TN - Holly Bobo, 20, Darden, believed abducted 13 April 2011 - #30

[Plumeria5]

I can't buy the suspicious neighbor theory, because Clint claims he saw Holly and perp walking into the woods at 7:50. If that was the neighbor walking her off at 7:50, why in heaven's name would he report a scream to his mother at 7:40 and then go next door and nab Holly? That just makes no sense, folks. Either the scream was Holly and she probably was abducted at that moment by person/s unknown, or the scream was not Holly and we have no idea what happened to her or when exactly it happened. Or the scream was a screech owl, bobcat, fox or mountain lion. All those things make sounds like a woman screaming for her life. Google it.

That is assuming the timeline of 7:50 is correct. Scream at 7:40, dog waits 10 minutes to bark or Clint sleeps through the barking for 10 minutes, Clint awakens at 7:50. Or in reality does Clint really wake up at 7:40 because the dog is barking after hearing Holly scream. Maybe there is no scream. I am just trying to see it from all angles as nothing is as it seems. Maybe I need a timeout.

 

[wishuwerehere]

At 7:30 a.m. there is a “flurry” of calls between Holly, Drew and KB. I would like to know if they were texting one another or actually talking. Because if Holly was only texting, it would be impossible to know if she was actually doing the texting, unless she conveyed something only she would know, or someone witnessed her texting at that time. I’m having a hard time reconciling the timeline in any kind of way until I can find out when was the last time someone heard Holly’s voice. I know some of you may say the scream indicates that is the last time Holly is actually heard, however it has not been confirmed if the scream is Holly’s voice or not. I’m not ruling out the possibility of it being Holly’s scream, but as usual, in this case, I’m searching for confirmation.

And in my experience screech owls, bobcats, and foxes tend to be nocturnal creatures. I also have mistaken a screech owl to sound just like a baby crying in the night in the woods. Creepy.

 

[~n/t~]

I went back to thead #29 and found a great post by Frogzilla. I copied it and here it is.

Thank's Frogzilla!

http://m.jacksonsun.com/news/article...10130314&f=645
Holly Bobo's family questions early handling of investigation

Here are some snippets-
"A lot of people stuck their nose in law enforcement business that day, and too many people showed up there at one time," Wyatt said. "We were trying to keep people away as best as we could, but when you have a few hundred people showing up, it is hard to do."

Wyatt said the deputies had a hard time keeping people from going into the backyard, but that no one walked around the area where Holly was last seen.

But Clint said people walked all around the area where he last saw his sister and that this was one of his largest concerns.

"As I was writing my statement, I guess I kind of had a feeling that we might not get Holly back right away," Clint said. "So I was trying to preserve the crime scene and keep it from being disrupted because I knew the only thing we might have would be footprints, and I knew if someone stepped on them, then that's ruined.

Wyatt said deputies did not want to enter the area or allow others to do so for fear that they would impair some evidence that might be found and because they were waiting on a search dog and trying to gather information leading them to go a certain direction.

Wyatt is a local and a pastor. I'll believe TBI before I believe the local guys. He's right up there on my hinky meter.

 

[wishuwerehere]

Wyatt is a local and a pastor. I'll believe TBI before I believe the local guys. He's right up there on my hinky meter.

Everything about this case seems to be so convoluted.

The only thing I know for sure is that Holly is missing.

 

[MizStery]

Wyatt is a local and a pastor. I'll believe TBI before I believe the local guys. He's right up there on my hinky meter.

Thanks n/t~ for helping me understand who he is..I had no idea. :seeya:

 

[~n/t~]

Thanks n/t~ for helping me understand who he is..I had no idea. :seeya:

Here he is at 3:23 mark

http://www.newschannel5.com/story/1...missing-decatur-co-woman?clienttype=printable

 

[MizStery]

At 7:30 a.m. there is a “flurry” of calls between Holly, Drew and KB. I would like to know if they were texting one another or actually talking. Because if Holly was only texting, it would be impossible to know if she was actually doing the texting, unless she conveyed something only she would know, or someone witnessed her texting at that time. I’m having a hard time reconciling the timeline in any kind of way until I can find out when was the last time someone heard Holly’s voice. I know some of you may say the scream indicates that is the last time Holly is actually heard, however it has not been confirmed if the scream is Holly’s voice or not. I’m not ruling out the possibility of it being Holly’s scream, but as usual, in this case, I’m searching for confirmation.

And in my experience screech owls, bobcats, and foxes tend to be nocturnal creatures. I also have mistaken a screech owl to sound just like a baby crying
in the night in the woods. Creepy.

We are on the same page. You are right if events were documented on the method of
communication & if we had cell phone records I believe we could answer that question. I am
going to make an assumption that James had an alibi. But,other than the 7:40 scream we still do not know the last person to speak directly to Holly (land phone or cell). If we go by Mr. Naotek's timeline then it was Holly's mother(assuming it was cell and not texting)Am I overlooking something? If non family it was Holly's school friend at around 7AM. I just wanted to repeat this is assuming James has an alibi therefore he would have no motive to make up the scream at 7:40 coming from Holly's home.MOO

 

[birpu]

And in my experience screech owls, bobcats, and foxes tend to be nocturnal creatures. I also have mistaken a screech owl to sound just like a baby crying in the night in the woods. Creepy.[/QUOTE]

Well, Tennessee is full of bobcats. Bobcats sound extremely human when they scream. Truly like a woman screaming. They are not nocturnal:
Bobcats can be active day or night but tend to exhibit crepuscular (dawn and dusk) activity. Their activity peaks three hours before sunset until midnight and again between one hour before and four hours after sunrise. They remain active year round and do not hibernate. This from: http://www.mass.gov/dfwele/dfw/wildlife/living/living_with_bobcats.htm

Not saying it was a bobcat, but it could have been. If it was an animal the neighbor heard, that would be the most likely one. But the coincidence of it being the morning Holly disappeared makes me think there is a more human connection.

My other scenario about the scream is that it could have been someone seeing Holly in a lump on the floor of the carport and realizing she's injured or worse.

 

[wishuwerehere]

And in my experience screech owls, bobcats, and foxes tend to be nocturnal creatures. I also have mistaken a screech owl to sound just like a baby crying in the night in the woods. Creepy.

Well, Tennessee is full of bobcats. Bobcats sound extremely human when they scream. Truly like a woman screaming. They are not nocturnal:
Bobcats can be active day or night but tend to exhibit crepuscular (dawn and dusk) activity. Their activity peaks three hours before sunset until midnight and again between one hour before and four hours after sunrise. They remain active year round and do not hibernate. This from: http://www.mass.gov/dfwele/dfw/wildlife/living/living_with_bobcats.htm

Not saying it was a bobcat, but it could have been. If it was an animal the neighbor heard, that would be the most likely one. But the coincidence of it being the morning Holly disappeared makes me think there is a more human connection.

My other scenario about the scream is that it could have been someone seeing Holly in a lump on the floor of the carport and realizing she's injured or worse.[/QUOTE]

Bobcats in my area are crepuscular (I like this word): Of or like twilight; dim. I have seen a bobcat in my front yard and it was right at dusk. I have had neigbors have little dogs disappear and bobcats have been suspected.

 

[wishuwerehere]

snipped:

My other scenario about the scream is that it could have been someone seeing Holly in a lump on the floor of the carport and realizing she's injured or worse.

I have thought this as well.

 

[MizStery]

Posted by Birpu:
My other scenario about the scream is that it could have been someone seeing Holly in a lump on the floor of the carport and realizing she's injured or worse.

snipped:


I have thought this as well.

Birpu and wishyouwerethere may I ask a question about the above quote.If someone happened on Holly at 7:40 injured or worst case scenaro deceased... what motive would they have concealing their horror (by screaming in shock)from the investigators. Would not the innocent person coming upon Holly quickly realize the urgency to summon paramedics to aid her. Or am I just not connecting the dots. Thanks in advance.

 

[birpu]

Ok, I'm afraid to put this out there in this forum, but go ahead and ax me if I shouldn't say this. I wasn't thinking the person "coming upon Holly" was necessarily innocent. Perhaps an accident happened. Perhaps someone shot into the dim morning light at an intruder. Perhaps they realized they instead shot a family member. Screamed in horror.

 

[MizStery]

Ok, I'm afraid to put this out there in this forum, but go ahead and ax me if I shouldn't say this. I wasn't thinking the person "coming upon Holly" was necessarily innocent. Perhaps an accident happened. Perhaps someone shot into the dim morning light at an intruder. Perhaps they realized they instead shot a family member. Screamed in horror.

Thank-you for your post.There is nothing in TOS rules that says you cannot have a theory. Now,I understand. I just had not considered that particular event.

OK,I agree your stated theory is possible and will mesh with Mr. Naotek's timeline. As to your
theory on a mountain lion scream... stanger coincidences have occurred. Although not very
likely. I think the scream reported by James at 7:40 is closest to the truth. i just believe James had an alibi and no motive to throw the entire investigation into confusion. Which is not the same as saying that the investigation isn't confusing.:waitasec:

I find it pecular in Mr. Naotek's timeline her brother talked to practically every person in the county mutiple time's but never her. It almost seems like he was intentionly distancing himself from her by a convoluted system of talking to anybody and everybody but her(deliberately avoiding coming in direct contact with her at every turn) Very odd. Just my theories and musing on the timeline.MOO

 

[Mr. Noatak]

The thing that strikes me about that morning is no matter how crazy the story I feel like it is sort of locked in for a timeline unless a TON of people are in on a conspiracy including multiple teachers, secretary, both parents, CB, Holly's friends, and the neighbors, and LE. Like, every major time is recorded by a phone call and outside witnesses. It doesn't leave me a lot of space to think of ideas outside the box-like, if she was dead earlier than everyone says or if it was an accident. If CB accidentally killed her he is the quickest and most efficient killer ever to literally kill her and hide the body and be calling family/911 all in a 10-15 minute time period.

I still don't get how we can have an actual puddle of blood, yet her also walking semi-normally into the woods not being led, helped, or dragged. Or why at least CB stood around and didn't charge into the woods after them. Or why the abductor sat in the garage with her for at least 10 minutes and even with that 10 minutes it didn't help Holly. Like, most abductions seem so fast that in a blink of an eye they are over-someone grabbed from a bed or from a front door or from a side of the road and hauled off before anyone could react. This one? Really?

Just some musings.

My opinions only, no facts here:

A timeline with witnessess is useful, as you can see. I agree with some posters that it would be nice to know if a "phone call" was text or voice. I agree with Darcyline that the timeline seems pretty solid and continuous. I like to block out portions of a timeline that have few or no witnessess or study the longest gaps in a timeline. It is likely that the witness times could be up to a few minutes off, but I did my best to maintain the sequential order of events implied by news reports. However, I think the neighbor who heard the scream may have given a fairly accurate time. When you hear a scream AND are leaving for work AND then tell your mother about it- you probably have a good sense of what time it was. I do not disagree with other posters that the scream could be an animal- this is at least a possibility.

But I am inclined to say: regardless of who is the suspect, they had 20 minutes to remove Holly from the area, between 7:40 and 8:00 AM. How they did this depends upon what the tracking dogs found, if they were actually used.

 

[birpu]

Mr Noatak,
Where on your timeline would you put CB's call to his mother when he looked out and saw the figures in the garage? He actually stated that he called Karen to figure out who was on their property. It would have to be between 7:35 - the flurry of calls - and 7:50, when he said he saw them walking into the woods.

 

[R.U.Kidding!]

My opinions only, no facts here:

A timeline with witnessess is useful, as you can see. I agree with some posters that it would be nice to know if a "phone call" was text or voice. I agree with Darcyline that the timeline seems pretty solid and continuous. I like to block out portions of a timeline that have few or no witnessess or study the longest gaps in a timeline. It is likely that the witness times could be up to a few minutes off, but I did my best to maintain the sequential order of events implied by news reports. However, I think the neighbor who heard the scream may have given a fairly accurate time. When you hear a scream AND are leaving for work AND then tell your mother about it- you probably have a good sense of what time it was. I do not disagree with other posters that the scream could be an animal- this is at least a possibility.

But I am inclined to say: regardless of who is the suspect, they had 20 minutes to remove Holly from the area, between 7:40 and 8:00 AM. How they did this depends upon what the tracking dogs found, if they were actually used.

OK---I cannot get past the "SCREAM"--never could.

1) When scream was initially reported couldn't understand how "Clint did not hear it"--we assumed he was sleeping.

2) Now Neighbor's son hears it, but his own mother does not, and son is living with her? ...and she is wide awake. How can that be?

Forgive me--It would seem the SCREAM is the most important factor in the events of that morning. It establishes the beginning of the timeline we are using.
For me, the scream has to make sense before any theory can be expanded.

The neighbors live 350 yards away from the Bobo's, help me understand why 1 person, only, hears this .....and that person just continues on to work. What kind of a relationship does he have with the Bobo's ? I mean why even bother to call his mom if he isn't concerned enough to check himself.

and , again, don't even get me started on the" 10 minute disappearing with No trace of Holly act". I have absolutely no idea how anyone can make sense out of this mess let alone find Holly!:furious:

 

[birpu]

I agree the scream is a big deal. It has always bothered me. From the first day it never made sense with the rest of the story. Maybe it is more accurate to say the story never made sense with the scream.....

But it does seem possible that the neighbor went outside to get in his car and heard the scream, then drove off and called his mother on the way in to work to have her check into it. His mother was probably inside the house. Clint was apparently inside the house, maybe still asleep. So the neighbor's son being the only one to hear a scream is not problematic for me. It is the TIMING of the scream with the other "facts." The other big problem I have is the blood in the carport in conjunction with the scream. Pair that with Holly walking off without a struggle, knowing her brother is home to help. I just have trouble imagining that, myself.

She clearly lost the blood before walking away. Then she was gone. If someone else screamed - well, what if someone carried an accidentally-shot Holly across the yard ("flecks" of blood) and put her down in the carport to tend to her. Perhaps is bending over her in the garage/carport in the early morning hunting hours ...... Someone else comes out to investigate.... screams. Just a thought.

But then there is that odd "walking into the woods" story to contend with.

 

[MizStery]

OK---I cannot get past the "SCREAM"--never could.

1) When scream was initially reported couldn't understand how "Clint did not hear it"--we assumed he was sleeping.

2) Now Neighbor's son hears it, but his own mother does not, and son is living with her? ...and she is wide awake. How can that be?

Forgive me--It would seem the SCREAM is the most important factor in the events of that morning. It establishes the beginning of the timeline we are using.
For me, the scream has to make sense before any theory can be expanded.

The neighbors live 350 yards away from the Bobo's, help me understand why 1 person, only, hears this .....and that person just continues on to work. What kind of a relationship does he have with the Bobo's ? I mean why even bother to call his mom if he isn't concerned enough to check himself.
and , again, don't even get me started on the" 10 minute disappearing with No trace of Holly act". I have absolutely no idea how anyone can make sense out of this mess let alone find Holly!:furious:

Here is the link to the timeline at the JacksonSun.com. Unfortunately it gives just a few paragraphs then informs you to view the entire article in Sunday's paper. So unfortunately I cannot give you a link to the entire article.
http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/jackson...onstruct+ti me+before+Holly+Bobo\'s+abduction

I will go by my memory,please posters correct me if any thing I say is inaccurate. An article from he Jackson Sun said that James lived in a mobile home next to his parents which is approx.350 feet from the Bobo's home. James was about to get into his car to go to work. He hears the scream coming from the Bobo home. He calls his mother inside her home and tells her about the scream. James continues to work. James mother calls Holly's mother and the chain of events is in Mr. Noatak's timeline. I believe other posters have watched video or read more details perhaps even giving more details about exactly what James heard.

I feel confident if James has an alibi he is a reliable witness to what exactly happened that morning.I can find no motive for him to mislead authorities. Perhaps even more crucial is his account is independent from the families statements. James provides a critical link as to the exact time and provides continuity in the chaotic retelling of what happened that morning.MOO

 

[R.U.Kidding!]

The accidental shooting could be possible--but with that I would expect someone to hear the gunshot, wouldn't you?

I have no doubt that if indeed a scream was heard it was a "human" scream. People in these part of the country certainly should know the difference.

The "blood" in and of itself is problematic--first, was it a drop, flecks, puddle? If it was enough blood to pool in a puddle, then she must have been taken right there in the carport where the injury happened. I say this because puddle, to me , would indicate too much blood to be stopped that fast without leaving some further evidence as she was moved ---anywhere.

So now I also question if Clint ever saw her "walk" anywhere". For all we know someone could have threatened Clint --Maybe Holly went willingly in order to protect Clint?

LOL--See what happens when things don't make sense--my imagination gets the best of me!

 

[OldSteve]

My opinions only, no facts here:

A timeline with witnessess is useful, as you can see. I agree with some posters that it would be nice to know if a "phone call" was text or voice. I agree with Darcyline that the timeline seems pretty solid and continuous. I like to block out portions of a timeline that have few or no witnessess or study the longest gaps in a timeline. It is likely that the witness times could be up to a few minutes off, but I did my best to maintain the sequential order of events implied by news reports. However, I think the neighbor who heard the scream may have given a fairly accurate time. When you hear a scream AND are leaving for work AND then tell your mother about it- you probably have a good sense of what time it was. I do not disagree with other posters that the scream could be an animal- this is at least a possibility.

But I am inclined to say: regardless of who is the suspect, they had 20 minutes to remove Holly from the area, between 7:40 and 8:00 AM. How they did this depends upon what the tracking dogs found, if they were actually used.

Great work on the timeline! Also nice to see some new posters here.
Personally, I doubt we will get anything more out of events we have... need some new info to come out...

One question that puzzles me - I would like to see a timeline of events AFTER 8 am. How fast did all the volunteers and other people arrive?

How did so many get the word that something happened so fast?

Could the perp(s) have been involved in getting the word out to get the crime scene flooded with people? Mess up the crime scene - thinking back to the JonBenet Ramsey scene.