Theories On What Happened to Caylee Part #7

[Mamabear1963]

Not so much theory on how Caylee died..but the thought process of the cover up.

Honestly...I believe ICA was sick and tired of being tied down...and wanted to rid herself of the burden...and over ICA dead body would she allow CA to have Caylee...

I believe that ICA thought she could just make Caylee "disappear"...look at other missing children...some literally disappear without a trace...no matter how hard they are searched for...IF ICA thought she could do away with her...and dump the body...it would be as if Caylee just disappeared as in many other cases of missing children...


The only problem was...in those cases the prep was a bit smarter...had thought things out a bit more...

I think ICA had several plans that she was thinking and those plans became a mottled mess that we have now...

Then enter CA who tries to cover up...well it is hard to cover up 2 or 3 different scenarios.

Seriously this family thought they could get away with it...all of it...and they have been surprised that their plan isn't working.

I don't know if CA and GA knew what happened...or even now fully know how Caylee died...but I believe that they knew ICA had something to do with it since they picked the car up.

MOO

 

[strawberry]

But wouldn't she be afraid that her parents might find the body?
Maybe if they had a big full sized freezer in the garage or something. But a top half sized freezer in the kitchen? I don't think so.

They do have a freezer in the garage. I picture a chest freezer...IIRC CA said she put things from the car on it to air out (eww). And in the depositions I think the State made a point of asking about the freezer.

ETA: They as GA about it on Page 299, line 20. I find it interesting that he downplays the size. He says it's 4 or 5 cubic feet which would be about 2 x 1.5 x 1.5 feet, barely bigger than a case of beer. Maybe he's just not good at math?

http://www.wftv.com/pdf/21310228/detail.html

On PDF 124 and 125 she talks about putting stuff on the freezer. She also talks about the Febreze:

http://www.wftv.com/pdf/21310288/detail.html

 

[crucibelle]

For me, the duct tape negates any accident scenario. Dr. G ruled out that it was placed post-mortemAt one time, my mind was open that it could have been an accident and she panicked, but since studying the forensics, the evidence proves otherwise to me.

Respectfully snipped an BBM. The bold statement is wrong, and I keep seeing a lot of people stating this. What Dr. G's report said was that the tape was placed prior to the complete decomposition of the soft tissue. That is because the soft tissue held the mandible in place until it (soft tissue) totally decomposed, then the tape held it there. The tape could have been applied post mortem and one would have the same situation, as long as it was placed before complete soft-tissue decomposition. Basically, what Dr. G is stating is that the tape was not placed after the body had skeletonized.

 

[crucibelle]

I know that some respected posters have refuted the theory, but I have not thrown out the freezer being a temporary storage place for poor Caylee for the reason I bolded above...

Also, I would postulate that in such a small freezer it would take days to weeks until a small human would be frozen solid enough for her bones to forensically show evidence of having been frozen (ie. osteocytes displaying characteristic freeze/thaw irregularities, etc.).

I think only her soft tissue would have frozen solid (and the purge fluids) which would have bought some time on the timeline for the decomp smell. The freezer would have had to be working overtime to accomplish even that much, IMO.

So I'm not throwing out the freezer storing theory myself either.:twocents:

I, too, kind of believe in the freezer theory. It just makes sense to me.

 

[Schmerty_Jones]

Great theories & discussion. I must admit I never thought of the chest freezer,but as soon as it was brought up I had this A HA!!! moment. It just clicked

 

[katydid23]

I am not sold on the freezer theory. I lived with my parents briefly when I first graduated from college. I had things, occasionally, that I wanted to hide from them back in the day.
[ this was in the early 70's...different world]
I would have never tried to hide anything in the big garage freezer. That was my mom's domain. She was always fussing around in there, seeing what needed to be used next, and taking out her frozen casseroles to be thawed for dinner. I just cannot see hiding a dead child in there and driving off, and not be worried that it would be found. That would be a big huge new thing in the freezer. IDK

 

[belle3]

Im starting to wonder if she left caylee somewhere in the house or in the yard for a day. Im starting to think that she came back to the house to get caylee. U dont just put a toddler in ur trunk in broad daylight, right?? what if when she came back to the house and backed into the garage, it was to recover caylee and getting the shovel was a lame attempt at a burial at home but when that was gonna be impossible to do in the time she had she then put her in the trunk and left.Only to come back the next day to put her in the bags.

 

[watcher9]

I don't believe little Caylee was ever put in the freezer.
Wouldn't there be some evidence of decomposition left in the freezer if she was placed in it?

Also, the bugs don't lie. They showed up in the trunk as she began to decompose.

 

[katydid23]

Im starting to wonder if she left caylee somewhere in the house or in the yard for a day. Im starting to think that she came back to the house to get caylee. U dont just put a toddler in ur trunk in broad daylight, right?? what if when she came back to the house and backed into the garage, it was to recover caylee and getting the shovel was a lame attempt at a burial at home but when that was gonna be impossible to do in the time she had she then put her in the trunk and left.Only to come back the next day to put her in the bags.

I thought that to at first, that she may have left her in the yard overnight. But the A's have two dogs. I know my dogs would be going crazy if they smelled a dead baby in the yard or the house. [ except maybe the freezer, but I still doubt that. ]

I think she was wrapped in her baby blanket and placed in the trunk, first thing after she died. I think one could get away with placing a large bundle in the trunk during the day time. I put large things in my trunk in my driveway all of the time. There aren't too many people around in the daytime--they are in school or at work usually.

 

[Whisperer]

I think she put Caylee in the sand box. Wasn't there a blue crate filled w/toys at one point in the car trunk? It could be that she removed all the play toys from the sandbox, put them in her car, and then placed Caylee in the sandbox. That is what she needed the shovel for she covered her w/sand. She may have even purchased play sand for this.

It was raining around that time. Caylee would not be found in the yard because her parents would remain in the house till the rain ceased. George locked the shed. she had to get Caylee from the sandbox and borrowed a shovel to use for the sand. She then washed the rest of the sand away on the grass and washed the shovel. She put Caylee in her trunk, put the toys back in on top of the sand and drove away.

 

[BigMomma]

I, too, kind of believe in the freezer theory. It just makes sense to me.

Especially if one couples it with the car being left opened in the closed garage for hours. The odor premeated into everything in that garage. Nobody would know if there was decomp in the garage prior, they'd just chalk it up to being infected or compromised.

 

[wenwe4]

I know that there is quite a few threads on theories of what happen to Caylee.

I was watching Nancy Grace tonight and it wasn't one thing in particular that had me thinking about this, but a lot of things.

So here is my thoughts on what happened.

I think that KC had put Caylee down for a nap. Couple of hours to text, get on the computer and talk on her phone, or whatever else she wanted. This was her time. How dare Caylee interrupt her. I think that Caylee threw a huge tantrum. I seem to remember that there was a lot of talk about KC not being able to get Caylee to sleep without going through a routine. Didn't CA say that she had called KC home because she couldn't get Caylee to sleep? My grandaughter is just a month older than Caylee was at the time. A almost three year old can throw a huge tamtrum at times. I have heard my grandaughter do this and I couldn['t believe how long it went on. It is just something that they go through and outgrow eventually. It is tough on a young parent. I think this is what happen and ICA flew into a rage with her. We have seen ICA fly into the rages with her parents in the jail house tapes. The signs are there. Perhaps put the duct tape on her because she was so mad that she wouldn't stop throwing her tamtrum and interupting her time. I think that her rage cause her daughter's death.

If you had called anyone, she still would have been charged with murder and the only thing that she could do is go into this coverup mode. IMO

Don't forget the parenting books open to pages about handling tantrums. There are only 2 reasons to duct tape a toddler's mouth and/or nose. (IMO)
1) Shut Them UP for good
2) After death to contain bodily fluid purging.

in the 2nd scenario that would be more difficult (IMO) because the whatever amount of fluid that leaked (that originally would alert the perp to duct tape the mouth) would preclude the tape from sticking to the skin. It could be argued that the tape went into the hair on each side of her face, enough to hold the mandible in place, was the only way to secure the duct tape to the face as the liquids prevented a good skin/tape bond. The hair was the anchor for the tape to remain in place.

As Joypath pointed out . . . the shovel probably wasn't used in the placing of the body into the bags (thank you for helping me to clear that out of my head). I now believe more than ever that a baby blanket was used as a sling to pick up Caylee's body, as I don't believe kc would think of bagging Caylee until it became clear that decomp was setting in.

 

[LambChop]

Respectfully snipped an BBM. The bold statement is wrong, and I keep seeing a lot of people stating this. What Dr. G's report said was that the tape was placed prior to the complete decomposition of the soft tissue. That is because the soft tissue held the mandible in place until it (soft tissue) totally decomposed, then the tape held it there. The tape could have been applied post mortem and one would have the same situation, as long as it was placed before complete soft-tissue decomposition. Basically, what Dr. G is stating is that the tape was not placed after the body had skeletonized.

I think the doctor meant right after death, minutes/hours because the mandible drops when a person dies and within a short period of time. I do not remember anything in the doctor's report about the tape being placed prior to complete decomposition of the soft tissue only that she mentioned pre-mortem or shortly post-mortem. It's been a long time since I've read her report. jmo

 

[LambChop]

I think she put Caylee in the sand box. Wasn't there a blue crate filled w/toys at one point in the car trunk? It could be that she removed all the play toys from the sandbox, put them in her car, and then placed Caylee in the sandbox. That is what she needed the shovel for she covered her w/sand. She may have even purchased play sand for this.

It was raining around that time. Caylee would not be found in the yard because her parents would remain in the house till the rain ceased. George locked the shed. she had to get Caylee from the sandbox and borrowed a shovel to use for the sand. She then washed the rest of the sand away on the grass and washed the shovel. She put Caylee in her trunk, put the toys back in on top of the sand and drove away.

The blue crate in the trunk of the car did not contain toys, see CA deposition. If Caylee was left in the backyard the A's dogs would have found her when the A's let them out in the backyard to do their business. Caylee was a member of that family and the dogs would have been all over the sandbox. jmo

 

[LambChop]

I don't believe little Caylee was ever put in the freezer.
Wouldn't there be some evidence of decomposition left in the freezer if she was placed in it?

Also, the bugs don't lie. They showed up in the trunk as she began to decompose.

It would have been apparent when they did testing of her bones if she had been in a freezer. jmo

 

[Intermezzo]

I don't believe little Caylee was ever put in the freezer.
Wouldn't there be some evidence of decomposition left in the freezer if she was placed in it?

Also, the bugs don't lie. They showed up in the trunk as she began to decompose.

I also do not believe Caylee was ever put in the freezer..but I would expect LE to check or inspect the freezer

IIRC LE, seeing the freezer in the garage, did ask Dr G to determine if the body had been put in the freezer...

 

[Intermezzo]

I thought that to at first, that she may have left her in the yard overnight. But the A's have two dogs. I know my dogs would be going crazy if they smelled a dead baby in the yard or the house. [ except maybe the freezer, but I still doubt that. ]

I think she was wrapped in her baby blanket and placed in the trunk, first thing after she died. I think one could get away with placing a large bundle in the trunk during the day time. I put large things in my trunk in my driveway all of the time. There aren't too many people around in the daytime--they are in school or at work usually.

IMO Casey put Caylee in the trunk of the car and then disposed of Caylee
Casey was the only person who had access and control of the car during the 31 days.
The June 24th incident with George wanting to access the trunk to get something and Casey flying into a fit to get to the car first demonstrates that she did not want George to open and touch anything in that trunk

 

[RR0004]

I know that some respected posters have refuted the theory, but I have not thrown out the freezer being a temporary storage place for poor Caylee for the reason I bolded above...

Also, I would postulate that in such a small freezer it would take days to weeks until a small human would be frozen solid enough for her bones to forensically show evidence of having been frozen (ie. osteocytes displaying characteristic freeze/thaw irregularities, etc.).

I think only her soft tissue would have frozen solid (and the purge fluids) which would have bought some time on the timeline for the decomp smell. The freezer would have had to be working overtime to accomplish even that much, IMO.

So I'm not throwing out the freezer storing theory myself either.:twocents:

Ya know...this just rang a bell for me...didn't TL in his most recent depo go on about how ingenious Casey was in feeding them...putting meals together on little or no money...how can he say that when he was with her after she raided the fridge, when she was buying beer and stuff? Sorry, know it's OT...but the talk of the freezer brought this to mind. Was he afraid of being accused of knowing about her stealing?

 

[GourmetSoy]

I think the chloroform was used to subdue Caylee and keep her from struggling while ICA put on the duct tape. The duct tape was covering her nose and mouth to smother her and the chloroform was used so she wouldn't struggle while being smothered.

I don't think ICA would have touched her after decomp started to cover her nose and mouth. In my opinion the tape was the murder weapon. I think she then wrapped her in the blanket, put her in the laundry bag into the trunk. She went on about her business that night like she was planning.

The next day she went back to the house and if I remember correctly she was seen backing in the garage. I think she took Caylee in the laundry bag out of the trunk and went to the backyard thinking she would bury her there and realized she couldn't find a shovel. She set her down in 3 different areas looking for the right spot (dog hits) and decided against it that day. I think she then double bagged her in the garbage bags because the smell had begun and put her back in the trunk.

The next day she comes back to the house, backs the car up again and decides to go borrow the shovel from the neighbor. She tries to dig a hole to bury Caylee by the pool and decides it's too difficult and gives up. She returns the shovel, puts the bag back in the trunk and drives around looking for a spot. The smell by now is horrible in the car and she is in a hurry to get rid of her so she decides on the final spot where Caylee is ultimately found.

I think she was seen a third time backing in (that Friday?) and I think that's when she cleaned the trunk because the smell was not gone even though Caylee was gone from the trunk. She may have had the chloroform in the laundry detergent bottle in the trunk and it spilled, which would give the reason for the high levels of chloroform in the air tests. Something was saturated with it in the trunk or it was spilled, saturating the trunk liner.

She then went on to party her heart out that night in the blue dress like nothing ever happened. :loser:

 

[crucibelle]

Some believe George saw them the 16th, some do not. Yes, KC uploaded a pic on the 16th @ 11 something, but where was she earlier that morning (as in the night of the 15th to morning of 16th b4 she uploaded that photo)? Why would the Anthony home phone call KC on her cell @ 7:45 the morning of the 16th? There is some lying going on here. And I am not saying Lee is lying about when he saw her last. It is possible KC went to Lee's the night of the 15th without his knowledge.

BBM. In regards to the bold statement, I never heard/read this. Is this really true?