Trial Discussion weekend Thread #24

[steveml]

From the balcony?.

Johan Stipp and his wife heard the screaming after the shots, I don't think they specified which part of the house the screaming was coming from.

 

[Gryffindor]

Then the case is closed for you because Oscar said he shouldn't be tried for murder let alone premeditated murder.

Correct, although I can form my own judgements, thank you.

If we can pick and choose who we believe though, like Baba, then Oscar isn't excluded either.

Baba can claim, not assert. Wonder if Oscar had it installed, IF so? I'm sure Nel wouldn't have omitted questioning on its existence during his home security cross. . .

 

[molly333]

So what is your explanation for all the female screaming heard by the neighbours?

I don't know that testimony. I've only been looking at this case for about a week. So I am coming to many of my conclusions right before your eyes. lol

What do you think of it?

 

[shane13]

Does that include the magic gun going off without his finger on the trigger? His 'word' has been proven to be lies for 'most' things so far - and Nel hasn't even got started. I'm glad he is fighting for Reeva. After all, it was her life that ended in a toilet after being shot by someone we now know was thoroughly unpleasant, highly volatile, a liar, immoral, thought nothing of shooting a dog in the back of the head (without saying a word to the owner), accuses his DT for his inaccurate affidavit, his friends of lying, the police for not showing him 'courtesy' when dealing with his firearm in the car, the list is too long to complete. But one thing I know, is he's a nasty piece of work, and if it was anyone other than him, no one would give him the time of day. Famous people are just people with more money than the rest of us. They're not saints. And plenty of them have murdered.

BBM
I think ID channel [Investigative Discovery] has had several series where the rich etc. either were murdered or did the murdering.

Wasn't one called "Behind Mansion Walls" or such?

I guess all that money or fame is conducive to all sorts of problems?

 

[james83]

Does that include the magic gun going off without his finger on the trigger? His 'word' has been proven to be lies for 'most' things so far - and Nel hasn't even got started. I'm glad he is fighting for Reeva. After all, it was her life that ended in a toilet after being shot by someone we now know was thoroughly unpleasant, highly volatile, a liar, immoral, thought nothing of shooting a dog in the back of the head (without saying a word to the owner), accuses his DT for his inaccurate affidavit, his friends of lying, the police for not showing him 'courtesy' when dealing with his firearm in the car, the list is too long to complete. But one thing I know, is he's a nasty piece of work, and if it was anyone other than him, no one would give him the time of day. Famous people are just people with more money than the rest of us. They're not saints. And plenty of them have murdered.

Oscars performance on monday no doubt won him a few hearts.
It certainly didnt win mine, those tears were all for himself.

 

[molly333]

So why did it take around 15 minutes for him to get the toilet door open?.

Can you give me your timeline?

What time did his friends come to help?

 

[Cherwell]

As for the actual facts. Prsident Kennedy was shot in the head at 12:30 PM. Here is video of Assistant White House Press Secretary Malcom Kilduff telling all the reporters in Parkland Hospital at circa 1:30 PM, that President Kennedy died at 1:00 PM.

In other words, despite massive brain tauma and frankly massive loss of brain, his heart beat for another half hour.
I would also beseech all you sleuthers to watch the short video to its very end where he shows where the fatal head shot actually entered the President’s head…

It's O/T, but my interpretation of that has always been that he was declared dead after all hopes of saving him had been extinguished. It was the President of the USA, they would have felt they had to be seen to have tried to revive him, even though it was clearly hopeless.

 

[asanque]

I don't know that testimony. I've only been looking at this case for about a week. So I am coming to many of my conclusions right before your eyes. lol

What do you think of it?

I think that 5 different independent witnesses called by the prosecution who heard female screaming between 3 to 3:17 a.m. are highly credible (and would mean that the 3 a.m. sounds were not the fatal gunshots).

If you are looking at this case just now, I recommend you read juror 13.http://juror13lw.wordpress.com/

She provides a very succinct summary of the matter to date.

 

[shane13]

You don't have to believe me but I'll say it anyway. He was DOA. They made sure of that. His head exploded on camera.

The massive doctoring of the Zapruder film has been well proven. Several books on it--read here.

Over a dozen doctors treated President Kennedy for a half hour trying to keep him alive. But you know they were all imagining this?

I've read a remarkable book from one of the treating doctors, Dr. Charles Crenshaw veriifying many things.

 

[steveml]

So your contention is that OP sounds like a woman when he screams and to others like a man AND a woman.

We also need to disregard all evidence to the contrary that he actually sounds like a man when screaming (i.e. from Sam Taylor)

My contention makes no difference, and neither does the witnesses. If the first shots were gunshots, Reeva did not scream, shout or make any sound afterwards, because she was dead.
We cannot ignore that, it's one of the few facts in this case that we can establish. Whether OP's voice is low-pitched or high-pitched or sounds male or female is an irrelevance,

All the sound tests in the world cannot disprove that fact.

 

[molly333]

Not really, he didnt have to give a statement for 4 days, all he had to do at the time was claim he thought she was an intruder, as he was suspiciously keen to point out to Dr stipp.

Who could even think that up so fast, much less play it out?

I'm wondering now, though, if that was maybe plan B instead of plan A.

Plan A seems to be friends, plastic bags, and no security people or ambulances.

Dr. Stipp might have been the fly in the ointment?

 

[DebinGA]

A large plastic bag could be used as a tourniquet to stop bleeding if tied tightly around an injured limb

Sent from my GT-N5110 using Tapatalk

Or on OP's expensive car's floorboard to protect it from blood stains.

 

[steveml]

I think that 5 different independent witnesses called by the prosecution who heard female screaming between 3 to 3:17 a.m. are highly credible (and would mean that the 3 a.m. sounds were not the fatal gunshots).

If you are looking at this case just now, I recommend you read juror 13.http://juror13lw.wordpress.com/

He provides a very succinct summary of the matter to date.

I agree with you entirely. The only way that the sounds can be those of Reeva is if the first noises were not gunshots.

 

[shane13]

It's O/T, but my interpretation of that has always been that he was declared dead after all hopes of saving him had been extinguished. It was the President of the USA, they would have felt they had to be seen to have tried to revive him, even though it was clearly hopeless.

Of course it was hopeless, he had a third of his brain shot out. He would have been a vegetable even if they could have kept his heart going indefinitely.

That's not the point, as you can see from my other post above.
Many witnesses saw and said that his heart beat for half an hour after the brain shot. That's alli was trying to say in that regard. So it is on topic in that a massive brain shot and loss of a signiicant part of the brain can still in some cases have the victim's heart beat for some time afterwards. And this possibility may be relevant here .Or it may not as each "case' is different.

Dr. Crenshaw one of the treating physicians testified in Court about all that in the case of Crenshaw vs JAMA--where he sued JAMA for what they said about him and what he witnessed. He won, or JAMA settled with him as I recall.

 

[soozieqtips]

I'm sure Judge Masipa has dealt with all sorts on the stand and is quite used to murderers using every emotion to try and escape a conviction for murder. As she's been keeping notes of all the times OP has been caught lying, her pen must have run out of ink a zillion times, but at least she can refer back to the plethora of lies and inconsistencies when summing up.

 

[Freya1977]

You don't have to believe me but I'll say it anyway. He was DOA. They made sure of that. His head exploded on camera.

I've seen videos of people with worse trauma to the head sitting up in an ER. Concious. If you don't believe it, Google something like "alive with head blown apart" or something similar.

 

[asanque]

My contention makes no difference, and neither does the witnesses. If the first shots were gunshots, Reeva did not scream, shout or make any sound afterwards, because she was dead.
We cannot ignore that, it's one of the few facts in this case that we can establish. Whether OP's voice is low-pitched or high-pitched or sounds male or female is an irrelevance,

All the sound tests in the world cannot disprove that fact.

Well actually, you are ignoring the testimony from the state pathologist that the first shot hit Reeva on the hip allowing her time to scream.

 

[molly333]

Molly.. at the first page of this thread are all the documents, testimony, evidence tabled by the Prosecution , and the defence.. You will also find all direct video of testimony given so far, except that of Dr Saayman, and his summarized evidence is there also.. you will find all the telecom evidence, showing times of calls, from and to whom..

That will take me hours. You trying to get rid of me?

Besides I need answers fast.

Seriously, thanks!

 

[molly333]

I've seen videos of people with worse trauma to the head sitting up in an ER. Concious. If you don't believe it, Google something like "alive with head blown apart" or something similar.

You might ask yourself--what happened to his brain? It never showed up in Bethesda.

 

[Freya1977]

Can you give me your timeline?

What time did his friends come to help?

Perhaps you should read the actual facts of the case? There's many time lines provided right in this forum.