TX - Terri 'Missy' Bevers, 45, killed in church/suspect in SWAT gear, Midlothian, 18 Apr 2016 #46

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  • #801
I’m not active on this case but have followed from the beginning.
My father-in-law was a member at Creekside and I’ve been there several times over the years.

I’ve never felt that this was a burglary gone bad or random opportunistic killing. I’ve felt that Missy was absolutely targeted.

My theory is that it was someone obsessed. Not obsessed with Missy though.
Obsessed with BB.

Thoughts?
bbm
What do you think exactly: did the SP want to punish BB or did he want to free BB from Missy?
 
  • #802
bbm
What do you think exactly: did the SP want to punish BB or did he want to free BB from Missy?

Someone sympathetic to and obsessed with BB who got rid of Missy to free BB.

Just a theory though.
 
  • #803
Someone sympathetic to and obsessed with BB who got rid of Missy to free BB.

Just a theory though.
I don't think this possibility has been given as much consideration as it deserves.

Likewise I dont think the theory is remote as the "hobby interest" of both individuals can generate emotions- and then actions in some participants that are not always logical, proportional, consistent or realistic.

The only "downside" to your idea is that it adds to the complexity of the investigation.
 
  • #804
IF the SP (or the initiator/client) had in mind, to free BB, then the husband will be able to guess, who did it for him. He might not be informed, who SP is, if the killer was hired. Can BB be thankful for the gruesome "Free-B!"-action? Financially it might have been a huge help, indeed.
BB's thoughts are still circling around his poor girls and his m-i-l, it seemed to me, when I saw part of the interview-video. Did he use Missy's name one single time - Idk.
 
  • #805
I am wondering, whether the killer left something other than "tools" behind at the location the murder took place.
Something they were possibly carrying around or picking up.

-Nin
 
  • #806
Means, Motive and Opportunity
Although motive is not a requirement, juries typically want to learn of one or two.
Portions have been politely snipped.
If she normally got there at 4, why is SP only emerging 10 mins before that on the other side of the church and then proceeding to tour the church rather than looking for her?
Not all clues will fit the puzzle of the crime. It is up to us, as our role on this forum, to discern the limited clues we have in order to determine SPs motivations while in the church.
As far as you saying we can "approximate SP being along the Western Hallway", that is true if you are meaning to include the main entrance and the auditorium.
Yes, I believe the attack occurred in the W Hallway between the auditorium doors over to the front doors including near the NW corner.
[extracted]if SP has done all this planning and knows she normally gets there at 4 and knows (as I do) that the early birds were normally always on time and began promptly at 4:30, then why does SP behave the way they do and why do they not abort the "mission" when she hasn't shown by 4:15?<>
The early birds arrived at 4:35 that fateful morning. It seems folks were hampered somewhat by the torrential rain including Missy.
SP initially roams in a counter clockwise fashion. There was no noise made by Missy once SP entered the church nor as he emerges from the Kitchen in the N hallway. SP heads to the Western Hallway facing the SW entrance where MB would enter. There was no reason to abort the determined mission. SP was tough; not fearful, a willful pussyfooter; not a quitter.

They had no way of knowing whether the weather was going to allow the class to work out under the awning or if they were going to move inside. If you assume SP monitored Missy's FB, her last comment is that they have cover under the awning. <> So how is SP going to be able to plan for this? The answer is, they couldn't have.
That is not true because they did. In my opinion, the mission was well-planned but a particular date had not been settled upon. Someone (Person 1) gave the killer the notice that it was go-time which I feel happened early the evening prior but the green light signal could have been as soon as the weather forecast was made known.
Two major things occurred to make the timing perfect. The campers were moved indoors because of the torrential rain; even convincing one or more not to attend. The other, and perhaps the most important, is that BB would be out of town; thereby, providing an ironclad alibi.

Along with all the other circumstances that you believe SP controls, do you believe they controlled the weather too?
Seriously?
Dallas, TX Weather History | Weather Underground
3.17" of rain fell overnight and the winds blew up to 20-25mph. It is why BBs flight was stuck on the tarmac Sunday.
If SP intended to "confuse LEO" that this was an interrupted burglary, then why not do more to remove the ambiguity?
I'm not privy to the inner workings of SPs precise plan but apparently to SP, enough glass breakage and damage was done in order to lead others to believe it was a disrupted burglary, in which case, he succeeded.
It's intriguing that SP manages to breach the exterior Kitchen door but cannot breach the locked door in the W Hallway.

[extracted]If they want it to appear to be a burglary, then they seem to be shooting themselves in the foot.
SP did not shoot himself in the foot. SP sadistically shot and killed Missy.
They also could have<> They could have <>. For all the premeditation that you think SP put into this, they sure suck at being convincing.
Some people are convinced it was a disrupted burglary. Hence, SP managed to convince some folks, just not all.
And I disagree with you on it being "highly probable that MB entered the church every time."
On a clear day, would Missy use the tailgate of her truck to place sign in sheets, the forms for newbies to complete, etal? Did Missy use the restroom prior to exercising before classes began? Did Missy fill a jug of water and ice from the Kitchen? Did Missy enter the church in order to do any of this type of stuff prior to campers arriving? It's highly probable that she did enter the church.
All we know is that she unlocked the doors. But that did not require entering. <>Why would SP have a NEED for that?
In a premeditated murder theory, the SP planned for a B&E to appear as though the burglary went woefully wrong because the true purpose was a diabolical murder; not theft. Perhaps a mistake on the part of SP was that nothing was removed from the church during SPs inspections.
Are you thinking it's because a connection to Missy would be apparent and SP didn't want that?
Absolutely, SP did not want to be found connected to Missy. Missy was warned:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/new-video-timeline-released-in-terri-bevers-death-at-texas-church/
"Her husband had told her to be prepared. You know he had worried about something like that, that early in the morning," said [Marsha] Tucker."
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/mom-slain-church-had-marital-financial-issues-warrants-n569236
If BB purchased the firearm Missy kept in her truck prior to her death as we've been told that presents an impression of caring for her.
Two possible motives emerge in the SWs. LEO discovers text messages that there was financial struggle in the marriage and intimate relationships external to the marriage, according to SWs.
Jethro wrote in post # 788:

Thus, this leaves at least 8 minutes and 30 seconds to do whatever SP did with regard to Rooms 5, 4, and 3 and possibly the auditorium access at the NW corner - including the access door to where the AV people and equipment are setup for services, etc.
There is no logical reason for SP not to enter the office areas in order to search for cash as time permitted. SP was already inside the church so what's the harm in searching for a bonus of extra cash while there.
Police as far as we know have never pursued that theory; instead they pursued a target list of people all with a connection to Missy, and then BWH who they also believed would have targeted Missy. So if SP thought it was necessary to fake a burglary to avoid detection, why didn't their failure to pull off the fake burglary result in identification and arrest?
Who knows how many unsolved crimes there are due to lack of identity of the perpertrator?
April 21, 2016
https://news.yahoo.com/texas-fitness-trainer-missy-bevers-church-killing-134837318.html
"Police said it’s feasible Bevers could have interrupted a burglary in process, but that nothing from the church appears missing.<> Bevers posted that she would be at the church early Monday for her fitness class.
“We are excited to see all your smiling faces in the morning!” Bevers wrote, encouraging her students to be there rain or shine.
On Facebook, Camp Gladiator wrote, <>A top comment to that post -- “This story brings attention to the fact that
trainers arrive early and alone. And I’ll do a better job getting to camp early.”"
[extracted]I “lean toward it being untargeted.” Never once do I take the black and white position you do when you say something like “This particular murder was a premeditated attack on MB in order to end her life.” So tell me, who is the one who isn’t considering that they may be wrong? <>
Discovering there was a firearm used infers a killing would transpire. These threads contain opinions that changed to targeted once the usage of the gun was made known.
So you think SP would basically dress as what they are (or used to be) - LE or military. Does that seem smart to you?
If I opined it, then, yes, it seemed smart of SP to don the SWAT gear in order to prevent ID and depositing trace evidence. Although, SP could have other reasons in mind. I added that there was possible training involved. It doesn't necessarily require formal training. It could be as simple as target practice at a firing range or employment as a security guard, etal.
[extracted]I questioned why SP would go all over the place and not even seem to be aware of time or of entry location.
SPs meandering the hallways appears to be organized and methodical. SP was at the right place at the right time.
I’m not sure where you come up with the idea of SP looking at pictures of the church online, much less determining that it’s “highly likely”.
In this day of social media, it would be assumed that SP would take advantage of any online data that would further assure his nefarious plan would succeed. Crooks are known to possess blueprints of buildings they wish to breach.
As for “monetary gain from a targeted hit”, how do you suppose the hitman and the person who hired said hitman managed to get away with it for 5 years? With (1) no evidence of a financial transaction for police to find; and (2)No other people finding out about it despite the fact that you’ve involved more than one person in this thing; and (3) the fact that Person 1 managed to hire Hitman successfully without accidentally getting an undercover cop as they often do?
1) People are known to stash thousands of dollars, excess cash savings, in safe deposit boxes, in the refrigerator, under the mattress, buried in a tin can in the yard, and so forth; therefore, providing there'd be no paper trail.
2) Who would openly discuss that they hired the killer of Missy and chance being arrest for an accomplice to Murder 1? Why would SP want to reveal to anyone that he is responsible for viciously murdering a beautiful mother of 3; thereby, risking the Death Penalty in TX?
3) Until there is an arrest, we may never know how the agreement was made. It is doubtful Person 1 answered an ad on Craigslist, by example.

So far there is no proof that SP even knew who Missy was or expected her to come walking in, much less hating or despising her.
I posited the same in my response.
With new evidence that comes out,[extracted].
  • The gunshot came out - that didn’t really point one way or the other. Burglars carry guns, same as hitmen. Au Contraire. The gunshot(s) very much indicates an intentional hit on MB.
  • Details about the early bird campers came out. That upended the whole timeline. We could no longer think of SP has having plenty of cushion. A strike against targeted. The first early bird arrived at 4:35. It's in the Media Thread, pg 5. Hence, not sure how that upends the TL.
  • Details about the outside camera that wasn’t working came out. Turned out there was no possibility of tampering. Just bad luck. So there is a strike against targeted. Exterior non-working camera is Irrelevant.
  • Details about the mystery object came out. instead of some sort of Dexter-style kill box, it turned out to be a storage tray containing small, non-sharp tools that would not be helpful in a murder. A strike against targeted. Who knows what was in the white container? I've never read anyone insinuate it may have been a Dexter Morgan type kill box.
[extracted]So it’s not that I’m insisting on being right. I’m perfectly fine to be wrong.
Following an arrest, I'll rapidly report my sincere apologies for being wrong, if that turns out to be the case.
.
 
  • #807
This back-and-forth over targeted vs untargeted is so interesting. Seeing how the "facts" can be made to fit whichever assumption you start with, and so much of the proof for either side ends up being "because I said so," it looks to me like we have so little truly objective evidence that makes a difference, in a way to point us to one person and exclude others.

The possibilities are so broad. It was a male or female.They knew MB, or didn't. Or BB. They had a pre-existing reason to kill her, or didn't.

Some minor limitations do exist, but they are so broad. They were of medium height. They were of an age/health to be able to beat in a window and enter, walk the halls, try to pry or beat on doors and glass, and shoot a gun. They had obtained a costume and a gun. They were able to be in Midlothian on the day in question. Even the unusual gait - a possible further limiter - can't be assumed to be real, as significant as it looked on video, or permanent, per the expert who knows such things.

That narrows it down from 7.5 billion people in the world, to perhaps millions of adults of an appropriate age, health, and height in the right geography to have been able to be there that day and hour if they so chose.

There were people who were eliminated one at a time, because LE had the time and a reason to pursue whether they could have been there that day. But we just don't know enough to really matter. Not yet, anyhow.
 
  • #808
Maybe, we should look at the driving time, Missy would have needed from her location/home to the Midlothian church. If an accomplice spied on her, starting at Missy's home, and told SP via Walky Talky or similar (I have no idea of technology), when she started and when she was located at mile 1, 2, 3 and so on, SP was able to prepare for her arrival. The accomplice at the same time and quite in time would have arrived at the meeting point, where he could have waited for SP as his get-away-driver.

The car at the SWFA left the parking lot at a certain time. Did the driver have enough time to get to Missy's home, before Missy started? (I don't find the infos about exact times, when I need them ...)
 
  • #809
This back-and-forth over targeted vs untargeted is so interesting. Seeing how the "facts" can be made to fit whichever assumption you start with,...
@SteveS bbm sbm Thx for reading my mind & posting these thoughts.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^What SteveS said ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I appreciate the different detailed analyses and hope someday there will be a resolution w'in our criminal justice system.
 
  • #810
Anyone else find Dr. Michael Nirenberg's work to be intriguing?

Was his analysis helpful to the FBI?
Will he become a witness at the trial?
Why did it require the FBI to approach him and not MPD?

The good doctor from Indiana says the FBI sent him four different samples of people walking who were unaware they were being filmed. The samples included both genders. Only one of them could be the SP.

We know it wasn't BWH because they're done with that guy.
Can't help but wonder who the four people were, though.

 
  • #811
My impression is that the one "possible match" on the gait the podiatrist had identified was BWH. But he was ruled out for other reasons, apparently.

What made you think it was only 4 possibilities that he has been asked about? If there was a number given in this video, I sure missed it.

So far it would seem he has been useful, to eliminate some possibilities for them, but the main goal certainly hasn't been achieved (to help LE identify who killed MB). Hopefully that will happen some day.
 
  • #812
The one possible match on gait was BWH. Nirenberg eliminated everyone else. It says this in the Dec 2016 BWH search warrant.

Nirenberg seems ready and willing to let any media outlet interview him when they’re doing a story on Missy. I’m sure it’s good for business. But the hard truth is that his work was not helpful to LE other than in obtaining a BWH warrant that went nowhere, and they haven’t spoken to him since late 2016.
 
  • #813
The one possible match on gait was BWH. Nirenberg eliminated everyone else. It says this in the Dec 2016 BWH search warrant.

Nirenberg seems ready and willing to let any media outlet interview him when they’re doing a story on Missy. I’m sure it’s good for business. But the hard truth is that his work was not helpful to LE other than in obtaining a BWH warrant that went nowhere, and they haven’t spoken to him since late 2016.
Just curious, did BWH have a beard/moustache at the time? Can we rule out anyone who had facial hair, going by the images picked up from the car-park? Also, the image where you can see the neckline of the suspect, could be a big clue there, if that could be enhanced, for ruling out suspects. MOO
 
  • #814
Just curious, did BWH have a beard/moustache at the time? Can we rule out anyone who had facial hair, going by the images picked up from the car-park? Also, the image where you can see the neckline of the suspect, could be a big clue there, if that could be enhanced, for ruling out suspects. MOO
Hard to say. There have been times he has had a goatee. There have been times he has been clean shaven. Here is a link to his booking report with a poor quality black and white photo. But this was many months after the murder so there is no telling what his facial hair was like in April 2016.
Dropbox - 17MP013066 Bobby Henry Public Reports.pdf - Simplify your life

And regarding the images from SWFA, remember that we cannot say for certain that the car or its drivers were even connected to the murder.
 
  • #815
But the hard truth is that his work was not helpful to LE other than in obtaining a BWH warrant that went nowhere, and they haven’t spoken to him since late 2016.

Not helpful? Really?

Respectfully, I'm not sure how you (or LE) can say the podiatrist wasn't helpful. When consulted, it looks like he identified BWH for them as a possibility, eliminated other suspects for them, educated them (and all of us) on some aspects of the gait, and will probably be vital to them even more in the future if they find more potential suspects. Especially the right one.

If they haven't consulted him since 2016, doesn't that speak to their failures rather than his? If their (or your) standard is that he has to make the right suspect magically appear somehow, in order for him to be thought of as helpful, that's really on them.
 
  • #816
Please don't, but if you filmed me getting out of the car after a long trip -- yeah that's about my gait.

Been through the list of conditions, but leg length discrepancy (could be structural or functional,) valgus deformity/knock knees, and alphabet soup of the lower back are likely....

Sort of wondering if we'll ever know, sadly.

jmho ymmv lrr
 
  • #817
Hard to say. There have been times he has had a goatee. There have been times he has been clean shaven. Here is a link to his booking report with a poor quality black and white photo. But this was many months after the murder so there is no telling what his facial hair was like in April 2016.
Dropbox - 17MP013066 Bobby Henry Public Reports.pdf - Simplify your life

And regarding the images from SWFA, remember that we cannot say for certain that the car or its drivers were even connected to the murder.
Thanks Gumshoe Stories. Just re the SWFA driver, if it is proven that the number plate has a disability symbol, and we see the suspect at the church walking with what seems to be a disability, then it would seem to strengthen the case that the driver at SWFA is in fact the SP .... just my opinion of course.
 
  • #818
Hard to say. There have been times he has had a goatee. There have been times he has been clean shaven. Here is a link to his booking report with a poor quality black and white photo. But this was many months after the murder so there is no telling what his facial hair was like in April 2016.
Dropbox - 17MP013066 Bobby Henry Public Reports.pdf - Simplify your life

And regarding the images from SWFA, remember that we cannot say for certain that the car or its drivers were even connected to the murder.

Haven’t been following here much but...Wow. Same build as the guy in the church video. Stocky.
 
  • #819
Thanks Gumshoe Stories. Just re the SWFA driver, if it is proven that the number plate has a disability symbol, and we see the suspect at the church walking with what seems to be a disability, then it would seem to strengthen the case that the driver at SWFA is in fact the SP .... just my opinion of course.
Do you believe that a person with a specialized license plate would drive around a business with 150 cameras if the driver was a bad actor intending to commit a crime that night? And that this driver would then drive to another property that also posted having video surveillance?

If the Altima is connected, don’t you think it’s more likely that the driver switched out the plates first in order to minimize risk?
 
  • #820
Not helpful? Really?

Respectfully, I'm not sure how you (or LE) can say the podiatrist wasn't helpful. When consulted, it looks like he identified BWH for them as a possibility, eliminated other suspects for them, educated them (and all of us) on some aspects of the gait, and will probably be vital to them even more in the future if they find more potential suspects. Especially the right one.

If they haven't consulted him since 2016, doesn't that speak to their failures rather than his? If their (or your) standard is that he has to make the right suspect magically appear somehow, in order for him to be thought of as helpful, that's really on them.
Nothing against the doctor - I’m sure he is good at what he does. But he can only be helpful here if gait analysis can be helpful here.

We have a suspect who is probably dressed in an outfit they don’t normally wear. @No it's not has estimated that the shoes are much larger than what would be proportional to height. If SP normally wore size 7 but on this night wore a size 14 or perhaps even larger, that would impact SP’s gait a great deal. And that is just the shoes. Now throw in shin guards. Then throw in a tactical belt with potentially numerous things hanging from it.

Here is an example from another case - the Rob Limon murder. An indistinct figure is seen on video surveillance limping into the shop where Limon is working alone. He shoots and kills Limon. You could have sent the footage to Dr. Nirenberg and it would have done you no good. Why? Because the killer was faking the limp.

SP may not be faking the way that they walk, but their gait is influenced by what they’re wearing.

One more analogy. I am a hitman trying to get my target to open their front door so I can shoot them. I dress as a clown, with all the makeup and wig and the oversized clown shoes. I have balloons tied to my waist and I also have one of those clown horns dangling from my belt. The target’s Ring doorbell captures me walking up the front walk to the door. If you were the detective on the case, would you send that footage to a forensic podiatrist?

Gait analysis is only going to be helpful in a case in which the suspect is wearing clothing/shoes similar to what they wear every day, and walking in a way that is authentic to how they normally walk.
 
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