Trial Discussion Thread #21 - 14.04.09, Day 19

[minor4th]

What good does it do to kick a door that swings open towards the outside instead of opening towards the inside? The door is not going to swing open after kicking it so why? Unless of course it was out of anger and/or to scare the person in the toilet room.

MOO

To kick the door in because it's locked.

 

[minor4th]

I do not remember Mrs. Stipp being mocked. Maybe I'll go back and read through the thread she appeared in but she was neither crucified nor mocked, that is a complete exaggeration.

She wasn't, except that one poster made up a new verb: to be stipped.

 

[soozieqtips]

I agree that there's a difference - Mrs. Stipp was clearly lying (or she was tricked by the police into signing a statement that they fudged) and Oscar's was an in-artful use of words that has now been clarified - no reason for him to contradict himself and give a different version now. It's not like he totally made up seeing a person that he didn't see.

Yes, it was a mistake to shoot through the door - he mistakenly believed it to be an intruder. That ain't murder. Is he minimizing it at times? YES, of course he is.

Why is it necessary to keep repeating that Mrs Stipp 'clearly lied' without ever accepting she made a mistake which she herself corrected very soon after? Did OP correct all his glaring errors? He did not. He was FORCED to acknowledge them today, proving deliberate intent to deceive, in my opinion. Therefore, according to the reasoning you use for Mrs Stipp (who didn't murder anyone that night as far as I know) OP was very clearly lying too. You can't have your :violin: and play it too...

 

[TorisMom003]

IMO the phrase "Give someone enough rope and he'll hang himself" describes OP on the stand. He is not doing himself any favors, much like many other defendants that have taken the stand in their own defense.

MOO

 

[MeeBee]

She wasn't, except that one poster made up a new verb: to be stipped.

Oh, yes. Perhaps that's the mocking people are referring to...:facepalm:

 

[zwiebel]

Nel is changing breeds from a Rockweiler to a Pitbull now.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...ete-in-dramatic-crossexamination-9248031.html

 

[steveml]

It was an iphone. I'm trying to remember how mine worked. If you have a passcode on your phone, I think you have to enter the code to get to the keypad.

Yep, it's a 4-digit number lock. :smile:

 

[04009margaret]

It's not often that I praise the British Law and government but Thank Goodness we have pre trial laws about what can be said or shown in the media and online.

This case has been full of discrepancy's from bad or incorrect reporting in the Media the recently enquiry into phone hacking etc has made it very clear this will be stopped. I was astonished to find out that even the SA police had leaked things.....no wonder there is such corruption.

Unfortunately it happens with all celebrities. Too many photogs & mags out there offering easy money to be the first with the scoop. Look what happened to Brittney Spears with her public meltdown

 

[minor4th]

They were indeed made on these threads, and by people who claim not to be supporters of OP but who are just interested in the 'truth'. Mrs Stipp was crucified and mocked beyond belief, and the Burgers were accused of using things they heard in the media to concoct their story and therefore couldn't be trusted. I could go on, but the majority of comments were quite ugly. Probably good that you did miss them.

It's not a blood letting to suggest that the Burgers modified their story after being influenced by the media. That's not mocking or crucifying or being ugly.

And Mrs Stipp was treated with no disrespect. No one was laughing at her or mocking her - she was called out for lying in a sworn statement and the discussion was about her credibility as a witness, not on her worthiness or value as a person.

 

[soozieqtips]

It's not a blood letting to suggest that the Burgers modified their story after being influenced by the media. That's not mocking or crucifying or being ugly.

And Mrs Stipp was treated with no disrespect. No one was laughing at her or mocking her - she was called out for lying in a sworn statement and the discussion was about her credibility as a witness, not on her worthiness or value as a person.

We'll have to agree to disagree about what constitutes disrespect.

Moving on.

 

[BritsKate]

Each to their own.



Which ones in particular do you find a joke?



There have been some that made me :facepalm: or :waitasec:, sure, but :floorlaugh:? Not when the subject matter is as it is, I'm afraid!



The whole case to me is just sad. Everything about it makes my heart heavy. I don't feel sorry for Oscar Pistorius, more a disappointment. I remember wiping tears from my eyes watching him at the 2012 Olympics. To see anyone fall from grace so catastrophically is *tries to find the right word*...depressing? I don't know, there is a part of my brain that has a certain sadness for him, not empathy or sympathy, pity maybe. I certainly don't look at him vomiting, wailing in court and feel gleeful about it, put it that way.



My overwhelming feeling is of total sadness for June and Barry Steenkamp for the brutal loss of their only daughter. To me, her warmth and intelligence shines out every time her name is mentioned or one of her texts is read out to court. I am so sad for Reeva that she lost her life in such a way and at the hands of somebody she loved. I only hope she had little consciousness of all of it, I find thinking the contrary too difficult.



Anyway, what I'm trying to say is - and maybe I'm a little oversensitive, fine - I just don't get the :floorlaugh::floorlaugh: attitude about OP's being on the stand, I don't get the incredulity at his tears, I don't get the namecalling.



:dunno: It's just all sad. And please don't think I am sitting here playing tiny violins for Oscar.

Respectfully, I think the majority of us understand the gravity of this trial even if we aren't draping our hearts on our sleeves. I was thinking earlier about the Steenkamps - to lose your child so unexpectedly to such violence...but I was also thinking about her friends too. None of them will ever be the same again either. I lost a very close friend to rape/homicide 22 years ago. Charlene was 15 years old and in her first year of high school. It still affects all those who cared for her - most obviously her family - but it still affects our view of the world, how we parent, how we protect those we love - it's changed who we may have been - and even now, I wonder if I could have done anything different. I wonder who she'd be, what she'd be like - and I know the world would have been better with her still in it. So...some of us get it in a very big, very personal way - but all of us want to make certain a much-loved, beautiful, intelligent young woman isn't forgotten behind the shadow of 'celebrity'. Smilies or not.

MOO



Please pardon errors as posted via Tapatalk with a less than stellar user.

 

[04009margaret]

I gave my guess in my post, quote:

"BTW I can only deduce that after giving it great consideration his team recognized that if he was on the balcony light would illuminate the bedroom, so he must have been able to see Reeva missing. Hence the change to the fairy tale"

I went back yesterday and read Magistrate Nair's comments to OP, questions he had, this issue is one of Nair's questions and obviously it needed to be dealt with. Roux an Co designed away to try to get around it, change it.

Also his friend & neighbor gave a magazine interview claiming the outside light was always on at night.

 

[minor4th]

So I thought it was pretty interesting that the state's witnesses who were not called by the state all heard only crying and wailing and no woman screaming or blood-curdling screaming.

 

[minor4th]

It is not necessary to mock and ridicule Oscar in order to show respect and sorrow for Reeva.

 

[Gryffindor]

Yes, I guess I wasn't paying close attention the first time around.

He did say it was accidental. He goes on later to explain that yes he pulled the trigger but he did it without actually forming the thought or intent to kill someone in the bathroom.

Doing it out of fear. A reflex reaction- pulling the trigger.

 

[TorisMom003]

So I thought it was pretty interesting that the state's witnesses who were not called by the state all heard only crying and wailing and no woman screaming or blood-curdling screaming.

According to the defense. Those witnesses have not yet testified to that fact. If they do, then it may mean something. If they don't, then like the non-existing dog that Roux tried to use to trip up Mrs. Stipp, it will show that the defense is once again being dishonest.

MOO

 

[BritsKate]

So I thought it was pretty interesting that the state's witnesses who were not called by the state all heard only crying and wailing and no woman screaming or blood-curdling screaming.

They apparently heard crying - no screaming at all. The screaming Oscar yesterday admitted.

Please pardon errors as posted via Tapatalk with a less than stellar user.

 

[sleuth-d-]

Emergency calls are free in SA.

http://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Travel-g293740-s603/South-Africa:Emergencies.html

"The nationwide emergency phone number for the ambulance service is 10177 - you will not need to dial an area code. Ambulance services are run by both the provincial health departments as well as private companies. The largest private emergency response company is Netcare911. They will respond to emergencies whether you are a member or not and their number is 082 911. Go to The Netcare911 website for more information: www.netcare911.co.za
The mobile phone companies have their own emergency numbers which can be dialed even if the phone is out of credit or locked:
The number for Cell C is 084 -140
The number for Vodacom is 082 - 147
The number for MTN is 083 - 112
However, the standard GSM emergency number (112) number should work on all mobile phone providers, regardless of whether or not the phone has credit."


Maybe if you have just blown your lover's brains out the free emergency number will not spring to mind?

:banghead:

his first call didn't prove to be to the emergency services though. it was to a friend who could help him. so a locked phone was no use to him.

 

[04009margaret]

Pray may be the key word in the event of a fire.

I really don't know the answer to that yet. I've still got fans in my head.

:smile:

LOL, but who brought up the fans? LOL

 

[katydid23]

At least Nel, as the day ended, was FINALLY questioning about the correct issues.

Conceding that OP believed there was an intruder..... did he fire intentionally... taking OP to task over his answer that it was "an accident"

I do fear that this is only temporary moment of clarity from Nel... tomorrow he will be back to arguing that OP knew Reeva was in the toilet :banghead:

There is a method to Nel's madness. He would not have gotten anywhere with OP if he had not done all of those crazy detours and antics first, in order to shake OP free from his memorized answers.

If he had just calmly walked up and began asking about the 'correct' issues, OP would have used his memorized scripted answers and seemed credible. But Nel came at him so quickly from so many surprising places, OP was off balance and we saw the holes in his stories.