Trial Thread 10 May 2012 - Judge's Instructions and maybe deliberations!

[maxfactor]

Thanks Max - Hopefully I will be back!!!!! I can't wait for them to be sequestered and start deliberating.

Do we need a poll or guestimate thread for how long it will take them to reach the verdict?

Salem

I think that's a great idea Salem!!!

 

[swedie]

If it's any consultation Carrie, if MR is found guilty and gets 25 years with no chance of parole for 25 years, it doesn't mean he will get out in 25 years. There are so many legalities he will have to go through once he files for parole, and all that takes time and it will also depend on his behaviours and such during incarceration. Let's pray he rots away in there if he is found guilty and we'll have no worries. MOO. Hopefully he'll get no time reduced for good behaviour. I'm not sure if he will or is eligible for that. MOO

Yes, but "Life" around here isn't really life. He'll be young enough still when he gets out to do something like this again.

What I was wondering if he'll get double time served for the last three years.

 

[Flowercb]

Rafferty much less reactionary today than during the crown's closing arguments

I don't think the judge would tolerate MTR rolling his eyes at the judge's comments. MOO and LOL. Wouldn't you love to see that!

 

[~n/t~]

I have to leave also. I'll see you all later. I'll pick up some snacks on the way home so we can munch on something while we wait tonight.

 

[snoofer]

If it's any consultation Carrie, if MR is found guilty and gets 25 years with no chance of parole for 25 years, it doesn't mean he will get out in 25 years. There are so many legalities he will have to go through once he files for parole, and all that takes time and it will also depend on his behaviours and such during incarceration. Let's pray he rots away in there if he is found guilty and we'll have no worries. MOO. Hopefully he'll get no time reduced for good behaviour. I'm not sure if he will or is eligible for that. MOO

apparently not if he is convicted of murder 1. MOO

 

[swedie]

YES. You are correct n/t.

Which is exactly what the Crown said, right? If the victim was murdered during the commission of a felony, and even though the accused did not cause intent or action, (wielding hammer) it's still first degree?

 

[maxfactor]

If it's any consultation Carrie, if MR is found guilty and gets 25 years with no chance of parole for 25 years, it doesn't mean he will get out in 25 years. There are so many legalities he will have to go through once he files for parole, and all that takes time and it will also depend on his behaviours and such during incarceration. Let's pray he rots away in there if he is found guilty and we'll have no worries. MOO. Hopefully he'll get no time reduced for good behaviour. I'm not sure if he will or is eligible for that. MOO

I don't think good behavior sentence reductions apply to life sentences Swedie!! The parole board will look at his behavior when he gets his first parole hearing. From what I understand the hearing won't happen exactly at the end of the 25 years, he would have to go through the steps to apply and wait his turn. MOO Even if parole is granted it is usually done in steps, escorted passes, unescorted passes, halfway house etc. At least that's what I have been told.

 

[nursebeeme]

attention: we will be moving to the verdict watch thread as soon as the charge is complete and the jury is sequestered:

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=171727"]**verdict watch** - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

If the the thread is locked at that time and a mod is not around please alert the thread to open the door.

 

[Tahorn]

Do you think he still would have not know Tori was kidnapped by the time they left HD, or even when he drove up that laneway?

If he honestly did not know about the kidnapping until HD and did indeed drive to MT Forest to think or figure out what to do next then no he is not guilty of 1st degree. Where is the intent?

 

[Alison]

I have to leave also. I'll see you all later. I'll pick up some snacks on the way home so we can munch on something while we wait tonight.

Pass on the snacks but I drink budweiser

 

[Flowercb]

I'm still wondering about MTR's reactions in the court room. I wished I knew something about psychology. I don't understand why he started all his mumbling and rolling eyes during the closing argument. Why not during the testimony? Why showing any kind of reactions when the trial is in the wrapping up process? Everything he did hear there was nothing different than weeks earlier during the beginning of the trial... ?? So why starting when it is way too late??

The defense had nothing to lose at this point. His lawyer would have stopped him if it was during testimony, or--his lawyer instructed him to go for it now, hopping that his sideline, eye-rolling testimony would make him appear not guilty. MOO!--I think Derstine had something to do with this...MOO

 

[maxfactor]

I have to leave also. I'll see you all later. I'll pick up some snacks on the way home so we can munch on something while we wait tonight.

Let's hope we need champagne!!

 

[swedie]

Interesting. Even without a back seat in his car he would allow the strange child to come along for a drive out of town. AND not make you take this stranger child into HD while you shop? There would be no way my hubby would allow me to leave someone else's child in his care, not in this day and age IYKWIM. Just saying and MOO.

Funny, my husband said the same thing ... He said that if a women friend asked for a ride with a child he would not of questioned it would never even crossed his mind that it might be a kidnapping

 

[Sailor Bug]

Earlier tweet should read kidnapping or sex assault can be part of a constructive first degree murder verdict.

 

[snoofer]

Murder 101 Exam

Circle one.

18 year old delinquent, pushes young 8 year old girl into 28 year old slightly perverted man's car. The girl was on her way home from school and her mother was waiting for her and very worried she was not home on time. The car heads right to the highway, makes a stop for a hammer and some drugs. Heads to the rural in a deserted field far, far from the road. Only the man has ever been to this deserted road before. Why was the girl in the man's car? (5 marks)

a. the man and the lady needed a third person to play "monkey in the middle".

b. the man and the woman thought that would be cool when babysitting

c. she was kidnapped and will be raped and killed

d. it's been a long day so the man and woman needed to talk, walk and think about stuff


Question 2

Circle one.

Review question one above. In addition to the information in the first question. Consider that police found a small amount of blood and semen in man's car, the deliquent 18 year old woman told police the man raped the girl, the man told the police dozen's of lies. The man got rid of his bench seat in the back of car as well as other articles police had been looking for. Why was the girl in the man's car? (5 marks)

a. the man and the lady needed a third person to play "monkey in the middle".

b. the man and the woman thought that would be cool when babysitting

c. she was kidnapped and will be raped and killed

d. it's been a long day so the man and woman needed to talk, walk and think about stuff
__________________
As always, JMO

 

[snoofer]

Interesting. Even without a back seat in his car he would allow the strange child to come along for a drive out of town. AND not make you take this stranger child into HD while you shop? There would be no way my hubby would allow me to leave someone else's child in his care, not in this day and age IYKWIM. Just saying and MOO.

maybe would be different if he was a cab driver or something. MOO

 

[robynhood]

..ok must say I am sincerely sorry for tweeting that darn judgement tree in court TODAY! ...It got me very frustrated too....

BUT I FINALLY have some great NEWS>>>>>Court is on a 10 min recess I think it said and there was a tweeter comment that Judge told the poor JURY that he is ALMOST DONE.....so they will be... than leaving to START their decision making process....and as I posted earlier I heard on CP24( our Toronto news major station )that The jury will work from 9am - 9 pm until they have reached a verdict.....

IMO that POOR JUry has been thro a terrible ordeal with this trial ....I am sure they will be happy to be FINISHED !!!!.....all of you in toronto stay tuned to CP24 as they shall be following thru with news breaking news on the progress........Thk God this is almost over...I have never followed a trial ever....found this site because of OUR ANGEL TORI.....my sincere appologizes for todays tweets it got me very upset too ....robynhood!

 

[HoldOnTight]

If he honestly did not know about the kidnapping until HD and did indeed drive to MT Forest to think or figure out what to do next then no he is not guilty of 1st degree. Where is the intent?

Um, driving to a secluded laneway shows me I - N - T - E - N - T
If he knew at HD, why leave Guelph?

 

[robynhood]

..court is back ...lets hope this Judge stuff ends real soon.....!

 

[otto]

are they required by law in Canada?

I think a "legal decision tree" is one of the visual aid available, but not mandatory in all trials.