GUILTY Turkey - Sarai Sierra, 33, NY woman murdered, Istanbul, 21 Jan 2013 - #3

[delal]

Some reports said he walked her home, so in that case he did know where she was staying.

 

[Herat]

Aha.

The Pope is resigning. It all falls into place now.

I don't know why we didn't figure this out before.

 

[ToutCa]

I checked those ones. In all other cases the sole purpose of the peep seems to be sexual assault. In the case which is very similar where a japan tourist had a blow to her head by a rock the peep is identified and arrested.

One threatened by a knife and pulled there at 3 am
The other one lured there
The other one - japanese one: peep asked for a cigarette, she asked for the directions of the hotel. He said I can take you there...

No murder involved.

Thanks Lavy -- did you get any info on who the perp was in each case?
Age, profession, nationality, "druggie" status?

 

[citizenofworld]

Turkish journalists are starting to get as frustrated as we are -- they are starting to grumble about imposed media black-outs on the investigation...

There's a blackout from the police? I wonder if that's good or bad. Who's saying this?

 

[ThinkHard]

Respectfully snipped. Yes, I know some of them would not call themselves Catholic. That is why I explained why I do. Why would you bother to correct me when I said the very thing you're correcting IN MY POST? I'm not Coptic, so I referred to all of the groups I alluded to the way my culture does.

Some of the articles also referred to the Armenian church that held Sarai's body as Catholic.

And also this website details the Eparchy of Constantinople: http://www.armeniancatholic.org/inside.php?lang=en&page_id=315

I wasnt trying to pick on you, just used your post as a reference point as to why I thought it was highly unlikely sarai death had anything to do with her religion.

Also as far as jewelry, the Armenia cross and catholic cross are distinctly different.

 

[Herat]

"But she'd been in town a long time -- she could have heard about them, read about them, seen them on a map...especially if she was saying to everyone "where can i take photos of RR tracks in an area nearby that looks cool?"

And it would be all over the maps, guidebooks and it's very apparent from GoogleEarth

Serkeci is very famous as the terminus of the Oriental Express and I would think that would be at least a place to begin exploring trains.

BTW: I don't find her IG photos to be very interesting. They are linear, often symmetrical, without much local reference, emotion, or photographic risk. The only one I am drawn to is the one with the sandpiper up in the corner. Everyone has their own taste.

 

[bourne]

Ok, what circumstances point to random attack?
1. Location of where body was found
2. She had been walking VERY near the area, alone (a not-so-great area to boot), just prior to disappearing
3. Yashim was an eyewitness to the crime, saw the entire thing, and can testify under oath he saw a 14 year old paint-sniffing druggy who is not very strong do it.
4. Other attacks in the same area SS' body was found- random in nature
5. What else??

Conversely, what points to SS being murdered at the hands of someone she knew?
1. Speculation that the trip to Turkey was not what it originally appeared to be (i.e. photography may not have been the only reason for this trip)
2. Rumors of marital discord
3. Taylan (I don't need to clarify beyond his name, right? Just imagine me saying, "TAYLAN!!" with my fist in the air. Kind of like, "Foiled again!")
4. Rumors that she met creepy carpet-guy twice on the trip
5. Rumors that surveillance video shows SS being followed in the mall in the day (or was it 2 days- can't remember) before she went missing
6. Botched plans to meet at the bridge the morning she went missing (TAYLAN again!! **Fist in air**)
7. Rumors of Taylan having a sexual relationship/not having a sexual relationship with SS
8. Rumors of SS telling landlord she's unmarried (could mean nothing- may not even be true at all, frankly)
8. Amsterdam Ammer's statement (again, may not even be true) that SS was uncomfortable with certain folks in Istanbul
9. Unexplained shortening of trip to come back home
10. Rumors that SS met with at least one other male, as yet unidentified, from IG in Instanbul
11. What else???

You make me laugh! I'm totally with you on **Fist in air**

I remain steadfast that it's Taylan or someone she met on her trip. The bashing of her face into unrecognizable form is much too personal to be a random stranger.

I know peeps are saying they didn't find Taylan's DNA on her fingernails, but we know they found his semen on her, yes? He apparently admitted to having sex with her...Or did he? (Recent reports contradict this, so I have no idea what is true or not).

Also, even if LE didn't find Taylan's DNA under her nails, it could simply mean he was smart enough to wipe them off with alcohol pads or some other chemical agent and then swipe some homeless druggie's blanket all over her fingers and body to plant false DNA on her. Hey, even I know to do that if I ever wanted to plant false evidence. And it's not unheard of to stage a crime scene and plant artificial DNA to incriminate someone else.

 

[ThinkHard]

I wouldn't discount a random attack just because her jewelry wasn't taken, especially the rings. The electronic items were the big ticket and easy to grab, maybe along with any cash she had. My wedding rings are very hard to remove. If the same were true for Sarai, someone may have decided to make a quick getaway with what they could grab, not risking getting caught at the scene of the crime.

Having said that, I'm still on the fence Bout random vs acquaintance.

Now back to work...:seeya:

One thought though about this....is if they took the time to remove most of her clothing, why would they feel too rushed to also removed the two chains she was reportedly wearing?

 

[ToutCa]

I find it strange that she would not have seen her IG friends more often. If I was visiting a foreign city recommended by IG friends, especially where language may be a problem, I would be relying heavily on them for contact.

Maybe she didn't want to see Taylan often. Mystery is important in romance. Or even in hook ups. Maybe she liked exploring on her own with encounters with Taylan that were only occasional on purpose to heighten their romantic or sexual intrigue.

 

[bourne]

If you look at photos number 10 and 11 in this gallery, I think it may show the person who may have been following Sarai near the mall

http://galeri.haberturk.com/gundem/galeri/423673-kayip-sarainin-pesindeki-esrarengiz-takipci

I recall I thought the same when I first watched the video of her in the food court. I told my hubby then and he shrugged. He said "Could be her stalkers. But could also just be that men like to check out women." lol

 

[ThinkHard]

You make me laugh! I'm totally with you on **Fist in air**

I remain steadfast that it's Taylan or someone she met on her trip. The bashing of her face into unrecognizable form is much too personal to be a random stranger.

I know peeps are saying they didn't find Taylan's DNA on her fingernails, but we know they found his semen on her, yes? He apparently admitted to having sex with her...Or did he? (Recent reports contradict this, so I have no idea what is true or not).

Also, even if LE didn't find Taylan's DNA under her nails, it could simply mean he was smart enough to wipe them off with alcohol pads or some other chemical agent and then swipe some homeless druggie's blanket all over her fingers and body to plant false DNA on her. Hey, even I know to do that if I ever wanted to plant false evidence. And it's not unheard of to stage a crime scene and plant artificial DNA to incriminate someone else.

I don't think we know that they found taylans DNA on her. Whether it be semen or under her nails.

 

[bourne]

My aim was not to defend Turkey or justify any possible weakness or unfairness of Turkish law enforcement. It was only a call to concentrate on what matters. The context required me to say "let's not dwell on Turkey's political issues", on another post I might have said "President Obama's Chicago visit is not relevant here" or "Puerto Rican food does not fall within the scope of this discussion."

In fact, I totally agree with you. I support people's freedom to express themselves without even worrying about political correctness and similar constraints.

But when somebody comes up and says:

"Hi, my name is ABC. This is my first post. Your mother's fat and your father is bald. Therefore, Turks are murderers."

Then, I begin to sense an ulterior motive there.

Otherwise, I think we not only have no right to impose limits on what each other has to say, but we are also obliged to respect each others' posts and encourage active participation of all members.

Yet, sometimes you just know, Bourne. Can't always prove it, but you just know.

By the way, my mom's skinny as a stick and my dad has long, shaggy, curly hair that we have been forever trying to convince him to cut! So Turks cannot be murderers. mwahahahaha

 

[ToutCa]

There's a blackout from the police? I wonder if that's good or bad. Who's saying this?

A Turkish journalist or two I saw throwing out grumbling asides suggesting the word from on high (govt or police?) was to let nothing else out.

It's not good for us sleuthers, but maybe it helps LE work better?

 

[CMac2]

I wouldn't discount a random attack just because her jewelry wasn't taken, especially the rings. The electronic items were the big ticket and easy to grab, maybe along with any cash she had. My wedding rings are very hard to remove. If the same were true for Sarai, someone may have decided to make a quick getaway with what they could grab, not risking getting caught at the scene of the crime.

Having said that, I'm still on the fence about random vs acquaintance.

Now back to work...:seeya:

I agree that we don't have enough information to discount a random attack. That said, I think we need to also take into account the term "easy to grab" as being a relative term. For someone like me, yes, it'd be much, much easier to simply grab the electronics and run. However, this guy just beat her upside the head- repeatedly- with enough force to kill her. I'd submit that was not an "easy" thing to do- at least not by a normal person's standards. He killed her in a terrible fashion, incurred great risk of being caught to (likely) remove her pants and move her body. I highly doubt removing a ring and and a necklace (or bracelet) is going to be such a difficult task that he would simply opt out of doing it, just for the sake of ease.

 

[lavy]

Thanks Lavy -- did you get any info on who the perp was in each case?
Age, profession, nationality, "druggie" status?

No, noting about it.

 

[CMac2]

I don't think we know that they found taylans DNA on her. Whether it be semen or under her nails.

You heard Yashim, ThinkHard! Sometimes you just know!

Just kidding.

You're right. We know pathetically little in this case. I'm like a small child, starving for a bit of bread. Every time I think I've gotten a piece of bread to eat (some facts to work with), it gets yanked out of my hand again (constantly changing media reports).

After a while, you just get loopy.

 

[ThinkHard]

Just for clarity, about Taylans semen. We only know that he supposedly made the claim they had sex after it was discovered DNA was recovered from the scene. (He could have made this claim all along though). It was reported that NO DNA matched anyone yet, checked that included Taylan. So we cannot conclude that Taylans DNA was found on sarai at all. Is that correct or am I mistaken?

 

[ThinkHard]

I think if Taylan was involved, then it was some kind of group, I don't think he acted alone. But maybe he was the bait that gained her trust, and knew where she would be.

But I don't know, I certainly have not ruled him out. I just don't think he was the one who actually murdered her.

I think if she was murdered by someone for perceived romantic reasons or abandonment it is someone who we are not yet aware of. Perhaps even someone who was following her, and maybe was mad at her for sleeping with Taylan?

 

[ToutCa]

Just for clarity, about Taylans semen. We only know that he supposedly made the claim they had sex after it was discovered DNA was recovered from the scene. (He could have made this claim all along though). It was reported that NO DNA matched anyone yet, checked that included Taylan. So we cannot conclude that Taylans DNA was found on sarai at all. Is that correct or am I mistaken?

Mostly correct, except that the news that DNA cleared the first 22 suspects (Taylan included, and I think the AirBnb host included?) was never confirmed by LE. They've just said tests will be out in 2 weeks, and they are testing 56 or so people as of now for DNA.

As Lavy said this morning, mainstream Turkish TV said they are looking harder at 5 suspects.

 

[MLE]

Thats sad but thats one of the most popular international tourist scams.

I vividly remember reading about this one girl who was on a trip in Japan. She met with two girls who said lets go to a traditional tea house. At some point she noticed something is not right so she only ordered a can of coke but still ended up with 600$ bill.

I got charged $60 or so for two beers at a bar between the Hyatt and Hilton in Istanbul. If I had hired any of the many Ukrainian sex slaves they had available, maybe they would've waived the cost of the drinks, but I was just wanting a brew. This is exactly the type of scam action delal is talking about in the tourist areas of Istanbul.