The Phone Calls in the early morning of Dec.18, 2013 (both PayPhone & cells)

[rtjedarling]

Logs show both user and incoming activity.

very logical reasoning jillycat and hopefully jurors with similar good reasoning skills hear the case and justice will be served. That said, I've seen some jurors interviewed after acquitting a guilty person and thought "Good Lord, there is dumb, dumber, and dumbest. I wouldn't rely on them to tend to my house cat."

 

[Mahouston69]

"Ping" means went looking for a tower to connect to...but calls, texts, could have been coming in still after that (date saying goodnight, I had a nice time, BW checking on her, schedule reminders, banking reminders) again, we might be told and we might not if it's not relevant to convicting the persons charged with murder or the defense doesn't bring it up as alibi..etc.

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[Ghostwheel]

Here, the media said Terry said the phone last "pinged" at 3:00 a.m.
http://www.carolinalive.com/news/story.aspx?id=986738#.U0iqJCjOeQI

Here, the media said the police said Heather and SM exchanged communications, "mostly through private messaging", between 2 and 6. At the time of this report, police were "falrly comfortable" Heather drove herself to PTL.
"Those communications occurred as late as 6 a.m. Dec. 18, police records state."
http://www.myhorrynews.com/news/crime/article_ada6ad1c-8f77-11e3-8ca7-001a4bcf6878.html

So she and SM were chatting until at least 6. Later she was in harm's way by then. Then she was deceased by then.

But here's what we can be sure Terry Elvis himself said:
http://www.hlntv.com/video/2014/01/06/elvis-heather-missing-date-myrtle-beach-parents-speak

And he says "The phone was last used...". The phone was last used. Not that it was the phone's last ping. Not that there were no incoming messages. People can call it word salad if they want to. I believe something else happened with that phone after 3:41am, and it's going to matter.

 

[CarmonCayman]

It could possibly be that the call logs either TE or the person he talked to if he did call tmobile direct could have been wrong. A simple google search of incorrect call logs on t-mobile accounts turns up instances of this.





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[jillycat]

And he says "The phone was last used...". The phone was last used. Not that it was the phone's last ping. Not that there were no incoming messages. People can call it word salad if they want to. I believe something else happened with that phone after 3:41am, and it's going to matter.

Pings and usage/activity are altogether different. Communications vs usage vs calls vs contacts vs back and forth vs "final ping", etc., are all media/police report language that have had different meanings at different times.

Are you talking about pings? Or SM/TM creating activity after Heather lost control of the phone?

 

[PPKik]

Just maybe, possibly, slight chance, could be, might be...that Heather's phone did not communicate, interact, send, call or text anyone after 3:41 a.m., but maybe, possibly, other phones of people(s) involved could have communicated, interacted, sent, called or texted TO Heather's phone. So, to sum it up, HER phone had nothing going out but other peoples' phone(s) might have had stuff going OUT to Heather's phone. Just a possibility but now so I don't get hit by a rock, I am going to do this :truce:

I won't throw anything! I do want to add that the police said there was back and forth communication between heather and SM. So, if it was back and forth...there would have been something going out, too.

All the discussion recently about her phone seems to center on the assumption that Heather's phone was destroyed at 3:41am, when she was allegedly kidnapped and murdered. The earlier statement insisting on this back and forth "communication" has really been a sticking point for me.

I'm trying to understand how both can be true, but "the 6am back and forth" was effectively denied when Richardson called it a "roundabout figure."

No way, in my opinion. They had to know by the time they made those statements whether the phone was in use or not, whether talking, texting, or just on, even if the data aspect was turned off. :ufo:

 

[stillwatersc]

In order to clear the date, LE had to get confirmation of where he was & when. LE tracked his phone pings to verify his story. They possibly found video of his truck on it's route as well or have other witnesses to the time he got home. LE knows exactly where SS was in the early hours of Dec 18.

 

[NFYIAMY]

That's a good question, Knox. I have asked that too.

I have never seen a credible person say Heather was afraid of Tammy Moorer and give a source. Any source.

So - I don't know if you consider me credible or a source.....

I'm verified on here as a professional - probably could be verified as an insider but choose not to. I was at the bond hearing. I have pages of notes from the bond hearing.

I can absolutely confirm that during the bond hearing there were statements made by the state in which they clearly stated that Heather was afraid of TM.

From another posting: That being said, at 3:41 all "data" ended. Not all "communications" ended. It might mean the same thing, but in other cases, wording was important. I don't believe LE has ever said that there was "nothing" after 3:41. Just no "data" after that time. There are widgets that disable your mobile data with one click.(helps keep you from going over your data limit, if you have one) One article from February has Heather's last phone "ping" at 3am, yet LE states that data ended at 3:41 (if you have data going, you have a ping). The phone information in media changed from day to day, from last ping at X to last phone call at X to data ended at 3:41. I have heard nothing about the last phone "ping" since LE announced that the data ended at 3:41.

At the bond hearing the state said that at 3:41 EVERYTHING stopped from Heather's phone. (Off the top of my head - they had stated they had google gps etc up until that time - but it 'all' stopped at that time.) So - LE didn't say it but the solicitor did.

======

I don't think - that the state would state, infer, or anything else at the court hearing, that isn't information they plan to stick with as they move forward in this case.

With that said......I guess they could be maneuvering behind the scenes to get TM or SM to admit to things - to work deals, etc ---- I know LE can make things up but I wouldn't think the prosecution would ---- but I've been way wrong before! LOL

 

[Surfside]

So - I don't know if you consider me credible or a source.....

I, for one, consider you to be both, and for that, THANK YOU!

 

[magnolia]

So - I don't know if you consider me credible or a source.....

I'm verified on here as a professional - probably could be verified as an insider but choose not to. I was at the bond hearing. I have pages of notes from the bond hearing.

I can absolutely confirm that during the bond hearing there were statements made by the state in which they clearly stated that Heather was afraid of TM.




At the bond hearing the state said that at 3:41 EVERYTHING stopped from Heather's phone. (Off the top of my head - they had stated they had google gps etc up until that time - but it 'all' stopped at that time.) So - LE didn't say it but the solicitor did.

======

I don't think - that the state would state, infer, or anything else at the court hearing, that isn't information they plan to stick with as they move forward in this case.

With that said......I guess they could be maneuvering behind the scenes to get TM or SM to admit to things - to work deals, etc ---- I know LE can make things up but I wouldn't think the prosecution would ---- but I've been way wrong before! LOL

BBM

Thanks Hoppy :loser: I don't doubt your confirmation. However, did the state show any proof that Heather was afraid of Tammy? Did they put on any witnesses to substantiate their statement. If not, it's possible "fear of Tammy" may just be part of their theory.

 

[stillwatersc]

Does anyone else remember the interview Terry Elvis had with Peter Hyatt. It appears to be gone from media now but we discussed it in thread #14. 3:41 AM on 12/18 was a significant time for Terry Elvis after seeing the phone records. He kept mentioning that time in the interview.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - SC - Heather Elvis, 20, Myrtle Beach, 18 Dec 2013 - #14

 

[OkieGranny]

Does anyone else remember the interview Terry Elvis had with Peter Hyatt. It appears to be gone from media now but we discussed it in thread #14. 3:41 AM on 12/18 was a significant time for Terry Elvis after seeing the phone records. He kept mentioning that time in the interview.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - SC - Heather Elvis, 20, Myrtle Beach, 18 Dec 2013 - #14

Here's a direct link to the interview:

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/peterhyatt/2014/02/09/-with-peter-hyatt

 

[PPKik]

So - I don't know if you consider me credible or a source.....

I'm verified on here as a professional - probably could be verified as an insider but choose not to. I was at the bond hearing. I have pages of notes from the bond hearing.

I can absolutely confirm that during the bond hearing there were statements made by the state in which they clearly stated that Heather was afraid of TM.


At the bond hearing the state said that at 3:41 EVERYTHING stopped from Heather's phone. (Off the top of my head - they had stated they had google gps etc up until that time - but it 'all' stopped at that time.) So - LE didn't say it but the solicitor did.

======

I don't think - that the state would state, infer, or anything else at the court hearing, that isn't information they plan to stick with as they move forward in this case.

With that said......I guess they could be maneuvering behind the scenes to get TM or SM to admit to things - to work deals, etc ---- I know LE can make things up but I wouldn't think the prosecution would ---- but I've been way wrong before! LOL

hoppy I hope you have misunderstood what I have been saying.

In no way have I suggested you were not credible, or verified, nor have I impugned anything you have said. I have never doubted what you saw and heard at the bond hearing.

What I doubt is what the state is alleging with all the shifts and changes they have made. That has absolutely nothing to do with what you heard and reported. I am sorry if somehow you thought I was doubting you, as your post seems to suggest you thought I was.

I was under the impression from what I was able to gather from the bond hearing that all activity did stop. I wasn't at the bond hearing so when people have written "all data stopped," making a distiction between "data transmission" and other form of communication, I have tried to understand exactly what that means.

Here you have stated unequivically that all communications stopped.

"At the bond hearing the state said that at 3:41 EVERYTHING stopped from Heather's phone."

That is extremely helpful because of the general confusion of different terms such as "data," "communications," "data activity," "activity"ad nauseum, not just what these terms really mean, but mean to the individuals using them. Are they being precise, or just using handy terminology? And our interpretation of these terms here: Are we all here understanding these terms the same way as they meant them, or just what they mean to us? I'd say NO, we do not understand all these terms the same way!

You wrote: "I know LE can make things up but I wouldn't think the prosecution would..."

I've probably said more than enough on this subject already, but prosecutors can and do make things up, just as LE can and do make things up. I sincerely wonder why you wouldn't think they do. Check out Mike Nifong...

The fact that Donna Elder said so and so, Heather was afraid, etc. is simply what she is saying. There has never been a source or any proof whatsoever. As I have written, all Heather's actions showed the opposite.

How does Donna Elder know that the relationship was over when she said? How does she know that they didn't see each other at all, after it was over? How does she know that SM "cared" for Heather? Just because she said it, doesn't make it true, no matter how many people heard it at the hearing.

I don't know who did what in this case in terms of investigation, but typically LE gathers the evidence that the prosecution uses to prosecute, though this office does seem to have its own investigator, too. I'd say, from what I've read, that most of what Elder is alleging has come from LE.

If Sidney Moorer is proved to be guilty of the major felony charges, then I would very much doubt he cared at all.

If you follow enough trials, or have been involved in any, you will soon see that not everything the prosecution alleges is true by a long shot, nor is everything the defense says.

Trials are not just about "real proof," or "absolute truth," or even justice in many cases, but about many other factors, such as who has the most convincing experts and how much money is spent on good ones, which lawyers are the most convincing and charismatic, what kind and quality is the jury pool [See Casey Anthony], even how sympathetic a defendant may seem or not seem, etc. and etc.

 

[Knox]

So - I don't know if you consider me credible or a source.....

I'm verified on here as a professional - probably could be verified as an insider but choose not to. I was at the bond hearing. I have pages of notes from the bond hearing.

I can absolutely confirm that during the bond hearing there were statements made by the state in which they clearly stated that Heather was afraid of TM.




At the bond hearing the state said that at 3:41 EVERYTHING stopped from Heather's phone. (Off the top of my head - they had stated they had google gps etc up until that time - but it 'all' stopped at that time.) So - LE didn't say it but the solicitor did.

======

I don't think - that the state would state, infer, or anything else at the court hearing, that isn't information they plan to stick with as they move forward in this case.

With that said......I guess they could be maneuvering behind the scenes to get TM or SM to admit to things - to work deals, etc ---- I know LE can make things up but I wouldn't think the prosecution would ---- but I've been way wrong before! LOL

Thank you Hoppy, your sourcing and reporting has been phenomenal!!

I have no doubt the State said Heather was afraid of Tammy, my question is who told prosecutors this? I guess like the cell phone time record issue, this may be revealed at trial. Just sticks out like a sore thumb to me at this point, because we have some things that point the opposite direction.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Elvis was last heard from around 3 a.m. Dec. 17, when she called a family member to talk about how a date she was on had gone well, her family said

Read more here: http://www.thestate.com/2014/01/12/3203903/every-time-we-turn-around-there.html#storylink=cpy

 

[UndiscoveredTruth]

True. But that is what the police report says. It's almost a direct quote. If we didn't have the report, then I would trust the media to distort it.

Terry Elvis said the officer who came to his door was a friend. I expect that part of the p.r. is accurate. He checked this T-mobile records early enough for that information to be in the Dec. 19 p.r. He said 6am.

:thumb: I'm with you, PPKik. According to the Police Report, Terry Elvis stated that he contacted his cellular provider (T-Mobile), who provided him with a call history (activity log) for Heathers cell phone and he advised the Officer writing the report that the last phone calls were at approximately 0600 hours on December 18th and the calls were back and forth between Heather and SM. This report was written on the 19th, this is the first Police Report, this is the report that everyone should be going on, surely (?) In my opinion, things such as words and sentences can change but a call history no, I'm afraid not, not if it's provided by a company such as T-Mobile. They are calls that are made, incoming, outgoing, ph. numbers, times, that can never change sooo what happened? When and where does this "all phone activity stopped at 3.41am" come in and by whom? Terry Elvis? Why? There has to be a reason in my opinion. Surely the defence will ask to see this Call History (activity log)..(?) I'm thinking yes. The call history does NOT change, it cannot change--0600 hours is what Terry Elvis saw on the call history (activity log) that was provided by (T-Mobile). :scared: Such a mess and ever so confusing at times!

 

[NWLady]

Maybe Terry was mistaken. Not purposely, but by accident. I mean, after all, everyone makes mistakes especially with everything that was going on at the moment (and he still has a lot going on, obviously). The poor man's daughter was and still is missing, so I'm quite sure with all the added stress and things to think about, he could very well have made a mistake. I'm guessing that if he has Heather on his phone plan that he may very well have his other daughter, and his wife, himself, and possibly even his son on the same phone plan and may have made an honest mistake when looking at call log and/or the call logs are not always accurate especially when you have retrieved them online from your cell provider's website. JMO

 

[PPKik]

:thumb: I'm with you, PPKik. According to the Police Report, Terry Elvis stated that he contacted his cellular provider (T-Mobile), who provided him with a call history (activity log) for Heathers cell phone and he advised the Officer writing the report that the last phone calls were at approximately 0600 hours on December 18th and the calls were back and forth between Heather and SM. This report was written on the 19th, this is the first Police Report, this is the report that everyone should be going on, surely (?) In my opinion, things such as words and sentences can change but a call history no, I'm afraid not, not if it's provided by a company such as T-Mobile. They are calls that are made, incoming, outgoing, ph. numbers, times, that can never change sooo what happened? When and where does this "all phone activity stopped at 3.41am" come in and by whom? Terry Elvis? Why? There has to be a reason in my opinion. Surely the defence will ask to see this Call History (activity log)..(?) I'm thinking yes. The call history does NOT change, it cannot change--0600 hours is what Terry Elvis saw on the call history (activity log) that was provided by (T-Mobile). :scared: Such a mess and ever so confusing at times!

Thank you, thank, thank you :loveyou:

:goodpost:


I hope we can get out of this :worms: and off the phone log:treadmill:

 

[UndiscoveredTruth]

Maybe Terry was mistaken. Not purposely, but by accident. I mean, after all, everyone makes mistakes especially with everything that was going on at the moment (and still does). I'm guessing that if he has Heather on his phone plan that he may very well have his other daughter, and his wife, himself, and possibly even his son on the same phone plan and may have made an honest mistake when looking at call log and/or the call logs are not always accurate especially when you have retrieved them online from your cell provider's website. JMO

Mistaken? 0600 hours doesn't look anything like 0341 hours :floorlaugh: No seriously, I know what you mean. Really though, unless all their cell numbers are almost identical it's kind of hard to make a mistake in my opinion. Call/activity logs, how are they set up? Do they have a specific cell number, with every incoming and outcoming call showing--then another number, with all the activity on that number i.e.

Cell no. 021 023 2123

17/12/13 2334hrs 027 343 3454
18/12/13 0100hrs 027 343 3454
18/12/13 0300hrs 027 343 3454

Cell no. 021 112 3333

17/12/13 2230hrs 025 555 1122
18/12/13 0200hrs 025 555 1122

If the call/history log shows something like the above, there cannot be a mistake, no matter how many members in the family have their cell number charged to the same account. Still, it's possible to make a mistake I suppose lol, but highly unlikely in my opinion especially when a member of your family is missing. You'd think there would be no room for mistakes. :scared:

 

[rtjedarling]

there was a video, don't remember which, with Terry Elvis looking into the camera and saying 3:41 was the last time Heather used her phone and the way he said it, I knew he was saying it was over for her at that time, and I'm sure he would have not wanted to have to admit that. I'm sure he would have preferred more communication from her phone that he felt he could attribute to her, but he could not. At that time I thought well, if there is more phone activity he is saying it was due to someone else. Even the way he stressed- that was the last time Heather used her phone, still made me think there was something more regarding the phone, so yes, it was interesting that now it's all data ended at that time. Odds are there is very many more instances of circumstantial evidence which have not been that hard to come by given the personalities involved.