TURKEY - George Smith, 26, missing from cruise ship, July 2005

[Scout]

The balcony railing is tall. He would have had to climb up on it or on a piece of the balcony furniture in order to fall over. The canopy is metal. It's actually meant to conceal the lifeboats so they're not visible from above.

ETA: If George had gone out on the balcony alone and accidently fallen overboard, I don't think the balcony doors would have been closed and the curtains drawn. That tells me that someone else had a hand in him going over that railing. George was a big guy. I suspect it might have taken two guys to get him over it.

 

[joanofarc]

From the amount of blood on the canopy, I believe that George was severely injured/cut before "being pushed" over the railing.

What is weird is that it looks like there is one area on the blood stain on the deck that is more prominent...like something hit (i.e. his head) in this one area or remained on the deck long enough to produce a darker, more pooled blood stain in a circular pattern (perhaps the darker stain is from an area that was already bleeding before he hit the deck).....could the body have lain on the deck for a while and then eventually slide into the water?

 

[fundiva]

The balcony railing is tall. He would have had to climb up on it or on a piece of the balcony furniture in order to fall over. The canopy is metal. It's actually meant to conceal the lifeboats so they're not visible from above.

ETA: If George had gone out on the balcony alone and accidently fallen overboard, I don't think the balcony doors would have been closed and the curtains drawn. That tells me that someone else had a hand in him going over that railing. George was a big guy. I suspect it might have taken two guys to get him over it.

You are right - the door and curtains are a key element. If George was as drunk as they stated he would not have closed the door and the curtains when he "stumbled" out onto the deck and "accidently" fell over.

 

[PaperDoll]

I'm thinking the guy who stayed behind to use the bathroom had something to do with this.. I think he is the one who got in a fight with George and since George was so drunk, couldn't really fight for himself.. Then again, if George is this big guy that everyone thinks, how can just one guy toss him over, I would think someone who's drunk would be a bit more "dead weight"? Looked like too much blood on the canopy for him to just land on.. something else caused all that blood, but what? :waitasec: This is a puzzling case..

 

[BrendaStar]

Looked like too much blood on the canopy for him to just land on.. something else caused all that blood, but what? This is a puzzling case..

Looks to me like George was stabbed and thrown overboard. The pooling blood looks like it is from a slowly seeping stab wound. What's puzzling to me is that when they brought the drunk wife back to the room she wasn't alarmed that her husband wasn't there because she was used to him spending nights in another couple's room. The weirdest honeymoon I ever heard of.

 

[joanofarc]

Looks to me like George was stabbed and thrown overboard. The pooling blood looks like it is from a slowly seeping stab wound. What's puzzling to me is that when they brought the drunk wife back to the room she wasn't alarmed that her husband wasn't there because she was used to him spending nights in another couple's room. The weirdest honeymoon I ever heard of.

No kidding!

Sorry, I am behind in this case as I didn't follow too closely so not sure if this has been stated before but did Jennifer drink some of the absynth that night?

For the life of me, I can't imagine getting so drunk that I would kick my newlywed husband in the jewels....what would make her that mad that she would do that or was she experincing the effects of consuming the illegal alcohol?

Also, what gets me is her "barbie doll" plastic attitude....like this happened to me......"whatever"....on with my life.....:waitasec:

 

[PaperDoll]

Can someone refresh me on this so I don't have to go back and read the article.. :blowkiss: ... Does anyone know the timeframe in which the guy who used the restroom met back up with his friends? Or did he meet up with them at all? I was just wondering after the Thud of George hitting the canopy if anyone heard someone leaving the cabin right after...

 

[Scout]

Can someone refresh me on this so I don't have to go back and read the article.. :blowkiss: ... Does anyone know the timeframe in which the guy who used the restroom met back up with his friends? Or did he meet up with them at all? I was just wondering after the Thud of George hitting the canopy if anyone heard someone leaving the cabin right after...

According to Josh, he used the restroom while the other guys were putting George to bed. They all went back to the room of one (or more) of the Russian guys after that and ordered room service. Josh supposedly ate with them before returning to his room.

ETA: I'll have to get back to you on whether someone was heard leaving the cabin after the thud.

 

[Tristan]

George was 6'4....very tall.

I went on a date with this guy once, who was 6'4, and he got REALLY
drunk that night. At one point, he got up to use the restroom, and he
literally fell on his face at the club we were at. Security escorted him off
the premises, as he couldn't walk on his own. Needless to say, that was
our LAST date. LOL

The reason I'm mentioning this, is because even a big man of 6'4, when
intoxicated or drugged, can EASILY be pushed around, shoved etc.

I strongly feel that foul play was the cause of George's death.
The closed door and curtains, the hard partying circumstances, and
let's not forget, the Russian men were accused of making a video where
they GANG RAPED a woman on this same cruise!!

Hello!! These are not "Choir boys"!!

 

[Scout]

I didn't mean to imply that he couldn't be easily pushed around. IIRC, the balcony railing was about 4 feet tall. I don't think Jennifer could get him over that railing, and it would be a lot of work for one of the guys to do it (but probably possible). Clete Hyman saw 3 of the guys walking down the corridor away from the Smith's cabin before the "horrific thud" so that would leave one guy behind in the cabin with George.

 

[mfmangel1]

Statements indicate Jennifer left the disco at approx. 3:30a.m.

She was found, passed out on the ninth floor of cabins at approx. 4:30a.m.

After leaving George, the group of guys returned to one of their cabins and ordered room service.

Does anyone know what time Josh left his buddies and returned to his cabin?

His cabin was approx. five doors away from where Jennifer was found. If he had returned before 4:30a.m., he would have had to have seen her.

 

[PaperDoll]

According to Josh, he used the restroom while the other guys were putting George to bed. They all went back to the room of one (or more) of the Russian guys after that and ordered room service. Josh supposedly ate with them before returning to his room.

ETA: I'll have to get back to you on whether someone was heard leaving the cabin after the thud.

Thanks Scout for the info :blowkiss: ...

 

[tweedledee]

George was 6'4....very tall.

I went on a date with this guy once, who was 6'4, and he got REALLY
drunk that night. At one point, he got up to use the restroom, and he
literally fell on his face at the club we were at. Security escorted him off
the premises, as he couldn't walk on his own. Needless to say, that was
our LAST date. LOL

The reason I'm mentioning this, is because even a big man of 6'4, when
intoxicated or drugged, can EASILY be pushed around, shoved etc.

I strongly feel that foul play was the cause of George's death.
The closed door and curtains, the hard partying circumstances, and
let's not forget, the Russian men were accused of making a video where
they GANG RAPED a woman on this same cruise!!

Hello!! These are not "Choir boys"!!

true they are not choir boys, but I thought that after seeing the tape, authorities said the sex was consensual.

 

[PaperDoll]

true they are not choir boys, but I thought that after seeing the tape, authorities said the sex was consensual.

Yes I remember them saying that.. What I'm wondering is what girl in her right mind would allow herself to be video taped with strange guys? I wonder if she was drugged? I wonder if they interviewed her as well.. :waitasec:

 

[Usher737]

I feel there are only 2 possibilities in this case: accident or murder. The evidence can point to the correct conclusion. However, we do not have all of the facts.

I would love to know whose blood that is on the towel and in the bed. If it belongs to Josh or one of the Russian-Americans then that leads me to believe a fight broke out and George was accidentially killed. When males are that intoxicated fights can easily occur over the smallest things. Perhaps one of them made an inappropriate comment about Jennifer not being in the room and off with another man. The easiest way to dispose of the body is to throw him overboard. Clean up the room a little, shut the curtains, and get lucky when the cruise line mishandled the entire investigation.

I would like to know if Jennifer was asked about the curtains and what her answer was. Did she close them or were they closed when she awakened?

The amount of blood on the canopy makes me think George was injured before he went overboard. Did he stumble on his own, bump his head, and fall ? If this is true, I cant imagine him stopping to close the curtains. IMO the blood and curtains are the most important clues.

I do not think Jennifer was involved. She did what most drunks do - pass out. Only those 4 males know what really happened in that room.

 

[Iwillgo]

What happened here is obvious. When left alone is his room, George became very angry, suspecting his new wife was in another man's room. Remember, earlier she had kicked him in the groin. He pounded his fist on the walls and caused a minor injury, causing the small amount of blood in the room. Then sat on the railing to cool off and fell over backward in his intoxicated state. A trajedy to be sure. But, I wish the Smith family would stop calling it murder. It was the honeymooners own fault! Their behavior was outrageous. I do have some sympathy for Jennifer because she no doubt was angry with her husband for spending their honeymoon carousing with these young men.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

What happened here is obvious. When left alone is his room, George became very angry, suspecting his new wife was in another man's room. Remember, earlier she had kicked him in the groin. He pounded his fist on the walls and caused a minor injury, causing the small amount of blood in the room. Then sat on the railing to cool off and fell over backward in his intoxicated state. A trajedy to be sure. But, I wish the Smith family would stop calling it murder. It was the honeymooners own fault! Their behavior was outrageous. I do have some sympathy for Jennifer because she no doubt was angry with her husband for spending their honeymoon carousing with these young men.

BWHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA You crack me up.

 

[cazador]

I feel there are only 2 possibilities in this case: accident or murder. The evidence can point to the correct conclusion. However, we do not have all of the facts.

I would love to know whose blood that is on the towel and in the bed. If it belongs to Josh or one of the Russian-Americans then that leads me to believe a fight broke out and George was accidentially killed. When males are that intoxicated fights can easily occur over the smallest things. Perhaps one of them made an inappropriate comment about Jennifer not being in the room and off with another man. The easiest way to dispose of the body is to throw him overboard. Clean up the room a little, shut the curtains, and get lucky when the cruise line mishandled the entire investigation.

I would like to know if Jennifer was asked about the curtains and what her answer was. Did she close them or were they closed when she awakened?

The amount of blood on the canopy makes me think George was injured before he went overboard. Did he stumble on his own, bump his head, and fall ? If this is true, I cant imagine him stopping to close the curtains. IMO the blood and curtains are the most important clues.

I do not think Jennifer was involved. She did what most drunks do - pass out. Only those 4 males know what really happened in that room.

In the Oprah lnterview..
A woman passenger spoke up and said she was talking with Jennifer at 2:30 a.m. and she was fine..coherent..
Jennifer was out of her mind at 3 a.m...
I believe she was drugged..
How she ended up in a hall is another story..
The fact that Jennifer has no memory also shows the after effects of such a drug...

jmho

 

[Morag]

This is a repeat of a program from January. It will be interesting to see how it sounds in lieu of things we have learned since it originally aired.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

In the Oprah lnterview..
A woman passenger spoke up and said she was talking with Jennifer at 2:30 a.m. and she was fine..coherent..
Jennifer was out of her mind at 3 a.m...
I believe she was drugged..
How she ended up in a hall is another story..
The fact that Jennifer has no memory also shows the after effects of such a drug...

jmho

Couldn't large amounts of alcohol have the same effect? I'm not knocking your opinion, and its possible, but wouldn't that mean that this was all premeditated? Do you think its possible that whomever did this planned it for a day or two?