TX - Terri 'Missy' Bevers,45, murdered in church/person in SWAT gear,18 Apr 2016 #34

[Jethro4WS]

GRACE: Unleash the lawyers, Margie Mow (ph) joining us out of LA, Randy Kessler. He also, Randy, is telling the person, the killer, to turn

themselves in. He also has revealed that he has seen other secret police video that has not been released to the public, and based on everything he

has learned from the investigation, he believes the killer is a woman.

RANDY KESSLER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, you know, maybe he has a specific woman in mind that that person walks, the person that he`s seeing, or maybe

he just sees this person walking. If he`s seen other videos, there are other videos that might reveal more of a woman tendency, more feminine

qualities than the ones we`ve seen.

http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1605/26/ng.01.html

Isn't that the Nancy Grace special episode from the Friday before memorial day that contained all kinds of pieces from various dates? I have been trying to find the source of BB actually saying that. I am sure he did. I just want to know when because I am thinking this was before the longer video was released.

 

[arkansasmimi]

These cameras operate on motion detection. So when they say they see SP on video first at approximately 3:50am (they know the exact time to the second) and they know when Missy was seen on camera (again to the second) that leaves the total amount of time to be roughly 25 to 30 minutes. But there would only be that much video if SP was in range of a camera so that it detected the motion and recorded.

But SP was off camera for several minutes from the time they were in the North hall at the opening of the 2:27 second video (they were on camera there for about 10 seconds). The next time they are seen in the video is at least 7 minutes later (we know this because MPD released a snippet of time stamped video). After moving from the main hall to the South hall, after they open and enter the room with the dutch double doors they again lose motion. For some unknown period of time SP is not seen. We see them next coming back down that hall only to enter the alcove by a set of entry doors to the sanctuary. They are again off camera for some period of time until we see them again coming out of Room 12 (we don't see them enter Room 12). And that is where the video ends. If we knew the time stamps for those periods we would have a better idea of how much time they were off camera. Or, potentially how much more video they could have. If SP had stayed in one place out of view, or actually just stood still even right in front of a camera eventually the camera would detect no motion and stop recording.

Respectfully, What would your theory be if say.. the edited together video is not in chronological real time order. We are not told that it is, the only time we actually know for certain is 358am because of the 7 sec video released time stamped. There is nothing in the 227 min that says it is in order . JMHO.

 

[Jethro4WS]

Exactly!!

That's why FB is not a reliable source of information all the time

Thanks

So you don't consider MPD to be a reliable source? It is their own FB page and their own replies.

 

[jellybeanz]

This thread and the investigation seems to be going nowhere.

RIP Missy

 

[arkansasmimi]

GRACE: Unleash the lawyers, Margie Mow (ph) joining us out of LA, Randy Kessler. He also, Randy, is telling the person, the killer, to turn

themselves in. He also has revealed that he has seen other secret police video that has not been released to the public, and based on everything he

has learned from the investigation, he believes the killer is a woman.

RANDY KESSLER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, you know, maybe he has a specific woman in mind that that person walks, the person that he`s seeing, or maybe

he just sees this person walking. If he`s seen other videos, there are other videos that might reveal more of a woman tendency, more feminine

qualities than the ones we`ve seen.

http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1605/26/ng.01.html

He also alludes to seeing more at the press conf re the shirt April 27. He explains why he now thinks she was targeted (remember when he first stated random, on April 19 he had only seen the 7 sec like everyone else, and he had gotten home shortly prior to the MPD press conf on Monday) When asked on April 27 why he changed his mind he said evidence, because of evidence and also alluded to seeing the video MOD has. jmho

 

[GeeEm]

I think at some point they're going to have to release more info because their investigation has stalled.

Maybe but I think it would be very little because I think we've gotten about all we are going to get without jeopardizing the case.

jmo 🐮

 

[Jethro4WS]

Respectfully, What would your theory be if say.. the edited together video is not in chronological real time order. We are not told that it is, the only time we actually know for certain is 358am because of the 7 sec video released time stamped. There is nothing in the 227 min that says it is in order . JMHO.

If the video is not in chronological order then I would not be able to have any theory of their movements or their actions or behaviors. If it were known to not be in order I wouldn't even be here typing or following the case - it would be a waste of my time. So I have no theory that can cover all of the elements we have seen in all the possible combinations of the order of events. Far too many possibilities to make it useful. If, for example, the video is out of order and the last true time SP was seen was at close to 4am and all other pieces of video were from prior to that time there are far too many possibilities of movements and placements that are unseen to build any theory of the crime. You might as well throw darts with a blindfold on.

 

[GeeEm]

So you don't consider MPD to be a reliable source? It is their own FB page and their own replies.

by GeeEm View Post
Exactly!!

That's why FBis not a reliable source of information all the time

BBM

Did I say MPD? No!
I said FB in general terms 🗣

 

[liz b.]

He also alludes to seeing more at the press conf re the shirt April 27. He explains why he now thinks she was targeted (remember when he first stated random, on April 19 he had only seen the 7 sec like everyone else, and he had gotten home shortly prior to the MPD press conf on Monday) When asked on April 27 why he changed his mind he said evidence, because of evidence and also alluded to seeing the video MOD has. jmho

This is interesting to me. Has LE ever said that they showed more video footage to BB ? Or anyone else ? And, I have to wonder what their motivation would be,if they did,indeed show it to him. jmo

 

[arkansasmimi]

07-13-2016, 03:45 PM#240 Jethro4WS

Quote Originally Posted by Scout View Post
If I understand you correctly, you're saying that the room depicted in the photos I use is not Room 10. Is that correct?

The one with all the kids with the tables is probably not room 10. The other one with the Breakaway stuff very probably is - considered that is where jr/sr high kids go according to the bulletins. http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...T-gear-18-Apr-2016-32&p=12688415#post12688415

RBBM
I respectfully disagree. Room 10 as depicted at the time of the VBS Photo shows that ROOM 10 is Project Point

Theme for 2012 Creekside CoC VBS was Adventures on Promise Island -
**from ANOTHER CHURCH but this is what PROJECT POINT is...

Welcome to Adventures on Promise Island, where God’s promises never change!

Each day at Promise Island kids will participate in the excitement of Seaside Celebration, experience Bible stories about God’s promises at Lifeguard Lagoon, create service or craft projects at Project Pointe, enjoy snacks and learn more about God’s promises at the Coconut CafÈ, and play great games at Fun Time Falls! And, through it all, they’ll discover God’s promises and His lifesaving love

Lifeguard Lagoon was in CCoC Worship Center
Coconut Cafe was in Room 8
Project Point was in Room 10
Funtime Falls, I am unsure what room that actually was in, but thinking in an area of the Worship Center but not sure.

ROOM 10 Def is this room, Also, if numbering rooms, no matter what they are renumbered now (if they are) Room 10 and 12 def would be near room 8 not on the other side of the building. JMHO


and this photo is the same room

Room 10 ***ETA No showing of windows in this room from photos or video either. JMHO

 

[arkansasmimi]

Jethro4WS on your layout/map http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...-18-Apr-2016-33/page9&p=12699959#post12699959 I commend you for the had word you have done. I too started making a layout long ways back. I along with many here worked together. I never stated my or out thoughts were to scale but we did provide photo and link back ups to out thoughts. I saw where you asked where the metal door that had the busted handle on the North side was called Kitchen door. While there IS an MSM article stating kitchen, here at WS it may be my fault that it is referred to as the Metal Kitchen Door as that's what I called it and we all referenced it that to know where we were speaking of.

On the North hallway exit door from NE corner of the Auditorium/Worship Center, every photo I have ever seen and I too have looked at many. That door does not appear to be angled as you have in your diagram. The hallway photos show the recessed area and this photo from the Creekside CoC Breakaway Youth Ministries shows looking out the Room 8 door closest to the Kitchen straight across is the door that you show angled but appears not. Nor in the photos from inside the Auditorium/Worship Center. *not a big deal in the scope of thing but just my opinion but it does help with getting the feel where what is what.
https://www.facebook.com/breakawaysm/photos/a.492654417478208.1073741825.195364240540562/492654434144873/?type=3&theater JMHO

Also can you tell me where you have this room on your diagram? Thanks If you look close you can see another door at the left edge of photo down a ways

 

[Lizzysun]

:coffeews: Marking my spot....

Glad your back!

 

[Scout]

RBBM
I respectfully disagree. Room 10 as depicted at the time of the VBS Photo shows that ROOM 10 is Project Point

Theme for 2012 Creekside CoC VBS was Adventures on Promise Island -
**from ANOTHER CHURCH but this is what PROJECT POINT is...

Welcome to Adventures on Promise Island, where God’s promises never change!

Each day at Promise Island kids will participate in the excitement of Seaside Celebration, experience Bible stories about God’s promises at Lifeguard Lagoon, create service or craft projects at Project Pointe, enjoy snacks and learn more about God’s promises at the Coconut CafÈ, and play great games at Fun Time Falls! And, through it all, they’ll discover God’s promises and His lifesaving love

Lifeguard Lagoon was in CCoC Worship Center
Coconut Cafe was in Room 8
Project Point was in Room 10
Funtime Falls, I am unsure what room that actually was in, but thinking in an area of the Worship Center but not sure.

ROOM 10 Def is this room, Also, if numbering rooms, no matter what they are renumbered now (if they are) Room 10 and 12 def would be near room 8 not on the other side of the building. JMHO
View attachment 98993 View attachment 98994

and this photo is the same room View attachment 98995 View attachment 98996

Room 10 View attachment 98999 ***ETA No showing of windows in this room from photos or video either. JMHO

IMO, Funtime Falls was outside on the lawn. I believe the photo with the palm tree and a sign pointing toward Funtime Falls is the SE corner of the corridors and the sign is pointing toward the SE exit.

 

[11frogs]

This is interesting to me. Has LE ever said that they showed more video footage to BB ? Or anyone else ? And, I have to wonder what their motivation would be,if they did,indeed show it to him. jmo

Reaction.

 

[Jethro4WS]

RBBM
I respectfully disagree. Room 10 as depicted at the time of the VBS Photo shows that ROOM 10 is Project Point

Theme for 2012 Creekside CoC VBS was Adventures on Promise Island -
**from ANOTHER CHURCH but this is what PROJECT POINT is...

Welcome to Adventures on Promise Island, where God’s promises never change!

Each day at Promise Island kids will participate in the excitement of Seaside Celebration, experience Bible stories about God’s promises at Lifeguard Lagoon, create service or craft projects at Project Pointe, enjoy snacks and learn more about God’s promises at the Coconut CafÈ, and play great games at Fun Time Falls! And, through it all, they’ll discover God’s promises and His lifesaving love

Lifeguard Lagoon was in CCoC Worship Center
Coconut Cafe was in Room 8
Project Point was in Room 10
Funtime Falls, I am unsure what room that actually was in, but thinking in an area of the Worship Center but not sure.

ROOM 10 Def is this room, Also, if numbering rooms, no matter what they are renumbered now (if they are) Room 10 and 12 def would be near room 8 not on the other side of the building. JMHO

and this photo is the same room

That isn't the same room.

There are two sets of double windows with a visible post in the room with the kids with the tables. There are only double windows on the East side of the building. The windows are 16 feet apart and it is 6 feet from the left most windows to the post and 9 feet from that post to the windows to the right. The post itself is a foot wide.

In the Breakaway room you can see the edge of a post on the left side of the photo and only the right pane of a set of double windows. That set of double windows has to be closer to the post than 9 feet at that angle to only be able to see just the right pane of the double windows. That post is further than 6 feet from the photographer so if it were the same room you should be able to see the edge or even the right pane of the double windows that would be there if it were the same room as the kids with the tables. You don't see that. That structural post in that room aligns with one at the rear of the sanctuary 21 feet north of the Se corner of the sanctuary. There is a structural column in the left corner of the room in the photo of the breakaway room - you can see it above the wall line (enlarge and lighten) - that aligns with the structural column at exact SE corner of the sanctuary. None of this is possible in the room with the kids at the tables.

Room 10 is definitely the Breakaway Room that would also be labelled E3 on my map. That has two doors and is located at the southern end of the east side. It can't be anywhere else. There are photos of both doors to this room with the one showing the southernmost door also showing the right edge of the northern most door to the room. They are closer than I have on my map and I will be updating that to reflect the actual position of the second door.

The room to the north of Room 10 is the room with the kids at the tables. It is labelled E2 on my map. The door to that room is just out of sight in the picture of the room with the kids that is aimed away from the windows. It would be just behind where the pastor is standing talking to the women. For whatever reason, in that church they tend to have doors mounted to the left of structural columns (if you were looking from inside the room). You see this throughout the building. So, where you see the structural column in the photo of that same room that is toward the windows there is a structural column on the opposite side of the room (walled on both sides, so hidden) and the door would be mounted to the left side of that post.

Room 12 is E1 on my map. Room 8 (N1 on my map) is just to its north 8 feet away. I certainly don't have it on the other side of the building.

 

[Scout]

Jethro4WS on your layout/map http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...-18-Apr-2016-33/page9&p=12699959#post12699959 I commend you for the had word you have done. I too started making a layout long ways back. I along with many here worked together. I never stated my or out thoughts were to scale but we did provide photo and link back ups to out thoughts. I saw where you asked where the metal door that had the busted handle on the North side was called Kitchen door. While there IS an MSM article stating kitchen, here at WS it may be my fault that it is referred to as the Metal Kitchen Door as that's what I called it and we all referenced it that to know where we were speaking of.

On the North hallway exit door from NE corner of the Auditorium/Worship Center, every photo I have ever seen and I too have looked at many. That door does not appear to be angled as you have in your diagram. The hallway photos show the recessed area and this photo from the Creekside CoC Breakaway Youth Ministries shows looking out the Room 8 door closest to the Kitchen straight across is the door that you show angled but appears not. Nor in the photos from inside the Auditorium/Worship Center. *not a big deal in the scope of thing but just my opinion but it does help with getting the feel where what is what.
View attachment 98997https://www.facebook.com/breakawaysm/photos/a.492654417478208.1073741825.195364240540562/492654434144873/?type=3&theater JMHO

Also can you tell me where you have this room on your diagram? Thanks View attachment 98998 If you look close you can see another door at the left edge of photo down a ways

Auditorium door: Examine that photo more closely, arkansasmimi. You can see that the alcove for that door is triangular by looking at its ceiling.

In the Funtime Falls photo, you can see the light from the glass doors reflecting on the wall. You can even make out the shadow from the center horizontal part of the door's metal frame.

 

[liz b.]

Reaction.

Possibly. I don't think that if LE showed the public all of the video it would impeded the investigation. I'm guessing that there is a better view of SP's face, and this enabled LE to describe him as "light skinned" . Someone might recognize a way of moving. or a gesture. could be very useful. jmo

 

[Scout]

I can't recall ever being in a building where the rooms are numbered out of order. The very reason for numbering rooms is to sequence them for ease of locating.

 

[arkansasmimi]

This is interesting to me. Has LE ever said that they showed more video footage to BB ? Or anyone else ? And, I have to wonder what their motivation would be,if they did,indeed show it to him. jmo

JMHO to see his reaction. And JMHO I think it was either Wed April 20 or Thur April 21. Because on Thur BB mother said in an interview : “ said Tucker. "I know that they have questioned him, looked at their phones." http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/Sl...ster-in-Law-Speaks-to-Dateline-376629821.html

BB said on April 27 when doing the press conf with his dad, that he had only had 1 Formal Interview. JMHO thats when they showed him whatever it was that changed his mind as he stated in response to a reporter. JMHO

 

[arkansasmimi]

That isn't the same room.

There are two sets of double windows with a visible post in the room with the kids with the tables. There are only double windows on the East side of the building. The windows are 16 feet apart and it is 6 feet from the left most windows to the post and 9 feet from that post to the windows to the right. The post itself is a foot wide.

In the Breakaway room you can see the edge of a post on the left side of the photo and only the right pane of a set of double windows. That set of double windows has to be closer to the post than 9 feet at that angle to only be able to see just the right pane of the double windows. That post is further than 6 feet from the photographer so if it were the same room you should be able to see the edge or even the right pane of the double windows that would be there if it were the same room as the kids with the tables. You don't see that. That structural post in that room aligns with one at the rear of the sanctuary 21 feet north of the Se corner of the sanctuary. There is a structural column in the left corner of the room in the photo of the breakaway room - you can see it above the wall line (enlarge and lighten) - that aligns with the structural column at exact SE corner of the sanctuary. None of this is possible in the room with the kids at the tables.

Room 10 is definitely the Breakaway Room that would also be labelled E3 on my map. That has two doors and is located at the southern end of the east side. It can't be anywhere else. There are photos of both doors to this room with the one showing the southernmost door also showing the right edge of the northern most door to the room. They are closer than I have on my map and I will be updating that to reflect the actual position of the second door.

The room to the north of Room 10 is the room with the kids at the tables. It is labelled E2 on my map. The door to that room is just out of sight in the picture of the room with the kids that is aimed away from the windows. It would be just behind where the pastor is standing talking to the women. For whatever reason, in that church they tend to have doors mounted to the left of structural columns (if you were looking from inside the room). You see this throughout the building. So, where you see the structural column in the photo of that same room that is toward the windows there is a structural column on the opposite side of the room (walled on both sides, so hidden) and the door would be mounted to the left side of that post.

Room 12 is E1 on my map. Room 8 (N1 on my map) is just to its north 8 feet away. I certainly don't have it on the other side of the building.

Respectfully can you provide photos your speaking of that show the windows and a link for where they came from. Thanks again .