UK - Arthur Labinjo Hughes, 6, killed, dad & friend arrested, June 2020 #2

[JayWill]

This is probably a stupid question but would TH and ET have access to phones in the holding place they are in before they get sentenced?

Only logged and recorded phone calls I would imagine. MOO.

 

[Carroll520]

Only logged and recorded phone calls I would imagine. MOO.

Aw ok, yep that makes sense. I would just love for them to see the outpouring of love for Arthur especially over the last few days, so many more people are aware of the case and for them to see the sheer hatred people have towards them

 

[ScottishSam]

I don’t know..it’s a social housing house so it would be a family that would be offered it, I don’t know if many would want to live there, like you, I think it would be hard not to think of the suffering.
The area is very convenient as it has very good primary and secondary schools and it’s 5 mins walking distance to a huge Sears retail park with huge stores like M&S, Next, tk max, Boots, Smyths etc . For social housing, it’s a really good area to be offered so maybe there will some families that will want to try their hardest to try forget what went on it and turn it in to a house full of love.

It sounds amazing location wise. And the garden is perfect too. Plenty of room for kids to run about.

 

[Ironside]

Aw ok, yep that makes sense. I would just love for them to see the outpouring of love for Arthur especially over the last few days, so many more people are aware of the case and for them to see the sheer hatred people have towards them

I think it’s possible Tustin completely lost it when she was told the audio and video of Arthur was being released to the media. She’s fast becoming Britain’s most hated woman.

 

[ScottishSam]

I don’t know..it’s a social housing house so it would be a family that would be offered it, I don’t know if many would want to live there, like you, I think it would be hard not to think of the suffering.
The area is very convenient as it has very good primary and secondary schools and it’s 5 mins walking distance to a huge Sears retail park with huge stores like M&S, Next, tk max, Boots, Smyths etc . For social housing, it’s a really good area to be offered so maybe there will some families that will want to try their hardest to try forget what went on it and turn it in to a house full of love.

It sounds amazing location wise. And the garden is perfect too. Plenty of room for kids to run about.

I think it’s possible Tustin completely lost it when she was told the audio and video of Arthur was being released to the media. She’s fast becoming Britain’s most hated woman.

I agree with this. It's one thing to be on trial, it's another for everyone to see the videos, the audios. For this all to now be public is bound to terrify them both.

 

[Dotta]

I agree with this. It's one thing to be on trial, it's another for everyone to see the videos, the audios. For this all to now be public is bound to terrify them both.

They are not only evil but also absolutely dumb.
They gave evidence (recordings, camera footage, SMS messages) on a plate to Prosecution.
They would be sentenced even without these evidence, sure, but made everything so much easier for LE.
TH's words about "digging a grave" were prophetic not only for Arthur, but also themselves.

 

[Mellowmelly]

Let's hope the trial goes ahead today, put an end to this for Arthur's family that did love him.

 

[ChloLo]

ET and TH are held in remand in prison. No access to phones, apart from the monitored prison ones.

 

[ScottishSam]

They are not only evil but also absolutely dumb.
They gave evidence (recordings, camera footage, SMS messages) on a plate to Prosecution.
They would be sentenced even without these evidence, sure, but made everything so much easier for LE.
TH's words about "digging a grave" were prophetic not only for Arthur, but also themselves.

You've got to remember the jury have not returned their verdicts yet. Only they can decide who was guilty of what.
There are many examples in the UK of children who have died at home and not received the justice they deserve. Because the parents blamed each other it was unclear who delivered the fatal blow, and light sentences are often the only option.
As you say the cctv, messages and voice recordings are undeniable.

 

[ChloLo]

You've got to remember the jury have not returned their verdicts yet. Only they can decide who was guilty of what.
There are many examples in the UK of children who have died at home and not received the justice they deserve. Because the parents blamed each other it was unclear who delivered the fatal blow, and light sentences are often the only option.
As you say the cctv, messages and voice recordings are undeniable.

That’s one of the reasons the charge or causing or allowing the death of a child was created.

There is a lot of evidence in this case, which should help the jury reach the right decision quickly.

 

[squish]

If ET has harmed herself, or is faking some kind of condition, I think it’s likely because she knows she’s utterly and just wants some stress relief of being a cared-for patient in a hospital. She doesn’t think that far ahead, this is just a desperate stress-relief action that makes her temporarily feel in control, and temporarily delays the inevitable.

The way they treated Arthur shows that they are completely stupid and incapable of thinking of anything other than their short-term desires.

How did they think their treatment of him would end? It is obvious that at some point this continuing torture and neglect would have killed him. Yet I don’t think they actually intended to kill him, they wouldn’t have wanted to get into trouble. They wouldn’t have recorded so much evidence of their behaviour if murder was the actual plan. They made very little effort to even conceal their abuse.

They are just so stupid that they thought of nothing more than their immediate desire to take out their hatred of Arthur for daring to exist, enjoying getting their power trips by torturing and dominating a tiny child who loved them.

Imagining if Arthur had continued to survive, the gruesome twosome didn’t think ahead about that scenario. They didn’t think about the fact that at some point, lockdown would end. (I think it ended just a few weeks after he was killed?) And it would get harder and harder for them to continue inflicting misery on him without concerns being raised, by the school etc, and harder to keep family and outsiders away from him.

They didn’t think what would happen if Arthur survived longer-term. One day, he would grow up. Then what? If you follow their behaviour to its logical conclusion, although I don’t think they were thinking about it yet, it is obvious that if Arthur survived too much longer, they would have felt they had to kill him to conceal their abuse. But they didn’t think that far ahead.

Another thing that demonstrates their stupidity is their thinking that by letting Arthur go back to his Nan’s, Arthur would have “won”. If Arthur leaving for his Nan’s is him “winning”, what exactly constitutes ET and TH “winning”? Arthur never, ever leaving? Again that is the logical conclusion, but I don’t think they thought that far ahead. They just didn’t like the feeling of Arthur potentially “getting his own way”. So they kept him, even though they resented him being there.

 

[ChloLo]

If ET has harmed herself, or is faking some kind of condition, I think it’s likely because she knows she’s utterly ****** and just wants some stress relief of being a cared-for patient in a hospital. She doesn’t think that far ahead, this is just a desperate stress-relief action that makes her temporarily feel in control, and temporarily delays the inevitable.

The way they treated Arthur shows that they are completely stupid and incapable of thinking of anything other than their short-term desires.

How did they think their treatment of him would end? It is obvious that at some point this continuing torture and neglect would have killed him. Yet I don’t think they actually intended to kill him, they wouldn’t have wanted to get into trouble. They wouldn’t have recorded so much evidence of their behaviour if murder was the actual plan. They made very little effort to even conceal their abuse.

They are just so stupid that they thought of nothing more than their immediate desire to take out their hatred of Arthur for daring to exist, enjoying getting their power trips by torturing and dominating a tiny child who loved them.

Imagining if Arthur had continued to survive, the gruesome twosome didn’t think ahead about that scenario. They didn’t think about the fact that at some point, lockdown would end. (I think it ended just a few weeks after he was killed?) And it would get harder and harder for them to continue inflicting misery on him without concerns being raised, by the school etc, and harder to keep family and outsiders away from him.

They didn’t think what would happen if Arthur survived longer-term. One day, he would grow up. Then what? If you follow their behaviour to its logical conclusion, although I don’t think they were thinking about it yet, it is obvious that if Arthur survived too much longer, they would have felt they had to kill him to conceal their abuse. But they didn’t think that far ahead.

Another thing that demonstrates their stupidity is their thinking that by letting Arthur go back to his Nan’s, Arthur would have “won”. If Arthur leaving for his Nan’s is him “winning”, what exactly constitutes ET and TH “winning”? Arthur never, ever leaving? Again that is the logical conclusion, but I don’t think they thought that far ahead. They just didn’t like the feeling of Arthur potentially “getting his own way”. So they kept him, even though they resented him being there.

I agree with this. Except for the salt. I could buy the salt being unintentional and just used to make food unpalatable, if it wasn’t for the final “bolus” of salt.

 

[ScottishSam]

If ET has harmed herself, or is faking some kind of condition, I think it’s likely because she knows she’s utterly ****** and just wants some stress relief of being a cared-for patient in a hospital. She doesn’t think that far ahead, this is just a desperate stress-relief action that makes her temporarily feel in control, and temporarily delays the inevitable.

The way they treated Arthur shows that they are completely stupid and incapable of thinking of anything other than their short-term desires.

How did they think their treatment of him would end? It is obvious that at some point this continuing torture and neglect would have killed him. Yet I don’t think they actually intended to kill him, they wouldn’t have wanted to get into trouble. They wouldn’t have recorded so much evidence of their behaviour if murder was the actual plan. They made very little effort to even conceal their abuse.

They are just so stupid that they thought of nothing more than their immediate desire to take out their hatred of Arthur for daring to exist, enjoying getting their power trips by torturing and dominating a tiny child who loved them.

Imagining if Arthur had continued to survive, the gruesome twosome didn’t think ahead about that scenario. They didn’t think about the fact that at some point, lockdown would end. (I think it ended just a few weeks after he was killed?) And it would get harder and harder for them to continue inflicting misery on him without concerns being raised, by the school etc, and harder to keep family and outsiders away from him.

They didn’t think what would happen if Arthur survived longer-term. One day, he would grow up. Then what? If you follow their behaviour to its logical conclusion, although I don’t think they were thinking about it yet, it is obvious that if Arthur survived too much longer, they would have felt they had to kill him to conceal their abuse. But they didn’t think that far ahead.

Another thing that demonstrates their stupidity is their thinking that by letting Arthur go back to his Nan’s, Arthur would have “won”. If Arthur leaving for his Nan’s is him “winning”, what exactly constitutes ET and TH “winning”? Arthur never, ever leaving? Again that is the logical conclusion, but I don’t think they thought that far ahead. They just didn’t like the feeling of Arthur potentially “getting his own way”. So they kept him, even though they resented him being there.

I agree with all of this. I don't believe either expected him to die. Although I'm not sure what ET thought would happen if she continued to deny Arthur water, and lace his food with salt. I asked my son (gently), who's the same age as Arthur, although now a year older, what would happen if he ate too much salt. He said he'd get very thirsty, and if he didn't get a drink he'd die. Obviously, a year older now and his thought process has developed since he was 6. But I'd imagine Arthur would have known he was in danger, and would have been aware that something bad would happen to him. Hence his escape plan. Which is just so sad.
This is the bit I can't work out - ET and TH were to a massive extent protected by lockdown. They had to know that Arthur's continued absence from school would have raised concerns eventually. Was their plan to stop all this ill treatment, and for him to return to school as if nothing had happened? Arthur's behaviour would certainly have changed, we all know childhood trauma lasts a lifetime, and I hope the school would have picked up on this.
The salt thing though, did ET believe the death of a child would not have resulted in a massive investigation. Did she honestly think a 6 year old dying suddenly and unexpectedly in the family 'home' wouldn't have involved a post mortem, blood tests etc?

 

[suebaloo]

I agree with all of this. I don't believe either expected him to die. Although I'm not sure what ET thought would happen if she continued to deny Arthur water, and lace his food with salt. I asked my son (gently), who's the same age as Arthur, although now a year older, what would happen if he ate too much salt. He said he'd get very thirsty, and if he didn't get a drink he'd die. Obviously, a year older now and his thought process has developed since he was 6. But I'd imagine Arthur would have known he was in danger, and would have been aware that something bad would happen to him. Hence his escape plan. Which is just so sad.
This is the bit I can't work out - ET and TH were to a massive extent protected by lockdown. They had to know that Arthur's continued absence from school would have raised concerns eventually. Was their plan to stop all this ill treatment, and for him to return to school as if nothing had happened? Arthur's behaviour would certainly have changed, we all know childhood trauma lasts a lifetime, and I hope the school would have picked up on this.
The salt thing though, did ET believe the death of a child would not have resulted in a massive investigation. Did she honestly think a 6 year old dying suddenly and unexpectedly in the family 'home' wouldn't have involved a post mortem, blood tests etc?

To be honest with you, I don't think either of them thought that far. They probably thought in their ignorance, that Arthur would start "behaving" if they abused him enough. I don't think we're dealing with the sharpest pencils in the box here. Who knows what they were thinking. The mind boggles. And they were bound to be found out at some stage. With similar abuse cases, the perps have gone on and on and on and only get found out when the child dies. When did they think that enough would be enough?

 

[Sooty]

I think ET wanted TH to get to the point where he gave Arthur up for adoption. I think she invented and created all this bad behaviour to this end. Hence her manipulating the episodes (by administering salt to make him ill and uncomfortable) recording and documenting it all. She knew if she had a baby this would further push Arthur further down that line. She wanted marriage and a family - but by her own designs and on her terms.
MOO

 

[ScottishSam]

To be honest with you, I don't think either of them thought that far. They probably thought in their ignorance, that Arthur would start "behaving" if they abused him enough. I don't think we're dealing with the sharpest pencils in the box here. Who knows what they were thinking. The mind boggles. And they were bound to be found out at some stage. With similar abuse cases, the perps have gone on and on and on and only get found out when the child dies. When did they think that enough would be enough?

Yes, neither appears particularly bright. They seem to lack any degree of foresight. Its so sad that in this day and age, with a wealth of information and advice at your fingertips they chose to 'discipline' a 6 year old in a manner that has no logical or scientific evidence to work. Reading Arthur's treatment, it's like the Guantanamo Bay dossier

 

[Sooty]

I think possibly, that because Arthur’s mum was in prison for a violent murder, ET had confidence that Arthur’s memories of the abuse he endured within ET household could be blurred / confused/ rewritten to some degree and put down to experiences from his previous life. She definitely would have gas lighted Arthur, no doubt about it.

 

[ScottishSam]

I think possibly, that because Arthur’s mum was in prison for a violent murder, ET had confidence that Arthur’s memories of the abuse he endured within ET household could be blurred / confused/ rewritten to some degree and put down to experiences from his previous life. She definitely would have gas lighted Arthur, no doubt about it.

Definitely, I have no doubt she told Arthur his mum didn't love him and had gone to jail to get away from him, that his family didn't love him. And nobody liked or wanted him. It honestly makes my heart ache.

 

[ScottishSam]

I also have no doubt she'd have twisted his words and behaviour. And being 6 he's expecting his dad to protect him. It must have been so confusing and heartbreaking for Arthur to tell the truth to his dad about ETs treatment, and Arthur's version of events, only for TH to side with her. He said he didn't take sides, and was in the middle. He definitely took her side. There should be no middle when your children are involved with a stranger.

 

[Sooty]

I think ET is a complex character. I am not even an armchair psychologist but having thrown herself from 5 storeys with the clear intention she wanted to kill herself isn’t normal narc behaviour. She hated herself and wanted to destroy herself.
Is it possible, I’m sure someone here will know, she developed a PTSD which ‘rewired’ her psychology and brought in the narc traits? She also had a back history of SA if I’m not mistaken? Or maybe she did ‘kill’ herself off and became a born again version of ET? Having caused herself such harm, she became insensitive to causing harm to others?