trial thread: 3/21/2012

[dilbert]

TLM's edited agreed statement of facts

http://www.cbc.ca/news/pdf/agreed-statement-fact-mcclintic-stafford.pdf

 

[~n/t~]

We don't know that TLM said MR used the hammer at the plea hearing, that has never been released because of the partial publication ban that is still in place.

Didn't she say it in the interview?

 

[Sparklin]

wonders if snippits of these poems were on her facebook or the web???? For MTR to see at one time.

I have no doubt in my mind that she spoke at length to him about what a tough girl she was, maybe even reading him her poems/letters. She was the tough B... that would do anything ~ hence the "I knew you were all talk" from Rafferty!!! I can see her bragging about her murderous attitude and him suggesting the kidnapping (of single moms and later a child) and then when he decided to follow through and she was hesitant...he put the dare to her! I'm not in least condoning her involvement, but everything I have seen/heard so far leads me to believe it was MR that instigated this and ultimately raped and killed Tori.

 

[~n/t~]

I don't believe that TLM didn't know TS and that she didn't know TS was TM's daughter.

IMO TS was targeted and I think TLM and CM were so angry at TM regarding the dog breeding talks falling through, and perhaps other things possibly, that she wanted to make TM squirm.

The truth is yet to be heard, if ever, but TLM possibly set MR up for segments of this crime, as payback to him for cheating.

Just speculation on my part and always MOO.

Don't you think the defense would've questioned Tara if that was the case. They didn't go there which imo suggests there was no revenge motive. It was a thrill kill and sadly, Tori was the one. If not Tori, it would've been another innocent little girl.

 

[antiquegirl]

Oh had he made plans that morning to pick up Oxys? I thought he didn't call BA until the afternoon after they abducted Tori. That was the reason why MR put the battery back into his phone; to call BA to see if he could get Oxys. :waitasec:

Tentative plans could have been made in the morning and firmed up in the afternoon. Do we even know that he called BA after the abduction, or was he just checking his messages? I wouldn't make plans to go to Guelph from Woodstock (as he told TLM earlier that afternoon) without knowing if BA would be home. It's possible that she told him she'd try to get what he needed and would let him know if she was successful later. We'll know more when she testifies.

JMO

 

[swedie]

I think this is an interesting point.

TLM confessed and blamed the death on MR. She did an ASofF saying MR used the hammer. Based on this confession, she received a life sentence, which in Canada, appears to be 25 years with the possibility of parole fairly early on.

In the US - when you make a plea deal, you are supposed to be honest and if it is found out later that you were not honest, the prosecutor can motion the Court to take corrective action in the sentencing, by prolonging it where necessary. I don't think this is done often, but it is possible.

Does Canada have the same law? If TLM was thinking she was going to get parole in 10-15 years (or whatever) can the Crown now go to the court and ask that she not be eligible for the full 25 years because she lied and said she didn't kill Tori and now she says she did?

I also wonder if there was any contact between the 2 of them between TLM's 1st confession and the trial?

I tend to believe the 1st confession where she blames MR, but that is based mostly on the words and her demeanor she used when she recanted her story. Honestly, I'm on the fence over this one because I just don't understand why she is now contradicting what she said in the beginning.

Salem

Hi Salem. I highly doubt we have that law here in Canada, otherwise the Crown could have used it against Karla H. I know there was a plea deal in her case but when the new evidence of the video tapes came into play after the plea deal, nothing could be done to take back that deal. She got 12 years for her plea deal. Hope that makes sense.

 

[Sparklin]

and why he KNEW he could and she would take the bait.

Not to mention the 'things she would do for a little lovin'

 

[Hello_Kitty]

I don't believe that TLM didn't know TS and that she didn't know TS was TM's daughter.

IMO TS was targeted and I think TLM and CM were so angry at TM regarding the dog breeding talks falling through, and perhaps other things possibly, that she wanted to make TM squirm.

The truth is yet to be heard, if ever, but TLM possibly set MR up for segments of this crime, as payback to him for cheating.

Just speculation on my part and always MOO.

Ok but as already stated, why didn't he stop her when she was kicking Tori. Call 911, etc, he had a phone.

 

[dilbert]

Tentative plans could have been made in the morning and firmed up in the afternoon. Do we even know that he called BA after the abduction, or was he just checking his messages? I wouldn't make plans to go to Guelph from Woodstock (as he told TLM earlier that afternoon) without knowing if BA would be home. It's possible that she told him she'd try to get what he needed and would let him know if she was successful later. We'll know more when she testifies.

JMO

Exactly, she could have told him earlier in the day to call her when he gets to Guelph so she'd know approx. when he was going to get there.

 

[Sparklin]

@CityCynthia

• #rafferty has hand over his mouth, scowling. Rubbing his chin.

Oh spare me ~ like this is the first he's heard of these! Yeah right

 

[roseofsharon]

Ok but as already stated, why didn't he stop her when she was kicking Tori. Call 911, etc, he had a phone.

Good question HK and the only answer I can think of is fear, in that things had escalated so far out of control and he was in it up to his neck.

Just imo.

 

[dilbert]

Taken from the police video transcripts;

Jim Smyth: from the from the time you bring her back to Mike after using the washroom to the time you see her on the ground
Terri-Lynn McClintic: like fifteen (15) minutes ten (10) fifteen (15) minutes
Jim Smyth: okay so are are what else what are you doing during
those ten (10) or fifteen (15) minutes
Terri-Lynn McClintic: just trying to take in my surroundings like I like I said I glanced back a couple times like I could hear her calling me wanted I tried after after I gave her back to Mike (u/i) after I took her to the washroom I walked....

She was just trying to take in the surroundings?? Alrighty then...

http://www.am980.ca/Other/McClinticVideoTranscript.pdf

 

[Hello_Kitty]

Good question HK and the only answer I can think of is fear, in that things had escalated so far out of control and he was in it up to his neck.

Just imo.

Whichever of them did what, each (if MTR was there) could have saved Tori anytime during this saga. Tori didn't have to die, so to me both are responsible, and that's what the crown will prove (again if MTR was there).

 

[matou]

Why wasn't the blue knife used to kill Tori? The knife was used to remove pieces of the car seat. Why a hammer? JMO

slides 45-47: http://www.am980.ca/Other/McClintic.pdf

 

[dilbert]

Why wasn't the blue knife used to kill Tori? The knife was used to remove pieces of the car seat. Why a hammer? JMO

slides 45-47: http://www.am980.ca/Other/McClintic.pdf

According to TLM's letters, she said she wanted to grab someone off the street and smash their head in (paraphrasing), you don't use a knife to do that, I guess that's why she bought the hammer.

MOO

 

[antiquegirl]

Why wasn't the blue knife used to kill Tori? The knife was used to remove pieces of the car seat. Why a hammer? JMO

slides 45-47: http://www.am980.ca/Other/McClintic.pdf

That's a good question. Why was a hammer even necessary? There were strong male hands and then there were rocks. The only answer I can come up with is because it was MTR's knife and it was TLM who killed Tori. Her purchase, her weapon, her choice. She probably didn't even know about the knife until she allegedly used it to cut out pieces of the car seat. I suspect it was in the glove compartment.

JMO

 

[antiquegirl]

According to TLM's letters, she said she wanted to grab someone off the street and smash their head in (paraphrasing), you don't use a knife to do that, I guess that's why she bought the hammer.

MOO

Here are the tweets, Dilbert:

AM980.ca‏@AM980_Court
McClintic said she was "thirsty as a mother ****er, I feel like a vampire in heat". Said she wanted to "grab somebody off the street"

Laura Carney‏@TheLC_75
Letter being read now, McClintic wrote about grabbing the first person she saw...she'd smash their skull in, among other things.

 

[matou]

I think the knife wasn't used because it would cause a mess of blood and Rafferty wanted to avoid that. He allegedly walked around without any pants on during this whole phase of the crime, he didn't even bother putting them back on again probably to avoid getting any more blood on him. JMO

 

[flipflop]

This has me wondering why she even wrote those letters knowing full well that the staff would read them before they were mailed out. According to one of the tweets she had to see a psychiatrist because of the violence in the letters.

I don't think that will make any difference in this world...as long as she is behind bars for the rest of her life, society is safe -from her anyways. The village is less one idiot, now what do we do to get rid of the rest before another innocent life is taken.

 

[maxfactor]

Here is the transcript of the video:



http://www.am980.ca/Other/McClinticVideoTranscript.pdf