Trial Discussion Thread #23 - 14.04.11, Day 21

[steveml]

Roux - you need your eyes checked. The denim is in fact on top of the corner of the duvet. Even MiLady agrees with Nel.

The problem is that Col. Van Rensburg who was at the scene disagrees.

 

[G.bng]

Did he actually say the words, "you're lying" or did he just insinuate it? And if so, maybe it is ok to say they're lying but not to call them a liar.

If you are talking about Nel, well just this very moment, Sky's reporter AND the advisory lawyer of the day have just said exactly the same as I, that Nel has called OP a "liar" several times a day so far, so why the admonishment now is very strange.

If you are talking about a case I was litigation friend to, I can't remember, but you're probably right and our barrister said to the witness he was lying. It concerned what was alleged to be a 5 year-old photocopy of a lost original. New evidence miraculously turning up and being disclosed with the court's permission on the last day of the trial, but on which you could feel and see at the back the indentation caused by a black biro used to add the hand written notes. Our barrister's summing up words for that witness who was duped by his spouse to present the document to support her in a breach of trust case against her concerning vulnerable adults were, "... he entered the box a dishonest man, but left it an honest one". Not surprisingly the witness left his spouse very soon after she was found guilty of fraud against the adults.

 

[Gryffindor]

Why is it relevant? Are the photos not detailed with a time? Though that's still meaningless.

 

[Trooper]

nel.. lets see if we can get the photos on the screen.. I am going to show you two photos.. it may take a minute..

Roux.. I request we look at 185.. we have a witness that will come and tell us that the denim was not there.. ( ooo. this could be the mysterious Colonel Motha ) . .

Nel. I am going to blow it up and get it from another angle. . this pic, 183.. we zoom in.... what is important milady, before I go to another angle there is a label on the denim, that isn't important.. in context, one has to take in the corner of the duvet.. when you look at it from a different angle, the colour of the label is the same as the duvet..

Roux says something, the judge says carry on.

Nel.. milady.. Its just the corner, we are not talking about the duvet.. this little corner of the duvet where the denim is lying.. ,

its a different angle.. ( judge, its a different angle?) . yes milady.. the label on the denim is not part of the debate. its the corner of the duvet.. this portion.. makes it difficult to see the corner but it is there. now we go to 183. the thicker part of the duvet is more visible on 185. there we can see the label. the rougher corners. its clear from that photo, the denim is on the duvet. it is from this, I intend to proceed.

Roux.. I don't see it. he can say its his impression.

judge well. if the evidence is here, you can argue at the end of the case..

roux. well. you cant put it as a fact. he should say its his interpretation...

judge. from the photos it looks as if the denim is on top? you can go as far as that..

Nel. when you look at the photo, it looks as if the denim is on top of the duvet.. and this creates a problem with yur version.

Oscar. well. if the colonel says so, it doesn't create a difficulty.

Nel. did you pick that up from mr roux argument??

Oscar yes.. I picked that up frm mr roux argument..

nel. you are not answering the questions.. I asking you. does this create a problem for your version??

Oscar. well. it does look its on top of the duvet.. it could create a difficulty.

nel. well if you dropped it there, your version doesn't make sense..

Oscar. if colonel van rensburgs evidence isn't allowable, then it doesn't make since.. I haven't looked at these photos in my bail hearing..

Nel. when we showed you this photo, did you think the denim was laying next to the duvet??

Oscar. .I didn't think.. from pic 55 it looks like they are next to each other.. colonel von rensburg was not the photographer, he moved around the room and saw things from many different angles.

Nel. you can page thru the album.. is there anything you want to point out??

no..

 

[zwiebel]

Nel asks what O thinks of pic 55. Says it looks like jeans are next to duvet, which I think they do too, in that pic.

Nel seems to be trying to show O is basing his version and a mistake Col V made, in thinking jeans next to duvet?

 

[zwiebel]

Now Nel's asked if OP sees any prob with pic of his ipad/cover by the bed?

O says no...

 

[MeeBee]

If you are talking about Nel, well just this very moment, Sky's reporter AND the advisory lawyer of the day have just said exactly the same as I, that Nel has called OP a "liar" several times a day so far, so why the admonishment now is very strange.

If you are talking about a case I was litigation friend to, I can't remember, but you're probably right and our barrister said to the witness he was lying. It concerned what was alleged to be a 5 year-old photocopy of a lost original. New evidence miraculously turning up and being disclosed with the court's permission on the last day of the trial, but on which you could feel and see at the back the indentation caused by a black biro used to add the hand written notes. Our barrister's summing up words for that witness who was duped by his spouse to present the document to support her in a breach of trust case against her concerning vulnerable adults were, "... he entered the box a dishonest man, but left it an honest one". Not surprisingly the witness left his spouse very soon after she was found guilty of fraud against the adults.

Oh, no, I was talking about Roux.

 

[zwiebel]

That ipad looks like someone took a bite out of it.

 

[katydid23]

The problem is that Col. Van Rensburg who was at the scene disagrees.

But a picture's worth a thousand words....:wink:

 

[whiterum]

The dogs and chairs were NOT that early morning with Reeva.

But wasn't it when he woke up with ST and heard noises downstairs and said the dog had got inside. The point is how did it get inside on that occasion and also in doing so why did the dog not set off the alarm since he claims to be so security conscious the night he killed Reeva.

 

[kaos]

I could make out somebody whispering "excellent" there but don't know if it was the judge or Nel.

 

[Trooper]

the ipad cover.. Nel. on this photo.. did yu pull the fan to the position where you did. . the multiplug would have moved in yur direction.

Oscar.. I don't know, ,I don't know the lengths.. that's my vest, I put it over my legs. I threw it there I don't know where it landed. that's what s shown

Nel. why did you put your vest on your legs??

Oscar. is a habit. I always do it, I do it at the track.. I cover my prosthetics..if I had to get up in the night I knew know where my clothing is... always in the same place..

no feed.. dang.

 

[wb180]

It's a successful strategy. He does the same as Juan Martinez---jumps around so the witness cannot stay on scripted, memorized answers.

Jumping around also makes it hard for the witness to remember exactly the sequence of events if he is faking it.

 

[Gryffindor]

But a picture's worth a thousand words....:wink:

Depends which photo though. There were umpteen and who, what, when, where is all a big jumble now

 

[zwiebel]

The grey item behind is OP's vest, he says. When he put legs on 'I threw it there'

But I thought he said before that, he'd put it over his legs.

N: Even in your bedroom you'd put it on your legs?

O: Yes...so I could SEE where my legs (were if he need to get up, go to loo)

So he could see in the bedroom at night, usually?

 

[shane13]

Yes. Plus that's what I always thought looking at Jurer13 pictures, that it's pitchblack or LED lit, so how did Reeva not stumble around ipad, the electrical cords. And not make noise normal tossing off the duvet that she has to take off her legs.

Or, if she's rolling around over the left hand side of his bed, she has to make sure she navigates the couch and make sure she doesn't hit his legs that he says are placed there.

Just think of that.
If Op's version were true--at the outset--Reeva would have tripped, fallen been injured, and thus no running to toilet and would not have gotten shot.

 

[Cher352]

Just did a test,

I place a paper tablet about an inch behind my keyboard. When I look at it sitting in front of my keyboard, it appears the keyboard is on top of the tablet but it is not.

That is why I still think I would need an overhead shot to be certain.

 

[zwiebel]

Ugh. Back to fans.

Why didn't Nel labour the point OP just said he used clothing to help him see in the room at night?

 

[BritsKate]

BTW,

A vest is a tank top for my compatriots.

 

[shane13]

That ipad looks like someone took a bite out of it.

Correction: Mega-byte...