The SODDI Defense (Some Other Dude Did It)...If not KC, who?

[brownflower]

IMO, the defense knows the SODDI strategy is not going to work. That's why there is so much emphasis on the penalty phase. JB brought in an attorney who is known as "the angel of death row." She will try her darnest to keep Casey from getting that needle poked in her arm.

IMO CA was so tearful at the motions hearing because she knows that Casey will be found guilty. IIRC she couldn't see Casey when she first sat down and she was looking all around for her. When she got a glimpse of her she started to cry.

It reminds me of when I saw my cousin at our Aunt's funeral. My Aunt had been my cousin's lifeline. (My cousin was a chronic alcoholic). At the end of the funeral I looked my cousin straight in the eye and stared bawling my eyes out. I knew she wasn't going to make it without my Aunt. I think she thought I was crying for my Aunt, but I was crying for her. Two months later my cousin was dead at 42 years old.

I think that's the same type of crying CA did when she saw Casey. Just my gut telling me this.

I am also so thankful to the press for not falling for JB's, "JG is a suspect" line. That should show him how ineffective his grandstanding truly is.

 

[songline]

It has been documented that parents have killed their own children.

It makes more sense then a Parent that ignores the fact that their child is lost and is in constant and unknown danger. As you said, such a child could be with a SO. We have all heard the horrable stories of what could happen to such a child. Ending in death or life as some sex slave.

Instead of being taken by some SO, the child might have been lost in the woods all that time. Until she starved to death or was attacked by a gator or snake. All because her Mother was to embarrased to report her missing.
I agree with your perception of the A's. I just don't think it would cover the 'why' she didn't report the baby missing. And for the reasons I just listed. KC would have to be really sick to have ignored a missing child. With murder, at least you know the child is no longer suffering. With a missing child, you don't know if your child is hurt, cold, wet, tired, sick, etc. I have a harder time seeing a Mother (or anyone) ignoring a child that might be in such danger. With death, it's over. that kind of now knowing must be horibal, I remmber losing a cat, I could not take it, how could you not look for a child ??? well in my opinion she did know

If SODDI, it would be someone whom KC thought the baby was safe with. If she thought she was with a SO, etc, then in my book ,she is worse then a murder and should get several DP's.

reply to bold.
I can agree with much of this but - you lose me that she could have been wondering in the woods.
Because a snake did not put her in a plastic bag.

 

[songline]

There are procedures to follow in the courtroom and I don't think JB can just stand up and testify for his client and throw all sorts of scenarios out there. He would have to find some way to bring this defense in through other testimony to get it in front of the jury.

As to Cindy, no, I don't think she will go along with taking the blame. She is narcissistic enough to only want to be seen as the perfect mother. That's what started this whole mess.

As to a sex offender committing this crime, why would KC cover for him on 7/16 by saying she talked to Caylee on the phone that day and she was fine?

I agree with most of it accept when you say Casey said then I have to remind you...Who said??? Miss BS cant say anything that is not 1/2 fabricated. Casey did not speak with Caylee on 7/16 I won't believe that.

 

[songline]

Interesting... Could sod turn into accidental death? I don't believe j can be framed. LE has looked at him quite closely and the glove does not fit, and I don't think it can be sold.

This is going to be quite interesting. I don't think the da would let ca off the hook, if they jury let kc go because ca had been sufficiently implicated.

The As in MO have been implicated in the cover up, clean up.
I do not think they can be impacted for murder. nor do I think KC would sit in jail for CA - no way.

 

[songline]

Hi GUYS I did not see any of this today;
I know the Anthony's have not been visiting with Casey, but can someone tell me Why they did not see her today?
Or why Casey kept her distance? anything on this ?

I do not agree with them covering up, but, but, but.
that little "B" should appreciate them for it.
Am I missing something?
OH I don't think they are going to try to pin Caylees demise on CA - is that is all you have for why there was no contact???

 

[trixi491]

There are 2 routes they can go with SODDI (it was a complete stranger or someone she knew) but both seem to be questionable..

First, if it was a complete stranger (or SO) that abducted Caylee why did she not call 911 or report her missing? There is no mother on the planet who would not report their child missing if they suddenly just disappeared. KC said the reason behind this was that she was being threatened. If she wasn't, there is honestly no reason it shouldn't have been reported and NO juror will buy into that. It would be embarassing for the defense to even attempt to say she was "conducting her own investigation" or thought it would work itself out. She would also likely be given a harsh sentencing for child neglect.

Second, both JB and LKB have brought up the "ugly coping" theory and how people grieve differently. To me, this seems that they will be saying that KC knew something was wrong and was coping with it as best she can, even if it wasn't what we would consider normal coping. She wouldn't have to "grieve" or "cope" if she thought her child was with someone safe the whole time..

Lastly, if it was someone who she knew and was scared of (which is why she didn't report Caylee; ie: a stalker), why hasn't she reported who it was once Caylee's remains were found? No one can threaten her anymore--she is in protective custody and her parents could have a whole team of bodyguards if needed, before this person was tried and brought to justice.

That being said, I still see them sticking to KC's claim about Zanny, the threats, and the script. Not one, but two of her lawyers brought up ugly coping so I really think it will be brought up in trial to describe what went on during those 31 days, unless AL can change their mind. In order for an ugly coping strategy, KC must have known her child was in danger and couldn't do anything about it. That takes away both 1) a complete stranger (she could have done something by calling 911) or 2) someone she trusted and therefore had no reason to "grieve" since she believed her child was safe.

 

[Spangle]

reply to bold.
I can agree with much of this but - you lose me that she could have been wondering in the woods.
Because a snake did not put her in a plastic bag.

The theory was that some SO took her. And KC didn't report she was missing cause she felt guilty for failing to watch her properly and was afraid of what CA would say and/or do. So she did nothing.

Being lost in the woods is many of the unknowns that could happen to a child. If KC didn't report it because she was embarrassed or felt guilty, then she left her child in unknown danger without trying to 'save' and/or protect her.

I just don't see anyone, much less a Mother just walking away and ignoring that a child might be in danger. Make no real attempt to find that child "lost" in the woods. So the 'missing' theory, I don't buy either.

And as for the SO theory, she would have to be a real, real sick monster to know a SO had her and walk away from it.

In both of those situations, the baby would be in possible bodly harm. Where the child would need to be 'saved'. could be dealing with on going trauma. Again, she would have to be a real monster to walk away, knowing her child could be in some sort of danger.. and not even care. That would be worse then a split second choice of murder. Thought, action, done. No taking back. The other, she could have changed her mind and got help for her child. So it would be a continuing choice she would be making.

To me, the only way KC could walk away and forget about it, is if a known person had her and she thought the baby would be safe. Or she knew it was all over. So there was no reason to hurry. As you point out, she didn't get in that bag accidentally.

 

[Spangle]

There are 2 routes they can go with SODDI (it was a complete stranger or someone she knew) but both seem to be questionable..

First, if it was a complete stranger (or SO) that abducted Caylee why did she not call 911 or report her missing? There is no mother on the planet who would not report their child missing if they suddenly just disappeared. KC said the reason behind this was that she was being threatened. If she wasn't, there is honestly no reason it shouldn't have been reported and NO juror will buy into that. It would be embarassing for the defense to even attempt to say she was "conducting her own investigation" or thought it would work itself out. She would also likely be given a harsh sentencing for child neglect.

Second, both JB and LKB have brought up the "ugly coping" theory and how people grieve differently. To me, this seems that they will be saying that KC knew something was wrong and was coping with it as best she can, even if it wasn't what we would consider normal coping. She wouldn't have to "grieve" or "cope" if she thought her child was with someone safe the whole time..

Lastly, if it was someone who she knew and was scared of (which is why she didn't report Caylee; ie: a stalker), why hasn't she reported who it was once Caylee's remains were found? No one can threaten her anymore--she is in protective custody and her parents could have a whole team of bodyguards if needed, before this person was tried and brought to justice.

That being said, I still see them sticking to KC's claim about Zanny, the threats, and the script. Not one, but two of her lawyers brought up ugly coping so I really think it will be brought up in trial to describe what went on during those 31 days, unless AL can change their mind. In order for an ugly coping strategy, KC must have known her child was in danger and couldn't do anything about it. That takes away both 1) a complete stranger (she could have done something by calling 911) or 2) someone she trusted and therefore had no reason to "grieve" since she believed her child was safe.

They said the Nanny took her to teach her a lesson. Thought she was a bad Mom. And they also said the family was in danger if she talked.

Up to this point, none of the story has been provable. If they just had something to work with. In order to stick with the script, they are going to have to show reason the Nanny would do such a thing to KC. They would have to show why KC would honestly believe her family would be in danger, even with the cops and media out side her home.

 

[songline]

The theory was that some SO took her. And KC didn't report she was missing cause she felt guilty for failing to watch her properly and was afraid of what CA would say and/or do. So she did nothing.

Being lost in the woods is many of the unknowns that could happen to a child. If KC didn't report it because she was embarrassed or felt guilty, then she left her child in unknown danger without trying to 'save' and/or protect her.

I just don't see anyone, much less a Mother just walking away and ignoring that a child might be in danger. Make no real attempt to find that child "lost" in the woods. So the 'missing' theory, I don't buy either.

And as for the SO theory, she would have to be a real, real sick monster to know a SO had her and walk away from it.

In both of those situations, the baby would be in possible bodly harm. Where the child would need to be 'saved'. could be dealing with on going trauma. Again, she would have to be a real monster to walk away, knowing her child could be in some sort of danger.. and not even care. That would be worse then a split second choice of murder. Thought, action, done. No taking back. The other, she could have changed her mind and got help for her child. So it would be a continuing choice she would be making.

To me, the only way KC could walk away and forget about it, is if a known person had her and she thought the baby would be safe. Or she knew it was all over. So there was no reason to hurry. As you point out, she didn't get in that bag accidentally.

You are right...:blowkiss:

 

[songline]

They said the Nanny took her to teach her a lesson. Thought she was a bad Mom. And they also said the family was in danger if she talked.

Up to this point, none of the story has been provable. If they just had something to work with. In order to stick with the script, they are going to have to show reason the Nanny would do such a thing to KC. They would have to show why KC would honestly believe her family would be in danger, even with the cops and media out side her home.

You are right again...:blowkiss:

I have to say that after reading about the new attorney I am sick to my stomach. FOR REAL.
http://www.chicagoreader.com/features/stories/hottype/080131/
IMHO the other attorneys left due to ethics and would not want to connect their name with this.
They must know something and fled for ethical reasons.:clap:
IMHO an attorney while they do have a legal obligation to a client - only some can live with
knowing about a crime and defending it.
Well her new lawyer let someone innocent rot in jail for 26 years - uke:.

I do not care what really happens at this point because I will never know the truth.
I AM DONE - If I peek around it is only for curiosity I really do not care.

I TRIED hard to give Casey the benefit of doubt, but I think that JB realized that any one
who cares about the law and has ethics will never take this case, so he got someone that
can live with themselves for 26 years knowing the guy innocent and still in jail.
This is enough to send me off.....while I may look in I REALLY DO NOT CARE.
BUT I do pray that there may be an intervention from above.
and I pray that karma gets this new lawyer but good;
OMG letting a man rot, when you have the power to make a difference?
I would like to put my hands around her neck.

I do not get involved in too many cases, I do not think it is healthy for my spirit.
I take one at a time.
Time to go see what is happening somewhere where I can care.
There is not one ethical player in this entire saga, starting with her parents,
all the way to the attorneys. MOO

 

[archenemy toenail]

Premise my post by saying I am not an advocate or supporter of Casey's.
Playing devil's advocate and adding to your theory....

http://www.wftv.com/news/19489838/detail.html



The Publix Store where he bought the beer is 3.8 miles from Hopespring Dr.
Driving directions to Hopespring Dr, Orlando, FL 32829
3.8 mi – about 10 mins

Curry Ford Rd & Dean Rd
Orlando, FL 32825

1. Head west on Curry Ford Rd/FL-552 toward S Dean Rd 1.8 mi
2. Turn left at S Chickasaw Trail 1.7 mi
3. Turn left at Suburban Dr 0.1 mi
4. Turn right at Hopespring Dr 0.2 mi

Hopespring Dr
Orlando, FL 32829

Looked him up on white pages:
http://www.whitepages.com/search/Fin...caltime=survey

He lives 3 miles from the Anthony home.

The proximity of this guy (and just the guy in general) freaks me the eff out.

Dig this: 6/16/08, Casey's on the phone and playing on the computer in the Anthony home while Caylee naps in another room. This guy has been watching them for awhile now and knows their routine, and Casey may have even seen him outside a window masturbating thus her avoidance of windows when AD stayed the night but she never told anyone because she's lazy and didn't want to have to deal with it, i.e. file a police report or deal with G or C being frightened or becoming overprotective. While he knows Casey is distracted, the perp sneaks into the house through an unlocked door and grabs Caylee and takes her out to the garage. He duct tapes her, does...whatever..., smothers/strangles her, and leaves, without leaving his beer this time. Later on, Casey wonders why Caylee hasn't woken up yet, goes to check on her, and finds her gone. She searches the house and finds her body in the garage. The flurry of calls ensues. After she fails to get a hold of anyone, she realizes that because she doesn't know what happened to Caylee under her watch that she will be blamed for this by CA if not LE and that her ego can't take this and that this is her chance to make a break from CA. Because she is a sociopath, she is more annoyed than anything that her daughter has been murdered mysteriously and she doesn't want to deal with it as she had other plans for the evening. She places a heart-shaped sticker on the duct tape to make what she's doing appear more cute, wraps Caylee up, puts her in the trunk of the Sunfire to be dealt with later, and goes to Tony's. A couple of days go by and she has still not been able to come up with a plan and maybe even feels like she shouldn't have to because she's not the one who killed her, but something needs to be done because the body has begun to leak and smell, so she simply decides to discard her in a place where she knows there is illegal dumping of trash. 31 days go by and she explains Caylee's absence using the nanny that she made up to make her friends think that her life was so much cooler than it was. When the $h!t hits the fan and LE are finally called, she continues to use the made up nanny because her narcissistic ego will not allow her to admit to any wrong doing as far as dumping the body and failing to report a crime or allowing/not noticing that a crime was being committed while Caylee was under her care. Saying that she was with the nanny puts Caylee under someone else's care when she was molested and killed. Casey is just a one-track-minded sociopath who was in the wrong place at the wrong time. :crazy: :crazy: :crazy: Any physical evidence of the actual perp is gone due the decomposition of the body and the A's meticulous cleaning habits.

 

[USARDOG]

The proximity of this guy (and just the guy in general) freaks me the eff out.

Dig this: 6/16/08, Casey's on the phone and playing on the computer in the Anthony home while Caylee naps in another room. This guy has been watching them for awhile now and knows their routine, and Casey may have even seen him outside a window.

Your post edited by me for brevity

The basic premis here does not fit. The houses here are quite close together, and most have fenced yards. Anyone walking down the road would be noticed, anyone sitting in a car would be noticed, and anyone climbing over fences would be noticed.

The A's have 2 yappie little dogs, yet this guy was able to sneak in unobserved, and confident enough to take the time to kill Caylee, duct tape her up right in their home.

KC's reaction... none... puts the body in her trunk and goes to rent a movie with TonE.

None of this is sellable, IMO.

Now, change the sod to an accidental death, and some could be made to work. Caylee falls in the pool and dies. kc freaks out, etc. Her reaction is still to strange for words, but this is slightly more sellable, IMO.

 

[archenemy toenail]

Your post edited by me for brevity

The basic premis here does not fit. The houses here are quite close together, and most have fenced yards. Anyone walking down the road would be noticed, anyone sitting in a car would be noticed, and anyone climbing over fences would be noticed.

The A's have 2 yappie little dogs, yet this guy was able to sneak in unobserved, and confident enough to take the time to kill Caylee, duct tape her up right in their home.

KC's reaction... none... puts the body in her trunk and goes to rent a movie with TonE.

None of this is sellable, IMO.

Now, change the sod to an accidental death, and some could be made to work. Caylee falls in the pool and dies. kc freaks out, etc. Her reaction is still to strange for words, but this is slightly more sellable, IMO.

Oooh...I forgot about the yappie dogs. :bang: I agree; it's not sellable, nor have I heard any SODDI theories that would be without a stretch of the imagination. I do wonder, though, because of his proximity to the A home and the duct tape and the age of the girl he's been accused of attempting to kidnap, if this guy won't be brought up as a possible alternative to Casey at trial.

 

[USARDOG]

Oooh...I forgot about the yappie dogs. :bang: I agree; it's not sellable, nor have I heard any SODDI theories that would be without a stretch of the imagination. I do wonder, though, because of his proximity to the A home and the duct tape and the age of the girl he's been accused of attempting to kidnap, if this guy won't be brought up as a possible alternative to Casey at trial.

I'm sure he will... It seems to me after reading all 24 pages of this thread, that if they are going to use a sod defense, as someone mentioned before, it will have to be an un-named sod. They will have to be content with attacking anything the prosecution puts up, without offering any specific sod of their own. I don't expect to see a specific attack on JG but rather vailed comments.

 

[Balthazar]

The already DID investigate and r/o GH.

No, the police interviewed them regarding Casey and gave JG a polygraph, however, they did not look at their cell phone records extensively, except where Casey was concerned, they did not determine their whereabouts, interview friends, work, family about them at the level of detail that they looked at Casey. They did not search their homes or vehicles. Because they arrested Casey so quickly, the police focused on Casey as the ONLY suspect. Unfortunately, this is going to allow the Defense to create reasonable doubt all over the place.

 

[USARDOG]

No, the police interviewed them regarding Casey and gave JG a polygraph, however, they did not look at their cell phone records extensively, except where Casey was concerned, they did not determine their whereabouts, interview friends, work, family about them at the level of detail that they looked at Casey. They did not search their homes or vehicles. Because they arrested Casey so quickly, the police focused on Casey as the ONLY suspect. Unfortunately, this is going to allow the Defense to create reasonable doubt all over the place.

When there is no evidence coming up against a "suspect" it is a waste police resources and of tax payers money to do all the hours of investigation required when there is evidence against a suspect turning up. Had their initial investigation turned up something they would have been all over JG like white on rice.

I see no problem in the way the investigation was run, and I see no "reasonable doubt all over the place." Guess time will tell.

 

[cecybeans]

No, the police interviewed them regarding Casey and gave JG a polygraph, however, they did not look at their cell phone records extensively, except where Casey was concerned, they did not determine their whereabouts, interview friends, work, family about them at the level of detail that they looked at Casey. They did not search their homes or vehicles. Because they arrested Casey so quickly, the police focused on Casey as the ONLY suspect. Unfortunately, this is going to allow the Defense to create reasonable doubt all over the place.

She wasn't initially arrested for murder; she was arrested for crimes she had committed and belonged in jail for: lying to police officers, obstruction of justice, child neglect (resulting in a missing child) and forging checks. It was obvious to LE and FBI from her parents' own admissions that she was a chronic liar and thief and had stolen thousands of dollars but nobody in her family had pressed charges, most likely to save themselves the embarrassment.

There was plenty of time during the first month for any reasonable SODDI to check out which she, her family, and attorney could have jumped on instead of trying to frame an innocent woman named Zenaida and KC's friends.

Instead of coming out with any kind of reasonable alternative, she told her family and others that she was "protecting" them from the kidnappers. They obviously tossed aside the nanny story and spent little or no time looking into it, but buckets of time and energy trying to build cases against her friends. Wouldn't it have just been easier to stick with the Bushy-haired SO at that point instead of trying to put someone innocent in prison for kidnapping and possibly murder?

If a suspect and her family are willing to frame an innocent person for a crime they don't believe the suspect did, but may have a weak case or alibi, WHAT does that say about their ethics and integrity? If a person is not guilty of a crime but willing to see someone innocent take the fall, then imo they deserve whatever they have coming.

 

[Verité]

. . .If a suspect and her family are willing to frame an innocent person for a crime they don't believe the suspect did, but may have a weak case or alibi, WHAT does that say about their ethics and integrity? If a person is not guilty of a crime but willing to see someone innocent take the fall, then imo they deserve whatever they have coming.

Bold mine

Re-reading this when all is quiet in the wee small hours of the morning, the last para and the statement bolded above jumped out at me.
Since my attention over the last couple days has been on the topic of the new defense attorney and her complicity in knowingly allowing an innocent person
to sit in prison for 26 years as the wrongful SOD, I'm having an aha! moment complete with goosebumps. Out of all the possible defense attorneys in the USA, :unksam:
how is it that KCA winds up with this one??? Or that "this one" makes her debut in the courtroom on the occasion that JB announces JG as a "suspect"?

We're about to see more courtroom drama than we ever imagined, but despite all the oratory and theatrics, I'm going to stay mindful of whether or not
there's some affidavit locked away in some sealed metal box, somewhere. . . . History may be old, but it does tend to repeat itself.

 

[Balthazar]

She wasn't initially arrested for murder; she was arrested for crimes she had committed and belonged in jail for: lying to police officers, obstruction of justice, child neglect (resulting in a missing child) and forging checks. It was obvious to LE and FBI from her parents' own admissions that she was a chronic liar and thief and had stolen thousands of dollars but nobody in her family had pressed charges, most likely to save themselves the embarrassment.

Yes, it was obvious that Casey was a chronic liar and thief and the police looked no further for any other suspect in Caylee's disappearance. Once they arrested her, Casey hired an attorney and that was the end of all discussions with police. Further, the police simply focused on Casey as the suspect without detailing other people who might have been involved. However, being a chronic liar and thief does not make someone a murderer. It does, however, make that person an open target to many other people, including their victims.

There was plenty of time during the first month for any reasonable SODDI to check out which she, her family, and attorney could have jumped on instead of trying to frame an innocent woman named Zenaida and KC's friends.

Not after Casey was arrested. Her attorney made certain that Casey didn't talk to police any more after that.

Instead of coming out with any kind of reasonable alternative, she told her family and others that she was "protecting" them from the kidnappers. They obviously tossed aside the nanny story and spent little or no time looking into it, but buckets of time and energy trying to build cases against her friends. Wouldn't it have just been easier to stick with the Bushy-haired SO at that point instead of trying to put someone innocent in prison for kidnapping and possibly murder?

We don't know what the defense is or who or what constituted a "nanny" in Casey's mind.

If a suspect and her family are willing to frame an innocent person for a crime they don't believe the suspect did, but may have a weak case or alibi, WHAT does that say about their ethics and integrity?

What George and Cindy think or say or do or have done doesn't matter here. They are not going on trial. What matters is what Casey's story is and what the defense will be. Casey , to this day, has not tried to implicate anyone but Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez - and not the Zenaida Gonzalez who is suing her, either.

If a person is not guilty of a crime but willing to see someone innocent take the fall, then imo they deserve whatever they have coming.

You can't be serious. You would rather see an innocent person get the death penalty if they are willing to see the person they think is guilty take the fall? Think of all the rape victims who have misidentified their rapists and an innocent person winds up in prison for many years only to be exonerated by DNA later. By your reasoning, then you think the rape victim should go to prison instead because that is what they have coming in that situation?

 

[yolorado]

IMO, the defense knows the SODDI strategy is not going to work. That's why there is so much emphasis on the penalty phase. JB brought in an attorney who is known as "the angel of death row." She will try her darnest to keep Casey from getting that needle poked in her arm.

IMO CA was so tearful at the motions hearing because she knows that Casey will be found guilty. IIRC she couldn't see Casey when she first sat down and she was looking all around for her. When she got a glimpse of her she started to cry.

It reminds me of when I saw my cousin at our Aunt's funeral. My Aunt had been my cousin's lifeline. (My cousin was a chronic alcoholic). At the end of the funeral I looked my cousin straight in the eye and stared bawling my eyes out. I knew she wasn't going to make it without my Aunt. I think she thought I was crying for my Aunt, but I was crying for her. Two months later my cousin was dead at 42 years old.

I think that's the same type of crying CA did when she saw Casey. Just my gut telling me this.

I am also so thankful to the press for not falling for JB's, "JG is a suspect" line. That should show him how ineffective his grandstanding truly is.

You may be onto something. I think Cindy's demeanor in the courtroom at the last hearing is note worthy and may mean something is up and she knows about it. I thought the same thing when, before Caylee's body was found, the Anthonys did an interview in which Cindy's appearance had deteriorated drastically causing her to look suddenly guant and hopeless. This was during the period the Anthonys still maintained Casey was alive, but after that appearance, they went uncharacteristically silent. I always thought they'd might have just been told that KC was was going to take some kind of plea deal, possibly in exchange for leading them to the body. In the same vein, something was up with Cindy during that last hearing.