Trial break: The State vs Jodi Arias; trial resumes 4 February 2013

[Ramblinrose01]

Something isn't right with the defendant.

She over-killed the deceased. Imagine hitting him with a knife that many times, she had to have hit bone on the back of his head. Did she stop, no, she drove on brutally. She cleaned up and then drove for miles and miles, carrying on as if nothing happened. How the hello does someone do that ? No PTS, no guilt, no remorse. Started to take up with another guy. Drove herself back to Yreka. Called the deceased, left a phony message about hooking up at a later date. Turned that rental car in . Then eventually lied like all heck during the interrogation.

I repeat something is really wrong with someone who could do this.

No guilt, sorrow, remorse, heck probably not even any fall-out nightmares.

Don't forget.....she also went to his funeral and consoled his grieving family.

 

[CUCKOOHEAD]

Don't feel bad. I woke up thinking it was Saturday.

Don't feel alone. I drove to my bank to make a deposit and it was closed. I went to the office and called the bank toll free and asked if today was a bank holiday? I wasn't sure what day today was and didn't know what time I drove up to the back.

PS. It was an hour before they opened.

PPS. I have been banking with the same bank with the same hours for 23 years.

:floorlaugh:

 

[Linda7NJ]

I think money was very important to JA.

She bought pants that were too small that were on sale ( I have done this knowing that dieting will let me fit into them. Ha ha)

She was too cheap to buy gas cans. She had to get them for free.

I don't think TA lived that lavish of a life. He had a house with roommates and it appears that the trips were not that luxurious or plentiful.

If it was only money, there were other guys out there that would go for hot blonde like her.

Other posters on here have talked about their obsessive spouses or BF's who were not like that with others.

It would be interesting to find out what the deal is with these kind of situations

Travis has status, friends and was well respected and looked up to by many. She wanted that for herself...not by working hard etc... But By through being connected to Travis.


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[neesaki]

Plus these types of murders are just not done by normal people. Cutting someone's throat is about as cold hearted a killing there is. It's not a self defense wound and is usually done from behind. jmo

ITA, I can't imaging stabbing someone even once, much less multiple times, then slitting their throat, :no:. It totally turns my stomach to even think about it. No normal person could engage in anything this violent. Just think Norman in Psycho. And he was far, far from normal. This woman seriously has something missing, IMO.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I remember reading that Travis Alexander's family wants the death penalty? I know seeking justice should be the main objective to the prosecutor but don't know how much a family's wish at sentencing would affect the state seeking the DP?

They do listen to the family's input but the state ultimately makes the decision on their own. They rule it a death penalty case when the evidence is showing that the crime was extremely cruel and heinous and filled with premeditation. Like in this one or a case that has other prongs in it qualifying it for the death penalty.

 

[jevipo74]

Don't forget.....she also went to his funeral and consoled his grieving family.

And she said she sent an email to Tanisha offering to send money for the BMW...after she killed him. Who does that?

 

[LambChop]

It just occurred to me that the roommate said when he came home the door was locked and it's never locked so he had to use the code for the garage door to get in. My garage doors make a lot of noise when they are opened so if he came in while Jodi was there, she would know. He claims he was delayed at work, I think, or missed his transporation connection and was later than usual getting home. Is it possible Jodi was waiting for the roommate to get home so she could also kill him and make it look like a murder/suicide? She did not seem worried about the timeframe getting close to the roommate usual time of getting home and we figure with cleanup she was still there after 6pm. Could this be why she waited until 5:30 to kill him? ME would have put their deaths around the same time. TA first, the roommate second. So could those pictures with two males found on the hard drive be a reference to the secret not being Jodi but the roommate which in her mind would take the focus of the investigation off of her? This is just me thinking and it may not make any sense but I don't see what the connection is with the pictures. jmo

 

[Linda7NJ]

ITA, I can't imaging stabbing someone even once, much less multiple times, then slitting their throat, :no:. It totally turns my stomach to even think about it. No normal person could engage in anything this violent. Just think Norman in Psycho. And he was far, far from normal. This woman seriously has something missing, IMO.

A conscience


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[oceanblueeyes]

ITA, I can't imaging stabbing someone even once, much less multiple times, then slitting their throat, :no:. It totally turns my stomach to even think about it. No normal person could engage in anything this violent. Just think Norman in Psycho. And he was far, far from normal. This woman seriously has something missing, IMO.

BBM

I agree. She is missing a conscience.

She even took chunks of bone out when she stabbed him in the top of the head.

She is something that a horror movie could be made about.

 

[Justme84]

You think she is histrionic? Interesting. I really can't wait for the penalty pahseof this trial (once she is found guilty). Was denied Casey's and am very curious about her psychology. Fascinating and terrifying stuff.

To be honest, I am not sure if she is histrionic and she could be sociopath but I do not think so. I do know that many of the same traits for sociopath come up in histrionic.

I would love to see what a psychologist has found.
Some things just do not add up for me in regards to sociopath for me.
Things like calling her a pathological liar. If you aren't going to confess or take responsibility for something like this of course you are going to lie your face off.
However, she doesn't have an extensive history of lieing. People have come forward with all kinds of things about her being obsessive but nothing about lieing.

Inappropriate sexual behavior is often mentioned by his friends. Even this is hard to read because what a Mormon versus the average 20 something sees as innappropriate can be different.

Rapidly shifting emotional states- this is another reason many see her as a sociopath but its also a trait of histrionic. We see a lot of this during her interviews.

Easily influenced by people- shifting religions so quickly, blinding putting so much faith in prepaid legal

one of the big ones that really makes me think its this instead of sociopath is
" belief that relationships are more intimate than they are"
even if Travis told her over and over they wouldnt be together she saw it differently and because he did not know how to deal with it or he was horny or whatever reason he kept sleeping with her

 

[BD1]

Something isn't right with the defendant.

She over-killed the deceased. Imagine hitting him with a knife that many times, she had to have hit bone on the back of his head. Did she stop, no, she drove on brutally. She cleaned up and then drove for miles and miles, carrying on as if nothing happened. How the hello does someone do that ? No PTS, no guilt, no remorse. Started to take up with another guy. Drove herself back to Yreka. Called the deceased, left a phony message about hooking up at a later date. Turned that rental car in . Then eventually lied like all heck during the interrogation.

I repeat something is really wrong with someone who could do this.

No guilt, sorrow, remorse, heck probably not even any fall-out nightmares.

Yeah, I have to agree. She may have started out garden variety cluster B, but somewhere along the line she went right over the cliff to NO empathy. Sometimes with all the exposure to violence we get these days, we don't really stop to think just.how.horrific. this crime really was. All of us may have our various diagnoses and issues, but very few of us (talking humanity here, not WS's) could do what Jodi did, and then act as she did after.

 

[CUCKOOHEAD]

They do listen to the family's input but the state ultimately make the decision on their own. They rule it a death penalty case when the evidence is showing that the crime was extremely cruel and heinous and filled with premeditation. Like in this one or a case that has other prongs in it qualifying it for the death penalty.

Thanks ocean. IMO as it should be, seeking justice for the crime committed.

 

[lil_buddy]

I think money was very important to JA.

She bought pants that were too small that were on sale ( I have done this knowing that dieting will let me fit into them. Ha ha)

She was too cheap to buy gas cans. She had to get them for free.

I don't think TA lived that lavish of a life. He had a house with roommates and it appears that the trips were not that luxurious or plentiful.

If it was only money, there were other guys out there that would go for hot blonde like her.

Other posters on here have talked about their obsessive spouses or BF's who were not like that with others.

It would be interesting to find out what the deal is with these kind of situations

I definitely think it would be interesting to know how a 27 year old woman got pushed over the edge like this. It is fascinating. How could we ever hope to thwart this type of behavior if we do not understand it? How can we educate potential victims? I would love to see an intelligent discussion regarding these things somewhere.

 

[HarvestMoon]

PS ... folks somewhere aren't fessing up. A person does not become such a staunch liar .. over nite.

I'd sure like to hear the real story from her mother.

 

[m00c0w]

Disproven by previous relationships? How so? We simply don't have enough of a history. I don't see much in the way of symbiotic relationships. I don't see anyone long term except her mother.

I have ample evidence to form an opinion that she's a psychopath. I don't rely on the media for information. Her behavior, before, during and after the slaughter of Travis is enough. Total disregard for human life, premeditation, total lack of remorse, they way she mimics others, the way she manipulates and uses everyone around her, just watching her interviews and the evidence should be sufficient.


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Prefatory statements: I am not attacking your post. It's just the first one that has been posted since this has been started.

I am also not attacking Travis, but using him as an example. I do not believe what I am about to say. I am just demonstrating how easy it is to "diagnose" someone with a mental disorder based on interpretation of symptomology alone.

The criteria for Antisocial Personality Disorder via the DSM-IV-TR is as follows:

A. There is a pervasive pattern of disregard for and violation of the rights of others occurring since age 15 years, as indicated by three (or more) of the following:

(1) failure to conform to social norms with respect to lawful behaviors as indicated by repeatedly performing acts that are grounds for arrest
(2) deceitfulness, as indicated by repeated lying, use of aliases, or conning others for personal profit or pleasure
(3) impulsivity or failure to plan ahead
(4) irritability and aggressiveness, as indicated by repeated physical fights or assaults
(5) reckless disregard for safety of self or others
(6) consistent irresponsibility, as indicated by repeated failure to sustain consistent work behavior or honor financial obligations
(7) lack of remorse, as indicated by being indifferent to or rationalizing having hurt, mistreated, or stolen from another

B. The individual is at least age 18 years.

C. There is evidence of Conduct Disorder with onset before age 15 years.

D. The occurrence of antisocial behavior is not exclusively during the course ofSchizophrenia or a Manic Episode.​

You have to have three or more incidents that fall in the "A" category, and the rest of the categories must fit.

Well, let's take a look at the "A" category:

(2) deceitfulness, as indicated by repeated lying, use of aliases, or conning others for personal profit or pleasure​

Did the victim not repeatedly cheat on others? Did he not lie to them about it? Did he not work in a triangular-circular-pyramidal operation that involved actively signing up less-than-wise individuals under you? And didn't he do remarkably well at it? Did he also not keep things from his Mormon counterparts, and the church itself?

(3) impulsivity or failure to plan ahead​

Wasn't he accepting of Arias, even when he had other girlfriends at the time? He would ask for her to come over, according to witnesses, and she would come. One might even suggest that he asked her to come over before another girl showed up. He also went on sporadic trips with individuals he didn't have any particular relation to, right?

(6) consistent irresponsibility, as indicated by repeated failure to sustain consistent work behavior or honor financial obligations​

Wasn't he having financial difficulty "because of Arias"?

(7) lack of remorse, as indicated by being indifferent to or rationalizing having hurt, mistreated, or stolen from another​

Did he not cheat on multiple girlfriends? And then promise to be different to one of them, and then went ahead and kept on doing things behind her back? Didn't he continuously mislead those in the church he belonged to? Didn't he participate in a baptism ceremony he, by all rights, was not allowed to perform under the rules of the church? Did he show sorrow for this?

Now, that is one more criteria than the three necessary. Let's look at the rest:

B. The individual is at least age 18 years.

C. There is evidence of Conduct Disorder with onset before age 15 years.

D. The occurrence of antisocial behavior is not exclusively during the course ofSchizophrenia or a Manic Episode.​

B is confirmed.

C is unconfirmed, but there is no such evidence for Jodi Arias, either. We can conveniently leave out this criteria.

D is assumed.


If you were to go by this, you can make anyone into a socio/psychopath. There is a reason why the DSM-IV-TR has a huge disclaimer in it saying that it's only a guideline and those with proper clinical experience and training are the only ones that can make any sort of credible assertion based on these guidelines.

It is very easy to let cognitive biases take over and come up with "diagnoses" of sociopathy. But there's a lot more to it than reading about symptoms and playing match-up with them.

 

[Bravo]

Funny thing too, IMO she's really not that bright. She somehow successfully managed to manipulate those around her so effectively, she had no reason to kill before.

Psychopaths, the bright ones anyway, appear to be too good to be true wonderful people, until they don't get what they want. If everything is going their way, all is right with the world.

IMO .


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Agree. And not all of them kill. Some are quite happy to just make life miserable for people. I worked with a Gal who fit this to a "T". Fun part was we all knew it. So when games were played we were always one step ahead. She was good at it. Especially with men. We would just sit back. Fold our arms and watch her "work it". She transferred out thankfully as it got old. She is in Court right now and has her former flame up on abuse charges. This man has been married before and had relationships since his Divorce. Not a peep of abuse. Until her. His life has been ruined including his business.

 

[FrayedKnot]

Just a friendly observation here .. starting sequential posts with "This is false" is likely to lead to an unpleasant exchange.

Good night.

Meh, some of us are WAAAYYY used to it, lol. :lol:

 

[neesaki]

Funny thing too, IMO she's really not that bright. She somehow successfully managed to manipulate those around her so effectively, she had no reason to kill before.

Psychopaths, the bright ones anyway, appear to be too good to be true wonderful people, until they don't get what they want. If everything is going their way, all is right with the world.

IMO .


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And she's not that attractive either, IMO. I'm about sick to my stomach hearing NG and JVM repeatedly describe her with the terms "gorgious" , "beautiful" and "stunning" :what:.

 

[CUCKOOHEAD]

It just occurred to me that the roommate said when he came home the door was locked and it's never locked so he had to use the code for the garage door to get in. My garage doors make a lot of noise when they are opened so if he came in while Jodi was there, she would know. He claims he was delayed at work, I think, or missed his transporation connection and was later than usual getting home. Is it possible Jodi was waiting for the roommate to get home so she could also kill him and make it look like a murder/suicide? She did not seem worried about the timeframe getting close to the roommate usual time of getting home and we figure with cleanup she was still there after 6pm. Could this be why she waited until 5:30 to kill him? ME would have put their deaths around the same time. TA first, the roommate second. So could those pictures with two males found on the hard drive be a reference to the secret not being Jodi but the roommate which in her mind would take the focus of the investigation off of her? This is just me thinking and it may not make any sense but I don't see what the connection is with the pictures. jmo

Lambchop. I need to sit down and find myself a stiff drink.

Have you ever thought about writing who done it mystery novels?

 

[minor4th]

I was actually thinking she had more of a histrionic personality disorder if anything.

ITA that you can't make any sort of factual "diagnosis" of anyone without actually spending time with that person. Running exams, mental health inventories, and many other things. A lot of disorders are either comorbid or have overlapping symptoms. It takes a complete history of the person, along with interactions with them to start to begin to diagnose a psychological disorder.

If you could take the DSM-IV-TR and just run down the list of symptoms and say, "Well, I think that fits," a graduate/doctoral degree wouldn't be necessary to diagnose these things.

I feel confident in my assessment that she's cray cray