Trial Discussion Thread #11 weekend thread

[MeeBee]

With an ugly green tag indicative of it being labelled to be a spare? Seems odd to me. Was there not also a shot taken of items in bottom of sunglasses case showing bunches of keys with tags on them? Just glanced over in trial. But presented just the same by Nel as if it was pertinent. Like a cache of spares?

Did Reeva really lock it with a key or did she just lick it and Oscar had to go back to room to get it?

I suppose Nel glossed over it because it's not really that important. They were key only locks. They needed keys to be locked and I guess probably had spares.

 

[Trooper]

Yes!! He said it twice. The look on Oscar's face during the iPad stuff was very interesting. He was looking down at first, then looked up and was in a daze for the rest of it.

Nel repeatedly asked Mr. Sales to confirm that even though he was reviewing the browsing history and bookmarks from the iPad3 that everything from that device was downloaded. And he specifically made a point to say that all information was given to the defense, along with the device itself. The same is true for the iPad 2. And he left it at that.

Roux immediately needed 5 minutes to think.

Something is up with the iPads. Can't wait to find out what!

Nel and the IPAD man were detailed in the extreme re passing on to the defence all and EVERY item downloaded and the ipads 2 and 3 both being passed to the defence way way before..

and Nel was enjoying it, too. Submitting evidence to the bench about the passing onto the defence all the stuff was peculiarly significant.

the IPAD analyst is up next week, early. probably Monday. . * snort*

 

[lisasalinger]

2 double taps = 4 shots

I was kind of being a wise guy with that one, but technically yes, you're right.. it is 4 shots.

My point being though that Roux wants to minimize those 4 shots as much as possible so now they are 2 "double taps". To me it just came across as such a silly defense tactic to make 4 gunshots sound like not that big of a deal.

 

[Trooper]

Cristo M. (who will likely be called by defense?)

mr Menalou will not be called up by the defence.. you can take that to the bank.

 

[Rumpole]

Your clocks are all within 3 minutes of each other. We're talking about a 10 minute gap between the first bangs and the second bangs. I kind of doubt that all the witnesses who heard the bangs at 3:17 had clocks that were 10 minutes fast

Witnesses who heard TWO sets of bangs did not have clocks that acted as TARDIS's such they heard same set of bangs twice as they reset their clocks

Many of the time data points come from phone records and NOT people's memories of (possibly wonky) clocks.

 

[lisasalinger]

I cant find Mr Menalou on the list of witnesses testifying so far.


did I miss a whole morning, or sumfink?

No, he has not testified.

 

[MeeBee]

Cristo M. (who will likely be called by defense?)

mr Menalou will not be called up by the defence.. you can take that to the bank.

Why do you say that?

 

[Trooper]

BBM

I don't know how he can walk away from that assertion now though. Roux pretty clearly stated that Oscar did a double tap twice. So 2 shots, not 4. Could Roux really do his presentation next week and be like no, I was just kidding... he really shot 4 times. I don't think he can do that, he would look like a clown. He kind of painted himself in to a corner.

Mangena was awesome. He shot him down (no pun intended) quickly! He pointed out to Roux that if it were 2 double taps right after each other than all 4 wounds would have been in the same vicinity. There would be no way to explain the wounds in 4 different locations of the body (hip, arm, hand and head)

The judge would have to SEE Oscar do a double tap shot. with that gun, in the dark, in that place.


Roux claiming he can is merely theory.

 

[Rumpole]

Then what did Mr and Mrs Stipp and Christo M. hear at 3:08?

And after 3:17+ nobody heard the cricket bat bangs at all.

OP had a hell of a lot to do then if he shot AFTER 3:17, called from balcony, put on his legs, bashed down the door, dragged Reeva's body to bathroom, tried to assist, and then phoned 3:19... all that in the space of a little over a minute??
I don't think the State time line holds up well at all!!

 

[lisasalinger]

My guess on potential final State witnesses (and basically the people that I want to hear from):

The Standers!

Mr. Nhlegenthwa - the neighbor directly to the left of OP's house (if you are looking at the house from the front.) He was the one with all of his lights on that night and he also called Baba to report gunshots.

Mrs. Stipp

OP's live-in gardener

The iPad/cell phone data people. And I want details! No monkey business... I want ALL of the details


I also want to know about the blood spatters on the bedroom wall and duvet, the damage to the bedroom door, the damage to the downstairs window, the blue jeans on the ground outside and those freaking first round of sounds that Dr. Stipp heard!

That is my early Christmas list.

 

[Trooper]

so Mr Menalou HASNT testified?


no Menalou evidence submitted so far??


okidoki.. I thought not, just checking..


do we know if Mr Menalou even exists??

 

[Trooper]

My guess on potential final State witnesses (and basically the people that I want to hear from):

The Standers!

Mr. Nhlegenthwa - the neighbor directly to the left of OP's house (if you are looking at the house from the front.) He was the one with all of his lights on that night and he also called Baba to report gunshots.

Mrs. Stipp

OP's live-in gardener

The iPad/cell phone data people. And I want details! No monkey business... I want ALL of the details


I also want to know about the blood spatters on the bedroom wall and duvet, the damage to the bedroom door, the damage to the downstairs window, the blue jeans on the ground outside and those freaking first round of sounds that Dr. Stipp heard!

That is my early Christmas list.

ha,, the Standars.. Clarice, for sure. She was such a busy woman that morning.. I would like to hear if she was patted down and body searched, cavities and all.

 

[MeeBee]

so Mr Menalou HASNT testified?


no Menalou evidence submitted so far??


okidoki.. I thought not, just checking..


do we know if Mr Menalou even exists??

Lol, what are you talking about? He's on the defense witness list and has given several interviews before. That he is a neighbor that will be called by the defense and not the prosecution, I'd say it's because his testimony will be more beneficial to Oscar than to the state.

 

[lisasalinger]

My guess on potential final State witnesses (and basically the people that I want to hear from):

The Standers!

Mr. Nhlegenthwa - the neighbor directly to the left of OP's house (if you are looking at the house from the front.) He was the one with all of his lights on that night and he also called Baba to report gunshots.

Mrs. Stipp

OP's live-in gardener

The iPad/cell phone data people. And I want details! No monkey business... I want ALL of the details


I also want to know about the blood spatters on the bedroom wall and duvet, the damage to the bedroom door, the damage to the downstairs window, the blue jeans on the ground outside and those freaking first round of sounds that Dr. Stipp heard!

That is my early Christmas list.

Oh... and I also want character witness too (even though they are not kosher).. I want more of Oscar's ex-girlfriends, Reeva's ex's and friends thrown in there too. Show me the money!

 

[Rumpole]

I suppose Nel glossed over it because it's not really that important. They were key only locks. They needed keys to be locked and I guess probably had spares.

New style toilet lock introduced in SA..

 

[Rumpole]

I also want to know about the blood spatters on the bedroom wall and duvet, the damage to the bedroom door, the damage to the downstairs window, the blue jeans on the ground outside and those freaking first round of sounds that Dr. Stipp heard!

That is my early Christmas list.

<snipped to address one part>

It seems that these things are NOT considered relevant by the State.
Spots on wall and on duvet NOT confirmed as blood even. Blood spatter guy made no mention, so not even important enough for him to look, or perhaps he looked and not relevant? He certainly did not mention them at all.

 

[lisasalinger]

I was kind of being a wise guy with that one, but technically yes, you're right.. it is 4 shots.

My point being though that Roux wants to minimize those 4 shots as much as possible so now they are 2 "double taps". To me it just came across as such a silly defense tactic to make 4 gunshots sound like not that big of a deal.

I have to admit, I laughed out loud when I heard Roux start with the double tap business. He is a creative old lad.

I can only imagine how they will try to explain the . Let me guess, Oscar was really searching for chlorophyll because he thought it contained chloroform, which led him accidently to

 

[MeeBee]

I have to admit, I laughed out loud when I heard Roux start with the double tap business. He is a creative old lad.

I can only imagine how they will try to explain the . Let me guess, Oscar was really searching for chlorophyll because he thought it contained chloroform, which led him accidently to

Ok, this made me giggle.

 

[lisasalinger]

<snipped to address one part>

It seems that these things are NOT considered relevant by the State.
Spots on wall and on duvet NOT confirmed as blood even. Blood spatter guy made no mention, so not even important enough for him to look, or perhaps he looked and not relevant? He certainly did not mention them at all.

Not yet anyway... we can't say for sure until we hear the rest of their case. When lawyers introduce an exhibit in to evidence, they are doing it for a reason. It will either be addressed next week or it could be used if Oscar takes the stand and tries to give a story that doesn't jive with the actual evidence. Or it could be nothing. We just don't know yet. That's why it's my Christmas wish list.

 

[minor4th]

And after 3:17+ nobody heard the cricket bat bangs at all.

OP had a hell of a lot to do then if he shot AFTER 3:17, called from balcony, put on his legs, bashed down the door, dragged Reeva's body to bathroom, tried to assist, and then phoned 3:19... all that in the space of a little over a minute??
I don't think the State time line holds up well at all!!

I'd still like to know what people think the Stipps and this Christo guy heard at 3:08 (give or take since clocks are not all synched) if it wasn't gunshots