trial day 36: the defense continues its case in chief #106

[AZWatcher]

I also have wondered if I missed speculation regarding a straight razor, one used in 'shaving the old fashioned way'. I don't know if it could be compared to a knife in shape or even have the ability to do the damage.

I have a hard time trying to figure out why she would bring two weapons. If the plan was to shoot him did she really thing far enough ahead to be able to bring two weapons just in case? In my mind, that part is the part where she had split minute premeditation because she had to find a knife if she didn't bring one. And why would she? She had a gun. If she was the tire slasher maybe that knife was still in her purse..lucky her.

The whole thing is mind boggling because I just don't understand how the crime itself happened. I don't think we will ever know either.

Kelly

No evidence that he owned a straight-edge. There was speculation, but I think all she meant was that he used an old-style brush for applying shaving cream.

 

[MrsWilco]

The Defendant needed a protective order from Beth Karas? . . . . while she is in jail? . . . . .

Please someone explain!

I read somewhere over the weekend that she's seeking a protective order from the person in overheard in the public gallery last week saying they wish JA was dead already. She could be calling the media types to testify in support of this I dunno.

 

[websurfer]

Can't sleep.
Lights too bright in jail?
Wonder if the menu is ok for the :goldcrown::violin:

 

[momof7]

any idea why beth karas and others are mentioned in this?

I had read that the media was trying to get information about how much witnesses and dt were getting paid.

The DT doesn't want that information out because it is detailed and there are things that they don't want anyone to know about. It could be prejudicial for the defense.

That is what I understand, not sure that is what it is though.

Kelly

 

[snowshuze]

I agree in principal however; I want Ms Arias to be properly represented even if I totally dislike or disagree with that representation. I want zero excuses for her future appeals and JMO to avoid this issue would likely help assure an appeal on grounds. So while I do not like the idea of either Dr. Samuels or Ms. LaViolette as, I firmly believe that anyone who thinks they decide what is normal and what is not in someone else's brain is basically off their own rocker, in todays little PC world, criminals have more rights than ever. I just want them to have their say so no appeal judge can rule she was not properly represented. This woman deserves death, if not death, nothing less then LWOP - I want it to stick and am willing to tolerate this lunacy to see that happen.

Hallelujah and Amen.

 

[websurfer]

I read somewhere over the weekend that she's seeking a protective order from the person in overheard in the public gallery last week saying they wish JA was dead already. She could be calling the media types to testify in support of this I dunno.

More sympathy evoking methods? I really do not think anyone saying that means it..

 

[luvtenniss]

Yes but why did she corner Travis in the shower if she planned on using only a gun? She could have shot him while he slept. Her need for him to be in the shower, naked and wet seems to indicate that she planned on frightening the he.. out of him and then stabbing him to death.

Good morning, all! I think JA planned on using both the gun and knife the whole time. My theory is gun first - I know, I know, the ME says otherwise. I think she wanted to shoot him and then slit his throat. All in the shower, for easy clean up and evidence erasing. Travis just didn't die as easy as she thought he would. A big MOO.

 

[scorpio24]

Good for you for seeing your pets reaction and adjusting your behavior accordingly.

Thanks! She's the sweetest dog EVER! It took her forever just to learn to play with toys. Now, she is as active and playful as our min pin. And they wrestle and play together so well. We couldn't ask for a better pet.

I say that because I believe my chihuahua, who DOES shake when she hears a vacuum start or a loud voice, suffers more from PTSD than JA could ever dream. If a dog who is encased in a loving home for years can still remember traumatic events, so can a woman who stalks then brutally murders her ex-boyfriend. :twocents:

 

[Dmacky]

http://www.hlntv.com/video/2013/03/25/watch-jodi-arias-confesses-she-kicked-dog

NG thinks she is "Live"! :giggle:

"Bombshell tonight" ~~~ "Unleash the Lawyers" :lol:

 

[cricket49]

The fact that Jodi moved out of her family home and moved in with a boyfriend at age 15 is very telling to me.

How would any mother handle that situation? I know my mother would have found me, yanked me by the hair and dragged me back home. I think her mother was doing everything she could do to discipline her and bring her up the right way. However, Jodi was not the youngest and was not getting any attention. She became a smart a$$ teenager and was harder to control than most children her age. Remember, it has been stated that she moved out of the family home because she and her mother did not see eye to eye on things. Geez, sounds like so many teenagers going through puberty.

Jodi's mother was the main parent trying to discipline the children and here lies the issue between them. Jodi resented her. Usually when you become an adult, you look back at your childhood and realize what you did to deserve the punishment. Usually you agree that your parents did the best they could do. Jodi never grew up to appreciate her mother. I don't want to hear about the "wooden spoon" story because I was spanked and hit much worse than she was. My mother did the best she could do trying to raise 6 children who could be out of control at times.

I DO have compassion (or is it sympathy) for Jodi's mother. She let her leave the home at 15 because she was tired of dealing with an out of control teenager.

 

[EGirl]

What the bleep? :what:

Protective order??

 

[BritsKate]

It changed her world so much she left a dog downstairs for FIVE DAYS while his owner lay dead in a shower. JA sickens me in SO many ways! My dogs are like my kids! One is a rescue from an abused home and, three years later, she still runs under the bed if my husband and I raise our voices, not at her, but at one another. (It's a good reminder to us to take some deep breaths.) All we have done is love her with all our hearts, but she is still affected.

I believe JA was violent from a young age and I believe that will be more apparent in the rebuttal case. :furious:

Ditto. I have a rottie/shepherd mix who was abused and neglected the first several months of her life. She's now five years old and still comes running to me, shaking, and giving me kisses like she's done something wrong every time a door slams or my human kids start bickering.

Even our pups know what PTSD feels like better than Ms. Arias. :furious:

 

[Donnareit]

I don't disagree with you about what the dt will go for. However, aren't therapists and physchologists supposed to take the word of the person sitting in front of them, evaluate the possible truthfullness of it but in the end in order to help the person have to see it from their viewpoint whether it is right or wrong. I probably not explaining what I mean. Basically, they know its not the truth but it is part of the diagnosis..paranoia, serial lying. They then have to see things from their view point in order to help them get passed it to the rational way of thinking, learning to cope with the issues they have.

I just think we are really hard on these guys sometimes when technically they are doing their job. IMHO, I am not one of them, but I have seen a few and this has always been my experience. In order to help the patient you have to establish a trust. That trust might be built on lies from the patient.

Kelly

I see Dr. Samuels as being sort of "old school." I do not think he should be advertising to be an evaluator when it seems like his heart is into therapy, but maybe he doesn't have the energy for that anymore.

Watching his testimony I remembered some Psych 101. I would bet this was his approach with Jodi:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Positive_Psychotherapy

 

[momof7]

The fact that Jodi moved out of her family home and moved in with a boyfriend at age 15 is very telling to me.

How would any mother handle that situation? I know my mother would have found me, yanked me by the hair and dragged me back home. I think her mother was doing everything she could do to discipline her and bring her up the right way. However, Jodi was not the youngest and was not getting any attention. She became a smart a$$ teenager and was harder to control than most children her age. Remember, it has been stated that she moved out of the family home because she and her mother did not see eye to eye on things. Geez, sounds like so many teenagers going through puberty.

Jodi's mother was the main parent trying to discipline the children and here lies the issue between them. Jodi resented her. Usually when you become an adult, you look back at your childhood and realize what you did to deserve the punishment. Usually you agree that your parents did the best they could do. Jodi never grew up to appreciate her mother. I don't want to hear about the "wooden spoon" story because I was spanked and hit much worse than she was. My mother did the best she could do trying to raise 6 children who could be out of control at times.

I DO have compassion (or is it sympathy) for Jodi's mother. She let her leave the home at 15 because she was tired of dealing with an out of control teenager.

Its possible that her family knew that forcing her against her will to do something she didn't want too was a much worse scenario. I think JA probably held her family emotionally hostage during her teen years for sure.

Kelly

 

[Kimster]

REMINDER:

Name variations and name calling is a very plain and simple :nono: according to the rules in our forum. It's getting out of hand and has caused me to put my :saber: in the holster for the day.

 

[Kensie]

Can't sleep.
Lights too bright in jail?
Wonder if the menu is ok for the :goldcrown::violin:

Does JA think she is at some luxury hotel??

You did the crime, now you have to do the time.
Geesh - JA is unbelievable on a bad kind of way.

Good Morning Everyone!!! Happy Tuesday!!

 

[Mykeru]

I of course go along with the ME but I still think it is possible the gunshot could have come first and maybe the bullet casing rolled to its position in the blood when JA was cleaning up. That would explain the movement of blood spatters around the bathroom and down the hall. There are examples of people who remain mobile with brain injuries. This one was one of the first in recorded psych. history.

https://www.google.com/search?q=phi...tp%3A%2F%2Fcwfp.biz%2Fnews.php%3F1004;200;355

Phineas Gage - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Uh, just a little picking of nits. From all the accounts I have read of Phineas Gage he didn't "remain mobile" after a steel tamping rod struck him below the cheek, transversed his left eye orbit and exited out the top of his head just forward of the parietal lobe.

From the University of Ohio, Akron page:

The tamping iron was 3 feet 7 inches long and weighed 13 1/2 pounds. It was 1 1/4 inches in diameter at one end (not circumference as in the newspaper report) and tapered over a distance of about 1-foot to a diameter of 1/4 inch at the other. The tamping iron went in point first under his left cheek bone and completely out through the top of his head, landing about 25 to 30 yards behind him. Phineas was knocked over but may not have lost consciousness even though most of the front part of the left side of his brain was destroyed. Dr. John Martyn Harlow, the young physician of Cavendish, treated him with such success that he returned home to Lebanon, New Hampshire 10 weeks later.

BBM

Not that he didn't lose consciousness, but he may not have lost consciousness. Most accounts gloss over the accident and aftermath itself and focus on the personality changes he suffered. But most accounts describe him as being in some manner insensible and having to be carted back home, not surprisingly.

The reason for that is that a the tamping rod, propelled by whatever black powder was in the hole being tamped, is a much slower moving projectile than a bullet. Yeah, it's bigger. So is an arrow. The size of the tamping rod works against it having much energy.

As I have pointed out, what a bullet essentially is, is a little lead delivery device for kinetic energy transferred by its velocity. A military .223 round is going to do a lot more damage than a .22 short, even though they are basically the same diameter, because the .223 has a much larger casing, more powder behind it and strikes with a lot more force.

Another way of thinking about it, is would you rather be hit by a .22 caliber long fired at 1,500fps fired from a gun, or a big .50 caliberbullet that is thrown at you by hand?

What's the difference? Velocity and therefore kinetic energy.

All the comparisons to knives, arrows, nails from a nail gun, even a tamping rod to the head as being any way similar to a bullet misses the basic physics of the hypersonic velocity bullets travel at.

Again, the ballistic gel profile of a .25. in brain-like ballistic gel

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8rPWLWjt4vo
don't exactly like being "the gun guy" in this thread, but I will keep pointing this out.

:deadhorse:

 

[Schuby]

Good morning, all! I think JA planned on using both the gun and knife the whole time. My theory is gun first - I know, I know, the ME says otherwise. I think she wanted to shoot him and then slit his throat. All in the shower, for easy clean up and evidence erasing. Travis just didn't die as easy as she thought he would. A big MOO.

I have always been knife first, for the reasons Rose mentions, but as a side note, another thing that supports knife first is her refusal to talk about the knife attack. Even in the ninja story, she doesn't talk about the knife attack. This memory is very personal, pleasurable and private to her, which leads me to believe it was her preferred and chosen method and the gun was secondary.

 

[DebinGA]

Because it isn't true? Because there is no proof of it? :dunno:

Since when does the DT need proof? Even here there's no concensus about whether the shot or stabbings came first. Just seem such a ripe area to put doubt in jurors minds about the prosecution's theory. Someone posted a HLN link this morning to a side by side analysis of Dr. Horn's gun last theory v. the gun first theory by the Gwinnett County, GA medical examiner. Gwinnett County isn't a berg, it's a very populous (?), mostly middle class county near Atlanta, and the ME seemed very credible.

 

[Schuby]

The fact that Jodi moved out of her family home and moved in with a boyfriend at age 15 is very telling to me.

How would any mother handle that situation? I know my mother would have found me, yanked me by the hair and dragged me back home. I think her mother was doing everything she could do to discipline her and bring her up the right way. However, Jodi was not the youngest and was not getting any attention. She became a smart a$$ teenager and was harder to control than most children her age. Remember, it has been stated that she moved out of the family home because she and her mother did not see eye to eye on things. Geez, sounds like so many teenagers going through puberty.

Jodi's mother was the main parent trying to discipline the children and here lies the issue between them. Jodi resented her. Usually when you become an adult, you look back at your childhood and realize what you did to deserve the punishment. Usually you agree that your parents did the best they could do. Jodi never grew up to appreciate her mother. I don't want to hear about the "wooden spoon" story because I was spanked and hit much worse than she was. My mother did the best she could do trying to raise 6 children who could be out of control at times.

I DO have compassion (or is it sympathy) for Jodi's mother. She let her leave the home at 15 because she was tired of dealing with an out of control teenager.

I have had the same thought about her moving out so young. Most parents would call the police and have the guy brought up on charges. They seem to have said, "eh, whatever, she's your problem now."