GUILTY Turkey - Sarai Sierra, 33, NY woman murdered, Istanbul, 21 Jan 2013 - #3

[CMac2]

THANK YOU for posting more of that photo! I had not seen the part below with the details you note. Thank you also for your input.

I continue to be wrapped up in the beauty and mystery of that picture, in what happened to SS, and how haunting both of those events are.

I just love that picture of her. It seems to tell a story on its own. It's a reminder that SS had many layers to her. She can't be put in any one single box. She's probably everything we've speculated on this thread and a million other things too. Love it.

 

[yannis]

I just love that picture of her. It seems to tell a story on its own. It's a reminder that SS had many layers to her. She can't be put in any one single box. She's probably everything we've speculated on this thread and a million other things too. Love it.

totally agree with you , Sarai seemed a very special person , i'm on instagram for almost 2 years now and unfortunately i never came accross her feed when she was alive maybe instagram made be so interested about this case ... one of us is gone

 

[Yashim]

Thanks, KuriousKev.

Such a beautiful photo.

And such a wistful gaze. Never saw a picture that better suits that word.




I never saw a man who looked
With such a wistful eye
Upon that little tent of blue
Which prisoners call the sky,
And at every wandering cloud that trailed
Its raveled fleeces by.

 

[ToutCa]

On the smuggling theory:

--Do any of you guys know what kind of bag she was carrying on the last day, the 21st? Was it something big enough to contain suspect items for exchange?

--Are there known prior cases of couriers being assaulted or killed for backing out of an arrangement?

--Anyone have any knowledge of how the Istanbul underworld operates when it comes to smuggling couriers? Would they have picked SS, how would they have contacted her, would they meet her at the city walls, etc.?

On the rape "known dark spot" at the city walls:

-- Anyone find any info on the 3 prior rapes and rape attempts there?
I spent some time poking around and found nothing at all. I did read a lot of horror stories though, about rapes and other crimes in Istanbul and elsewhere...

 

[KuriousKev]

Just my feelings. SS was a basic woman, a mom, nothing that really stood out from the crowd but she was in a crummy boring relationship so she said *uck it and decided to do something extreme by taking this trip, explore, meetup with some of the guys she befriended online with a mentality of whatever happens happen! Still trying to fit in the mule portion...it's a tough one.

 

[CMac2]

On the smuggling theory:

--Do any of you guys know what kind of bag she was carrying on the last day, the 21st? Was it something big enough to contain suspect items for exchange?

From the Doom's Day article in the NY Daily News:

Sierra, an amateur photographer who took pictures with her Samsung Galaxy phone and iPad 3, was carrying her electronics and wallet in a bag slung around her shoulder. She left behind her passport and a second wallet.

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/wor...-slain-turkey-article-1.1259870#ixzz2KWlmlyHC

ETA: Back "slung around her shoulder" says to me it was either a backpack of some sort or one of those shoulder-crossing purses that women tend to covet. We like those purses because it keeps the purse hugged to our bodies, with the strap crossing down from one shoulder, securing the bag to our hip on the other side of our bodies. Makes it difficult for a mugger to grab our purse and run.

 

[Meri]

I agree with Lavy. This translates as:

"It was on January 14th Saturday that I last heard from her."

So, it could also mean his kids might have said "Dad, mom says hi".

Yet, I tend to think he directly spoke with her, but that's my take.

But, January 14 was not a Saturday - it was a Monday.

 

[Yashim]

On the smuggling theory:

--Do any of you guys know what kind of bag she was carrying on the last day, the 21st? Was it something big enough to contain suspect items for exchange?

--Are there known prior cases of couriers being assaulted or killed for backing out of an arrangement?

--Anyone have any knowledge of how the Istanbul underworld operates when it comes to smuggling couriers? Would they have picked SS, how would they have contacted her, would they meet her at the city walls, etc.?

On the rape "known dark spot" at the city walls:

-- Anyone find any info on the 3 prior rapes and rape attempts there?
I spent some time poking around and found nothing at all. I did read a lot of horror stories though, about rapes and other crimes in Istanbul and elsewhere...

I looked for the other cases too, but couldn't find anything. Will look again.

Rape attacks towards tourists are very rare in Istanbul, I think. Because tourists are usually extra precautions in big cities like Istanbul. Female tourists never get drunk at least when alone. But it is more of a concern in southern resorts, where tourists that to drink more and become easy targets. Given the special place of tourism in Turkish economy, laws, social sanctions against rape offenders, it should be zero, but it unfortunately is not.

 

[english]

Just my feelings. SS was a basic woman, a mom, nothing that really stood out from the crowd but she was in a crummy boring relationship so she said *uck it and decided to do something extreme by taking this trip, explore, meetup with some of the guys she befriended online with a mentality of whatever happens happen! Still trying to fit in the mule portion...it's a tough one.

I'm with you on those feelings KuriousKev. I've encountered several women in Istanbul in that exact same position. The only difference is they have gone home alive and I can't work out the one extra ingredient that SS had in her adventure that stopped her from going home alive.

 

[vtmeme]

I don't know this has been said. Could her brother and husband be involved? Did they know why she went? I think it was mentioned that her brother had a friend there. A professor, if I remember right.

 

[Yellow]

For those familiar with/native to Turkey:

What is the predominant method of transportation in Istanbul? Is it similar to some of the other European cities where people generally walk or ride their bikes everywhere? Is it more like New York City, where public transit is the most popular way to get from one place to another?

I'm wondering if it's possible TK and SS had planned to go see the sights someplace else that morning. Maybe because of logistics, TK tells SS to meet him at the bridge, because even though that's not their ultimate destination, it's central to where they're going to be headed, and he already knows she understands how to get there. Is it possible he was planning to pick her up at that location by car and take her wherever it is they'd decided to spend the afternoon?

SS may not have wanted TK to pick her up at her apartment because of her nosy landlord, who made her uncomfortable.

That would be an innocent explanation for why she was seen at a place she'd already visited, on her next to last day in Turkey.

The daily news article said they were going to blue mosque and Hagia Sofia that day.. Plans might have been flexible.

 

[Meri]

MY own musings, nothing factual here folks, just random thoughts in my head....

1. Someone earlier referred to SS as an "urban savvy tourist".
How could she be that already when according to what we have been told, this was her first trip abroad? ALL of her trip details that have been shared so far DO point to an urban savvy tourist - traveling alone, staying by herself in a basement apartment in a gritty neighborhood, arranging a side-trip to Amsterdam during the visit, striding confidently through the streets of Istanbul. NOTHING about her actions as they have been described show the usual tentativeness and uncertainty that I would expect of a neophyte solo-traveler, even one with a strong personality. Did she have a translation app on one of her devices? The language barrier alone adds an air of vulnerability that from what I can tell, she outwardly displayed not a trace of hesitiancy. I read about the "New York face", and I DO understand that, but she was not in NY. It seems to me too soon for her to have adopted an "Instanbul face" if this was her very first time in ANY foreign city.

2. I wonder if any of the 20 cameras show her stopping and checking her devices for texts or messages? Wasn't she waiting to hear from T about their planned meet-up? I would expect the cameras she was seen on would have seen her checking and rechecking a device to see if he was coming. Do the cameras show when she realizes/learns he is not?

3. The most-often used picture of SS is beautiful -the one of her in a leather jacket with a cap covering her hair and her eyes cast upward. When I first saw it the day her disappearance hit the news, I assumed she was someone who had made a name for herself as an author since it looked like a professional shot for a book cover. The details of her life as they were revealed seem much more humble, yet just as meaningful as a wife, mother, wage-earner and student. I find myself wondering in what context that picture was taken and by whom, because it IS so much more striking that typical photos a family might have around to use for publicizing a disappearance. It probably has no bearing on the circumstances of her tragic death, and I am just wondering as I fill in the picture in my own mind.

4. Re: the hit man from US theory - anything is possible, and I would think it more possible to be a Turkish hit-man hired by someone from the US. Who in her US life even has any connections in Turkey, and would that person want to harm her????

These are all questions and speculations and not FACTS.
Thanks for indulging me as I try to make sense of this tragedy.

I don't have a link but the very first articles said that her brother took that photo.

 

[KuriousKev]

I don't know this has been said. Could her brother and husband be involved? Did they know why she went? I think it was mentioned that her brother had a friend there. A professor, if I remember right.

I did suggest this up thread. I do feel that if it does come to light there was something criminal, SS's brother may possibly be involved in some way. I feel SS wouldn't have planned it or been involved alone.

 

[ToutCa]

I looked for the other cases too, but couldn't find anything. Will look again.

Rape attacks towards tourists are very rare in Istanbul, I think. Because tourists are usually extra precautions in big cities like Istanbul. Female tourists never get drunk at least when alone. But it is more of a concern in southern resorts, where tourists that to drink more and become easy targets. Given the special place of tourism in Turkish economy, laws, social sanctions against rape offenders, it should be zero, but it unfortunately is not.

Please do look, because it would be interesting to know if people were arrested and who. For example, if it was 3 druggies, your theory's looking pretty good, Yashim.

I should qualify my post that the horror stories of rapes and crimes that came up were not Turkey-specific, some were in Istanbul, some were in various tourist spots the world over. Violent crime can happen anywhere.

 

[Yashim]

But, January 14 was not a Saturday - it was a Monday.

But that's exactly what it says in the below links.

http://www.hurriyet.com.tr/pazar/22563655.asp

There can then be only 3 possible explanations.

1) The reporter got the name of the day wrong.

2) The reporter got the date wrong. In that case, he last spoke to her on January 19th, which is a Saturday.

3) January 14th was a Saturday in 2012. That means her husband hadn't spoken to SS for more than a year.

You pick.

 

[looking4answers]

But that's exactly what it says in the below links.

http://www.hurriyet.com.tr/pazar/22563655.asp

There can then be only 3 possible explanations.

1) The reporter got the name of the day wrong.

2) The reporter got the date wrong. In that case, he last spoke to her on January 19th, which is a Saturday.

3) January 14th was a Saturday in 2012. That means her husband hadn't spoken to SS for more than a year.

You pick.

I think #2, because it corroborates other pieces of info we have seen or heard.

 

[CMac2]

But that's exactly what it says in the below links.

http://www.hurriyet.com.tr/pazar/22563655.asp

There can then be only 3 possible explanations.

1) The reporter got the name of the day wrong.

2) The reporter got the date wrong. In that case, he last spoke to her on January 19th, which is a Saturday.

3) January 14th was a Saturday in 2012. That means her husband hadn't spoken to SS for more than a year.

You pick.

Seriously. Even that which should be the most simple of simple details is getting all screwed up. REALLY?! Not knowing whether or not the man talked to his wife in 7 days vs 2 days is kind of important.

I swear. They're doing this to us on purpose. The media's angry that we have run out of theories for them to print, and this is how they punish us. :banghead:

 

[CMac2]

And I can't find anything about these other attacks in that area, other than media reports from the SS case. Media probably made those up too. Grumble.

 

[ToutCa]

From the Doom's Day article in the NY Daily News:



ETA: Back "slung around her shoulder" says to me it was either a backpack of some sort or one of those shoulder-crossing purses that women tend to covet. We like those purses because it keeps the purse hugged to our bodies, with the strap crossing down from one shoulder, securing the bag to our hip on the other side of our bodies. Makes it difficult for a mugger to grab our purse and run.

I really wonder how big the bag was. If it was tiny, then it becomes unlikelier she was carrying some illicit object of value to exchange. If it was more like a knapsack, maybe just maybe there was something in it. But if not, she still could have been going to pick up a suitcase full of dope -- hypothetically, anyway. But if the violence came because she wanted to back out of the deal, why not just blow off the meeting? I guess she could fear some retaliation...

This drug angle is hard to figure.

 

[CMac2]

I really wonder how big the bag was. If it was tiny, then it becomes unlikelier she was carrying some illicit object of value to exchange. If it was more like a knapsack, maybe just maybe there was something in it. But if not, she still could have been going to pick up a suitcase full of dope -- hypothetically, anyway. But if the violence came because she wanted to back out of the deal, why not just blow off the meeting? I guess she could fear some retaliation...

This drug angle is hard to figure.

I already solved the drug stuff. The drugs were in the package she got from the US. Only it wasn't really drugs, per say, but "fun brownies". Case closed.