TX TX - Julie Moseley, 9, Mary Trlica, 17, Lisa Wilson, 14, Fort Worth, 23 Dec 1974 #7

[Valiant]

JMO, if TT posted the letter that evening, I don't think it would have arrived at Minot Drive by the next morning. That would be too quick, IMO, due to the huge volume of Christmas packages and cards that would be in the system at the time.

I don't think the letter ever went through the system...I think the envelope did though, probably with a Christmas card in it.

It is possible, probably unlikely.
The Post Office operated a lot different back then. Mail could travel directly from one small Post Office to another. Now it all goes to central processing locations, no matter how close the two Post Offices may be.

 

[Brightchaser47]

JMO, if TT posted the letter that evening, I don't think it would have arrived at Minot Drive by the next morning. That would be too quick, IMO, due to the huge volume of Christmas packages and cards that would be in the system at the time.

The envelope was postmarked and arrived on the 24th. This has been confirmed. Whether it actually traveled through the mail, or was "placed" in the mailbox--on the 24th-- is up for debate (IMO). Also up for debate is  when the letter was written. I still think it was written by TT sometime between the mall parking lot gathering  late on the 23rd, and the next morning. I also think he could've picked up a postmarked envelope, during that same time period, and either mailed it to himself, or placed it in his own mailbox, at some point (pretending to "check the mail").
There are differing versions of  how the letter was received (in or out of the envelope), as well as who actually saw it when it arrived. I would very much like to see that straightened out
.

I don't think the letter ever went through the system..

Very possible.

.I think the envelope did though,

Highly likely, but not an absolute.

probably with a Christmas card in it.

I don't think so. IIRC, measurements of the envelope were a bit off, for a Christmas card (but I could be mistaken).

 

[beubeubeu]

DA took two polygraphs (one of which she walked out of), one or both of which was allegedly inconclusive (she claims she passed). That's not a real shocker to me, at this point. What puzzles me is,  why was TT given  three of them ( all of which he passed)? After he passed the first one, you'd think that would be the end of it.  Maybe a second one, if there were questions about how it was administered, interpreted, etc. But  three?
. Was there something about DA's responses that made LE take a closer look at TT? If I'm not mistaken, DA only took/finished hers after being pressured to do so. Was there any reluctance on his part to take them?

Three polygraphs could be simply cause of new developments in the case = new, previously unanswered questions to ask. Unless these polygraphs weren't so far apart in time...
OR it could be some local custom to do so many. It's rather unusual considering whats in the coverage of other cases, but maybe it doesn't stood out as much when compared to other cases from Fort Worth?

 

[T rex]

I'm still leaning toward the idea TT wrote the letter that night, and mailed the envelope from the kiosk, after meeting with the others (families and LE) at the mall parking lot,

I think it's likely that the envelope was mailed immediately after the car was staged at the mall.

I don't think the letter ever went through the system...I think the envelope did though, probably with a Christmas card in it.

This is a possibility that I don't like all that much. An envelope arrived wthout a return address and mailed from SS right when they needed it. That's just a little too much luck for me.

 

[beubeubeu]

Also, there was mention (in a number of sources) of Rachel's and Renee's families camping together at Benbrook Lake in the summer. Is this accurate? If so, did they have permanent, rented spots with camping trailers, or did it change, depending on what was available?

May be exagerrated or downplayed. Hard to say since W's weren't talking much and RA is iffy as a source while likely an original source for other ones. It sounded like they just went there, picked a spot and camped near lake for a bit - occasionally with W's nearby but he wasn't saying it as they were planning to go and camp together to spend time together. He had to pretty young then.

 

[beubeubeu]

I think it's likely that the envelope was mailed immediately after the car was staged at the mall.

Depends on the schedule of the nearby post office where they collected the mail from kiosk. Afternoon load should theoretically ended up in the evening and should be stamped with 23rd. LE would know for sure if they bothered to go and talk to some workers there. It should be not nearly as much doubt about it as there is.

 

[Brightchaser47]

I think it's likely that the envelope was mailed immediately after the car was staged at the mall.

The car was staged ( if it was staged) before about 6:00 pm, on the 23rd. The envelope was postmarked the 24th. At what time did P.O. start postmarking for the next day? Afternoon seems a bit early...

 

[beubeubeu]

Something that bothers  me about the letter, is that while some family members are  certain that TT wrote it (those same family members claimed to have seen samples of Rachel's  and TT's handwriting), the "experts" (FBI) had access to "piles" of samples of Rachel's and TT's handwriting, and  their findings were inconclusive. Shouldn't FBI handwriting experts be able to tell
1. Whether more than one person wrote the letter?
2. Whether or not Rachel wrote the letter under duress?
3. Whether or not TT wrote the letter?

It's pretty small sample. Since they're unable to tell for sure, then it's hard for me to believe that it looks "nothing like her handwriting".
It would make sense if it was pretty similar to TT's (or to other people), yet different under closer inspection. Then its more believeable that A's and TT at first were sure that she wrote it, to later deny that completely.
Its worth remembering that as soon as they handed it over to the investigator, they likely had no way of looking at it and actually comparing, so having to rely on that first impression that it's her handwriting.
So receiving it, reading, being all emotional about what's in the note, likely more than about note itself, calling cops, giving it away... and seeing it again only after it was pretty much obvious that girls had no further conntact, havent came back, so much better time to suspect that letter may be forged: so samples of her handwriting delivered to LE, maybe then looking at it again and noticing some differencies.

 

[Brightchaser47]

May be exagerrated or downplayed. Hard to say since W's weren't talking much and RA is iffy as a source while likely an original source for other ones. It sounded like they just went there, picked a spot and camped near lake for a bit - occasionally with W's nearby but he wasn't saying it as they were planning to go and camp together to spend time together. He had to pretty young then.

I thought maybe if there was a spot they camped a lot(or found  while they were camping), the girls might go there to hang out, and possibly meet someone. It would likely be more private than, say, the mall.

 

[beubeubeu]

It seems much more likely that letter/envelope was mailed late on the 23rd or early night 24th, collected, sorted and delivered these few miles in the matter of hours (or later, if the version of envelope being delivered to LE only after Christmas) than to have a random letter, maybe with Christmas card in it:
- mailed just to TT (not him and his wife as Christmas cards mostly are, especially considering that he was married for years at the time, with short break in between):
- conveniently from that specific mailbox at the SS,
- in a perfect time,
- coincidentally written with highly similar handwriting (the theory of it coming from some old, local, unknown acquaintance of TT's parents is bit iffy, cause till now nobody has any idea who could it be, nobody claimed it, and older generation should have significantly different style of handwriting cause of calligraphy at school, shouldn't they?)

 

[beubeubeu]

I thought maybe if there was a spot they camped a lot(or found  while they were camping), the girls might go there to hang out, and possibly meet someone. It would likely be more private than, say, the mall.

Too far, RA was once describing going back to that spot I believe, and some serious driving around took place. It didn't sound like it was just near the road, easily accessible and convenient to hang out.

 

[beubeubeu]

BTW with today's technology they should be able to tell with certaintity: was that note in the envelope or not. If they've done the testing.
And with 70's technology they likely should be able to tell if the note was inside when the address was written on it.

 

[beubeubeu]

DA took two polygraphs (one of which she walked out of), one or both of which was allegedly inconclusive (she claims she passed). That's not a real shocker to me, at this point. What puzzles me is,  why was TT given  three of them ( all of which he passed)? After he passed the first one, you'd think that would be the end of it.  Maybe a second one, if there were questions about how it was administered, interpreted, etc. But  three?
. Was there something about DA's responses that made LE take a closer look at TT? If I'm not mistaken, DA only took/finished hers after being pressured to do so. Was there any reluctance on his part to take them?

Wait, was the polygraph she walked out of same one, which she was essentially bullied into taking? Same one with RA and DJ all over it?

 

[beubeubeu]

And was anyone else polygraphed? If they liked these test so much, why not give it to ST, CJG when he was still around, both security guards, FA and few more?

 

[Brightchaser47]

Too far, RA was once describing going back to that spot I believe, and some serious driving around took place. It didn't sound like it was just near the road, easily accessible and convenient to hang out.

I didn't think Benbrook Lake was that big an area. Could he have gotten turned around, looking for that particular spot?

 

[Brightchaser47]

And was anyone else polygraphed? If they liked these test so much, why not give it to ST, CJG when he was still around, both security guards, FA and few more?

Did ST give statements to both DJ and LE? If so, were they consistent? There was a claim that DJ had a statement from her that she denied writing (IIRC).

 

[FW_Froggy]

Wait, was the polygraph she walked out of same one, which she was essentially bullied into taking? Same one with RA and DJ all over it?

I don't think DA was the kind of Gal to be bullied.

 

[FW_Froggy]

Did ST give statements to both DJ and LE? If so, were they consistent? There was a claim that DJ had a statement from her that she denied writing (IIRC).

DA claims that she was drilled by both LE and the FBI.

 

[Brightchaser47]

DA claims that she was drilled by both LE and the FBI.

I was referring to ST. DA took a polygraph for FWPD in 2001 or 2002, and FBI a year or two later (IIRC).

 

[Brightchaser47]

For someone who, "by her own admission" was one of the last people to see the girls that day, ST seems to have escaped close scrutiny (in my opinion). Her 12:30 pm Minot sighting is  impossible, if the girls went to the mall, after the A/N Store. If the girls were killed  anytime that afternoon at Minot, her story is impossible. So either
1. Something happened to those girls that afternoon at Minot, and ST lied to protect someone,  or
2. ST was way off regarding the time of day she saw them, and they  were at Minot sometime that afternoon, but left, met trouble elsewhere, and the car was taken back to the mall and staged.