Turkey - Jacky Sutton, 50, British journalist, dies in airport restroom, 17 Oct 2015

  • #101
In the beginning of video we see she peacefully entered the room with her belongings, probably asked something, when multiple security officers just grabbed her and pushed her down and started to drag her.

Watch the beginning again. It is hard to see what happens while she is in the doorway but then she is going after the man and pushing/attacking him as he moves back behind his desk. She is obviously the aggressor and he is trying to get away from her.

That's when the other men rush in the room. Looks like she continues threatening the men after she is out of the room as well. I don't have any sympathy for her, if you go to non-western countries and act like that really bad things can and do happen.
 
  • #102
Not for a crazy person. Plus one would think four attackers (or the officials) would take the extra knives with them if they were trying to stage a suicide.

Not sure why you keep insisting that case (which isn't well publicized and thus might be the first time you read about it) was definitely a case of depression and hence suicide? If you read the other articles I listed, it specifically mentioned autopsy showed he had defensive cut wounds also. So, like this case, that case is definitely under the category of "suspicious" when it is labelled "suicide".
 
  • #103
Latest turkish report supporting 'suicide theory'. Also autopsy completed, official manner of death is suicide (per same source)



http://national.bgnnews.com/late-br...-not-to-board-flight-voluntarily-haberi/10477



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What the coroner (a bureaucrat in most places) states as the official cause of death? In a foreign country with surely great medical practices and transparency like Turkey no less? Sure. Lets take their word for it.

I doubt we will find out more about what happened in this case. If the family is accepting the official theory, perhaps also after getting a phone call, then just let it be.

Personally I think it is suspicious because I don't think a successful career person in her position (based upon a psychological profile), even if they were depressed, would have done this in such a conspicuous public place all on a whim like that. They would tend to choose a more discrete location, somewhere more private like a hotel or at home or out in nature, to do it (they tend to want to retain some dignity and self-respect, hence the desire for somewhere private and not public). Anyway, I'm sure if there is something going on and she is in a certain line of business, then the right kind of investigation will be happening behind the scenes - just that nobody will be reporting about it to the news anymore and they will get to the bottom of it.
 
  • #104
Not sure why you keep insisting that case (which isn't well publicized and thus might be the first time you read about it) was definitely a case of depression and hence suicide? If you read the other articles I listed, it specifically mentioned autopsy showed he had defensive cut wounds also. So, like this case, that case is definitely under the category of "suspicious" when it is labelled "suicide".

I didn't say depression, I said it sounded like paranoid schizophrenia. He claimed EVERYONE in the airport, even the taxi drivers were in on the plot to kill him! That is NOT rational!

Does anyone actually believe that the authorities sent out a message to every taxi driver and counter girl (and maybe even travelers) at the airport telling them about the plot? And that they were all in on it??? The guy sounds completely nuts, maybe he killed himself, maybe he tried to attack someone else and it ended badly.
 
  • #105
  • #106
What the coroner (a bureaucrat in most places) states as the official cause of death? In a foreign country with surely great medical practices and transparency like Turkey no less? Sure. Lets take their word for it.

I doubt we will find out more about what happened in this case. If the family is accepting the official theory, perhaps also after getting a phone call, then just let it be.

Personally I think it is suspicious because I don't think a successful career person in her position (based upon a psychological profile), even if they were depressed, would have done this in such a conspicuous public place all on a whim like that. They would tend to choose a more discrete location, somewhere more private like a hotel or at home or out in nature, to do it (they tend to want to retain some dignity and self-respect, hence the desire for somewhere private and not public). Anyway, I'm sure if there is something going on and she is in a certain line of business, then the right kind of investigation will be happening behind the scenes - just that nobody will be reporting about it to the news anymore and they will get to the bottom of it.

When it comes to official account, you are so right, there is a sense of humiliation in it.

But to know there will be no justice, its like a final blow delivered to a brave and very selfless woman.


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  • #107
While it was initially reported that the airport didn't have all the surveillance video, it appears they must have had her entering the bathroom alone, no one leaving, and no one entering until the Russians.

https://iwpr.net/global-voices/statement-death-jacqueline-sutton

•Comprehensive CCTV footage with no apparent time gaps, still photographs, witness statements, a viewing of the body by her sister, and a site visit by IWPR and the family all indicate that Jacky was alone and that there was no sign of struggle.
 
  • #108
  • #109
There is another meaning of the word satisfied, it is being used in that context:



It is horrible to imply her family would take a bribe.
I know I just woudnt use that in that context. Maybe its just a matter of taste.
Its also horrible to imply she would take her own life, she was very vibrant & full of life, plans.


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  • #110
There is another meaning of the word satisfied, it is being used in that context:



It is horrible to imply her family would take a bribe.
I think people tend to argue and debate about semantics alot here, whether from a source or sometimes between what members say here. It could just be 'content' with the description given by authorities? Or maybe the family doesn't care about the case anymore because what is done is done and they want the media coverage to tone down? Who knows.
 
  • #111
When it comes to official account, you are so right, there is a sense of humiliation in it.

But to know there will be no justice, its like a final blow delivered to a brave and very selfless woman.


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Yeah. I just don't really see someone in her position will choose such a public location to take their own life, even with a mental breakdown. It has high exposure, there is humiliation and the act lacks dignity. I think a career person with self respect who is extremely depressed will probably opt to suicide in a private setting. So this doesn't fit the profile.

Maybe there won't be 'no justice'. Maybe the matter gets dealt with and investigated behind the scenes. We will never know I suppose. I honestly doubt this case will get anymore major news developments going forward. It probably ends here as another mystery on the outside.
 
  • #112
Thought may be she left a note,,where she explained her actions, thats why family so sure, recognized her handwriting?
But no such note was left behind, as far as we know.


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  • #113
  • #114
Since mods have said nothing, that we cant speculate, I go full steam ahead.

From article above we know she ordered beer, may be they slipped something into it, like eye drops. Some people pass out as a result , some start vomiting and or get diarrhea.
Id assume criminals are watching people at airports, to find someone vulnerable, woman or drunk or someone traveling alone.
Its possible those gangs have airport staff who cooperate.
They assumed she had no money because they couldnt find anything. In her vallet may be 20 bucks. However later they found 2000 dollars, may be sewed inside her clothers. Many travelers do that in dangerous places.
Maybe it was a robbery gone wrong?


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  • #115
The videos look highly edited in both the Mrs Browns case and this woman's case.

For example how come we don't have the video of her going into the bathroom?
You know.... the main one that is needed. Instead they release snippets of her in different places of the airport like that is going to help convince us she did everything on her own.
It was reported the bathroom was near Passport Control. We will never see that video because it was not a bathroom normally used by public IMO.

Sorry but I don't buy it at all. I think the only reason the family AND her company put out that joint statement was for the safety of other employees of her company and to calm the international outrage that was just starting up. They squashed it with their response.

But they also indicated they were going to do their own independent investigation if they can.

The problem is there will not be much to investigate because I am guessing they will not be able to obtain all the CCTV footage that is really available and may have already been deleted.
 
  • #116
The videos look highly edited in both the Mrs Browns case and this woman's case. For example how come we don't have the video of her going into the bathroom? You know the main one that is needed. Instead they release snippets of her in different places of the airport like that is going to help convince us she did everything on her own. Sorry but I don't buy it at all. I think the only reason the family AND her company put out that joint statement was for the safety of other employees of her company and to calm the international outrage that was just starting up. They squashed it with their response. But they also indicated they were going to do their own independent investigation if they can. The problem is there will not be much to investigate because I am guessing they will not be able to obtain all the CCTV footage that is really available and may have already been deleted.
These sorts of reports are often BS. Because clearly a proper investigation involves maybe at least analysis of 24 hours worth of recording from all camera perspectives available. Someone could have gotten in to the toilet before hand, did the deed, then hid there, and it won't show on a short "continuous" tape recording. Wasn't there also a report that magically the security camera didn't work where it should have filmed her go into the toilet? I'm not sure if that news report is cleared or not. But if it is true, its as if that's not a red flag.
 
  • #117
These sorts of reports are often BS. Because clearly a proper investigation involves maybe at least analysis of 24 hours worth of recording from all camera perspectives available. Someone could have gotten in to the toilet before hand, did the deed, then hid there, and it won't show on a short "continuous" tape recording. Wasn't there also a report that magically the security camera didn't work where it should have filmed her go into the toilet? I'm not sure if that news report is cleared or not. But if it is true, its as if that's not a red flag.

I had not read about a certain camera not working but it would not surprise me if that is what they end up telling us about the needed footage of her going into the bathroom.

You are right that more than just the entry is sometimes needed in cases like this.

The thing that really bugs me is the whole "Passport Control". The one article said it was a bathroom near passport control. So that means she was most likely told to go there. Which I think is the same office where Mrs Brown lost her life.

Ms. Sutton had no need to go to Passport Control unless they ordered her there. We all know any ticket counter can deal with plane tickets. So someone ordered her there.

I do wonder if there is a racket to make money and if people start objecting too much then they are dealt with in the same fashion as Mrs. Brown. Mrs Brown may have just gotten very upset with being forced to buy a new ticket when she knew perfectly well she had a valid ticket to begin with.

I tried to search for other incidents and it must not be happening too much because I only found the ones we already talked about. It does make you wonder if it has happened more and just wasn't reported because people bought a new ticket and let it be.
 
  • #118
I had not read about a certain camera not working but it would not surprise me if that is what they end up telling us about the needed footage of her going into the bathroom.

You are right that more than just the entry is sometimes needed in cases like this.

The thing that really bugs me is the whole "Passport Control". The one article said it was a bathroom near passport control. So that means she was most likely told to go there. Which I think is the same office where Mrs Brown lost her life.

Ms. Sutton had no need to go to Passport Control unless they ordered her there. We all know any ticket counter can deal with plane tickets. So someone ordered her there.

I do wonder if there is a racket to make money and if people start objecting too much then they are dealt with in the same fashion as Mrs. Brown. Mrs Brown may have just gotten very upset with being forced to buy a new ticket when she knew perfectly well she had a valid ticket to begin with.

I tried to search for other incidents and it must not be happening too much because I only found the ones we already talked about. It does make you wonder if it has happened more and just wasn't reported because people bought a new ticket and let it be.
Regarding the camera that didn't work, I read it from one of the earlier reports by the daily mail, which of course has a reputation.

Regarding how common this happens to travelers there, not sure, but there is that other case of a traveler who died in custody.
 
  • #119
I was in and out of Ataturk Airport several times last summer. The International Terminal is laid out so that all of the shops, lounges and ticket agents are in the main, unsecured area and the secured boarding areas, which there are several, are pretty much just a lot of chairs for those awaiting departure. In order to enter this area, you would have to show a boarding pass for a flight departing from that boarding area and you would be subject to full security inspection.

Because there is more to do in the main terminal, most experienced travelers stay in the main terminal until departure time. Generally this would mean 1/2 hour before departure plus ample time to go through the security line. Apparently Jackie passed through this line one hour before departure. This is pretty normal; probably how I did it.

Once you are in the secure boarding area, there is little that can go wrong. There are few distractions and lots of people waiting for the same flight as you. All you have to do us wait for your boarding instructions to be announced.

If the boarding area for your flight is crowded, you might have to sit in a different area where it would be harder to know what is happening with your flight. If you are not paying attention you might miss something important. Falling asleep is an obvious problem. If you are in the boarding area of your flight, there would be a flurry of activity as boarding proceeds and someone would probably wake you up. If you were in a different area, you could easily miss it.

If you did miss your flight, you would need to go back to the main terminal to make necessary arrangements. There would be no reason to stay in the secure area. I assume that is what Jackie did although it is not clear that she was in the main terminal when her body was going.

It is all a bit fuzzy what happened at that time. She did not purchase a ticket on a later flight; which would have been the following day. Apparently she went to the ticket agent and expressed displeasure at having to pay for another flight. We do it know what happened after that except that 3 hours later, she was found hanging in the loo.

It's impossible to tell what happened except it would be extremely unlikely that this was any kind of planned assassination since there would have been no expectation that she would have missed her flight. There may have been some kind of altercation with security if she were making a "scene" at the ticket counter. If they got too rough with her, it is possible that they tried to cover it up with a staged suicide. You would expect there to be obvious injuries on her body at the time of the autopsy.

While the Turkish authorities might be complacent in a "coverup", the body has been transported to the UK where, presumably, some sort of a follow up has or will be done. The fact that the family is "satisfied" may mean that the issue is settled but more may still come up.

It seems that situations like this demand a healthy skepticism but we need to avoid jumping to conclusions until all facts are in.
 
  • #120

I realize we cannot tell for sure what happened to Mrs Sutton until there is more evidence but this person's December 6, 2014 incident sounds an awful lot like what could have happened.

This was shared before already but its worth reading through that December incident again. It sounds like both Mrs Brown and Mrs Sutton could have experienced similar issues with their tickets that was no fault of their own.
 

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