TruTv(Court TV) Insession is discussing the case.

[TURBOTHINK]

Incest is uncommon, but not rare, in dysfucntional families. And, there isn't an iota of evidence of incest, other than rumors started by KC and LP (who is a love, but is more often wrong than right).

Power struggles between a controlling mother and young adult daughter are as common as dirt. They occurred in my family, where there is no incest. The disdain (expressed mainly by verbal/emotional abuse) wed to professed, even gushy love is a VERY common controlling mechanism in dysfunctional but NON-incestuous families, as well as in incestuous families. Alcoholic families, for instance. Families with a personality disordered parent would be another example. I could list other examples all day.

Frankly, neither GA not LA fit the incest profile. The incestuous father/brother are usually male-entitled, male chauvinists who "rule the castle." The wife is submissive and often tacitly encourages the abuse, to keep the mate at home.

Those two guys look a tad whipped, to me.

Father/brother sexual abuse of the daughter just isn't common in a matriarchial home. That's where mother-son sexual abuse might happen.

Now, please post link to DNA results for LA & GA. Thanks.

With respect, this family is generating enough problems of its own, without other people imagining additional sexual components.

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on this one. I do see this as the perfect incestuous set up and there is no such thing as a non common type of of incest. I have seen it in all types of dysfunctional homes. A rageful husband is the perfect set up for a young child because of fear and we have seen GA & LA's rage played out many times. People do not fall into rage behaviors out of the blue, it is usually a long time pattern of behavior.

There is no link to the DNA results for LA & GA that I know of anywhere. JG had a full DNA profile of Caylee.

KC is the one making all the allegations of incest.

 

[TURBOTHINK]

Actually it would explain a lot. Besides explaining the power struggle, it could explain why they seemed to treat KC with kid gloves after her arrest. They could be petrified that she would tell about GA and he would also be arrested. It could also explain why KC didn't want to keep Caylee and in some ways could explain why she was killed. She might see GA agreeing with CA as betraying her, after she had had his child. Could be why CA took over Caylee so much, after all she would not only be her grandmother, she would also be her stepmother.

There are a lot of psychologists I work around who believe exactly that.

 

[Brini]

Actually it would explain a lot. Besides explaining the power struggle, it could explain why they seemed to treat KC with kid gloves after her arrest. They could be petrified that she would tell about GA and he would also be arrested. It could also explain why KC didn't want to keep Caylee and in some ways could explain why she was killed. She might see GA agreeing with CA as betraying her, after she had had his child. Could be why CA took over Caylee so much, after all she would not only be her grandmother, she would also be her stepmother.

That doesn't wash, psychologically, in terms of family dynamics. Again, you don't have male on female incest, where the females are dominant.

You haven't seen any psychologist or psychiatrist opine an incest dynamic, in all the "talking head" media. That's why.

They've all opined "sociopath." All of them. And, no, sociopathy is not caused by sexual abuse. Other things are caused by incest-- PTSD, BPD, a few other pathoses.

KC didn't want to keep Caylee because she wants to play. She has NEVER assumed responsibility, of any kind. That's also why Caylee was killed. It's just that simple. Being a sociopath, she isn't able to bond, and other people are only important if they are of use to her.

KC was treated with kid gloves all of her life, NOT just since her arrest. When she stole, the family repaid and covered for her. when she lied, the family agreed to believe her.

CA took over Caylee, because she wanted another "little princess" like KC was.

The incest theory may be "fun," but, with respect, in THIS case, don't try to voice it in an upper-division psych class. It does not mesh.

 

[Bobbisangel]

I don't think the A's have a law suite over the incest accusations. Because at this point everyone realizes that Casey lies. <shrug> It would be right along the lines of the other lies Casey has told LE.

If the DNA says the Dad is a family member, then, well.. that is that.

If they have a civil suit for the accusations then it would have to be Casey that they sue as she is the one that made that story up. I can't imagine how George felt when he heard that lie. I think if it weren't for Cindy George would have been honest from the beginning about everything that he knows.
She seems to rule George and so he goes along with whatever she says. He is one whipped man.

 

[Brini]

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on this one. I do see this as the perfect incestuous set up and there is no such thing as a non common type of of incest. I have seen it in all types of dysfunctional homes. A rageful husband is the perfect set up for a young child because of fear and we have seen GA & LA's rage played out many times. People do not fall into rage behaviors out of the blue, it is usually a long time pattern of behavior.

There is no link to the DNA results for LA & GA that I know of anywhere. JG had a full DNA profile of Caylee.

KC is the one making all the allegations of incest.

You see GA's rages subordinated by CA. She runs the show. He can throw a tantrum, but he defers to the women. Neither CA nor KC have shown any fear of GA. Nor do they show fear of LA. GA is more likely to yell, break something, or hit another male.

The only person whom KC has been shown to fear, in that house, is CA.

Yes, there ARE profiles and commonalities among incest cases. That's why there are textbooks on incest-- to teach psychologists and psych students to know what to look for.

Even KC, the chronic liar, did not allege chronic incest. She stated that LA tried to molest her, once, in middle-school IIRC. She said that GA "abused" her, without specifying, IIRC.

With respect, my guess is that you have little or no training or background in this. It is far from "a perfect set-up for incest."

 

[Carolina Girl]

:waitasec::waitasec::waitasec:
here is the transcript. no mention of "mommy and daddy" type of games at all.
http://itsamysterytome.wordpress.com/2008/12/16/kiomarie-cruz-le-interview-transcript/

there is also a Kiomarie thread here (part 1 and 2) which much more info.

"Mommy and Daddy" things is mentioned in this.

 

[Everly]

The incest speculation never completely goes away, does it? I still have no concrete feeling on the viability of that theory, but I have to keep it open as a possibility.

As far as the perceived Anthony family dynamic not being fertile for incest, there are always exceptions. It is also possible that Casey was the instigator for any incestuous episodes. While that would not in the least excuse Lee or George of guilt, it would explain how it could happen in a female dominated household.

I am still not at all sold on the incest angle. But if it were true, I wonder if George would be throwing incest into the "full immunity".

 

[SuziQ]

The 'not want to lose another one' was old news, said by Cindy on video in reference to reporters, etc. following them. Reference to George

It was in reference to Lee when he tried to outrun the media following him from a jail visit.

 

[Brini]

The incest speculation never completely goes away, does it? I still have no concrete feeling on the viability of that theory, but I have to keep it open as a possibility.

As far as the perceived Anthony family dynamic not being fertile for incest, there are always exceptions. It is also possible that Casey was the instigator for any incestuous episodes. While that would not in the least excuse Lee or George of guilt, it would explain how it could happen in a female dominated household.

I am still not at all sold on the incest angle. But if it were true, I wonder if George would be throwing incest into the "full immunity".

Yeah, it could be plausible, in that household dynamic, if KC initiated.

I doubt that it happened, but I wouldn't put anything past her.

KC is nobody's sexual victim. Or, rather, she's nobody's victim, period. She is a preditor.

 

[Thinaire]

You see GA's rages subordinated by CA. She runs the show. He can throw a tantrum, but he defers to the women. Neither CA nor KC have shown any fear of GA. Nor do they show fear of LA. GA is more likely to yell, break something, or hit another male.

The only person whom KC has been shown to fear, in that house, is CA.

Yes, there ARE profiles and commonalities among incest cases. That's why there are textbooks on incest-- to teach psychologists and psych students to know what to look for.

Even KC, the chronic liar, did not allege chronic incest. She stated that LA tried to molest her, once, in middle-school IIRC. She said that GA "abused" her, without specifying, IIRC.

With respect, my guess is that you have little or no training or background in this. It is far from "a perfect set-up for incest."

Brini, thanks for sharing all of this..fascinating stuff...

George had mentioned once (interviews with LE?) that he possibly regretting trying to be a disciplinarian? I am sorry...have NO idea where to look right now...but wanted to jump in...

I think perhaps George is referring to losing his temper with Casey...and that its very possible that Casey WOULD see that as "abuse." As in corporal punishment perhaps?

 

[Brini]

Brini, thanks for sharing all of this..fascinating stuff...

George had mentioned once (interviews with LE?) that he possibly regretting trying to be a disciplinarian? I am sorry...have NO idea where to look right now...but wanted to jump in...

I think perhaps George is referring to losing his temper with Casey...and that its very possible that Casey WOULD see that as "abuse." As in corporal punishment perhaps?

Hard to say. Looks like KC, like most socios, feels "entitled." She might see something as minor as valid or constructive criticism or disagreement of opinion as "abuse." Or, that fact that her parents WON'T give her more money, or the house, as she wishes. Or, even her parents demands that she work and raise a child responsibly.

I suspect that she sees their request that she move out as "abuse."

Remember how, in those early phone calls, she seemed to blame CA for her incarceration? She said, "It's not my fault." I think she DOES think it's not her fault.

I think it's likely that GA yelled at her. But, it looks like she yelled right back. She might not really respect GA, but does not appear to fear him.

Suspect that any corporal punishment might have come from CA, not GA. She admits she fears CA. That's prolly one of the few truths that she ever told.

 

[FloridaKatz]

I was just watching the TruTV show that has Ashley Banfield on it. She had an adjunct law professor from the University of Miami on there, and he used to be a prosecutor and is now a practicing defense attorney in the Miami area.

This lawyer said he had the opportunity to view the motion to remove the DP, that was made by the DP qualified lawyer from Miami, and said that UNLESS the prosecution can PROVE the manner of death in this case, it will be wise for them NOT to put the DP back on the table.

Proven manner of death in concert with COD is the kicker for getting a jury to agree to convict when the DP is present. If you can't prove the manner of death, a jury would be less likely to convict on a Murder 1 charge where the DP is the available punishment. Murder where punishment is LWOP, yes. Murder where punishment id DP, not likely. (per this Miami law professor/ex prosecutor/defense attorney).

 

[IWannaKnow]

With respect, my guess is that you have little or no training or background in this. It is far from "a perfect set-up for incest."

Brini - Just out of curiosity - what is your training and background?

 

[Tom'sGirl]

O.M.G. I am such a dork!!! I've been talking to someone here about someone going through crap and the damn name (their last name) stuck with me!!!!

My apologies to *everyone*!!!!

(Lowering my head in shame)

It happens, no apology needed. I think all has been corrected now

 

[FloridaKatz]

Please forgive my ignorance, I have never heard of Tru Tv (court tv) prior to joining WS, is this a paid subscription and is it on the web or on cable? Thank you so much for your help. I've heard it mentioned quite a bit and it sounds very interesting?

Mine is on the regular tv, and it comes through regular cable. If your cable service subscribes to it as part of their normal cable line up, then you should get it if you have cable.

One way to find out is to check the Yahoo television listings for your local area, based on who your cable provider is.

http://tv.yahoo.com/listings_setup

 

[Patty G]

Brad Conway on InSession - December 17, 2008

Part 1 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AaK9KNSHsEY
Part 2 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9Asjz10KWU

 

[PassTheMotrin]

Brad Conway on InSession

Part 1 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AaK9KNSHsEY
Part 2 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9Asjz10KWU

Thank you, Patty! I just watched it and everytime I hear your little furbaby bark, it makes me laugh.

 

[Brini]

Brini - Just out of curiosity - what is your training and background?

BA- Psych, MA- Counseling Psychology. Over 20 years in medical-surgical and psychiatric case management. Psych nurse.

 

[IWannaKnow]

BA- Psych, MA- Counseling Psychology. Over 20 years in medical-surgical and psychiatric case management. Psych nurse.

Thanks

 

[JADEPRINCESS]

Wasn't Lee recently DNA tested? I thought they got a court order for DNA from him.

True, Lee refused testing for DNA & fingerprinting but was recently supenoed, that's very telling, isn't it?