Found Deceased TX - PFC Vanessa Guillen, 20, Fort Hood military base, items left behind, 22 Apr 2020 *arrests* #3

[jondaba]

But seriously, do you honestly believe AR didn't harass or abuse any other females prior to what took place with VG?

I am a little old fashioned. I don't mistake my own beliefs for reality. You and I have the same knowledge of the actual facts as to whether AR harassed or abused any female soldiers prior to his murdering VG = NONE. You seem to need to believe he did - I don't need to believe that.
I don't need to believe the murder of VG was about sexual harassment. It wasn't about the milieu in Army and it wasn't about the fear of reporting sexual harassment.
It seems to me that independent of any sexual harassment that may transpire at Ft. Hood, poor Vanessa had the bad luck to be tricked into going to the armory of a young psychopath who had become fixated on her - and he murdered her.

 

[cvaldez1975]

The statement was appropriate. The lowest female enlisted all the way up to the top female officers in all branches know harassment exists and is a serious problem, women coming out in droves to post their experiences (#IAmVanessaGuillen) proves that. Posting a memorial to one captain doesn’t negate it or make it less of a problem.

yup pretty anecdotal. im sure capt. moreno dealt w inappropriate behavior in her career. RIP

 

[cvaldez1975]

double post

 

[Boxer]

I am a little old fashioned. I don't mistake my own beliefs for reality. You and I have the same knowledge of the actual facts as to whether AR harassed or abused any female soldiers prior to his murdering VG = NONE. You seem to need to believe he did - I don't need to believe that.
I don't need to believe the murder of VG was about sexual harassment. It wasn't about the milieu in Army and it wasn't about the fear of reporting sexual harassment.
It seems to me that independent of any sexual harassment that may transpire at Ft. Hood, poor Vanessa had the bad luck to be tricked into going to the armory of a young psychopath who had become fixated on her - and he murdered her.

Agree.
MOO AR fixated in a sexual way. Harrassing her on the way to his crazy escalation.

Also, CA was publicly looking for men, and apparently trying to sell feet pictures.
MOO AR wasn't CAs boyfriend in any traditional sense, though they were obviously close and at least friends in business.
Odd that after helping him with such a gruesome thing, she sold him out rather quickly.
So I wonder.

 

[cvaldez1975]

I am a little old fashioned. I don't mistake my own beliefs for reality. You and I have the same knowledge of the actual facts as to whether AR harassed or abused any female soldiers prior to his murdering VG = NONE. You seem to need to believe he did - I don't need to believe that.
I don't need to believe the murder of VG was about sexual harassment. It wasn't about the milieu in Army and it wasn't about the fear of reporting sexual harassment.
It seems to me that independent of any sexual harassment that may transpire at Ft. Hood, poor Vanessa had the bad luck to be tricked into going to the armory of a young psychopath who had become fixated on her - and he murdered her.

i dont think you are a woman in the military. if all the testimonials of the stuff they have faced dont register on your radar in this case, i dont know what to tell you. you arent changing any minds just as no one is changing yours. maybe scroll and roll to the offending posts from women who think this is a case of sexual harrassment.

 

[Midwestmom2019]

According to the article in the media thread, lawmakers said that after Guillen's case, many current and former service members shared their experiences of sexual assault and harrassment in the military and it shined a light on a "troubling reality."

They are asking that the Department of Defense conduct an independent investigation into Fort Hood's handling of the case.

Soon after Vanessa's body was found the army announced that a team of seven investigators were going to examine the SHARP program and assess whether the the command climate is supportive of soldiers reporting incidents and identify and problems with the program.

It may take a long time before we know whether they found any problems or whether or not they believe sexual harrassment was connected to the murder.

They may find that there is in fact a significant problem with reporting incidents of sexual harrassment but it had no connection to the case.

If there are witnesses who knew that Vanessa was being harassed, they may feel safer talking to investigators outside of the army.

Either way, it's clear that changes need to be made so hopefully in the end there will be some progress.

I'm so sorry your cousin went through that. ETA: Maybe VG's death can bring about some kind of change. Maybe.

Maybe is not an option. Change will start only when top brass mandates a change. Base commander has to make it happen. Not delegate down the line. Soldiers need to report. Up the line and horizontally. So that there are multiple avenues of reporting. And multiple records of the incidents being made simultaneously. Network record keeping inside the military and outside as well. And multiple sources to secure the information so that it’s not buried somewhere, and lost. Report to military. Civilian family and friends. Send pictures on phones everywhere. Make hell for the perp. And anyone that’s covering for them. This is not limited to women. I bet there are gay/lesbian assaults as well. If the military can’t fix it, get outside assistance. Special Prosecutors from the JAG team. Pull the cloak of secrecy off of this crime. Expose it everywhere.

 

[Midwestmom2019]

But seriously, do you honestly believe AR didn't harass or abuse any other females prior to what took place with VG?

If all of them reported him, multiple times, MAYBE someone would have noticed and done something.

 

[m00c0w]

The deviant sexual environment was created by the base command structure turning a blind eye to a prostitution ring run by Army personnel and a system that punished victims of sexual harassment and assault rather than the perpetrators. I wasn’t talking specifically about AR’s actions, but the atmosphere that allowed him to feel he might get away with whatever he chose to do.

IMO

What?

“Base leadership” had the prostitution ring shut down before it even started. It was fully investigated and he was sent to jail and dishonorably discharged. How is that “turning a blind eye”?

 

[jondaba]

i dont think you are a woman in the military. if all the testimonials of the stuff they have faced dont register on your radar in this case, i dont know what to tell you. you arent changing any minds just as no one is changing yours. maybe scroll and roll to the offending posts from women who think this is a case of sexual harrassment.

 

[jondaba]

Lets say that 100 women soldiers were sexually harassed by 100 men soldiers.

Does that prove that AR sexually harassed VG prior to the day he murdered her?

Other than the OTHER women who were harassed by OTHER men, please identify your evidence that prior to murdering poor VG on April 22, AR had sexually harassed VG.

 

[AmandaReckonwith]

The memorial in Houston at Taqueria del Sol is huge.

 

[California Sunset]

The first step to fixing the problem is acknowledging you have one - the Army has not ....
JMO

The answer to your comment in a way is: The UCMJ is there, but the people running the companies or smaller units possibly do not let their females know how to proceed. The army knows there is a problem, steps are in place, but the little people either aren't aware of what they can do or their immediate superiors are stumbling blocks. There is a 'clog' in the chain of command or whatever. The message isn't getting the whole way from the victim to those willing and able to discipline the perpetrators.

 

[windrower]

I missed where AR said that he felt "might get away with whatever he chose to do". Did he express that feeling? I haven't seen it on this thread.

Well, common sense says that, IMO, most criminals feel they might get away with their criminal behavior. AR apparently engaged in criminal behavior, ergo, IMO, he thought he might get away with his crime. And by his alleged actions, he certainly tried to cover up and get away with his criminal behavior. IMO.

What?

“Base leadership” had the prostitution ring shut down before it even started. It was fully investigated and he was sent to jail and dishonorably discharged. How is that “turning a blind eye”?

bbm

So there was no prostitution ring? I must have misunderstood.

 

[m00c0w]

Well, common sense says that, IMO, most criminals feel they might get away with their criminal behavior. AR apparently engaged in criminal behavior, ergo, IMO, he thought he might get away with his crime. And by his alleged actions, he certainly tried to cover up and get away with his criminal behavior. IMO.



bbm

So there was no prostitution ring? I must have misunderstood.

He attempted to start one. Nearly every article states the same thing - CID caught on and shut it down before he could actually do it.

 

[Midwestmom2019]

He attempted to start one. Nearly every article states the same thing - CID caught on and shut it down before he could actually do it.

And no court martial?

 

[Ninja Bunny]

There have been multiple prostitution rings at Ft Hood. There’s a pimp operating on every on-base corner it seems.

 

[California Sunset]

I am a little old fashioned. I don't mistake my own beliefs for reality. You and I have the same knowledge of the actual facts as to whether AR harassed or abused any female soldiers prior to his murdering VG = NONE. You seem to need to believe he did - I don't need to believe that.
I don't need to believe the murder of VG was about sexual harassment. It wasn't about the milieu in Army and it wasn't about the fear of reporting sexual harassment.
It seems to me that independent of any sexual harassment that may transpire at Ft. Hood, poor Vanessa had the bad luck to be tricked into going to the armory of a young psychopath who had become fixated on her - and he murdered her.

You and I have nothing in common unless you were a female sexually assaulted in the military and you have a degree in Administration of Justice, etc. Do any of these apply to you? I have additional educational and employment history that benefits me. Do you?
I know: Statistically speaking, a killer doesn't just pop off one day and kill someone. They usually work their way up to it. They may start out torturing or killing small animals, having verbal then physical altercations with various people, then they could go on to physical or sexual assault, then perhaps rape, and at some point they may 'accidentally' or on purpose, they kill someone. They work their way up to murder under most circumstances.
Show me your resume and then tell me you and I have the same knowledge. If that's the case, I'll go back to school and get another degree or two.

In the meantime, Let me alone. I'm done dealing with you.

 

[insearchoflight]

Lets say that 100 women soldiers were sexually harassed by 100 men soldiers.

Does that prove that AR sexually harassed VG prior to the day he murdered her?

Other than the OTHER women who were harassed by OTHER men, please identify your evidence that prior to murdering poor VG on April 22, AR had sexually harassed VG.

Well she told her mom she was being sexually harassed by a superior and then she ends up chopped up in a shallow grave by a man who is her superior. So.... it’s not a reach to make this link here. No, we don’t have concrete evidence yet, but I’d eat my hat if it weren’t true. Moo

 

[California Sunset]

There have been multiple prostitution rings at Ft Hood. There’s a pimp operating on every on-base corner it seems.

Pardon me, but, how in the world do they get away with that on a military base? Things do not sound better to me.

 

[California Sunset]

Well she told her mom she was being sexually harassed by a superior and then she ends up chopped up in a shallow grave by a man who is her superior. So.... it’s not a reach to make this link here. No, we don’t have concrete evidence yet, but I’d eat my hat if it weren’t true. Moo

AR was not her superior. He was only a Spc.4, I heard he was in another unit. He was a 20 year old sexually frustrated %$!@& with no authority over anyone.
I'm sure if I misinterpreted this, I'll hear about it from someone. (I refer to the not a superior, in another unit, with 'no authority over anyone', the rest is JMHO, and I'm allowed to that.)