The Scream in the Middle of Christmas Night.

[PagingDrDetect]

Originally Posted bySleuthingSleuth
would such a fall cause the skull to crack that way

Many think it was the flashlight that hit her on the head. The head of the flashlight matched the indented part of the skull.

It makes no sense to leave the note if she was dead.

Agree

I also find it odd that the note was found on the steps. Makes more sense that he'd leave it in a prominant place like in front of JBR's bedroom door or right where it was written... WHY bring the note with him down to the basement? HOW would he know if the Ramsey's would ever have gone down there in the near future? If he knew they would be conveniently out of the house at a party, wouldn't he also know they were leaving on a trip the next morning? How would he know any of them would go down those steps before leaving on their trip? Nothing about the note makes any sense, and everything about it points to an inside job.

Originally Posted bySleuthingSleuth
Indeed. And why was JBR found with duct tape on her if he didn't use it to start with? He brought it to the scene.

Dr. Henry Lee let slip that the piece of duct tape was USED... it came off of a doll in JBR's room (a doll that PP took from the house and was later replaced by another doll of the same type). So, no, an intruder didn't bring any duct tape with him, he rumagaded around the house looking for something that conveniently had a piece of duct tape on it he could pinch.

 

[narlacat]

I also find it odd that the note was found on the steps. Makes more sense that he'd leave it in a prominant place like in front of JBR's bedroom door or right where it was written... WHY bring the note with him down to the basement? HOW would he know if the Ramsey's would ever have gone down there in the near future? If he knew they would be conveniently out of the house at a party, wouldn't he also know they were leaving on a trip the next morning? How would he know any of them would go down those steps before leaving on their trip? Nothing about the note makes any sense, and everything about it points to an inside job.


Dr. Henry Lee let slip that the piece of duct tape was USED... it came off of a doll in JBR's room (a doll that PP took from the house and was later replaced by another doll of the same type). So, no, an intruder didn't bring any duct tape with him, he rumagaded around the house looking for something that conveniently had a piece of duct tape on it he could pinch.

Not true DrDetect.
Noone knows where the piece of duct tape came from.
What you just said is nothing but a rumour.

 

[kazzbar]

would such a fall cause the skull to crack that way

Many think it was the flashlight that hit her on the head. The head of the flashlight matched the indented part of the skull.

It makes no sense to leave the note if she was dead.

Agree

The note was left before he took JBR to but time.after all who would go straight down to the basement to look straight way.This would come much later after parents disscussed'what; to do about the note. Imagine the panic a note like this would cause.it would be dammn near impossible to think straight for a while after reading it.The note was just put there as a ruse.I have always thought that if an intruder took JBR it was not for money but other purposes.Obsession and Sex.
The note bought him time and he would have heard commotion if they were comeing down the stairs.in the end, though he did not collect the note because JBR was dead and the intruder was panicked. He did not mean to kill he just lost control. the whole'thing' went 'wrong'. Thus it was an 'accident'I also think perp may have been on prescription drugs.Just a feeling.

 

[Roxye]

Is it possible...

The intruder came to the house with intent of at least molesting JonBenet. He waited in the house while the Ramseys were at the party. While he waited, he wrote the note as more of a distraction tool then an actual means to communicate with the parents.

What I mean is maybe the note was only meant to be used to give him time to get away. Just in case a parent woke up in the middle of the night to find JonBenet gone. They would start searching the house. Perp could hear them searching and get away before they (the searchers) got to the basement, because the searchers stopped to read the note?

I know it is a stretch but it makes more sense then thinking the note was the real deal.

 

[kazzbar]

Is it possible...

The intruder came to the house with intent of at least molesting JonBenet. He waited in the house while the Ramseys were at the party. While he waited, he wrote the note as more of a distraction tool then an actual means to communicate with the parents.

What I mean is maybe the note was only meant to be used to give him time to get away. Just in case a parent woke up in the middle of the night to find JonBenet gone. They would start searching the house. Perp could hear them searching and get away before they (the searchers) got to the basement, because the searchers stopped to read the note?

I know it is a stretch but it makes more sense then thinking the note was the real deal.

Good 'on 'ya Roxye. You and i must 'stick' together! If it was not the R's then this is as good a theory as any. Oh, yeah, Welcom.

 

[close_enough]

This is true...a distraught mother would have certain imaginings.

I simply noted in her interview it was odd how she mixed in a statement that paints her as having heard her scream along with another event she personally witnessed.

yeah, it is odd.....she mentioned the word "nightmares" in the next sentence, so it could be nothing...

 

[close_enough]

A flashback is a recall of an actual memory, not an imaging of what might have been. Patsy referring to a flashback of JBR screaming is her referring to a memory. If it wasn't an actual memory and a slip of the tongue to call it a flashback, she should have clarified that. However, I always consider someone's first automatic response to be the truth... often "clarification" after the fact is a cover up. Politicians are guilty of this all the time. I just tend not to put much faith into anything that comes after "what I meant to say was, blah, blah, blah...".

ooooooh, you're right!....it didn't 'click' when i read that...

 

[julianne]

PagingDrDetect:

Still waiting for your reply to me regarding the post on another thread about your theory on the kiddie ....
#22

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julianne

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Originall posted by PagingDrDetect:

"The Ramsey's had no problem tarting her up like a mini Vegas showgirl publically and were even proud of it... how far of a stretch to farm her out for nudie photos or soft ?"

Although I agree that she was definately "tarted up" with the makeup, hairdo's and costumes, I think it is a BIG stretch to go from that to farming her out for nudie photos or soft . I don't agree with the whole beauty pageant thing & making these little girls look like mini-adults, but to some, it is an acceptable part of childhood if you are a girl. Especially with people who live in, or originated from the southern states. There are MANY little girls who are dolled up by their parents for beauty pageants, just like JonBenet was. Just look at some of the videos from the pageants---JonBenet doesn't look any more "tarted up" than the rest of the girls/contestants. As vulgar and offensive it is (to me), it is a very common practice in the beauty pageant circuit. I even seen a mother force her little 4 year old to wear fake teeth!! Sick? Absolutely. But I don't think it makes these parents more apt to be involved in kiddie .

Originally posted by PagingDrDetect:

"I've been hearing for years that there are kiddie photos of JBR on the internet, but no possible way am I going to test that theory out by looking for any. Some of the sources I've heard this from are from people who I'm convinced have actually seen some."

If you have spoken or had dealings with people that convinced you that they have seen firsthand kiddie pornographic photos of JonBenet, I trust you have notified LE in those people's cities, as well as the Boulder DA??? After all, child is not only disgusting, it is ILLEGAL, and with this being such a high profile case, I am sure they were extremely interested in any information you could provide regarding these people. Have you informed them of this? If so, what was their response? If you haven't informed them, WHY NOT??????

Edited to Add: I don't mean to sound confrontational AT ALL. It's just that I have never heard somebody say they were convinced that people they have spoken to have SEEN pics of JonBenet. To me, that is STUNNING, and since these people gave you information that led you to believe that they have viewed these photos, you are obligated to report this, morally & legally.

 

[curiositycat]

A flashback is a recall of an actual memory, not an imaging of what might have been. Patsy referring to a flashback of JBR screaming is her referring to a memory. If it wasn't an actual memory and a slip of the tongue to call it a flashback, she should have clarified that. However, I always consider someone's first automatic response to be the truth... often "clarification" after the fact is a cover up. Politicians are guilty of this all the time. I just tend not to put much faith into anything that comes after "what I meant to say was, blah, blah, blah...".

I disagree a flashback and a nightmare are two different things. A flashback is something that occurs when you are awake. I thought Pasty said she heard her screaming in her "nightmares". I could be wrong and if I am I stand corrected.

 

[narlacat]

The fact that PR had not one but two premonitions about her daughter dying is a huge red flag.

 

[Backwoods]

The note was left before he took JBR to but time.after all who would go straight down to the basement to look straight way.This would come much later after parents disscussed'what; to do about the note. Imagine the panic a note like this would cause.it would be dammn near impossible to think straight for a while after reading it.

Kazzbar and Roxye - What you have described is pretty much the only scenario with the note and an intruder that has made sense to me, too. I think this is perhaps why it was so long...and "rambling", if you will, with personal references to be wondered over, etc. ...it was all about buying time, I think, and causing exclamations, screams, commotion to alert the intruder in the basement to get out fast. I'd like to think that in a situation of finding a note like that, I would retain enough presence of mind to think...wait a minute, let me SEARCH first, maybe she's not been taken out of the house YET...but in reality I doubt many people would not be sidetracked for a least a while and make some alerting noises.

Perhaps the perp forgot about taping her mouth until, perhaps, she recovered enough and had a chance during some adjustment of the garotte to scream. Maybe that is when the perp panicked, hit (or dropped) her on the head, and escaped...an "accident"? Could the grating noise have been the metal grating over the basement windows being moved as he escaped through the window?

 

[narlacat]

No because there was no intruder going out that window.

 

[SleuthingSleuth]

No because there was no intruder going out that window.

What do you believe was the "metallic grating" sound in a non-intruder scenario?

 

[narlacat]

I don't believe Melody Stanton at all.
'maybe it was the negative energy enamating from JonBenet'
Yeah right.

 

[SleuthingSleuth]

I don't believe Melody Stanton at all.
'maybe it was the negative energy enamating from JonBenet'
Yeah right.

Well, when she got into that business, her credibility dips, yeah.

But I think her husband was the one who claimed he heard the metallic sound, and never took it back.
So, hrm.

 

[narlacat]

She spoke on behalf of her husband.
He didnt actually say it.

 

[englishleigh]

I don't believe Melody Stanton at all.
'maybe it was the negative energy enamating from JonBenet'
Yeah right.

Yeah, fruitcake alert!!

 

[narlacat]

Definitely lol

 

[OceanEyes]

Maybe he waited in the house for a while for them to get home, and wrote the letter and got everything ready while they were out.
Maybe he was down in the basement with her, he already had the garrotte on her loosely, but he hadn't caused any actual physical pain yet. Possibly when he put the paintbrush handle inside of her, she screamed, and he tightened the garrotte as a reflex to make her be quiet, saw that he pulled it to tight, panicked, hit her in the head, and the grating sound the neighbor heard was him hightailing it out of the basement, through the window maybe? Just my theory.

 

[BirdieBoo]

Maybe he waited in the house for a while for them to get home, and wrote the letter and got everything ready while they were out.
Maybe he was down in the basement with her, he already had the garrotte on her loosely, but he hadn't caused any actual physical pain yet. Possibly when he put the paintbrush handle inside of her, she screamed, and he tightened the garrotte as a reflex to make her be quiet, saw that he pulled it to tight, panicked, hit her in the head, and the grating sound the neighbor heard was him hightailing it out of the basement, through the window maybe? Just my theory.

Wasn't there a chair outside blocking the door, though? someone couldn't have placed a chair outside the door from inside the room.