/over!' They need to use it to their advantage!

Photo's, ie Justthefax did here, lock maintenance and testimony about other locks in the hotel, demonstration how someone could have tampered with the video camera undetected, questioning Gracie about the difference in the height, the contents of his suitcase, he may have miscalculated IF he put gas in the car from the garage BEFORE he left town AFTER the murder, and wasn't there originally a different hotel reservation? I could be mistaken, (I've just seen that since the end of the trial and never before brought up).....even an expert or two on how people react when told their loved one is dead and most specifically murdered. (it's never been stated, IMO I could be wrong, he even KNEW how Michelle died.)

In other words, there are so many ways they can improve their game and maybe even a different prosecutor. But the thought of this guy getting away with this is unthinkable to me. Maybe because I've already decided he's guilty and they just didn't present the evidence properly or thoroughly to show it HAD to be him and there's NO OTHER possibility except he's guilty! (ALLEGEDLY)

I haven't felt this strongly about any other guy I've seen getting away with their crime since the Natalee Holloway case. Just like that one, I said if 'he gets away with this, he'll be back in the news again!' I think we know how that one turned out! Another poor girl lost her life too!

Bet JY's on top of the world right now. Thinking he's going to be set free! :behindbar:

JMHO
fran

PS...oh, and I agree about the 911 call! They need to work on that, for sure. I know when this case first began, that's why so many of us here at Websleuths KNEW JY did it! C was just barely a toddler yet she spoke those words. Babies and toddlers do NOT know how to lie. It was an 'excited utterance,' that provided a window to solving this crime. imo, fran

 

[StJohn]

Gotta watch this preview of the 48 hours mystery about David Temple killing his pregnant wife. Yep, he was having an affair and staged the scene to appear to be robbery motivated. Colon needs to hire Kelly Siegler as a special prosecutor to slam the door on JLY. This woman is the real deal!!!!!

http://www.kellysieglerlaw.com/templevideo01.html

Preview

http://www.kellysieglerlaw.com/khouvideo02.html

Feature

Just watched this on CBS archived videos - eerily similar to Young case. I had seen DA Kelly Siegler featured on other 48 Hr cases. She is one tough cookie. If she had been on JY case, she would have torn JY a new one on cross exam, finished up with a good ole fashioned southern ass whippin' and a one way ticket to Central Prison.

 

[Just the Fax]

NCEast and Just the Fax

I read your comments on the 911 call. I have listened to the 911 call several times and will say with certainty that after the ring tone when the dispatcher is connecting MF with a sheriff's deputy that CY said 'Daddy did it." A few seconds before CY said this MF asked her if someone had been there.

I had my husband listen to the 911 call a couple of weeks ago so he could hear it, and he picked up on something that I didn't. About 1:45 (give or take a few seconds) into the call MF asked CY what happened to Mommy - did she fall? CY can be heard answering MF saying "Daddy did it" at around 1:59 into the call.

CY not only says it once on the 911 call but twice.

I'm wondering, like NCEast, if an expert can enhance CY's statements during the 911 call to hear what else she said that is inaudible because of MF's and the dispatcher's voices being most prominent. CY seems to be talking quite a bit in the call.

These were CY's first statements after MY being found deceased, and her insight could prove to be valuable especially since MF asked her what happened without prompting her to say JY was involved.

http://www.wral.com/news/local/audio/1119462/

The words "daddy did it" are obvious.
The problem is they were uttered by a 2 1/2 year old toddler and there is no way to authenticate today....unless CY takes the stand as a 7 year old and can recall that night. Thankfully for her, that tragic memory has apparently vanished.