Theory #3: Other Stranger Abduction

[iNTERESTEDWOMAN]

If I recall, the GW cyanide connection had to do with some interest in Hitler and GW wrote to someone inquiring about the "recipe"/concoction.

I, like Doogie and Annasmom saw no resemblence between Georgieanne, her siblings and Anna.

I could be wrong, but I don't recall any reference mentioned in the BFH with any cults other than GW's interest in " investing " or some kind of interest in synanon.

I know that many didn't Cubby, but Doogie did at first as well as a few others. I was not convinced until I made contact with several (6)ex-Peoples Temples members who assured me they are not the same girls. I just don't feel comfortable dismissing a gut feeling until I know for sure.

It's kind of like the Synanon Picture. It's brought up every few months, people look it over, 10 post are made on it and then it goes away and then it comes back up.......I wanted to make absolutely SURE that Georgiann was not Anna, so we, (well, I guess just me) wouldn't have to rehash it every few weeks. I posted here a few days ago that I am pretty much convinced that Georgiann is NOT Anna.

With that said, there are 408 unidentified (mostly children) still without a name. Even though Georgiann is not Anna, that doesn't mean that one of the other 408 are not her.

As I said before, last week I sent another letter to my contacts with pictures of Anna attached with detailed information of her disappearance, including info on the Georges. No one replied until Today.

 

[InterestedNHelping]

Quite some time ago I commented that "children were "Dropped off" at Synanon, but heard no response or comments about it. I still wonder about the same thing, and not just about Anna, but about lots of other missing children. I want to know how that was possible, dropping off, and 400+ children with no identity...someone, somewhere, knows how, why and who...
I hope I am wrong and none of these are Anna, I never thought the Synanon girl pic was Anna, but it takes alot of viewpoints to find out the truths, so everyone should explore what they feel is important. I think there must be a way to know more about the UID's at Evergreen, and possibly whom GB was buried next to, or near, or associated with possibly...

 

[SherlockJr]

This is an e-mail I received last year from a woman who lived at the Synanon and identified both girls in the picture.

The school was for the children of residents it was not a boarding
school. It would have been highly unlikely a child would be there who
didn't have both or at least one parent in Synanon, no matter who the
parent was or how much they could 'afford.' The school was an integral
part of the community

 

[iNTERESTEDWOMAN]

I agree Cubby... while Synanon may be a possibility, I just cannot get into the Jonestown theory.

Yes, it's a grizzly thought especially knowing the outcome of the majority of the Peoples Temple members.

This is why I believe there is a connection:

GB/GW lived a few blocks from the Peoples Temple Head Quarters
PT members walked the streets daily passing out literature & news letters to every nearby residents
PT was a Socialist movement - GB/GW had ties to/interested in the Socialist movement
(Rumored)PT had strong political ties - Brody claimed to be into politics
In 1973 PT had several "homes" they ran for elderly and foster children
408 UID buried in mass grave in Evergreen Cemetery - GB is cremated at Evergreen Cemetery in Oakland when there where many facilities closer to where he lived.
900 PT members committed suicide drinking a cyanide poison concoction - GW committed suicide drinking a cyanide poison concoction.

With all due respect to Cubby, Hitler took a cyanide PILL and shot himself in the head. If Waters was mimicking him, he would have killed himself much differently.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Adolf_Hitler

 

[iNTERESTEDWOMAN]

...t Evergreen, and possibly whom GB was buried next to, or near, or associated with possibly...

Brody was cremated and supposedly his ashes where with Waters...I wonder where they are now?

ETA: Just found the post that Annasmom stated that the facility disposed of the ashes

 

[MagicRose99]

Yes, it's a grizzly thought especially knowing the outcome of the majority of the Peoples Temples members.

This is why I beleive there is a connection:

GB/GW lived a few blocks from the Peoples Temple Head Quarters
PT members walked the streets daily passing out literature & news letters to every nearby resident
PT was a Socialist movement - GB/GW had ties to/interested in the Socialist movement
PT had strong political ties - Brody claimed to be into politics
In 1973 PT had several "homes" they ran for elderly and foster children
408 UID buried in mass grave in Evergreen Cemetery - GB is cremated at Evergreen Cemetery in Oakland when there where many facilities closer to where he lived.
900 PT members committed suicide drinking a cyanide poison concoction - GW committed suicide drinking a cyanide poison concoction.

With all due respect to Cubby, Hitler took a cyanide PILL and shot himself in the head. If Waters was mimicking him, he would have killed himself much differently.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Adolf_Hitler

You're definitely entitled to your opinions and theories and I wish you luck in your endeavor.

But, personally, I just cannot get into it. I believe that other possibilites are more probable.

 

[christine2448]

http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=49785

 

[iNTERESTEDWOMAN]

You're definitely entitled to your opinions and theories and I wish you luck in your endeavor.

But, personally, I just cannot get into it. I believe that other possibilites are more probable.

Would you mind sharing what possibilities you think are more probable? I personally think that every theory should be totally researched until proven right or wrong. Thanks.

 

[Shadow205]

This is an e-mail I received last year from a woman who lived at the Synanon and identified both girls in the picture.

The school was for the children of residents it was not a boarding
school. It would have been highly unlikely a child would be there who
didn't have both or at least one parent in Synanon, no matter who the
parent was or how much they could 'afford.' The school was an integral
part of the community

Not according to this former member:
"I was not a Synanon kid, but a child who my parents dropped off there."

http://www.synanon.org/synanon/Museum/GuestBook.cfm

I remember hen you were told that but if it is the child of "George" which I think that is what you were told. I don't think I can agree with that. Would you please pm me who the little girl is supposed to be and maybe I can get off of that theory.

 

[MagicRose99]

Would you mind sharing what possibilities you think are more probable? I personally think that every theory should be totally researched until proven right or wrong. Thanks.

I believe in the possibilities:
1) accident: falling in old well, creek, etc.
2) abduction for nefarious purposes
3) abduction because someone wanted a child
4) Synanon is a possibility to me, because, no matter how "sick" the George's were, I can see them giving Anna to Synanon... but I cannot see them having anything to do with Jones/Jonestown, because Jones would have conflicted with GB's self-delusioned image that HE was a "guru" himself.

 

[christine2448]

This is an e-mail I received last year from a woman who lived at the Synanon and identified both girls in the picture.

The school was for the children of residents it was not a boarding
school. It would have been highly unlikely a child would be there who
didn't have both or at least one parent in Synanon, no matter who the
parent was or how much they could 'afford.' The school was an integral
part of the community

I believe we may have been speaking to the same person, but NOT 100% on that...anyhow...I don't see anywhere where she says she knows who this specific child is, name, something. I'm just not willing to toss this to the side until we have something concrete telling us who this child is. Do you have something that you can share with us? THanks Sherlock, I so much admire all the work you have done on Anna's case.

 

[iNTERESTEDWOMAN]

I believe in the possibilities:
1) accident: falling in old well, creek, etc.
2) abduction for nefarious purposes
3) abduction because someone wanted a child
4) Synanon is a possibility to me, because, no matter how "sick" the George's were, I can see them giving Anna to Synanon... but I cannot see them having anything to do with Jones/Jonestown, because Jones would have conflicted with GB's self-delusioned image that HE was a "guru" himself.

These are all very good possibilities, though I have to wonder why you would think Brody/Waters would turn Anna over to Charles Dederich, but not Jim Jones. These 2 groups are almost synonymous with each other. It is stated in many web sites that CD was a brain washer, practiced in mind control, a murderer, believed in commune living and was mentally ill. The Synanon ultimately became a cultishChurch of Synanon in the 1970s. He forced married couples to break up and take new partners. They severely beat children who misbehaved or ran away.

These facts and many, many more are true of both "cults" Jim & Chuck where 2 of a kind. They where made from the same mold. Actually the treatment of children appeared to be much better in PT, they where only locked up for a few days as apposed to face beatings and slamming against walls as in Synanon.

Thanks for answering, your theories are all very possible but as respectfully as I can say it, If one feels that Brody would feel superior or had conflicting interests to Jones, he would most definitely have to feel the same way about Dederich. Dederich was just as bad as Jones. If the IRS would not have shut the Synanon down, there is no doubt in my mind that many would have died there too.

The following quote comes from:

http://www.rickross.com/reference/synanon/synanon5.html

Nonetheless, most news coverage of Synanon compared it with People's Temple and Dederich with Jim Jones. With Dederich barred by the court from running Synanon, and with the Internal Revenue Service taking away its tax exemption, the last of the cult died out in the 1990s. However, as late as 1996, two or three former members tried to resurrect a version of the group at the old Badger facility, but that land ultimately was taken over by the government as well.

 

[Annasmom]

Yes, it's a grizzly thought especially knowing the outcome of the majority of the Peoples Temple members.

This is why I believe there is a connection:

GB/GW lived a few blocks from the Peoples Temple Head Quarters
PT members walked the streets daily passing out literature & news letters to every nearby residents
PT was a Socialist movement - GB/GW had ties to/interested in the Socialist movement
(Rumored)PT had strong political ties - Brody claimed to be into politics
In 1973 PT had several "homes" they ran for elderly and foster children
408 UID buried in mass grave in Evergreen Cemetery - GB is cremated at Evergreen Cemetery in Oakland when there where many facilities closer to where he lived.
900 PT members committed suicide drinking a cyanide poison concoction - GW committed suicide drinking a cyanide poison concoction.

With all due respect to Cubby, Hitler took a cyanide PILL and shot himself in the head. If Waters was mimicking him, he would have killed himself much differently.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Adolf_Hitler

I have a question and a few clarifications: Didn't the Jonestown victims have to have passports? George Waters and George Brody had no sympathy for or connection to Socialism, and there is no reason at all to assume this. Dr. Waters was not emulating Hitler. Without going into this any further, I will just say that there was correspondence in his files which proves otherwise. Both Brody and Waters were against organized religion, which makes the Peoples Temple hypothesis extremely remote. I agree with you that no possibility should be dismissed until disproved, but there are some unfounded assumptions in this case.

 

[iNTERESTEDWOMAN]

I have a question and a few clarifications: Didn't the Jonestown victims have to have passports? George Waters and George Brody had no sympathy for or connection to Socialism, and there is no reason at all to assume this. Dr. Waters was not emulating Hitler. Without going into this any further, I will just say that there was correspondence in his files which proves otherwise. Both Brody and Waters were against organized religion, which makes the Peoples Temple hypothesis extremely remote. I agree with you that no possibility should be dismissed until disproved, but there are some unfounded assumptions in this case.

Yes, they did need passports. I'm sorry to say I assumed that you didn't know if she was ever granted one when your wrote this:

1st Thread on Theory # 2 dated 11-13-06 Post # 630

Annasmom wrote:
If the lady was aware of the case, she wasn't saying anything. They had told me previously that they could not give me any information on a passport for Anna, not even if she had one. Though she has been missing for such a long time, privacy laws prevent their giving out information about her. I had to send a death certificate for George, along with other documentation, to get this far. It has taken a long time, but at least we'll have that bit done before too long. The thing I find curious is that they found SEVERAL applications, not just renewals. I don't know what that means, but I'm intrigued.

I sorry that I assumed that the Georges where involved with the socialist movement. I see now that GW sister was involved, and she was the only one who Brody didn't bash. I must have gotten confused when you wrote this:

1st thread Theory #2 dated 1-7-07 Post #733

Annasmom wrote:
wanted to add this: Though none of the occult terms and fields mentioned in this post ever came up to my knowledge, GB did claim he could "read the akashic records" (he pronounced this ah-kay-shic) and he used this claim to "authenticate" his predictions and analyses. An interesting thing which comes up with regard to this post is that GW's sister, a member of the Socialist Workers Party, was the only member of the family who didn't come under fire from Brody.

I think you misunderstood what I wrote, I never said/thought GW was emulating Hitler, "Cubby" posted she thought that. I think he was emulating Jonestown. Cubby might have assumed that when you posted this:

1 Thread Theory #2 dated: 1-7-07 Post #731

Annasmom wrote:
This all makes sense to me. Brody did refer to Hitler a number of times in my hearing, and GW actually wrote two letters to the widow of a famous Nazi, asking her specifics about poisons. This post seems significant, and I need to read it several more times.

As far as religion, the Peoples temple was more of a commune than that of a religion. In your book, near the end of Chapter 6 you wrote that George had mentioned you joining a commune with 2 single men and 2 single women. Again I was under the assumption he was into communal living, not particularly a religion.

I'm sorry if I have offended you in anyway. I can't imagine the pain you have gone through for so many years. After more discussion with Mr. McGehee today, the world will never know who is buried in that mass grave of children anyway. It will never be allowed to be excavated. It is pointless even if someone from the Peoples Temple did possibly recognize Anna's picture. It can never be proven.

I wish you only the very best in your search.

 

[Annasmom]

Yes, they did need passports. I'm sorry to say I assumed that you didn't know if she was ever granted one when your wrote this:

1st Thread on Theory # 2 dated 11-13-06 Post # 630

read Theory #2 dated: 1-7-07 Post #731[/U]

I'm sorry if I have offended you in anyway. I can't imagine the pain you have gone through for so many years. After more discussion with Mr. McGehee today, the world will never know who is buried in that mass grave of children anyway. It will never be allowed to be excavated. It is pointless even if someone from the Peoples Temple did possibly recognize Anna's picture. It can never be proven.

I wish you only the very best in your search.

No, no! You have not offended me, not at all!!! You have done all this research, and we need you here! Don't leave us! I just wanted to clarify a couple of points. My question about passports had to do with identifying the children in that mass grave. If they all needed passports to get to Jonestown, I don't know why there's still any question about the identities. I did not see any family resemblance with the little girl you were looking at, but certainly I DID look. Anything is possible. I am guessing that the seemingly callous method of their burial had to do with public health concerns, but surely there is a record...I briefly considered whether Anna might have been involved at the time we learned of the Jonestown tragedy, but it seemed so unlikely, given the secrecy of the two Georges and the way they avoided any connection with any established groups...if Brody couldn't be the top gun, he didn't want anything to do with it.

 

[mfmangel1]

After having contact with LE and spending a great deal of time together recently, perhaps Dr. Doogie and Annasmom have better suggestions as to what direction they would like for us to follow in the investigation now.

We don't want to waste our resources in a million different directions or travel over the same old territory.

I am sure there are numerous viable and legitimate theories for us to follow.

 

[Annasmom]

After having contact with LE and spending a great deal of time together recently, perhaps Dr. Doogie and Annasmom have better suggestions as to what direction they would like for us to follow in the investigation now.

We don't want to waste our resources in a million different directions or travel over the same old territory.

I am sure there are numerous viable and legitimate theories for us to follow.

Mfangel1, I'll post on the General thread regarding Detective Gilletti's visit yesterday.

 

[Cubby]

Interested woman, Thank you for finding the following old post:

I think you misunderstood what I wrote, I never said/thought GW was emulating Hitler, "Cubby" posted she thought that. I think he was emulating Jonestown. Cubby might have assumed that when you posted this:

1 Thread Theory #2 dated: 1-7-07 Post #731


Quote:
Annasmom wrote:
This all makes sense to me. Brody did refer to Hitler a number of times in my hearing, and GW actually wrote two letters to the widow of a famous Nazi, asking her specifics about poisons. This post seems significant, and I need to read it several more times.

Too clear this up, since it appears to have been misunderstood. I never meant to imply GW was emulating, or even had an obsession with Hitler. I should have been more clear and I had assumed he had an interest based on the letter(s) he wrote. I don't know why he wrote that, could have been for his work in medicine........

Annasmom,
I am very sorry if I offended you in any way. If I did, it was certainly unintended. I have the utmost admiration for you, your family/friends and perseverance. I can only imagine what you have and continue to go through.

Annas case weighs on my mind daily. I think about it often, and sometimes even dream about trying to find ways for answers. It's frustrating, at least for me I can't do more........ But know we/I am here for you, all you or doogie or anyone needs to do is say the word, and I'll do my best to help in any way I can.

 

[Annasmom]

Annasmom,
I am very sorry if I offended you in any way. If I did, it was certainly unintended. I have the utmost admiration for you, your family/friends and perseverance. I can only imagine what you have and continue to go through.

Annas case weighs on my mind daily. I think about it often, and sometimes even dream about trying to find ways for answers. It's frustrating, at least for me I can't do more........ But know we/I am here for you, all you or doogie or anyone needs to do is say the word, and I'll do my best to help in any way I can.

Cubby, of course you have not offended me in any way. Now I am wondering if my schoolteacher-ish way of writing makes people think I'm mad all the time (no, I'm not!) I am grateful for the time and energy you and other Sleuths have put into trying to find answers to this mystery. I'm feeling stumped, too. I know there are several ways we could go, but it's hard not to feel let down after the DNA results. Never mind, I'll have a go at that dreaded BFH in the next few days.

 

[mjak]

I think it is very important that we stick to deductive reasoing when following leeds in the search for Anna. As if we do not do this there are no parmaters for our search and our chance for success decreases greatly. I think the work on Jonestown being done is admirable in that I feel it is important that these unknown children are given back to their families. However, I have yet to see a link upon which one can reasonable deduce that Anna may have been involved with Jonestown. Unless that link is found I would recommend we not spend a lot of time prusuing this theory. There is a link to synonm although a remote one, but neverless a link so that theory is worth persuing. What other theories can we come up with?

mjak