The third entry shows the doors from a few years prior - they are the same doors. These are from a video the Creekside Church made for Father's Day. What it shows is that the glass space in the doors is rather large. It would be very possible for human beings much larger than SP to actually pass through them. While there is quite a bit of reflection going on in the bottom picture you can see that there is space in between and then another set of doors - they are both open.
TX - Terri 'Missy' Bevers,45, murdered in church/person in SWAT gear,18 Apr 2016 #34
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The fourth entry provides a view of what the inner doors actually look like. Though the left door is partially blocked by the Easternmost door of Room 8. This is the first door you see to the right at the opening sequence of the 2:27 MPD video. Naturally, the hall doesn't always look like that. Every year the children put on a big event and spend a lot of time constructing the decorations and assembling them for church members to experience and enjoy. It is the best photo I have of those doors. Note the outer doors are beyond these doors but since they are aligned you can really only make out the bottoms of them.
The other picture shows the boarded up doors after Missy was killed.
The other picture shows the boarded up doors after Missy was killed.
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Why wouldn't luminal be used in this case? I would think it's quite possible tiny trace amounts of blood might be in SPs car. JMO, of course, but I am curious as to your theory...
Agree. I've been thinking the last few days that we need new information. Everyone here cares and is hungry for real information. I think that is what we need to strive for, in whatever way is open to us in our particular fields. I really hope we can unearth something. I for one am going to try.
DeDee
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The fourth entry provides a view of what the inner doors actually look like. Though the left door is partially blocked by the Easternmost door of Room 8. This is the first door you see to the right at the opening sequence of the 2:27 MPD video. Naturally, the hall doesn't always look like that. Every year the children put on a big event and spend a lot of time constructing the decorations and assembling them for church members to experience and enjoy. It is the best photo I have of those doors. Note the outer doors are beyond these doors but since they are aligned you can really only make out the bottoms of them.
The other picture shows the boarded up doors after Missy was killed.
Thank you for undertaking this portion. The entry point may help explain the escape route.
Room 8 door data is accurate. The children's decorations cover the hallway where the scratched metal door is located to the left and the sanctuary to the right in this image, but that is not where the Kitchen is located.
When facing the glass doors coming from the outside landing, and once indoors, take a left turn at the interior door pictured, you would be walking past two kitchen doors, Rooms 7 & 7, on the left hand side with the sanctuary on the right interior side on this hallway walking toward the Highway side of the building.
Currently, opposed to when the video was made, from the parking lot to the stairs and on the landing, there are three doors. When facing the exterior double doors, there is also a solid metal door to the left notated with a black plaque beside it. There is a camera mounted in the far upper right corner of the landing; however, we've learned that the exterior cameras were not, ironically enough, functioning properly.
:cow:
Scout
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I believe there are only two metal doors that are exterior doors -- one that opens into a small vestibule to the kitchen and another that opens onto a room or corridor at the SE corner of the building. The kitchen one is where police believe the killer forced entry. I can't recall if the SE metal door has a window in it.
For the bold and underlined. The view in that picture is looking east down the north hall. That is, it was taken from the Northwest area. The kitchen would be on the left a little down the hall. The metal rollup doors that go into the Sanctuary/Auditorium would be across from the kitchen. Room 8 would follow it as you go eastward down that hall. Pictures from Creekside from as recently as less than 2 weeks ago show both kitchen doors doors on the left in a picture taken from pretty much the same spot.
If you came in the doors I posted and made a left like you described you would be looking at the hall we see at the end of the 2:27 MPD video. The kitchen is on the North side of the building.
Are you sure you don't have the Northwest entry mixed up with the Northeast?
As for the bolded only part it sounds like the description of the Southeast entry area. That area does have a door on the left. I have that door on my map. If there were a door on the left of the entry way I showed in the second post that door would open into Room 12. The door in the Southeast area I believe opens to a place that has no other doors and has some kind of plumbing stack need.
Scout
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Luminol isn't used that commonly anymore. There are newer better chemicals that are easier to use and more effective for revealing blood traces. BlueStar and Amido Black are more commonly used. Sometimes only an ALS (Alternate Light Source) is used.
Equipment Room?
That is the Southeast corner.The metal door at the landing, the intercom is to the far left and off camera, the black plaque reads:
Experiment Room
Photo from experience
Scout
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The second entry shows the Northeast entry area from a frame grabbed from one of the drive by videos. This video was taken after the doors had been repaired. What is important to note is that there is plenty of covered space before you even get to the doors. It would be a great place to not only be out of the rain but also to possibly put on or remove tactical gear, for example. There is, of course, no visibility from any passing traffic on 287 and only limited visibility into the area itself due to its height from the ground with the best visibility being if you drove around the church counter-clockwise.
Do you have a link to the video these screenshots were taken from?
Yes, I believe they are the only two doors that would be mostly all metal. Though I would describe the outer doors at all of the entryways as metal doors. Others, will disagree.
My wife grabbed this out of a FB group that was closed down. I don't know where to find it in the wild. I could probably put it up on Google drive later.
DeDee said:
You guys are (perhaps accidentally) pulling and twisting things from context, and in so doing confusing yourselves. The phrase "reached and opened" was simply conversational shorthand used in the conversation I had with NIN, to make reference to LE's admitted speculation on Apr 18 that perp "broke the window and reached inside to open the door." Hope that helps.
I also gotta say about the other stuff being said, that all this conversation that LE may have been talking about a completely different door than the kitchen door is nuts. We have LE's description that "presumably he went out the way he came in, which was through a metal door that had a glass window that was broken out." We also have media at the building the same day talking about that very door and showing pictures of it and its damage the same day. And it's the ONLY exterior metal door with a glass window in that entire building that had any damage (there's only one other, on the opposite side of the building, and it was undisturbed).
Any and all of those facts make it clear there can be no question which door LE was talking about. It was clear the day they started talking about it, and it's still crystal.
The next two posts will provide an overview of the Kitchen so that people can also visualize the area just as I had done for the NE doors.
So first up, this entry shows the worked-over outer kitchen door and the vestibule that it opens into. It is approximately 6 feet deep with space to the left. The door you see on the other side of the vestibule does lead into the kitchen.
So first up, this entry shows the worked-over outer kitchen door and the vestibule that it opens into. It is approximately 6 feet deep with space to the left. The door you see on the other side of the vestibule does lead into the kitchen.
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This entry shows the door that leads to the vestibule from the kitchen and also an open door - other photos exist with the door closed - that leads into an area I have labelled as K1 on the maps I have uploaded. K1 has a set of double windows. The bottom photo shows an outside view of the Kitchen area. In particular, the kitchen window that was broken, the kitchen door and the windows that are in K1. Take note that there is not much coverage from the rain here. Only the 3 foot eaves are there. Unless the rain was falling toward the north or at least straight down (little or no wind) you are going to get plenty wet here. There is an outdoor light right above this door. There is also limited visibility of this area from 287 heading south but truly at that distance and in the rainy conditions I doubt much could be seen there that morning.
But what I think is very important to note about the bottom image is that the windows to K1 are both large and low to the ground. A question that comes to mind is why would SP wrestle with the kitchen door when they could have simply broken that window and gained entry much more easily? For me, it is just one more reason I question the actual point of entry.
But what I think is very important to note about the bottom image is that the windows to K1 are both large and low to the ground. A question that comes to mind is why would SP wrestle with the kitchen door when they could have simply broken that window and gained entry much more easily? For me, it is just one more reason I question the actual point of entry.
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Respectfully, MPD has never stated the entry nor exit locations for SP. They even said they were speculating.
Scout
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Female Reporter: And is he seen fleeing? Is he seen after the assault?
Captain John Spann: Again, we see him walking down one of the hallways, but presumably he went out the way he came in, which was through a metal door that had a glass window that was broken out. And, again, this is all speculation on our part that he broke the window and reached inside to open the door, but we also have a second and third windows [sic] that were broken, but we don't have any evidence that anybody ever went through them. They were just broken.
From Galadriel's transcript of the initial press conference.
Seems pretty straightforward to me. No misinterpretation of "reached inside".
MPD: "the way he came in, which was through a metal door that had a glass window that was broken out." They presume he went out the same way.
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