Trial Discussion weekend Thread #24

[james83]

Yep, he heard OP screaming initially, after Reeva was already dead.

From the balcony?.

 

[Gryffindor]

He doesn't believe in phones or panic buttons on security systems?

No panic button system has ever been mentioned, as existing. Not by DT, PT or Oscar.

 

[molly333]

Don't get why that is so hard to understand, he shoots her in a rage and then realises what's he done and then realises the implications, so of course he is going to act like he want's to save her, what would you expect him to do?, just leave her in the toilet and hope no one notices?.

If that's what he did, I have to say it shows great presence of mind.

Because if he did kill her on purpose, it was in a moment of rage or passion, not cold blooded, IMO.

Hard to believe someone could go from rage to working out a scenario that makes it look like an accident so fast.

He really only had minutes to figure this all out, if that's the case.

 

[james83]

Closes the curtains which leaves the room pitch dark, hears a noise and blindly goes to pick up his gun rather than reopen curtains to let light in, but of course that would have meant he'd have seen the bed was empty.

 

[Viper]

So...he wanted Reeva dead so he shot her. Then he tried to make it look like he didn't want her dead by breaking the door and rescuing her.
Once rescued she was dead, so he thought he'd again make it look like he was trying to save her. But it was all a cover-up, as he wanted her dead anyway?

Have I got this right? :dunno:

BIB. Congratulations, you have gotten them all correct. Nice job!

 

[molly333]

No panic button system has ever been mentioned, as existing. Not by DT, PT or Oscar.

Ok. Most security systems have them so I just assumed his did.

He could have tripped the system, though. Was he on contract with a security company?

 

[james83]

If that's what he did, I have to say it shows great presence of mind.

Because if he did kill her on purpose, it was in a moment of rage or passion, not cold blooded, IMO.

Hard to believe someone could go from rage to working out a scenario that makes it look like an accident so fast.

He really only had minutes to figure this all out, if that's the case.

Not really, he didnt have to give a statement for 4 days, all he had to do at the time was claim he thought she was an intruder, as he was suspiciously keen to point out to Dr stipp.

 

[Trooper]

If that's what he did, I have to say it shows great presence of mind.

Because if he did kill her on purpose, it was in a moment of rage or passion, not cold blooded, IMO.

Hard to believe someone could go from rage to working out a scenario that makes it look like an accident so fast.

He really only had minutes to figure this all out, if that's the case.

but he didn't figure it out.. he didn't figure it out far enough, and that's why a lot of murderers get bunged in the clink for many a long year.. that's why he got charged and is on trial for murder.. if he had figured it out, he'd be eyeing off another huge order for more weaponry and mouthing off at coppers just doing their job.

 

[Cherwell]

Perhaps that 66 second call was actually to prevent anyone from coming, just in case anyone else in the neighbourhood had called them, there's been no evidence to support that OP did in fact talk to anyone and if so, what was said. He could have said oops sorry, it was a b*tt call, so sorry no need here. Kinda like when Baba called and he said everything was fine.

If anything like that had happened, I feel sure that the prosecution would have called the Netcare operator as a witness. I sure would love to know the content of that call.

 

[Gryffindor]

Yep, he heard OP screaming initially, after Reeva was already dead.

Though Dr Stipp stated both sets were gunshots, to him, didn't he.

 

[molly333]

Ran on the balcony hurdling over the fan and duvet that were blocking his way and then was curiously not seen by all the witnesses who were looking at his house after hearing gunshots.

Edit: Or going with the first set of bangs heard at 3 a.m., his screams sounding instead like a woman or two people at once

:jail:

I think 3am is when she died.

 

[james83]

No panic button system has ever been mentioned, as existing. Not by DT, PT or Oscar.

Im willing to take pieter baba's word for it that there was a panic button.

 

[steveml]

He doesn't believe in phones or panic buttons on security systems?

First thing I'd do in an emergency situation like this would be to quickly shout for help, next priority get that door open by any means to see what condition my partner is in, next priority see if I can stem bleeding, whilst I'm stemming the blood my hands wouldn't be free to do anything else. As soon as I can do nothing more I would phone for help.

I don't know the situation with the panic buttons, but at this stage you're fully aware that you're not dealing with an intruder, you're dealing with a casualty. At that moment, shouting for a neighbour would probably be far quicker and more productive than anything security could do.

 

[Val1]

It's more or less the nearest you can get to the outside whilst the body is still inside. Not the best place to be if your intentions are anything but sincere. The bathroom is the best place.

I just have to reply... dumping the body out the bathroom window and having to cart it around the house to get to the car is the best place, as opposed to just taking it downstairs, bag it and tie it and out to the trunk that's been backed up neatly near your front door? Or is that why the ladders were left there....

 

[molly333]

but he didn't figure it out.. he didn't figure it out far enough, and that's why a lot of murderers get bunged in the clink for many a long year.. that's why he got charged and is on trial for murder.. if he had figured it out, he'd be eyeing off another huge order for more weaponry and mouthing off at coppers just doing their job.

I'd like to go over his actions in more detail after he shot her.

He turned down help from security system.

Was told to bring her in himself by ambulance service.

Called the friends over? When did that happen?

 

[wb180]

It's more or less the nearest you can get to the outside whilst the body is still inside. Not the best place to be if your intentions are anything but sincere. The bathroom is the best place.

I disagree. I think the foyer just inside your front door is the best place if you want to dispose of the body. I.e. call your mate to come and you carry the body to the front door but still inside your house so you can dispose of it as soon as possible.

The other scenario that OP told us was to help her as she was still alive but then seems like she was dead already. So his version can be dismissed.

I like my version better.

 

[Viper]

I think 3am is when she died.

Why? BTW, My thinking is 3:16 - 3:17.

 

[james83]

Remember folks next time you find someone "slumpped over but alive" call Johan Stander first, the ambulance can wait another 30 seconds or so.

 

[Cherwell]

About the alarm:
I suspect it was never turned on in the first place. He would turn it on before going to bed for the night, and I'm not at all convinced they ever did.


The business about the duvet and the jeans bothers me a bit, because OP himself could have moved them before the police ever got there, say while he was putting on his legs and generally faffing around. But I would have thought he'd have that explanation on the tip of his tongue.

 

[Val1]

If anything like that had happened, I feel sure that the prosecution would have called the Netcare operator as a witness. I sure would love to know the content of that call.

But they didn't know about that cell phone in time to get recordings, right?