TX - Five Yates children drowned, Houston, 20 June 2001 *Insanity*

[Jeana (DP)]

It's always good to read you Jeana...you bring an enlightenment to these posts. I agree about the stigma of mental disorders and think that if someone truly suffers from one, they should seek help at all cost. I absolutley believe there are alot of people out there who suffer...whether it be severely or moderately, they suffer. BUT I also think that now adays, the mental disease "professionals" push a quick fix on anyone who comes in with the slightest little problem. All of these meds dull a persons coping ability. It makes them dependent on "feel good" or "happy pills" and I absolutley do not agree with that. I think that mental disorders have gone full blown and more and more people claim to have them just beacuse they cannot cope. Especially if you take them off the meds...then they really go nuts...because they don't know what normal everyday life pain is anymore. And personally, I would not take something that cautions on the warning lable that it could cause me to have homicidal or suicidal tendancies when it supposed to make me feel better! HUH? What is that all about :waitasec: ! No one promised an easy, simple life to any of us. Life is hard at times and those times need to be dealt with, not dulled. Life can also be a beautiful ride and sadly that can also be missed when you're numb. I just think people should really live and that means dealing with life and all of it's highs and lows...But that is just my opinion.

Thanks Ember. You as well. I do agree with much of your post. Perhaps if Yates had stopped getting pregnant, she wouldn't have needed to continue to take the medication. I'm not intelligent enough about that sort of thing to know for sure. I would think that one's body would eventually go back to "normal," but unfortunately, she was pregnant so many times so quickly back to back that we'll never know. I think for people born with the imbalance that makes their disorders a fact of life, they most likely will need to continue the meds for life.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Yes I am. That case bothered me so much. Didn't she blame it on a spider running across her hand? Crazy Biotch...sorry....anyway....that poor baby, the pain she must have suffered. See, I guess that is why I cannot feel sorry for these people....all I can think about is the life that suffered at their hands and I feel NO sympathy for this scurge AND I truly believe they just need to be put down like a rabid animal that is suffering from its afflictioon as well.
The religion thing about these cases...well we just won't even go there. Most of y'all know how I feel about religion. :hand:

AMEN! LOL The fact that this man has an actual church with people that live around me is just CRAZY. I do blame the medical community in this case because she was hospitalized several times and each time, her husband was able to convince them to release her to his "care," which was non-existent. :banghead:

 

[kato]

AMEN! LOL The fact that this man has an actual church with people that live around me is just CRAZY. I do blame the medical community in this case because she was hospitalized several times and each time, her husband was able to convince them to release her to his "care," which was non-existent. :banghead:

Sounds like another Rusty.

 

[BillyGoatGruff]

BUT aren't you insane in the first place if you want to rape a child?

Insane: 1. afflicted with or characteristic of mental derangement
2. Immoderate; wild
3. Very foolish; absurd


OK, Cal. I love ya and know where you're coming from. I'm just saying the issue of insanity is a moot point to me. I can't see how that can be a defense or why that makes a person not guilty....it's a given in these situations....

Insanity s defined by the dictionary, how its defined by the legal system & how its defined by the medical community are all very different things.

Have you ever known or had to deal with someone who was genuinely insane--I don't mean eccentric--like a schizophrenic or a bi-polar but were more or less functioning--however marginally--in society? Have you ever met someone who was criminal in nature? A sociopath or a career criminal? While they might share some similar tendencies (such as delusiosn) there is no mistaking one for the other.

 

[kato]

Insanity s defined by the dictionary, how its defined by the legal system & how its defined by the medical community are all very different things.

Have you ever known or had to deal with someone who was genuinely insane--I don't mean eccentric--like a schizophrenic or a bi-polar but were more or less functioning--however marginally--in society? Have you ever met someone who was criminal in nature? A sociopath or a career criminal? While they might share some similar tendencies (such as delusiosn) there is no mistaking one for the other.

Our bio mother was a shizophrenic. We knew her because we were not babies when she gave us up and so were able to maintain ties with our bio familes. I give her credit on one thing. When she became a heroin addict and full blown paranoid schizophrenic she gave us to the county. (I can't for give her for not giving us to family though). Anyway, she didn't kill us even though she attempted suicide often. So, they're not all killers. Ironically she died last year of cancer that had spread to her liver of which she had Hep C due to shooting up. God takes care of people in his own way.

 

[calus_3]

he,he,he me too....but I don't suffer from it, I enjoy the hell out of it!

:blowkiss: to you Cal

Right back at cha.....

Who needs friends when you have so many personalities to keep you company!

One of the funniest lines in comedic history:
"wait, did you just refer to yourself in the fourth person?"....me myself and irene!

Cal

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Rusty speaks:

Prosecutor: No false testimony
Prosecutor Joe Owmby said Thursday the state offered no false testimony.

"I do not think about Rusty Yates; I do not want to think about Rusty Yates, and he needs to stop thinking about us," Owmby said.

Yates, an engineer at NASA's Johnson Space Center, said he plans to visit his ex-wife regularly, but his role in her life will diminish as he moves on with his own. He remarried in March and has now has two stepsons.

"I don't forget my children, and I don't forget Andrea, but I don't dwell on it either. I try to remember my children fondly," he said. "I'm building new life ... and have a new family and am more focused on them."

For his ex-wife to ever be released from state care will require a complicated evaluation process. Experts say it can take decades before psychiatrists decide a patient is healthy enough to leave, and even then a judge can reject those findings.

Yates said he was nervous on Wednesday as he waited for the verdict. The family, which has always supported Andrea, was devastated when she was convicted at the first trial 2002, he said.

Yates had testified for the defense in that first trial, and he said Thursday he didn't know why he wasn't asked to testify again.

"In some respects," he said, "I know Andrea better than anybody."



more at:

http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/07/27/yates.trial.ap/index.html

 

[NaNaRosebud]

I hope she can live in a facility that continues to make her life a better one than the one she escaped from.]/B] And I hope that Rusty eventually accepts the role he played in her downfall.

Hell of a way to escape isn't it.

Kill off your kids. CLaim you're insane when you did it, even though you KNEW you had killed them and called the police. Get off and live in a hospital with the chance of getting out scott free some day.

Yea, hell of a way to escape.

I do not feel ONE bit sorry for her, and I don't understand how ANY of you can.

 

[Jules]

(7/26/06 - HOUSTON) - The jury in Andrea Yates' first trial took just an hour and a half to find her guilty of murdering her children. On Wednesday, there was a very different outcome from the 6 men and 6 women on this jury.

****

Frank stood alone with fellow jurors close by to take questions about the verdict for Yates, which was not guilty by reason if insanity, for drowning her children.

Franks describes the 12 hours of deliberations, saying at first, the vote was eight to four with the jury leaning towards not guilty.

****

On Wednesday morning, the jury asked to see pictures of the kids, the family alive and happy.

"We wanted to take a moment to remember the children," said Frank.

"Don't let this happen again," pleaded Frank. "Do what you've got to do with the legislature, the medical community, the insurance companies. Don't let it happen again."

Something else Frank told us is that when the jury was deliberating, it was clear to all of them that Yates was psychotic before, during, and after the drownings. (AMEN)

http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?section=local&id=4403610

Sounds like a well-educated, informed, honest jury. They couldn't have done a better job.

 

[kk's mom]

Hell of a way to escape isn't it.

Kill off your kids. CLaim you're insane when you did it, even though you KNEW you had killed them and called the police. Get off and live in a hospital with the chance of getting out scott free some day.

Yea, hell of a way to escape.

I do not feel ONE bit sorry for her, and I don't understand how ANY of you can.

I agree with you 100%. I accept the opinion of others who feel otherwise. I don't agree though, with those who have said that Andrea received justice yesterday. The only ones that deserved any justice were those children and they did not nor will they ever receive it. I watched Rita Crosby last night and they showed footage of where she may possibly go. They have a lake with benches, paddleboats, vegetable gardens, craft rooms, etc. It made me furious to think that she can spend possibly the rest of her life there and her children are buried about 20 feet in the ground. Now that makes me mad..........

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Hell of a way to escape isn't it.

Kill off your kids. CLaim you're insane when you did it, even though you KNEW you had killed them and called the police. Get off and live in a hospital with the chance of getting out scott free some day.

Yea, hell of a way to escape.

I do not feel ONE bit sorry for her, and I don't understand how ANY of you can.

Being able to understand a bit about mental illness and the wreck it can make of human's lives and feeling sorry for someone are two completely different things.

 

[Details]

It's justice for Andrea. Justice for her kids would include charges against Rusty and the doctor who took her off the Haldol.

She was clearly insane, and had been for a long time - this wasn't just some quick little insane, "He hit me and I just snapped" temporary insanity, this is the full blown real thing.

I'm another who generally doesn't believe at all in most insanity defenses, nor most defenses, period. But Andrea was just plain nuts - a long record over many years, biological problems (and it's scary to realize how easily your body chemistry can turn you from yourself into someone completely different - willpower has nothing to do with it), suicide attempts, harming herself - this isn't fake at all.

What she did to the children was horrible - but that doesn't prove insanity - I think most everyone on this forum is quite aware that mothers, fathers, children - any of them can commit horrible crimes without being insane.

What she did was very methodolical - but that doesn't disprove insanity - she's insane, not stupid, not temporarily insane. She had a goal - an insane goal, but a goal she insanely thought was a good one, and took the steps necessary. Not an unusual thing for parents in some ways - we bring our kids in and hold them down while they scream, to give them their shots, because we know it's for their own good. She thought that she was doing something for their good - it's insane to believe that, and that's what she was, and still is.

 

[Jules]

It's justice for Andrea. Justice for her kids would include charges against Rusty and the doctor who took her off the Haldol.

She was clearly insane, and had been for a long time - this wasn't just some quick little insane, "He hit me and I just snapped" temporary insanity, this is the full blown real thing.

I'm another who generally doesn't believe at all in most insanity defenses, nor most defenses, period. But Andrea was just plain nuts - a long record over many years, biological problems (and it's scary to realize how easily your body chemistry can turn you from yourself into someone completely different - willpower has nothing to do with it), suicide attempts, harming herself - this isn't fake at all.

What she did to the children was horrible - but that doesn't prove insanity - I think most everyone on this forum is quite aware that mothers, fathers, children - any of them can commit horrible crimes without being insane.

What she did was very methodolical - but that doesn't disprove insanity - she's insane, not stupid, not temporarily insane. She had a goal - an insane goal, but a goal she insanely thought was a good one, and took the steps necessary. Not an unusual thing for parents in some ways - we bring our kids in and hold them down while they scream, to give them their shots, because we know it's for their own good. She thought that she was doing something for their good - it's insane to believe that, and that's what she was, and still is.

Well said! :clap: I agree 110%

 

[nightowl]

Has anyone started a thread anywhere on the conclusion of Andrea Yates' re-trial?

Found not guilty by reason of insanity.

I looked for a thread but couldn't find one. Perhaps it's a topic that is best if we avoid discussion on. Too many emotions.

There is alot of info on www.chron.com today.

 

[nightowl]

Oops -- sorry I just found the thread on Andrea Yates. If anyone else is looking for it, it's in the TRIALS thread.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

It's justice for Andrea. Justice for her kids would include charges against Rusty and the doctor who took her off the Haldol.

She was clearly insane, and had been for a long time - this wasn't just some quick little insane, "He hit me and I just snapped" temporary insanity, this is the full blown real thing.

I'm another who generally doesn't believe at all in most insanity defenses, nor most defenses, period. But Andrea was just plain nuts - a long record over many years, biological problems (and it's scary to realize how easily your body chemistry can turn you from yourself into someone completely different - willpower has nothing to do with it), suicide attempts, harming herself - this isn't fake at all.

What she did to the children was horrible - but that doesn't prove insanity - I think most everyone on this forum is quite aware that mothers, fathers, children - any of them can commit horrible crimes without being insane.

What she did was very methodolical - but that doesn't disprove insanity - she's insane, not stupid, not temporarily insane. She had a goal - an insane goal, but a goal she insanely thought was a good one, and took the steps necessary. Not an unusual thing for parents in some ways - we bring our kids in and hold them down while they scream, to give them their shots, because we know it's for their own good. She thought that she was doing something for their good - it's insane to believe that, and that's what she was, and still is.

This is the best post I've seen all day.

 

[NaNaRosebud]

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/4076428.html

She could get out of jail a free woman within 30 days!

Hill ordered that doctors there present a report to her court 30 days from today after evaluating Yates' mental state and whether she presents a danger to herself or others.

At that time, the judge will hold another hearing to determine if Yates, 42, meets the requirements for involuntary commitment and if there is a mental health plan to treat her illness.

If doctors conclude Yates does not have to be in a maximum-security facility, she could be moved from Vernon State Hospital to Rusk State Hospital — which her attorneys prefer — without Hill having to approve it.

I guess she' not postpartum depressed any more is she?

I hope someone in the facility can give justice to her children by getting rid of her. After all, that person would get off for murdering her wouldn't they? After all, they were insane when they did it!!

I wonder when she'll write her book.


Happy Mother's Day, Andrea!! Take a hot bath and everything will be OK!

 

[NaNaRosebud]

Also, read this:


http://law.onecle.com/texas/criminal-procedure/46.03.html

This explains in detail how she could possibly get out free as a bird.

take particular notice to this quote:

(d) A defendant who has been found not guilty by reason of insanity
shall stand acquitted of the offense charged and may not be
considered a person charged with a criminal offense.

so. ladies and gentlemen, meet Andrea Yates, loving mother of 5 children.

DId she committ a crime? NOt according to the jury she didn't!!

SHameful!!!

 

[Jeana (DP)]

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/4076428.html

She could get out of jail a free woman within 30 days!


I guess she' not postpartum depressed any more is she?

I hope someone in the facility can give justice to her children by getting rid of her. After all, that person would get off for murdering her wouldn't they? After all, they were insane when they did it!!

I wonder when she'll write her book.


Happy Mother's Day, Andrea!! Take a hot bath and everything will be OK!

:doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: There is no way on God's green earth that she'll be released in 30 days. Probably not in 30 years.

 

[Jules]

:doh: :doh: :doh: :doh:

Agree.... :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh:

And I'll raise ya :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: