TX - Hailey Dunn, 13, Colorado City, 27 Dec 2010 - #25

[winterrose]

She would have had to press charges against him,it's that way here anyway.

 

[captdj]

SBM-

Because she doesn't want anyone to judge her or slander her. Has she said this in MSM? or only to her friend CZ? I can't remember now...

TIA!

I think we are more interested in SA and if he threaten Hailey...
This is what is important about this report..
For Hailey sake we need the truth....

Billie say SA didnt threaten to Kill Hailey
LE says SA admitted to saying he wanted to kill them BOTH...

 

[SubtleGrace]

Oh you won't see me casting stones.. I'm not a bit better than anyone else and It certainly is never my place to judge what a person does or has done..

I am only attempting to come up with a reasonable idea of why she would lie..You ask did she tell MSM or just CZ and there is quite a list that we have heard and seen for ourselves.{i.e. just one example off top of my head is the illegal drug purchase made in Snyder}.. it is in the affidavit that she voluntarily is the one whom gave LE this info{that she withdrew $140 and purchased illegal drugs for her and SA}..

But for there to be a police report{including SA admitting that he had INDEED DONE WHAT HE WAS ACCUSED OF DOING}
filed when SA threatened to kill Billie and Hailey Feb 2010.. and she is stating this NEVER HAPPENED..

There is no judging whatsoever..It is straight up bewilderment on my part why she is choosing to lie at such an important and dire time in her child's life.. and that is whats being discussed..Ive seen some slanderous and libelous statements made about Billie but you're not gonna hear them coming from me

I think it matters a lot who she is lying to. I have heard her skirt the issue about the drugs to MSM, but not outright lie. In the aff., she admits to the illegal drugs, according to LE. So she did not lie to them about that. CZ says that Billie says no drugs (or something to that effect, can't remember, so tired...). So, Billie is obviously lying to CZ. Why would she do that? Because she doesn't want to be judged by her friend. That is why I would do it, if I were Billie. I did not mean to imply you were judging her. I meant that Billie does not want to be judged. Sorry for the confusion.

 

[txsvicki]

I don't blame her for not wanting to be talked badly about in the media, but getting the truth out of BD during interviews reminds me of trying to question a teenager. She won't answer about buying illegals drugs, but says they went to her mother's house and were only there for about 15 minutes. What if another person didn't use their own prescription and gave it to Billie, or she paid for the price of the rx. Cops would still consider it illegal to have someone else's pain pills or whatever.

 

[Simply Caustic]

Sounds to me like Billie is just being very literal and downplaying the death threats. She says that the death threat is not even the reason that 911 was called. She probably is telling the truth, but other additional things may have been said to the officer who showed up. The whole incident shows a guy who thought he had control of it all, even the debit cards, and when caught started making wild threats. Adding the info about a stolen debit card makes it all sound even worse and dysfunctional.

You know, BeanE had posted (yesterday? The day before? Gosh I'm losing it I have no idea when LOL) regarding Billie and, as you say, being 'very literal.' (Great way of putting it, I couldn't put it into words).
I'm going to summarize what MOO of BeanE's take on it was, since I can't find the post...but basically she was saying, Billie isn't answering the question as posed to her...she's replying in a roundabout way, like she did in regards to the question posed to her by Nancy Grace re: the prescriptions....and Nancy asked her a direct question, she answers a completely different question, but on the same subject...so although not technically lying, it's obfuscation IMO.
Re-reading what I wrote, I'm going to stalk down BeanE's post, as mine is (gasp!) closer to something the illustrious Anthony family would come up with

 

[impatientredhead]

She would have had to press charges against him,it's that way here anyway.

Techinically I think the state and the bank can proceed without you, but without you saying and maintaining that it was done without your permission it is not going to go anywhere.

Just like they can pursue domestic violence charges without you pressing charges but if the woman refuses to testify or cooperate it makes the odds of the case going forward less likely. Not impossible, but less likely.

 

[BOTLOF]

Now this makes no freaking sense to me at all. We have been told repeatedly that there is no internet at that house. To use the XBox to chat and play games with others you have to have internet access!!! So, if there was no internet, why in the blazes would LE take DD's XBox? And please don't say it was to see how long Hailey was on the game that Sunday night, because that info can be accessed by copying the hard drive info onto a memory card or flash drive.

So, what possible reason in the whole wide world would LE take a freaking XBox??????

Many devices have date/time stamps. Even if the date/time is incorrect (such as never set due to the lack of a network connection), they can trace the time based on the default date/time when the system was first started. This can give investigators an idea of all the times the xbox was turned on. Not to mention the hidden features that are planted into systems to help LE when needed.

 

[winterrose]

Techinically I think the state and the bank can proceed without you, but without you saying and maintaining that it was done without your permission it is not going to go anywhere.

Just like they can pursue domestic violence charges without you pressing charges but if the woman refuses to testify or cooperate it makes the odds of the case going forward less likely. Not impossible, but less likely.

You can't here,you have to press charges.I've complained to the police enough about a neighbor who keeps arguing and fighting w/her bf outside.LE comes,she does nothing.I asked LE why don't they just haul him in,they said they can't unless she presses charges.And BD would have to tell the bank he used her card without her permission for him to get in trouble.

 

[Texas Mist]

Don't know if this has been answered already, BUT.....the XBox has the ability to go online. While I understand that it's been stated there's no internet connection in the home - my son's Wii (not precisely the same but FWIW) can pick up WiFi, so that they may have been able to use someone else's unsecured internet w/ it, and also, my son's unit saves his history/messages in there - such as, he could play Mario Kart against a 'friend' by going online w/ the Wii --or he could be on YouTube with the Wii. Both entirely possible and easy to find out w/ the unit.

So even though they don't have internet access, the past history could be important to review in case there was current/past internet interaction with someone germaine (sp?) to the case

(note: I am confident there's no random internet stalker perp in this case, and that the threat was much, much closer than that and more nefarious...SA...I also want to point out, what if Hailey had been messaging a friend of hers on the XBox, or what if SA had slipped up using the XBox himself and Googled something on it at a pivotal time....I think that the XBox could be very useful and I'd be livid had it NOT been taken by the police.)

I don't think they come w/ built-in Wifi capability but it's possible they had an adapter for Wifi.

And as far as saving the data, what I've read of computer forensics, LE saves off the data as an image, not just copied files...I don't think they take the equipment necessary w/ them to do this which is why they seize potential evidence & take it with them.

ITA - it wouldn't be thorough police work if they didn't seize it.

 

[captdj]

I was referring to your question "So, what possible reason in the whole wide world would LE take a freaking XBox??????".

Correct me if I'm wrong, it depends on the model of the Xbox - games can be saved to the hard drive, so it wouldn't matter if it had been connected to the internet or not.

I didn't realize your point was "why are they keeping the xbox as evidence?" (instead of why did they take it)....it's the wee hours here for me, too. LOL

Why Would LE take the xbox?
:skip: me me me raising my hand..

9PM Hailey playing xbox in living room and DD guesses she would play that game for 3 more hours because of her skill level...

Then at 10PM Billie says Hailey was watching TV in her room...

If the xbox shows that it was active being played after 9PM say until 11pm then the 10PM sighting of Hailey watching TV in her bedroom may have not been correct???

 

[SubtleGrace]

I am getting very confused by comments about "what Billie said".

In my opinion only comments by Billie made to LE or MSM should be compared to known facts, or each other.

Because this is getting very convoluted.

KWIM?

I am not trying to act like a mod here, not my intention. I think it would be helpful if we all at least clarified our posts so we know if Billie said x to LE or MSM, or if Billie said x to CZ.

 

[Simply Caustic]

I don't blame her for not wanting to be talked badly about in the media, but getting the truth out of BD during interviews reminds me of trying to question a teenager. She won't answer about buying illegals drugs, but says they went to her mother's house and were only there for about 15 minutes. What if another person didn't use their own prescription and gave it to Billie, or she paid for the price of the rx. Cops would still consider it illegal to have someone else's pain pills or whatever.

Surely still is illegal, you got it, even if she/he didn't pay for the pills - consideration ($) isn't required to make it illegal, possession is.

Furthermore, the $140 or whatever it was: Here in Chicago, the street value varies greatly from one type of med to another, but generally speaking..and this is a generality....$.50 to $1/per milligram is a good rule of thumb. The popular pain meds such as Oxys - precisely the going rate. Norcos 10mg go for about 5. The benzos, (anxiety meds) are usually gong to cost anywhere from about 3 to 7 depending on how many you get - (oh yes, like Sam's Club, there's a discount for bulk purchases.)
So I really wonder if that 140 wasn't for a handful of Oxy's - the 40mg pills are sold here in 4 packs for 140.
Totally conjecture, and MOO and all that: But when Billie said 'I don't even know when I filled that prescription' at the tail-end of Nancy's question - I was reminded of how many addicts will run out of their script's early, and I was wondering if Billie replied like that out of fear that they'd notice her pill bottle was depleted more than it should be, given the date of refill.
Then again, I think SA went to work the following morning to pickup more of his drug of choice: Only reason I could fathom going to work for ten min. that morning -- to stave off withdrawals.

 

[SubtleGrace]

Why Would LE take the xbox?
:skip: me me me raising my hand..

9PM Hailey playing xbox in living room and DD guesses she would play that game for 3 more hours because of her skill level...

Then at 10PM Billie says Hailey was watching TV in her room...

If the xbox shows that it was active being played after 9PM say until 11pm then the 10PM sighting of Hailey watching TV in her bedroom may have not been correct???

Bingo!!! I think we have a winna here!!!!!

I forgot all about that. Now, did Billie say that in MSM or to CZ? TIA

 

[Simply Caustic]

I don't think they come w/ built-in Wifi capability but it's possible they had an adapter for Wifi.

And as far as saving the data, what I've read of computer forensics, LE saves off the data as an image, not just copied files...I don't think they take the equipment necessary w/ them to do this which is why they seize potential evidence & take it with them.

ITA - it wouldn't be thorough police work if they didn't seize it.

You're right, the XBox 360 (had to creep into the front room and check it out) has a Wifi adapter on it - I'm recalling my annoyance at the extra $50 cost!

ITA as far as saving the data, but with regards to the XBox, I don't think you can save the data as an image: But I could be wrong. I know they will seize the items until they make their copies, and then return them, in cases of computers and such...but I can't recall regarding game consoles. Hmmm, I wonder... especially since it's not a matter of merely the Internet data but also, the actual game-play on the console (to figure out when she stopped playing).

 

[SmoothOperator]

I guess after seeing those vids,I'd be freaked out that any of that bunch could get in the house.

Right on, winterrose.. That is a scary thought..

*but in the wee early morning hours your above post elicited a loud chuckle from me..I needed a little comedic relief..tho the bunch we're speaking of certainly nothing funny about them but I think a little case of deliriousness
combined with your specific words..well,its just funny..I'm still smiling and giggling..Thanks

 

[Texas Mist]

Sounds to me like Billie is just being very literal and downplaying the death threats. She says that the death threat is not even the reason that 911 was called. She probably is telling the truth, but other additional things may have been said to the officer who showed up. The whole incident shows a guy who thought he had control of it all, even the debit cards, and when caught started making wild threats. Adding the info about a stolen debit card makes it all sound even worse and dysfunctional.

I'm sleepy too, but too wound up to sleep, IYKWIM...but if I get this debit card incident right, that was before he moved in....hmmm - he has her PIN to her debit card, which I guess there's a good reason for that right?

I just keep mulling that over because DBF & I have been together for years, and he doesn't want my PIN, and I'd have to be in dire straits to give it to him. Not that we don't trust each other, we just respect each other's boundaries and see no reason for creating problems down the road.

The control issue does sound very plausible, for sure.

 

[Simply Caustic]

You can't here,you have to press charges.I've complained to the police enough about a neighbor who keeps arguing and fighting w/her bf outside.LE comes,she does nothing.I asked LE why don't they just haul him in,they said they can't unless she presses charges.And BD would have to tell the bank he used her card without her permission for him to get in trouble.

FWIW, LE can most definitely haul him in, and press charges FOR her, without her permission, if the State's Attorney deems it necessary to do so: Commonly called here 'picking up the case.' Such as, 'Mary wanted to drop the domestic violence charge again Bob but the state picked up the case.' It's not very common except in (IMO, MOO and all that) instances where the defendant has a very violent history, and/or where there's good reason to think that the complaintant is dropping the charge because she was intimidated by the defendant...I have personally seen quite a few of those, where the girlfriend is scared because the BF is a gangbanger or has threatened her, but she won't admit that's why - yet the BF has a past charge of intimidation of a witness, so the state picks up the case and prosecute's without the complaining witness.
I'd be astounded to hear, however, that the State picked it up on a sheerly verbal confrontation, and the first domestic call between the two individuals (I'm assuming it's the first call, since we've not heard of any others).
MOO and all that jazz.

 

[SubtleGrace]

I'm sleepy too, but too wound up to sleep, IYKWIM...but if I get this debit card incident right, that was before he moved in....hmmm - he has her PIN to her debit card, which I guess there's a good reason for that right?

I just keep mulling that over because DBF & I have been together for years, and he doesn't want my PIN, and I'd have to be in dire straits to give it to him. Not that we don't trust each other, we just respect each other's boundaries and see no reason for creating problems down the road.

The control issue does sound very plausible, for sure.

Can't we get a copy of the 911 call? Would clear a lot of things up!

 

[Simply Caustic]

This is called a control question. Did it happen during the first part of the poly? They do this because they know most people will have a reaction, so they can get a baseline on you. It is not so much about your answers as it is your response to the questions they are asking.

http://antipolygraph.org/index.shtml

I could be incorrect, I'm no expert whatsoever at polygraphs - but I would think it's NOT a control question - because those are normal questions which should establish a baseline for me. However, I should not be afraid of any of the questions on the test, because I work in the Dept. of Corrections and would be immediately terminated if I had, in fact, committed any of the acts in questions (smuggling in contraband, allowing inmates to smoke, accepted money from an inmate, etc). You know what I mean? So I think it was asked not as a control question, but instead to see what my reaction was, and if I was scared, to note that. Just my two cents and all that.
FWIW I think Billie was asked that question because after showing up for the initial poly under the influence of narcotics, and then her (reportedly by LE) deceitful answers on the poly, that that question was an entirely appropriate question for BOTH reasons. If you show up high for a LDT while your child is missing, and then the second test is showing signs of deception (as the polygrapher would be able to note immediately, given that he is administering the test), you may very well be afraid of the questions on the test.
Shoot, she could still be innocent (devil's advocate here, I don't incidentally believe she is). But an innocent reply could have been, Yes (she was scared of some questions)
and when he asked are you scared of being asked.....if you had anything to do with your daughter's disapperance, etc.? she could have said no
but when he asked, are you afraid of being asked about your drug history?
She could have said 'yes'. That'd be an innocent explanation for her nervousness, even if she were entirely uninvolved in Hailey's disappearance.
Sadly, I don't think that was the case at all. I think she was afraid of being asked questions -- in general. Why else show up high to the first test? MOO and all that

 

[captdj]

Bingo!!! I think we have a winna here!!!!!

I forgot all about that. Now, did Billie say that in MSM or to CZ? TIA

Ok cant take the credit for that....I read it on BeanE timeline in the last thread....

I have to sleep now I cant think or type....see ya tommorrow..

Maybe tomorrow will be the day and Hailey comes home safe.