Trial Discussion weekend Thread #24

[K.T]

I also saw some posts that were talking about how short OP is without his "legs" on. Saw one that said OP was under 5 feet without them on. This is not true. Although OP himself seems unsure of how tall he is without them on. During testimony he said he was 5 foot something without them on. I think it is important to remember that his legs are amputated well below the knee. The post about him not being able to urinate without his "legs" on, while cute, is simply not true. I believe his height with his legs on is at least 6 feet.

MOO

In trying to figure out the bathroom-window-figure-passing issue, I checked Oscar Pistorius' heights

According to some reports (there is variance):

Pistoruis with his prosthetic legs is 155/6cm = 5'1" or 5' (or 5.11+/- foot)

This determined that his height while wearing the prosthetic limbs is 1.84 metres, compared with 1.55 metres on his stumps. His height-to-shoulder level is 1.56 metres with the prostheses and 1.23 metres without. His height to elbow level is 1.26 metres with the prostheses and 0.96 metres without.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/mar/18/oscar-pistorius-not-wearing-prosthetic-legs-expert

 

[TorisMom003]

If that is the case where the defence can just claim crime scene photos are not reliable, then you can be sure that every trial that came up, it would be claimed for some reason or another that the crime scene had been tampered with before taking photos .. and yet they still continue to take photos, so why do you think they bother to do this? The police have no reason to change the crime scene and if anything, seeing as one police officer (who turns out to be a family member) who 'took care' of OP right from the word go, it would be more likely they changed the crime scene to be in his favour and match his story, rather than the reverse.

I saw the way Roux was trying to confuse the court by deliberately mixing up the sequence in which they were taken, and it was so obvious what he was trying to do there .. I very much doubt the judge will be taken in by it .. and at the end of the day, Roux has a job to do, he has to try and confuse because he knows OP's story is a complete fabrication so he has to try and get his client off in some way or another and this just one of the many ways he is trying to do it. It's quite transparent though, the way he is doing it .. the judge won't be fooled.

As Mr. Nel pointed out to OP, the police at that time had no idea what OP's version was going to be. So how did the police just happen to get lucky enough to move things around in order to prove OP's version incorrect?

Are the police mind readers now? Or does it make more sense that OP used those photographs to explain his "version" and to make claims that the police were framing him?

 

[soozieqtips]

I believe the text was supposed to have been sent around 10 pm. Not sure if it was in Reeva's phone records according to testimony or not.

I think it was established the text came from Reeva's phone. Gina didn't say it came from another number. Not that I remember for sure Milady!!

 

[Cherry]

I am shocked at how many times op has changed his version. This can only be due to lying. Did anyone else notice the golden rule about speech? He has said they them people plural ppl being in that bathroom coming thru that window. He has already hung himself w his speech n choice of words jmo. The choice of using words n plural or them and they indicates lying. Point blank. They argued she was afraid and he hunted her into that locked bathroom and he murdered her, IMHO.

I would like Mr Nel to zoom in on oscars pillow in photos 51 52 53. There is smthing that looks like blood on pillow. Has anyone else noticed it??

 

[Viper]

Thank you for acknowledging the post. I do hope someone knows the answer to this, I've been Googling this but haven't found an article that provides a good response. Most just say that in addition to the potential 25 years to life premeditated murder charge, OP also faces three separate gun charges

I will try for you, but my recollection is blurry. Two of them carry a maximum sentence of 5 years each, and one of them carries a maximum sentence of 15 years. None of the maximum sentences are mandatory, so the judge can give him a sentence ranging anywhere from no confinement at all, or up to combining them to 25 years if she ran them consecutively.

 

[TorisMom003]

It was sent from her phone at approx. 10pm. Her friend Gina said she didn't sign off like she normally did. Maybe OP sent the message from Reeva's phone. We'll never know. But they weren't arguing at 10pm, and if they were, it wasn't loud enough for anyone else to hear. The argument sounds came much later.

They could have been arguing before the neighbors heard it. Just not as loudly as when the neighbors heard it. Since Reeva didn't sign off as she normally does, that makes me think that OP took her phone when she was in the bathroom or something and sent that text for her. OP may have told her what he had done when she was ready to leave and that caused another argument.

MOO

 

[soozieqtips]

yeah, I see mention of the 'hurdle,' but never knew what it was. Had Reeva changed her plans in order to comfort him? For instance, cooking dinner?

I agree it's a cover story. He had nothing for her for V-day because they were not going to be together. Whose decision was that? Her friends in interview all say that was her favorite holiday and she was all about roses and candy and love for that holiday. So, if it was Reeva's decision, which it seems it might be given the gift the day before and not wanting to spend the night with him, I still think she was breaking up with him that night.

Tell us again how dangerous it is to break up with a man who considers you his possession.

Not sure where you're getting this breaking up thing on that night. Reeva texted her friend to say she was staying over. When do you think Reeva was going to dump OP, the next day?

 

[fox1lady]

yeah, I see mention of the 'hurdle,' but never knew what it was. Had Reeva changed her plans in order to comfort him? For instance, cooking dinner?

I agree it's a cover story. He had nothing for her for V-day because they were not going to be together. Whose decision was that? Her friends in interview all say that was her favorite holiday and she was all about roses and candy and love for that holiday. So, if it was Reeva's decision, which it seems it might be given the gift the day before and not wanting to spend the night with him, I still think she was breaking up with him that night.

Tell us again how dangerous it is to break up with a man who considers you his possession.

Do we know that they weren't going to see each other on VD? I know that she was going to be doing a presentation that day but perhaps they were going to meet for dinner on the evening? I can't understand why she would give him a picture of the two of them as a gift if she planned on breaking up with him.

I still think they had an argument, not sure about what. A lot of things were perhaps said and maybe she mentioned that she knows lots about him and would reveal it to the media!

 

[Cherry]

Maybe I missed some testimony but I don't remember anything being said so far about whether OP and Reeva had a physical relationship, much less whether there was any discussion about having sex that night. Seems really odd that the topic hasn't come up at all.

Maybe Nel will put it to him tomorrow, as well as zoom n on that pillow. The color on it is out of context w everything else in that room. Ie it looks. Like a struggle did occur threw off duvet, iPad hurled hard enough that it came out of its cover, all on the floor and in back ground of those photos something reddish is on oscars pillow. I want to knw wth it is.

 

[soozieqtips]

They could have been arguing before the neighbors heard it. Just not as loudly as when the neighbors heard it. Since Reeva didn't sign off as she normally does, that makes me think that OP took her phone when she was in the bathroom or something and sent that text for her. OP may have told her what he had done when she was ready to leave and that caused another argument.

MOO

They could definitely have been arguing beforehand, but no one heard anything. But yes, the row could have started much earlier and hit its peak around 3am. Someone did hear arguing from 1.56am on and off for an hour, but wasn't sure where the noise was coming from (I think!).

 

[jay-jay]

For the same reason, his responses to situations are not the same as those of a typically reasonable man. Sometimes he does odd things. I've always noticed this in people born with disabilities. Even when those disabilities are purely physical, it often carries over to a certain amount of mental dysfuntion as well. So he doesn't wait for Reeva to reply and does odd things like that.

Good grief .. :facepalm:

 

[fox1lady]

They could have been arguing before the neighbors heard it. Just not as loudly as when the neighbors heard it. Since Reeva didn't sign off as she normally does, that makes me think that OP took her phone when she was in the bathroom or something and sent that text for her. OP may have told her what he had done when she was ready to leave and that caused another argument.

MOO

They may have been arguing whilst she sent that text, perhaps she wanted to get things sorted and knew that by the time it was sorted it would be too late for her to drive. As she was preocccupied she didn't sign off in her usual way.

 

[soozieqtips]

Good grief ..

OP isn't mentally disabled. I've known some physically disabled people in my life, just a few, and none of them have mental issues because of their physical disability, or don't know how to answer a question!

 

[molly333]

Yes. Many times throughout the trial (I'm never without my iphone) I'm just saying take a picture, just take a picture Stipps/Baba!

About the bathroom window: I'm also unsure that Dr Stipp seeing a man moving from right to left past the window would conclusively mean that Pistorius had to have his prosthetics on.

Perhaps someone has already mentioned this, but the window is set at a relatively low window-to-floor height. Pistorius is 5'1" on his stumps. A figure, moving quickly across a window, could still be seen at that window height.

From the outside, without knowing the height of the window to floor ratio, you might see a figure as a taller person if Dr Stipp imagined the window was higher.

So Oscar is 5'1' on his stumps. Anyone know how tall Reeva was? I don't think she was that tall. I notice she is always wearing platform shoes in pictures.

 

[BritsKate]

The first three witnesses don't agree with you. They all heard woman screaming [and man] and then 4 gunshots at 3am, after which the woman screamed no more.

The gunshots were never at 3am by anyone's account. The defence wants us to believe the earliest bangs were the gunshots and that there was no screaming at all. Or that, if there was screaming, it was Oscar screaming.

Oscar estimates he fired at 3:12.
Dr. Stipp called security at 3:15.
Charl Johnson rang (the wrong) security at 3.16.
Oscar called Johan Stander at 3:19.

 

[TorisMom003]

From his Wikipedia page:

Height
1.84 m (6 ft 1⁄2 in) in prosthetics[2]

And from the cited source for the Wikipedia page:

http://www.webcitation.org/6ATEa50uf

"His representatives say Pistorius always stands 1.84 meters, whether racing or not,"

So OP is 6 feet tall with his "legs" on.

Now if I can just find something that tells his height without them on.

 

[Cherry]

It is at this point in the case that I believe this was domestic violence, and murder in the first degree. Since he walked so slowly to that door, he had plenty of time to change his mind. He wanted to get at her so badly he broke dwn the door w his cricket bat. I do not believe one word op has uttered on the stand. In fact at this point I believe he is quite the fool to take the stand and even a bigger fool that he would think the world would believe his sniveling and dry crying excuses. He is trying to save his Olympiad status but IMHO it is dead in the water. I hope he spends many yrs in. Prison. Many.

 

[Mr Fossil]

I think it was established the text came from Reeva's phone. Gina didn't say it came from another number. Not that I remember for sure Milady!!

Do we not think it strange that this SMS text message wasn't identified in any of the detailed call logs presented for any of the phones, given the time that is was apparently sent? An earlier unidentified SMS is recorded as being received on Reeva's phone.

 

[TorisMom003]

So Oscar is 5'1' on his stumps. Anyone know how tall Reeva was? I don't think she was that tall. I notice she is always wearing platform shoes in pictures.

I don't think that OP is only 5'1 on his stumps. Not after seeing an article where some of his representatives stated he was 6 feet and a half with his "legs" on. He isn't missing that much of his actual leg.

MOO

 

[HauntsForHope]

So how much time can he get for Culpable Homicide?