TX - Chad Read 54, shot/killed by ex's bf, Kyle Carruth, in custody dispute, Lubbock, 5 Nov 2021

[cvaldez1975]

Oh I loathe to wade into the quagmire that is 2A related thread but I had to come up from the depths to post.

First and foremost - without naming names - to whomever posted that the men “down there” like to control our women haven’t met many Texan women I take it. Sure there are cretins down here in the same ratio that you find idiots up there so let’s leave out the name calling of those of us who reside “down here’. You may not realize it but it’s not far off from using the “you people” description that is guaranteed to keep us all at odds.

Second, we HARDLY have the facts of this case. I would argue that we don’t know what happened prior to the video (but chads widow stated they record everything due to prior incidents suggesting there is more) or if there was any prior confrontation such as chad being aggressive in the past with Kyle. I was surprised that it took 10 pages of posts before the criminal history (which is possibly influential on Kyle state of mind) was mentioned. We don’t know enough of their situation we just saw a video which everyone sees a bit different as we well know.

Third, as a CCL Texan -I am NOT a lawyer - but I’m licensed, well trained and reasonably intelligent. I have carried a firearm almost every day for a decade but YMMV on what I perceive as my legal rights here in my great state. I don’t condone the use of violence to solve problems but the law and the culture here allow you to defend yourself if you feel in imminent danger. From my personal point of view I see a man tell someone to vacate his property to which the response was something on the order of ‘make me’. I think Kyle legally retrieved his firearm and defended his life and property but again we all see this event differently. I would argue that my point of view is significantly more prevalent throughout the state and more likely to reflect the perceptions of a Texas DA, grand jury or trial jury. The fact they are on acreage - land in Texas is holy and only idiot confronts an armed man on his own property AFTER being asked to leave multiple times is going to be damned hard to prosecute here.

One last last thing, what in the holy hell is up with these people arguing over who’s right or wrong when Chad is dead on the ground. They are all posturing for the video like nothing happened. It’s unsettling on so so many levels…

Just my .02,
BigTex

BBM see, thats what sara morales in florida did as well and here we are with people defending the shooter. i know, different cases, different states. just striking to me.

 

[cvaldez1975]

Out of curiosity, if you were being kept from your child, you’re saying you would just say “oh, ok” and wait weeks or months for a possible court date each time it happened?

like cash gernon and samuel olson, incidentally both in texas.

 

[Deleted member 229974]

Out of curiosity, if you were being kept from your child, you’re saying you would just say “oh, ok” and wait weeks or months for a possible court date each time it happened?

Exactly! Being a parent who fortunately has never been in Family Court, I cannot begin to image the pain a parent goes through being separated from their child. Our kids are like a part of our bodies, our lives and our hearts and to have to wait for your time to finally be with them again and discover the other party is playing games to keep you away from your child, well, I just can’t imagine the stress and anger that would cause a parent. The mother should be punished if she intentionally caused interference with Chad and his kids. It’s just inhumane to use your own flesh and blood to try to hurt someone else. The saddest thing is the effect that it leaves on the child! He or she is the one who ultimately suffers from the separation of their parents. Kyle may have killed him with a gunshot, but mother had her hand in this as well. IMO

 

[asmi106082]

Out of curiosity, if you were being kept from your child, you’re saying you would just say “oh, ok” and wait weeks or months for a possible court date each time it happened?

I would not say oh ok and sit back and relax. But at the same time I would know that confronting someone angrily is not good for the child and everything eventually catches up to you in court. I realize the courts work slowly but they still work. A family court judge can and will completely strip a parent of rights if they willfully disobey court orders.

 

[Vegasgrl]

^^bbm
And there's no statute of limitations for murder! I do think the shooter will eventually be indicted and arrested. MOO

Maybe arrested on another charge related or unrelated? I would not be surprised.

 

[Deleted member 229974]

Why even issue court orders if people can disregard them?

How many times have we read about a woman who was murdered by a boyfriend or husband, and she had a PFA order on him. I guess it is just a piece of paper.

 

[worm]

How many times have we read about a woman who was murdered by a boyfriend or husband, and she had a PFA order on him. I guess it is just a piece of paper.

I mentioned a local case that I’m following earlier in the thread that’s very much an example of this.

 

[Caffeine]

To preface, I'm very much a supporter of self defense and 2A rights. However, this was nowhere near self defense...even by Texas standards.

Chad had every right to be there per the custody agreement. I suppose Kyle had a right to ask him to leave and retrieve a firearm. The problem here lies in the fact that everything Kyle did after getting the firearm was undeniably wrong and created a dangerous and deadly situation.

Self defense generally requires a reasonable fear of death or great harm. The issue here will be Kyle, who was in no real danger, went back into his house and grabbed a rifle. Not only did he do that, he subsequently continued the verbal altercation, fired a warning shot and continued bumping chests with Chad.

That's not fear, that's being an aggressor. So not only was their a profound lack of danger here, he continued to engage Chad, gun in hand, until it became evident to Chad this was a life of death situation and he had to try and disarm him to walk away from this. After all, the guy just fired at his feet without any real provocation. Chad's threats were all court based, regarding his custody. There was nothing violent here from him until Kyle popped a round off at the ground. Of course then it created a deadly fight or flight situation and flight likely wasn't an option for Chad being that close.

Had a gun never been introduced here, we'd have some bruises and hurt egos. No death or major legal repercussions. Had Kyle used the weapon in a less threatening manner he could have created a safe distance and waited for the police to arrive.

No question, if I was a future juror here it would be manslaughter all the way for Kyle.

 

[Seattle1]

To preface, I'm very much a supporter of self defense and 2A rights. However, this was nowhere near self defense...even by Texas standards.

Chad had every right to be there per the custody agreement. I suppose Kyle had a right to ask him to leave and retrieve a firearm. The problem here lies in the fact that everything Kyle did after getting the firearm was undeniably wrong and created a dangerous and deadly situation.

Self defense generally requires a reasonable fear of death or great harm. The issue here will be Kyle, who was in no real danger, went back into his house and grabbed a rifle. Not only did he do that, he subsequently continued the verbal altercation, fired a warning shot and continued bumping chests with Chad.

That's not fear, that's being an aggressor. So not only was their a profound lack of danger here, he continued to engage Chad, gun in hand, until it became evident to Chad this was a life of death situation and he had to try and disarm him to walk away from this. After all, the guy just fired at his feet without any real provocation. Chad's threats were all court based, regarding his custody. There was nothing violent here from him until Kyle popped a round off at the ground. Of course then it created a deadly fight or flight situation and flight likely wasn't an option for Chad being that close.

Had a gun never been introduced here, we'd have some bruises and hurt egos. No death or major legal repercussions. Had Kyle used the weapon in a less threatening manner he could have created a safe distance and waited for the police to arrive.

No question, if I was a future juror here it would be manslaughter all the way for Kyle.

Thank you @Caffeine for succinctly describing what I think most of us saw develop in front of our very own eyes. And I'm aghast that an 11-year-old boy inside the vehicle with Chad's wife witness the same thing.

 

[Deleted member 229974]

To preface, I'm very much a supporter of self defense and 2A rights. However, this was nowhere near self defense...even by Texas standards.

Chad had every right to be there per the custody agreement. I suppose Kyle had a right to ask him to leave and retrieve a firearm. The problem here lies in the fact that everything Kyle did after getting the firearm was undeniably wrong and created a dangerous and deadly situation.

Self defense generally requires a reasonable fear of death or great harm. The issue here will be Kyle, who was in no real danger, went back into his house and grabbed a rifle. Not only did he do that, he subsequently continued the verbal altercation, fired a warning shot and continued bumping chests with Chad.

That's not fear, that's being an aggressor. So not only was their a profound lack of danger here, he continued to engage Chad, gun in hand, until it became evident to Chad this was a life of death situation and he had to try and disarm him to walk away from this. After all, the guy just fired at his feet without any real provocation. Chad's threats were all court based, regarding his custody. There was nothing violent here from him until Kyle popped a round off at the ground. Of course then it created a deadly fight or flight situation and flight likely wasn't an option for Chad being that close.

Had a gun never been introduced here, we'd have some bruises and hurt egos. No death or major legal repercussions. Had Kyle used the weapon in a less threatening manner he could have created a safe distance and waited for the police to arrive.

No question, if I was a future juror here it would be manslaughter all the way for Kyle.

Bravo!!!

 

[Deleted member 229974]

I would not say oh ok and sit back and relax. But at the same time I would know that confronting someone angrily is not good for the child and everything eventually catches up to you in court. I realize the courts work slowly but they still work. A family court judge can and will completely strip a parent of rights if they willfully disobey court orders.

Or you could just set the Dad up and kill him in “self defense”. No more shared custody problems.

 

[Gardenista]

Chad Read’s mother, children sue Kyle Carruth for gross negligence

 

[Deleted member 229974]

Chad Read’s mother, children sue Kyle Carruth for gross negligence

Good, but I’d think his children deserve more than one million dollars, shared with their grandmother. IMO

 

[JayWill]

To preface, I'm very much a supporter of self defense and 2A rights. However, this was nowhere near self defense...even by Texas standards.

Chad had every right to be there per the custody agreement. I suppose Kyle had a right to ask him to leave and retrieve a firearm. The problem here lies in the fact that everything Kyle did after getting the firearm was undeniably wrong and created a dangerous and deadly situation.

Self defense generally requires a reasonable fear of death or great harm. The issue here will be Kyle, who was in no real danger, went back into his house and grabbed a rifle. Not only did he do that, he subsequently continued the verbal altercation, fired a warning shot and continued bumping chests with Chad.

That's not fear, that's being an aggressor. So not only was their a profound lack of danger here, he continued to engage Chad, gun in hand, until it became evident to Chad this was a life of death situation and he had to try and disarm him to walk away from this. After all, the guy just fired at his feet without any real provocation. Chad's threats were all court based, regarding his custody. There was nothing violent here from him until Kyle popped a round off at the ground. Of course then it created a deadly fight or flight situation and flight likely wasn't an option for Chad being that close.

Had a gun never been introduced here, we'd have some bruises and hurt egos. No death or major legal repercussions. Had Kyle used the weapon in a less threatening manner he could have created a safe distance and waited for the police to arrive.

No question, if I was a future juror here it would be manslaughter all the way for Kyle.

But Kyle was a small man who felt big with a gun.

 

[Jealoushe]

Had to know that was coming. Hope he has good insurance. Wonder if it would even cover something like this.

Insurance doesn't cover criminal acts.

 

[TrustedTracker5097]

Chad Read widow calls for action in fatal shooting involving Kyle Carruth

 

[Argonaut]

After Mr. Read grabbed the gun, the shooting was justified, IMO.

 

[nightowl1975]

After Mr. Read grabbed the gun, the shooting was justified, IMO.

IMO, Self defense laws are much more complex than just that one snippet in time.

 

[Seattle1]

After Mr. Read grabbed the gun, the shooting was justified, IMO.

It was never clear to me why the shooter went inside and came back out with a weapon. Why didn't he just stay inside and call the police? Why didn't the former spouse phone her mother and tell her the victim was on his way to collect their son (as he offered) since she screwed up by not having him ready at 3:15 pm. No winners here -- a father, husband, friend, is dead.

 

[Deleted member 229974]

It was never clear to me why the shooter went inside and came back out with a weapon. Why didn't he just stay inside and call the police? Why didn't the former spouse phone her mother and tell her the victim was on his way to collect their son (as he offered) since she screwed up by not having him ready at 3:15 pm. No winners here -- a father, husband, friend, is dead.

Yep, Kyle could have de-escalated the whole thing by simply going inside the house. But people often don’t use their head and instead react foolishly to an emotionally charged situation. I think about Chad’s three kids who no longer have a father and will spend their first Christmas without him. Such a waste of lives. Hopefully this will be Kyle’s last Christmas too. IMO