Found Deceased UK - Joy Morgan, 20, Hatfield, Hertfordshire, 26 Dec 2018 *arrest*

[Legally Bland]

Finally... some reporting though not much by way of info.

Student midwife 'family' - murder accused

This is an odd story from that link. I doubt a telephone call would be satisfactory as proof of life in a murder investigation.

He married his wife in 2016 but her family did not approve of the relationship, he said, and they had had to move house repeatedly.

He claimed there had been a "ritualistic killing" of a pigeon outside their home and the brakes of his car had been cut.

On another occasion, police came to their home and tried to arrest Mr Israel for his wife's "murder" when she was not at home, he told the court.

"They said her family was looking for her and I explained to the police that her family wanted to force her into an arranged marriage," Mr Israel said.

"They feared harm had come to her and they were going to arrest me," he added.

He eventually reached his wife on the phone who told officers "she was alive".

Student midwife 'family' - murder accused

 

[mrazda71]

This is an odd story from that link. I doubt a telephone call would be satisfactory as proof of life in a murder investigation.

I was thinking the same Legally ... I'm assuming that this 'pigeon death' & 'missing but alive wife' tale is his defence!

Oh how I wish they would find Joy's remains!

 

[chimpface]

Am I the only one thinking Joy and this man had become "involved" somehow ie; a bit more than friends?

Joy seen crying that day was possibly guilt? Maybe she'd told the accused they had to come clean? He then chose another way of handling the situation.

It's the only motive I can think of.

 

[mrazda71]

Am I the only one thinking Joy and this man had become "involved" somehow ie; a bit more than friends?

Joy seen crying that day was possibly guilt? Maybe she'd told the accused they had to come clean? He then chose another way of handling the situation.

It's the only motive I can think of.

I guess in an ordinary setting, there would be 'gossip' and people on social media talking about what they'd seen or heard but in this case, the 'church's will close ranks, even to protect someone accused of murder.

I wonder if the loyalty and silence from IUIC members would be the same if the victim were a man and the young woman was the accused

 

[AnnesCuthberts]

The pair watched videos, ate dinner out and discussed issues affecting their church on December 27 and 28, the jury heard.

Israel said that during their conversations, Ms Morgan revealed she was "leaving the church" that he said had been hit by "controversy".

Joy Morgan: Student missing from Ilford told man on trial for murder she wanted to leave their church

I keep looking back at that video of her last page or so and she looked so happy there. Wanting to leave the church doesn't really seem consistent.

 

[AnnesCuthberts]

Ms Morgan claimed to have "inside information of people who were planning on leaving", Israel told the court.

He said that "hundreds" of people were breaking off from the church towards the end of 2018.​

With this as well, if Joy did say she was leaving the church, why would she say she had inside information on who else was leaving? Why would she discuss who else was leaving? If, assuming that account is true, did she believe he was likely to leave the church?

 

[Legally Bland]

I really hope we get more details when this is finished.
________________

Reading Crown Court 6 T20197135
Shohfah-El Israel (Aka Ajibola Shobamimu)
Details: Trial (Part Heard) - Resume - 10:16
Trial (Part Heard) - Case adjourned until 11:15 - 10:53
Trial (Part Heard) - Resume - 11:20
Trial (Part Heard) - Summing Up - 11:50

Reading Crown Court Case Listings, Daily Hearings, Archives, Records & Status Details

 

[mrazda71]

I really hope we get more details when this is finished.
________________

Reading Crown Court 6 T20197135
Shohfah-El Israel (Aka Ajibola Shobamimu)
Details: Trial (Part Heard) - Resume - 10:16
Trial (Part Heard) - Case adjourned until 11:15 - 10:53
Trial (Part Heard) - Resume - 11:20
Trial (Part Heard) - Summing Up - 11:50

Reading Crown Court Case Listings, Daily Hearings, Archives, Records & Status Details

Yes! Right now ... we've got little to go on ... I'm usually pretty sure that it will be a guilty verdict but I really don't know with this as we've heard so little!

 

[AnnesCuthberts]

Can't seem to find anything in the news today!

 

[Jackalyn]

It is VERY hard to leave this kind of church. People who do are branded as enemies. I can imagine the secrecy thing especially if some kind of scandal was about to become public. I can also see a situation where people who wanted to leave were supporting each other. Often those who expose what is wrong are branded particular traitors even if they are right in exposing what they expose. Loyalty to the cult seems to supersede loyalty to God, the law and common human decency where cults are concerned. If you look at other cults, those who leave never have an easy time getting out and can be ongoing targets. I wonder though if this will not be a relationship thing that went wrong between Joy and the accused. However, just to throw another possibility out, could it be an organisation trying to frame one person?

 

[Jackalyn]

The pair watched videos, ate dinner out and discussed issues affecting their church on December 27 and 28, the jury heard.

Israel said that during their conversations, Ms Morgan revealed she was "leaving the church" that he said had been hit by "controversy".

Joy Morgan: Student missing from Ilford told man on trial for murder she wanted to leave their church

I keep looking back at that video of her last page or so and she looked so happy there. Wanting to leave the church doesn't really seem consistent.

I can see a situation where a person might be happy to praise God, but unhappy with the situation the church was in. In such a position you might still enjoy worship but retain reservations, or you could be in the process of making a decision, be fairly fluid in how you feel, but then at some point in the evening have your suspicions or concerns confirmed. There can also be a lot of pressure put on people to look and act happy. It could also be Joy was OK at the point the video was taken, but realised as a result of her conversations with Israel about the church and said she would leave.

 

[Jackalyn]

Am I the only one thinking Joy and this man had become "involved" somehow ie; a bit more than friends?

Joy seen crying that day was possibly guilt? Maybe she'd told the accused they had to come clean? He then chose another way of handling the situation.

It's the only motive I can think of.

Or, realising to be true to herself, Joy felt she had to leave, but this meant leaving relationships that meant a lot to her. Oh why oh why can we not have more detail or better still, televised court.

 

[Jackalyn]

Can't seem to find anything in the news today!

Joy Morgan murder trial: Cricklewood man 'took more painkillers than prescribed' due to health problems, court hears

 

[Jackalyn]

I keep wondering. The use of wigs and hair extensions etc, is common with people with hair like Joy's and can change the appearance greatly. I have several friends who look totally different to the extent I do not recognise them when they great me when they change their hair. Cults can engender such fear people hide. This cult IS scary. It dislikes outsiders. If you become an outsider, how do they treat you?

 

[mrazda71]

I keep wondering. The use of wigs and hair extensions etc, is common with people with hair like Joy's and can change the appearance greatly. I have several friends who look totally different to the extent I do not recognise them when they great me when they change their hair. Cults can engender such fear people hide. This cult IS scary. It dislikes outsiders. If you become an outsider, how do they treat you?

I hear what you're saying and agree in part. Anyone leaving a cult, be it the Jehovah's witnesses or one like IUIC will face a lot from the remaining members and might feel the need to change their appearance and hide.

However ... Do these cults allow anyone to leave easily? Does a member not turn up to church one day and everyone just pretends they never existed? OR would remaining members be flooding the 'leaver' with messages and calls?

IF Joy had decided to leave, I believe she would have contacted someone, anyone! Even just to contact police to say 'I'm alive' ...

 

[chimpface]

'No DNA link' to man accused of murdering student

 

[Jackalyn]

'No DNA link' to man accused of murdering student

This is a collection of broken thoughts at 4.am so a bit disjointed.

This case makes less and less sense.

We have a missing person.
A man who lied and seems to be the last who saw her who may have lied out of fear of what his church might say or do, but seems also to be the object of a strange hate campaign by his family. (If he is telling the truth.) Joys keys are in his car. His car was searched for but was bright red and not hidden.

Given the church culture I could understand a man innocent of murder lying about Joy being at the (Cricklewood) flat and then admitting it later.

Did they search the flat?

No body. No DNA.

The prosecution describe the accused as "dishonest and manipulative" but have not said why. (Apart from not admitting Joy was in the Cricklewood flat, which is explained by a fear of church rules.)

Yet there is an early arrest and conclusion without a body or DNA evidence that one particular individual committed murder.

Which the accused denies.

A smiling victim supposed to have been upset.

A totally weird way of dealing with the upset by the woman who comfort her.

A church who ignores her absence.

And even here it seems people fear to say much....

I am not saying Israel is innocent but so much in the UK news makes me wonder about our broken system of justice.

Joy deserves as much attention as the missing white girls. The contrast in reporting is unfair but it feels like there is such an undercurrent to all this.

One theory is that Israel is set up by whoever sacrificed a pigeon. If that is true.

 

[Jackalyn]

The Jury retired to consider the verdict. This was reported in the Kilburn times but I cannot seem to copy the link. Actually the ONLY reporting is in minor local newspapers. The jury retired over 11 hours ago. Not a nod from the BBC. Even here posts about Joy do not appear in latest posts? This girl is as valuable as any other missing person whatever her ethnicity or religious persuasion. She is as missing as the girl in Milton Keynes. The Jury gives a verdict on Thursday.

 

[Cherwell]

How can they say when the jury will give a verdict?

 

[chimpface]

How can they say when the jury will give a verdict?

That is odd. I have a feeling it will be Not Guilty either way. From the few details we have heard the prosecution doesn't sound like they have a particularly compelling case.