trial day 36: the defense continues its case in chief #106

[Ladylub]

I don't disagree with you about what the dt will go for. However, aren't therapists and physchologists supposed to take the word of the person sitting in front of them, evaluate the possible truthfullness of it but in the end in order to help the person have to see it from their viewpoint whether it is right or wrong. I probably not explaining what I mean. Basically, they know its not the truth but it is part of the diagnosis..paranoia, serial lying. They then have to see things from their view point in order to help them get passed it to the rational way of thinking, learning to cope with the issues they have.

I just think we are really hard on these guys sometimes when technically they are doing their job. IMHO, I am not one of them, but I have seen a few and this has always been my experience. In order to help the patient you have to establish a trust. That trust might be built on lies from the patient.

Kelly

Yes they should go off the word of the person in front of them to a point. I have no problem with them building a trust with their patients/clients so they get the person to speak. It's what they do with the information after that I have a problem with.
Her ninja story did not add up and Samuel's knew it. He knew then that she was a liar. She then comes up with this other lie and the Dr is going to act like its the truth and only after JM basically pulled the man's teeth out did he admit that it could also be a lie. For me a good expert would not really take a side while on the stand. They would give both sides which I hope that this domestic violence lady does. While they may show a favorite side and may take a bit of a pull to get it out of them, it should not take pulling teeth to get it out.

 

[EGirl]

:welcome4:

Hi Ships! Glad you joined us!

 

[Nosey Parker]

Hi all - I stumbled on the JA trial after watching 48 hours locally (in Australia). It really piqued my interest and so I looked it up and realised that the case was ongoing…. As it turns out, the case is.. 'THE CASE', and I got hooked pretty quickly, and so I looked around on the web to see what was out there in terms of coverage. I found wildabouttrial which gave me a direct hook up to what was going on which was great - but then I searched around to see what communities were out there that would have a bash at dissecting the trial. I hoped for skeptical eyes and 'unlit' torches, and well, websleuths fit the bill. So Iv've been lurking I guess for a couple of weeks, and I like your style.

So here I am.

I have to say, I am continually thrown by my readings of Ms Arias.
In terms of my perceptions of her, I admittedly fluctuate, between believing she is wholly the premeditated-conniving murderer, as close to evil as an atheist (that's me) can conceive of evil, and yet, I find myself somehow (at least in part) believing the odd tidbit that supports her claims. All the while with full recognition of how accomplished she is as a liar.

I know a few of you have hinted at this exact same thing - she mixes in truths to support her lies. Undoubtedly she does. To what extent, I don't know for sure.

What I would say, is that there can be no black and white result to this question of what actually went on. Unless by some freakish stroke of clear thinking and desire of repentance from Jodi, it is unlikely we will ever get the clear picture we are all looking for with regards the lead up / actual event / post event circumstances.

Actually, it just dawned on me, if Jodi is in any way legitimately devout to the Mormon faith, then maybe that will be the only channel through which we find answers. For instance, if she is given life without parole, then after some religious counselling, she may eventually 'fess up. But of course, we may also be 15 years older by that stage.

When i recall the the Flores interviews and also the 48 hours blerrr-dee-blahh-fests, I easily revert to a 'Jodi Arias is a liar, and an evil one at that' mindset - but there is something about her innate ability to meld some elements of truth to bolster her fabrications that makes me - at least to some degree - want to know more. It keeps me clinging to a certain extent.
(And that's not to say I am under her spell. I do not, and have not ever found her attractive, actually. Personally, my interest is more about her innate confidence [ha ha self esteem eh?] ) But aside from from this I am concerned with her ability to switch between these two worlds… How does someone do that as seamlessly as it seems to occur for her? wtf…..

I've got a bunch to say about the trial, and a few thoughts on Jodi and the way she carries herself, but I thought I would leave just this one observation, and expand with later posts:

I know a lot of you have commented on her appearance, and how she has aged since her initial TV appearances. For sure, she has - most definitely. But the thing that sticks out for me, is her voice. She speaks differently now.

It is absolutely unnerving to me to hear her voice in those 48 hours interviews. It seems completely affected. ‪It sounds saccharin‬ sweet - and it sounds softer - the 'esses' are accentuated. Her voice seems higher pitched. It's crisper. And it sounds like she's portraying a diminutive character that of course, would be incapable of such a heinous crime.

5 years later, which voice do you believe?

:Welcome1: :goodpost:

I don't believe any of her voices. She is a pathological ventriloquist! :floorlaugh:

:cheers:

 

[Southern_Meadow]

I didn't watch Willmott's opening statement and can't find a transcript, so please correct me if the quote I saw from it is wrong. It read as if JW pointed to a pic of Jodi wearing the "Travis Alexander's" t-shirt/"Travis" panties and promised the jury an expert would explain how those are indicative of TA's controlling, abusive treatment of her.

I didn't hear Samuels mention that, so it must be Ms. LaV's task. If so, and Juan can prove the "Travis Alexander's" t-shirt said, "Being Better Blog" on the back, I'll be ecstatic. The DT couldn't possibly be that stupid, but I can hope.

Not only is there no proof of abuse, there's no proof that Travis is the one who made the shirt and underwear. I'm sure JA made those herself.

 

[TigerBalm]

:wagon: Welcome Ships, glad you decided to join us mate!!

 

[Softail]

Can someone please find this clip for me, or tell me where it's at? I haven't heard anything about she-devil :devil:
kicking a dog.


Thank you advance ~

http://www.hlntv.com/video/2013/03/25/watch-jodi-arias-confesses-she-kicked-dog

NG thinks she is "Live"! :giggle:

 

[scorpio24]

JA is so full of sh@!, she is lying in that "I kicked a dog once" snip. OMG, she is thinking up the story (lies) while she pauses before she says "that I can remember". Watch how dramatic and - quickly - she goes into "I kicked a dog once".

She had to take time to remember the dog kicking story, then tells Det. Flores that "it changed my world as far as the treatment of animals". BS BS BS

C'mon verdict! MHO

It changed her world so much she left a dog downstairs for FIVE DAYS while his owner lay dead in a shower. JA sickens me in SO many ways! My dogs are like my kids! One is a rescue from an abused home and, three years later, she still runs under the bed if my husband and I raise our voices, not at her, but at one another. (It's a good reminder to us to take some deep breaths.) All we have done is love her with all our hearts, but she is still affected.

I believe JA was violent from a young age and I believe that will be more apparent in the rebuttal case. :furious:

 

[DebinGA]

I do believe that the gun shot was last. I just happen to believe that she had the gun close to her from start to finish.

As crucial as it is for Jodi that the jury believe the gunshot came first, why didn't the DT put their own forensic pathologist on the stand to counter Dr. Horn?

 

[rose222]

I find the forensic reports very confusing in this case. Not even sure if I can build an entire theory around my idea but 2 things stick out for me....

The trajectory of the bullet makes perfect sense if TA was sitting in the shower and leaned forward the way you do when getting up.

The gun may have jammed. It did in the 48 HRS story and that might be the drop of truth that she includes in her lies.

Yes but why did she corner Travis in the shower if she planned on using only a gun? She could have shot him while he slept. Her need for him to be in the shower, naked and wet seems to indicate that she planned on frightening the he.. out of him and then stabbing him to death.

 

[Softail]

As crucial as it is for Jodi that the jury believe the gunshot came first, why didn't the DT put their own forensic pathologist on the stand to counter Dr. Horn?

Because it isn't true? Because there is no proof of it? :dunno:

 

[Donnareit]

Hi all - I stumbled on the JA trial after watching 48 hours locally (in Australia). It really piqued my interest and so I looked it up and realised that the case was ongoing…. As it turns out, the case is.. 'THE CASE', and I got hooked pretty quickly, and so I looked around on the web to see what was out there in terms of coverage. I found wildabouttrial which gave me a direct hook up to what was going on which was great - but then I searched around to see what communities were out there that would have a bash at dissecting the trial. I hoped for skeptical eyes and 'unlit' torches, and well, websleuths fit the bill. So Iv've been lurking I guess for a couple of weeks, and I like your style.

So here I am.

I have to say, I am continually thrown by my readings of Ms Arias.
In terms of my perceptions of her, I admittedly fluctuate, between believing she is wholly the premeditated-conniving murderer, as close to evil as an atheist (that's me) can conceive of evil, and yet, I find myself somehow (at least in part) believing the odd tidbit that supports her claims. All the while with full recognition of how accomplished she is as a liar.

I know a few of you have hinted at this exact same thing - she mixes in truths to support her lies. Undoubtedly she does. To what extent, I don't know for sure.

What I would say, is that there can be no black and white result to this question of what actually went on. Unless by some freakish stroke of clear thinking and desire of repentance from Jodi, it is unlikely we will ever get the clear picture we are all looking for with regards the lead up / actual event / post event circumstances.

Actually, it just dawned on me, if Jodi is in any way legitimately devout to the Mormon faith, then maybe that will be the only channel through which we find answers. For instance, if she is given life without parole, then after some religious counselling, she may eventually 'fess up. But of course, we may also be 15 years older by that stage.

When i recall the the Flores interviews and also the 48 hours blerrr-dee-blahh-fests, I easily revert to a 'Jodi Arias is a liar, and an evil one at that' mindset - but there is something about her innate ability to meld some elements of truth to bolster her fabrications that makes me - at least to some degree - want to know more. It keeps me clinging to a certain extent.
(And that's not to say I am under her spell. I do not, and have not ever found her attractive, actually. Personally, my interest is more about her innate confidence [ha ha self esteem eh?] ) But aside from from this I am concerned with her ability to switch between these two worlds… How does someone do that as seamlessly as it seems to occur for her? wtf…..

I've got a bunch to say about the trial, and a few thoughts on Jodi and the way she carries herself, but I thought I would leave just this one observation, and expand with later posts:

I know a lot of you have commented on her appearance, and how she has aged since her initial TV appearances. For sure, she has - most definitely. But the thing that sticks out for me, is her voice. She speaks differently now.

It is absolutely unnerving to me to hear her voice in those 48 hours interviews. It seems completely affected. ‪It sounds saccharin‬ sweet - and it sounds softer - the 'esses' are accentuated. Her voice seems higher pitched. It's crisper. And it sounds like she's portraying a diminutive character that of course, would be incapable of such a heinous crime.

5 years later, which voice do you believe?

:goodpost:
I'm with you. Sometimes I wonder just how many Jodi's are in there. Not only does her voice change, but her coloring goes from rosy to sallow. But the doctor found her to be an integrated personality, so I guess it just speaks to her chameleon ways.

 

[Novice Seeker]

What in the world is this about?

http://www.courtminutes.maricopa.gov/docs/Criminal/032013/m5692730.pdf

 

[AZWatcher]

http://www.hlntv.com/video/2013/03/25/watch-jodi-arias-confesses-she-kicked-dog

NG thinks she is "Live"! :giggle:

HA!! She cracks me up.

 

[VALee]

Rewatching RS on cross from yesterday, if the scores on the PDS test were irrelevant to his evaluation as he stated, then why the heck did he even do the test? What a yahoo train of thought, bah!

 

[Donnareit]

It changed her world so much she left a dog downstairs for FIVE DAYS while his owner lay dead in a shower. JA sickens me in SO many ways! My dogs are like my kids! One is a rescue from an abused home and, three years later, she still runs under the bed if my husband and I raise our voices, not at her, but at one another. (It's a good reminder to us to take some deep breaths.) All we have done is love her with all our hearts, but she is still affected.

I believe JA was violent from a young age and I believe that will be more apparent in the rebuttal case. :furious:

Good for you for seeing your pets reaction and adjusting your behavior accordingly.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Don't lump all defense attorney's into the same boat. Her first attorney quit, it's speculated, because Jodi wanted to admit the forged letters into the trial. The timing of her asking to be dismissed and the arrival of the letters is too coincidental. JMO

Also, we have some defense attorney's on the board who are trying to get the innocent set free.

I have much respect for defense attorneys. IMO they love the law and the constitution. It's not about if they're defending the guilty or an innocent. It's about the process. Everyone is entitled to a vigorous defense, everyone. The state must prove their case. beyond a reasonable doubt and if another scenario is plausible ... The state didn't prove its case. It's a tough job, I couldn't do it... But I have the upmost respect for those that do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[carnnell]

I'm waaay behind so sorry if this has been mentioned but I'm almost spat my coffee out all over the screen listening to HLN report that cold sores can lead to cognitive issues, particularly memory loss!

Forbes also has an article on it. How long before we see an expert on the stand citing this :floorlaugh:

I didn't hear this tidbit of info on HLN, I read the article on Yahoo news

"The latest research shows that viral and bacterial infections could have lasting legacies on cognition.

In a recent study, researchers found that people with higher levels of common infectious agents in their blood — including Chlamydia pneumoniae, Helicobacter pylori, cytomegalovirus and herpes simplex type 1 that causes cold sores — are more likely to have memory and cognitive problems than people with lower levels."

http://news.yahoo.com/cold-sores-could-hamper-memory-094500696.html

 

[AZWatcher]

Yes but why did she corner Travis in the shower if she planned on using only a gun? She could have shot him while he slept. Her need for him to be in the shower, naked and wet seems to indicate that she planned on frightening the he.. out of him and then stabbing him to death.

If she shot him to death in the shower.... easy clean up. If the initial gunshot wasn't fatal or completely incapacitating, then she has to resort to stabbing. Like I said, no theory makes sense to me when you consider the evidence.

 

[BritsKate]

The thing with psychopathy is that where many are indeed brutally abused as children even the ones that aren't grow up 'feeling' they were abused and mistreated. I believe they're very prone to victim-mentalities and use their 'victimhood' both as external justification for hurting others and manipulative prop to lure new victims.

No human being is capable of loving a psychopath enough; rewarding them enough; making them feel special enough. It's like they're a vast expanse you keep throwing everything you've got to give into and it's never enough for them. It's part of what makes having a relationship with one so exhausting and draining.

The other side of that equation is manipulation. By going through life adhered to a victim complex they ensure there will be an almost endless supply of victims too - it's why they tend to target vulnerable or compassionate people - after reading their targets, they begin to regale them with their sob stories of how awful their lives have been. They're also in the idealize phase of the relationship so you're also hearing how wonderful you are, you'll be the one to magically fix all that's gone wrong, you're their savior.

JMHO

 

[Tulessa]

And I think JM is soooooooo sick of a murderer, that wants to apologize to a dog that she kicked years ago, but has absolutely NO FREAKING remorse for taking a human life!! I agree that this trial is a joke! They should just inject her & make the world a better place!

^^^ I lost it & I want to apologize to every one here, including the Mods.