UK - Arthur Labinjo Hughes, 6, killed, dad & friend arrested, June 2020 #2

[Carroll520]

And I was already in prison for killing someone....

Not a good combo!

 

[Carroll520]

And I was already in prison for killing someone....

Not a good combo!

It's sad that whatever happened that night between Olivia and Gary led to the death of Arthur. It's crazy that that stupid decision led to this.
I've thought about Gary's family a lot as well. And how his mum must feel knowing the woman who murdered her son, has also had her son murdered.
It's bound to have given Olivia a different perspective on the crime she committed. She now knows how it feels to have murdered a son, and had a son murdered. What a world we live in

I was only thinking that today, how Olivia must blame herself in a way for Arthurs death. I would love to hear her thoughts on it all or is she so far gone on the drugs she could be numb to it all

 

[Helleux301]

One thing that is really bothering me, is if, Arthur's food was being tainted with salt how would TH not be aware. Arthur surely would of said to TH that it tasted salty or horrible and I would of thought the first thing yd do is try it yourself I know I would. With my kids when they were little If they were refusing to eat something I'd start to eat it and they'd soon decide they wanted it I'm really not convinced at all that he was unaware of this happening

 

[Mellowmelly]

I genuinely believe that TH was a good dad. ET f***** it all up. The reason he said he was guilty of all of it was because he wasn't aware of the salt poisoning, he didn't realise he was being manipulated. He didn't open all the messages ET sent. I think he fully expects to be found guilty for his part in this. But, he wants ET to face justice for her part. All the witnesses for him have said the same thing, until he met ET. She could only muster her step dad and ex partner. Who both gave glowing reports.
There's no doubt Tom is a weak, spineless individual. But, he's been at court every day. And I feel he tried to be mostly honest in his answers. He just couldn't open his eyes or ears when it mattered.

I suspect he didn't feel very secure in his relationship with ET and most likely didn't feel at home while staying with her. But I think he was so besotted with her, wanted to continue to live with her that he was afraid Arthur was going to ruin things, perhaps because of all the tails ET was telling him, either in text or in person. I think he was treating Arthur like he and himself were just visitors to ET's home and that they had to be on their best behaviour ir get out, so he believed everything ET was telling him and "disciplined" Arthur like a parent would if they went to visit a friend and their child was naughty or rude while there, although normal people don't beat their children. He took it to an extreme, as I suspect he knew thats what ET was expecting him to do and I also suspect deep down, he probably doubted ET's tales were always true but was in denial because he had rose tinted glasses on.

 

[ScottishSam]

One thing that is really bothering me, is if, Arthur's food was being tainted with salt how would TH not be aware. Arthur surely would of said to TH that it tasted salty or horrible and I would of thought the first thing yd do is try it yourself I know I would. With my kids when they were little If they were refusing to eat something I'd start to eat it and they'd soon decide they wanted it I'm really not convinced at all that he was unaware of this happening

I think he never tried the food. Maybe Arthur had been warned by ET not to tell his dad. TH said he was always running errands for her. It's not outwith the realm of possibility she timed the running of errands with 'feeding' Arthur. I know if my kids don't like something, their dad will taste it so he can ask whats wrong with it. My man is a man's man though, a spade is a spade and nobody pulls the wool over his eyes. Unfortunately for Arthur I think TH is very gullible, and doesn't question anything

 

[Carroll520]

I genuinely believe that TH was a good dad. ET f***** it all up. The reason he said he was guilty of all of it was because he wasn't aware of the salt poisoning, he didn't realise he was being manipulated. He didn't open all the messages ET sent. I think he fully expects to be found guilty for his part in this. But, he wants ET to face justice for her part. All the witnesses for him have said the same thing, until he met ET. She could only muster her step dad and ex partner. Who both gave glowing reports.
There's no doubt Tom is a weak, spineless individual. But, he's been at court every day. And I feel he tried to be mostly honest in his answers. He just couldn't open his eyes or ears when it really mattered

I think he may well have been a good Dad before. I understand people can be manipulated and he lost his confidence after Olivia and during lockdown too. So was easily led etc but i just dont understand at all how he did such a complete change of character, he didnt show any feeling or care towards his own son Arthur. We are all traumatised after seeing that cctv, TH saw him like that and made him call him sir that day, made him stand against a door, pulled him by the scruff of neck, verbally abused him, didnt pick him up when he fell getting into car. Its unforgiveable, manipilated or not.

 

[ScottishSam]

I suspect he didn't feel very secure in his relationship with ET and most likely didn't feel at home while staying with her. But I think he was so besotted with her, wanted to continue to live with her that he was afraid Arthur was going to ruin things, perhaps because of all the tails ET was telling him, either in text or in person. I think he was treating Arthur like he and himself were just visitors to ET's home and that they had to be on their best behaviour ir get out, so he believed everything ET was telling him and "disciplined" Arthur like a parent would if they went to visit a friend and their child was naughty or rude while there, although normal people don't beat their children. He took it to an extreme, as I suspect he knew thats what ET was expecting him to do and I also suspect deep down, he probably doubted ET's tales were always true but was in denial because he had rose tinted glasses on.

100% this.

 

[ScottishSam]

I think he may well have been a good Dad before. I understand people can be manipulated and he lost his confidence after Olivia and during lockdown too. So was easily led etc but i just dont understand at all how he did such a complete change of character, he didnt show any feeling or care towards his own son Arthur. We are all traumatised after seeing thst cctv, TH saw him like that and made him call him sir that day, made him stand against a door, pulled him by the scruff of neck, verbally abused him, didnt pick him up when he fell getting into car. Its unforgiveable, manipilated or not.

I think it happened gradually, so the escalation of punishment didn't seem as bad to him as it would have been at the start. As for Arthur’s physical condition, if you live with someone day in, day out you don't notice the changes. If you don't see them for a few days or weeks, you do notice the change.
I absolutely believe TH was gaslighted, manipulated and encouraged by ET.

 

[JayWill]

I think he never tried the food. Maybe Arthur had been warned by ET not to tell his dad. TH said he was always running errands for her. It's not outwith the realm of possibility she timed the running of errands with 'feeding' Arthur. I know if my kids don't like something, their dad will taste it so he can ask whats wrong with it. My man is a man's man though, a spade is a spade and nobody pulls the wool over his eyes. Unfortunately for Arthur I think TH is very gullible, and doesn't question anything

He certainly questioned his own family when they tried to tell him that Arthur's treatment was not right.

 

[Lancslass]

She’d be best placed to comment and give insight into TH as a partner and a father…. It’s not beyond the realm of possibility.

Would she be allowed to?
Probably not in person, but maybe via video link - but are prisoners allowed to give evidence in a trial that isn’t theirs?

 

[Carroll520]

I think he never tried the food. Maybe Arthur had been warned by ET not to tell his dad. TH said he was always running errands for her. It's not outwith the realm of possibility she timed the running of errands with 'feeding' Arthur. I know if my kids don't like something, their dad will taste it so he can ask whats wrong with it. My man is a man's man though, a spade is a spade and nobody pulls the wool over his eyes. Unfortunately for Arthur I think TH is very gullible, and doesn't question anything

Yeah i think TH left the house just after 1pm on 16th June and ET literally made Arthur a sandwich 3 mins later. She was doing all the salt poisoning behind his back. One thing i believe TH on is he didnt know about the salt

 

[Mellowmelly]

I think he may well have been a good Dad before. I understand people can be manipulated and he lost his confidence after Olivia and during lockdown too. So was easily led etc but i just dont understand at all how he did such a complete change of character, he didnt show any feeling or care towards his own son Arthur. We are all traumatised after seeing that cctv, TH saw him like that and made him call him sir that day, made him stand against a door, pulled him by the scruff of neck, verbally abused him, didnt pick him up when he fell getting into car. Its unforgiveable, manipilated or not.

I totally agree, maybe to outside appearances he was the doting dad but beneath the surface his paternal feelings lacked any substance. Maybe he was just doing what was expected of him by his family and going through the motions of playing dad. We will never know but I saw a picture of him and Arthur together when Arthur was still a baby and he genuinely looked really happy, also I have to say Arthur was such a cute baby.

 

[ScottishSam]

He certainly questioned his own family when they tried to tell him that Arthur's treatment was not right.

I think ET started to separate him and Arthur from the family very early on. I've no doubt she was whispering in his ear that they wanted to have Arthur, that they thought he was a s*** dad. Wasn't she involved in the decision to stop Arthur seeing his maternal side of the family? She said she encouraged Arthur to see his mum in jail, then said Arthur had been abused and neglected by Olivia. Although TH, JH and the family had no concerns over Olivia's parenting. Once she drove a wedge between them she could tell him what she wanted, and there was no outside influence to give him perspective or opinion.

 

[Dotta]

I think he never tried the food. Maybe Arthur had been warned by ET not to tell his dad. TH said he was always running errands for her. It's not outwith the realm of possibility she timed the running of errands with 'feeding' Arthur. I know if my kids don't like something, their dad will taste it so he can ask whats wrong with it. My man is a man's man though, a spade is a spade and nobody pulls the wool over his eyes. Unfortunately for Arthur I think TH is very gullible, and doesn't question anything

Im glad that you sound so proud of your hubby

As for TH, I considered him a monster from the start and I havent changed my mind at all.

Im not going to fling obscenities at him - I only want a fair sentence.

Which is life sentence!!!!!!!!

 

[Carroll520]

I think it happened gradually, so the escalation of punishment didn't seem as bad to him as it would have been at the start. As for Arthur’s physical condition, if you live with someone day in, day out you don't notice the changes. If you don't see them for a few days or weeks, you do notice the change.
I absolutely believe TH was gaslighted, manipulated and encouraged by ET.

Yeah i totally believe he was manipulated to the max by her but i dont get how it got to the level it did. A big thing i would love to know and it would make my mind up on TH, was how he treated Arthur at 3am the night before he died, when Arthur was complaining of a headache and called for him to come downstairs, in those quiet moments was he nice to him, did he get him a glass of water, all things he could have done, as they were alone. We will never know how that went i suppose

 

[ScottishSam]

Yeah i totally believe he was manipulated to the max by her but i dont get how it got to the level it did. A big thing i would love to know and it would make my mind up on TH, was how he treated Arthur at 3am the night before he died, when Arthur was complaining of a headache and called for him to come downstairs, in those quiet moments was he nice to him, did he get him a glass of water, all things he could have done, as they were alone. We will never know how that went i suppose

It was mentioned in the live feed, but they didn't go into detail. I know ET was complaining because 'everyone' was asleep and Arthur would wake them up.

 

[ScottishSam]

Im glad that you sound so proud of your hubby

As for TH, I considered him a monster from the start and I havent changed my mind at all.

Im not going to fling obscenities at him - I only want a fair sentence.

Which is life sentence!!!!!!!!

I am proud of him, he can be blunt to the point of rudeness though, compared to my Scottish sensibilities!
I also want a fair sentence.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion, I'm not going to argue because you have yours and I have mine. That's what this forum is for - discussion.

 

[Carroll520]

It was mentioned in the live feed, but they didn't go into detail. I know ET was complaining because 'everyone' was asleep and Arthur would wake them up.

Oh i would really love to know. I hope he was gentle and caring with him. Prob highly unlikely, he was probably worried ET would wake up. Poor Arthur pretty much dying downstairs and shes worried about him waking people up. I dont think i have ever felt such anger towards one person in my life

 

[JayWill]

I think ET started to separate him and Arthur from the family very early on. I've no doubt she was whispering in his ear that they wanted to have Arthur, that they thought he was a s*** dad. Wasn't she involved in the decision to stop Arthur seeing his maternal side of the family? She said she encouraged Arthur to see his mum in jail, then said Arthur had been abused and neglected by Olivia. Although TH, JH and the family had no concerns over Olivia's parenting. Once she drove a wedge between them she could tell him what she wanted, and there was no outside influence to give him perspective or opinion.

Yes, I can see all that, but I cannot for the life of me understand why he used that language to and about his own son apart from awful threats of violence. He was almost boasting about giving Arthur 'the slap of his life' and worse.

 

[Dotta]

Would she be allowed to?
Probably not in person, but maybe via video link - but are prisoners allowed to give evidence in a trial that isn’t theirs?

But this witness will be for defence.
I doubt she would defend him.
I bet she hates his guts.