Trial Thread 4/11/2012

[Wondergirl]

Corroborating TLM's testimony.

Doupe’s testimony about the grey fabric and strands of hair is significant because it corroborates evidence that McClintic gave earlier. She told investigators that after she had lured Tori into the car, the girl had been pushed into the back seat and covered with Rafferty’s black pea coat. A black pea coat was found at Rafferty’s home during a search.


McClintic also said that after Tori had been killed and she and Rafferty were back on their way back to Woodstock, he told her to cut out pieces of stained foam from the rear seat of his 2003 Honda Civic.


http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/a...came-from-car-like-rafferty-s-trial-told?bn=1

 

[Jezbel]

Thank you for clarifying Jezbel. :blowkiss:That is helpful to know. It must be hard for some reporters to keep up with the tweets, but one typo can really throw you for a loop.:moo:

So DNA was also found on the front seat of MR's car. Let's pray it shows more evidence then the spot of blood on the door frame. lease:

I believe the Crown likes to take breaks right around very crucial information to give the jurors time to process what they've heard and refresh them, have them alert, for what is about to come. :moo:

You're very welcome Swedie

Yes it does always seem that way and it's like the crown presents in pieces, first all stories, pictures, evidence found etc, then onto significance, forensics etc.

They didn't show a slide of the sample found in the front seat while I was there, but I also hope it is significantly larger it there are two DNA profiles, both can be extracted successfully for a match.

JMO

 

[KMouse]

Clad in a dark suit and striped tie, Mr. Rafferty sat quietly in the prisoner’s box, leaning back, his eyes half closed, as the evidence was aired.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...der-investigation/article2398421/?from=sec431

Sounds like he is bored. Too bad....this is the day I have been waiting for!

 

[Jezbel]

And Really now! Why can't they? What is it with the court system here?

I would maybe guess one reason is so information is not leaked that is not supposed to be reported (e.g when the jurors are out of the room) or so misinformation isn't reported. Any media has to sign in I believe and they receive a package detailing all rules and regulations to follow.

I have no idea if I am right just a though lol

 

[Wondergirl]

DNA links Rafferty and Tori

By Randy Richmond and Hank Daniszewski, The London Free Press
Last Updated: April 11, 2012 1:24pm

http://www.lfpress.com/news/london/raffertytrial/2012/04/11/19618341.html

 

[CarrieBean]

You're very welcome Swedie

Yes it does always seem that way and it's like the crown presents in pieces, first all stories, pictures, evidence found etc, then onto significance, forensics etc.

They didn't show a slide of the sample found in the front seat while I was there, but I also hope it is significantly larger it there are two DNA profiles, both can be extracted successfully for a match.

JMO

Could you explain a bit more about where the blood was, from the pictures you did see?

 

[Hello_Kitty]

Sounds like he is bored. Too bad....this is the day I have been waiting for!

Apparently when that sort of evidence is presented he does tend to react that way. The other day when they were presenting evidence of the autopsy, he was reported to be leaning back with his eyes half close. But when evidence of maps were being shown he was wide awake and staring at the maps.

 

[Salem]

~Respectfully snipped and bolded~

Also they did not yet reveal any results of whether the blood sample tested contained sperm cells. They were talking about 2 DNA profiles found in the blood sample and how there wasn't enough to determine a 2nd DNA profile, but the first DNA profile was that of Tori. It is really all very interesting but also very confusing.

Jezbel - thanks so much for sharing with us. May I ask - the way I understood the tweets was that the blood sample was mixed with sperm cells. The lab obtained DNA from the blood - matching Tori's but there were not enough sperm cells to identify the 2nd person.

In other words - it was not a test of 2 different blood DNA samples - but a test of one blood sample and one sperm cell sample.

Is that close to what you heard in court today?

Thanks,

Salem

 

[Jezbel]

Sounds like he is bored. Too bad....this is the day I have been waiting for!

I am no fan of Rafferty and you won't hear me defending him, but I always disagree with this reporter on his demeanor (well when I am there to view it myself lol). I wouldn't say his eyes were half closed and he didn't particularly look interested or disinterested.

JMO

 

[Salem]

Does this mean they found sperm cells in the blood spot? Or is she explaining the procedure of finding sperm cells?

To me, it means they found sperm cells mixed with the blood. Just not enough for a definitive answer.

Salem

However - sperm cells in Tori's blood answers the question for me.

 

[Sailor Bug]

12:30 RaffertyLFP: McLean's report concluded that the chances that the sample was from someone other than Victoria Stafford was 1 in 28 billion

12:36 RaffertyLFP: The blood spot was also tested for sperm cells and showed there was a mixture of DNA from two individuals

12:41 RaffertyLFP: McLean's said the DNA sample was from Tori Stafford with extremely high probability The other DNA amount found was below the minimum cutoff

12:43 RaffertyLFP: The court is shown a slide highlighting an area of the car door frame opposite the area where the blood was found on the moulding

12:48 RaffertyLFP: The second blood sample was not examined for DNA as it was assumed it was likely from Stafford

 

[SideKick]

I don't care how MR feels either. I get joy knowing he will never drive a car again, where civil clothes, get pills, have freedom and enjoy the company of good people and the community. He sucks and deserves nothing. There ya go!

 

[Hello_Kitty]

To me, it means they found sperm cells mixed with the blood. Just not enough for a definitive answer.
Salem

However - sperm cells in Tori's blood answers the question for me.

Yeah, it doesn't really matter whose cells they were as we know there was no other males than MR at the scene.

 

[Jezbel]

Could you explain a bit more about where the blood was, from the pictures you did see?

Let me see if I can give an example, might be easier then explaining.

I hope this is ok, it's my own mock up of it, see my red poor;y drawn circles?

 

[tygomuk]

I would maybe guess one reason is so information is not leaked that is not supposed to be reported (e.g when the jurors are out of the room) or so misinformation isn't reported. Any media has to sign in I believe and they receive a package detailing all rules and regulations to follow.

I have no idea if I am right just a though lol

Thankyou Jezbel. I just find it lame that it is after all an overflow room that does not really get much of what is going on (as it is CCTV) and any member of the public could theoretically sit in there and then come out and text/email/tweet their entire PTA or whatever that they had just heard/seen/witnessed. I live here, have watched many US trials and just find it lame. I agree there are details we as the public do NOT need to know but this is 2012 and I find it about a century out of date. JMO of course.

 

[Jezbel]

~Respectfully snipped and bolded~

Jezbel - thanks so much for sharing with us. May I ask - the way I understood the tweets was that the blood sample was mixed with sperm cells. The lab obtained DNA from the blood - matching Tori's but there were not enough sperm cells to identify the 2nd person.

In other words - it was not a test of 2 different blood DNA samples - but a test of one blood sample and one sperm cell sample.

Is that close to what you heard in court today?

Thanks,

Salem

Honestly Salem I am not sure. I got a little confused about that, Jennifer said on the stand there are two tests they run, one for DNA one for sperm. The DNA results are that of Tori but I don't think they hit on the results of the other test, unless that is when they started talking about the 2nd profile, in which a profile could not be built from it as the quantities were below there regular testing limits.

Does this make sense? :waitasec:

 

[Wondergirl]

One nanogram (billionth of a smartie) of DNA is the maximum cutoff. A quarter of that is the minimum.

The blood spot was also tested for sperm cells and showed there was a mixture of DNA from two individuals

There's a mixture of DNA in the blood spot. Tori's was the "major" female contribution. There was also a minor contribution.

In this test, odds somebody unrelated to Tori provided for blood was 1 in 150 trillion.

BBM: So, there was a MIXTURE of DNA in the blood spot in the car.

This would be in addition to the MIXTURE of DNA in the blood found in MTR's bag (which was revealed in opening statements, but, hasn't been testified about yet).

Corroborating evidence, IMO.

 

[Sailor Bug]

The blood sample was not very big at all.
How large is 4 mm diameter

25.4 mm makes 1 inch so a circle 3 mm diameter means it is 3 millimeters from one side to the other, which in inches is 0.118 inches or 1/10 th of an inch on your average ruler. Similarly 6 mm is equivalent to 0.236 inches or a little over 2/10 ths (tenths) on the ruler. thus a circle of 3 to 6 mm in diameter would be about 1/10 to 2/10 inches from one side of the circle to the other side, along any line that splits the circle in half. A circle of 2/10 ths of an inch diameter (equal to 6 mm) would be approximately similar to the circle at the end of your average yellow pencil before you sharpen it.

jmo

 

[Sailor Bug]

BBM: So, there was a MIXTURE of DNA in the blood spot in the car.

This would be in addition to the MIXTURE of DNA in the blood found in MTR's bag (which was revealed in opening statements, but, hasn't been testified about yet).

Corroborating evidence, IMO.

I cannot wait until court starts this afternoon...hope they unconfuse me:what:

UPDATE: 12:55Jennifer McLean, a biology expert fron the Centre for Forensic Science said she went to a specially-built examination area at an OPP station in Tillsonburg to examine Michael Rafferty's car over three separate days starting in late May 2009.

McLean said she found blood on the rear passenger side door and seat area. A small blood stain about four mm in diameter was found on the door moulding.

A sample from the stain was compared to Tori Stafford's DNA profile and McLean said the chance that the sample came from anyone other than Stafford was one in 28 billion. Additional DNA was found in the sample but McLean said the amount was too small for reliable analysis.

Another smaller blood stain was found on the car door frame opposite the area where the blood was found on the moulding but it was not subjected to DNA analysis.
http://www.lfpress.com/news/london/r.../19618341.html

 

[Hello_Kitty]

AM980.ca‏@AM980_Court
Blood spot was also tested for sperm cells The amount of cells tested was below the routine level, so results are subject to higher scrutiny

BBM


The way I read this is that they did find spem cells, but the amount was so miniscule (in another tweet she said that they usually test for 15 points but only found 1 point) and because of this could not determine a DNA profile matching MTR.