GUILTY UK - Karen Buckley, 24, Glasgow, Scotland, 12 April 2015 - #1

[zwiebel]

This is very sad because police don't appear to be searching for a living Karen now. It seems like a homicide investigation

 

[Clio]

Connor Gillies ‏@ConnorGillies · 1 min1 minute ago  Glasgow, Scotland
I'm at Dawsholm Park for missing #KarenBuckley hunt latest. I understand the cops leading this search will meet at 12

 

[Ironside]

This is very sad because police don't appear to be searching for a living Karen now. It seems like a homicide investigation

They are also searching Milngavie area for her. Not looking good at all.

 

[Alyce]

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/irel...-buckley-alive-1.2176630#.VS48ZOAeJiw.twitter




Police have stressed that the person they have established as the last to see Karen Buckley alive is not a suspect in their inquiry at this point in time.

The 21-year-old director of a courier firm met Ms Buckley at the Sanctuary nightclub on Dumbarton Road in Glasgow in the early hours of Sunday morning.

According to The Daily Record, the man told police Ms Buckley accompanied him to his flat at Dorchester Avenue in Kelvinside some 5km away but she left around 4am to go home.

A police officer searches the undergrowth in Dawsholm Park in Glasgow after the handbag which police believe belongs to missing student Karen Buckley was found. Photograph: PA Karen Buckley: Specialist police drafted in for park search
The brother of missing student Karen Buckley has appealed for anyone who may have seen her to contact policeKaren Buckley’s brother appeals for help in finding student

Karen Buckley (24), went missing in Glasgow after visiting a nightclub with friends on Saturday night. Karen Buckley profile: Cork student moved to Glasgow three months ago

The man told police that Ms Buckley followed him to his car parked around the corner from the nightclub and he drove her to his flat in Kelvinside, according to The Daily Record.

Det Supt Jim Kerr told a press conference at Goven Police Station on Tuesday afternoon that police were not treating the man as a suspect at this point in time.

“We have traced that man (seen with Ms Buckley on the CCTV footage outside Sanctuary), who claims he was intimate with her consensually in the early hours of Sunday.

“We only have one person’s version of events thereafter and believe she left there at 4am to go home to Hill Street. He thought she was going to get some form of transport home.

“At the end of the day, this man is a witness and is assisting in our inquiries as are other members of the public. He has been entirely co-operative with us.”

Meanwhile the man’s mother has told The Daily Record that her son is innocent and again stressed that he is not a suspect in the investigation into Ms Buckley’s disappearance.

The man’s mother told The Daily Record: “’She left his property at four o’clock in the morning and she was seen by other witnesses, not (her son’s name). So he is not a suspect.’

Wed, Apr 15, 2015, 11:11

First published:
Wed, Apr 15, 2015, 11:11




BBM

so the police are saying they have established that AP was the last person to see Karen
‘
His mother is saying Karen was seen by other people after she left his flat

cant both be right

 

[Clio]

THE search for missing Karen Buckley today widened to include the entire North West of Glasgow in a bid to uncover fresh clues.

HeraldScotland can reveal a recycling depot, which is close to where handbag was found, has been searched by officers.

Dawsholm Recycling Centre, which includes a compactor, was among the sites scoured by dozens of police.

A police insider said: "We are now widening out our search area.

"Looking at the industrial site near the park has been one line of inquiry."

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/...gow-park-in-hunt-for-missing-nurse.1429081727

 

[MissyLDT]

Sorry but are you basing how he looks from one photo? Plus girls aren't attracted to people just based on looks. There are other factors too. Personality for one?

 

[Cappuccino]

Daily Mail article showing pics of Karen, her family and one of AP. Many of the comments are saying (and rightly so) they should not be naming and picturing him if he's not a suspect. If he really hasn't done anything wrong it's a bit out of order.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...e-missing-Glasgow-student-hours-vanished.html

Its totally out of order, but the British tabloids are always like that. Remember Chris Jeffries....

 

[zwiebel]

Audio of locals here, talking about the area.

http://www.newstalk.com/Police-in-Glasgow-resume-their-search-for-Karen-Buckley

 

[zwiebel]

No matter what he looks like, I'm convinced Karen left her jacket behind because she thought she'd only be gone a short time and was going back to get it. I find it hard to accept she planned to just rush to Pacteau's flat, have quick sex and rush back. I feel she never intended to have sex with him, personally.

 

[strawb93]

I am discounting what his mother claims about there being other witnesses tbh. She is going to want to cling to any hope that her son is innocent, which he may well be, and who can blame her.

But if the police are saying they only have one persons version of events at 4am, that is a pretty clear way of saying there are no witnesses.

I also took the comments about being intimate as he believes it was consensual, just a badly worded sentence.

 

[YidArmyRach]

I couldnt work that one out either -

did he mean he * believed* he was intimate with Karen, but could not remember

or

Did he mean he believed the sex was consensual

I'm going for the second one.

In his favour, if he is admitting to having sex with her (at a time when nobody can prove that he did) then it could point to his innocence, as he is showing that he has nothing to hide by freely admitting this.

However, on a more negative basis, he could be ready with an explanation as to why his DNA might be found on Karen when/if she is located. And he didn't come forward, rather he was traced by police. However, he may not have realised the missing lady was the one he had been with.

If he is innocent, then he has found himself in a very difficult situation with being the last person to be seen with her, and being intimate with her, immediately before she goes missing. And doesn't look good for letting a lady walk home alone at 4.00am.

I'm not going to take the comment about him thinking she had arranged transport seriously, as that is something you would know and would be able to expand on - such as who was coming, where she was getting a lift from and so on.

I wonder if things are being added to the facts to put him in a better light (perhaps by his mother) which may hinder the investigation. Casual comments such as other people seeing her leave at 4.00am may be reported by the press, but the police may have heard nothing about that.

 

[jojo87]

Could she have went to get some stuff to bring back to the club and party with. Maybe she thought she was only nipping out and that's why she left her coat because she'd every intention of going back. JMO

 

[TravelingBug]

I wonder if there's a possibility AP was actually 'working' with someone else and THEY were the ones responsible for what ultimately happened to Karen? :thinking:

Perhaps someone else had a reason to want something done with her (which would make me think personal or at least someone somehow acquainted with her) and AP's role was to sort of 'deliver' her to him.

It could explain the rumor of 4 am CCTV footage showing her leaving the flat (assuming that's not confusion over the footage of her leaving earlier in the evening).

It could also explain the rumor she was seen getting into (or in) a gray car that was seen in multiple places, and that that person could have been them in the "doing something with her" stage and taking her to wherever they were going to do that (and all of that presumes gray car guy isn't AP)

And if it were someone she knew vaguely that had the actual agenda and brought AP into it, then that could explain her getting into the car (again, if the later gray car bit is accurate) since it wouldn't be a total stranger like a taxi would typically be, plus would actually be something 'AP' worked with gray car guy where his role was to actually "deliver" her into taxi driver's hands that night.

Obviously that's a lot of assumptions, but it seems like the odds of some form of that type of scenario being possible are at least significantly better than the odds of what any other real variation of a non-AP perp scenario would be.

I mean really, the guy has a one night stand with a girl and she just so happens to then mysteriously meet her demise within an extremely, extremely short window of time that supposedly elapsed between her leaving the flat safely and then just being gone that it seems some others are attempting to propose or are inferring is the case.

 

[ChuckieD]

Sorry but are you basing how he looks from one photo? Plus girls aren't attracted to people just based on looks. There are other factors too. Personality for one?

I realise how it sounds but IMO it is very plausible. In a perfect world it wouldn't be the case but we don't live in a perfect world. He does not look like the type of guy anybody would rush away from a club and friends to have a quick fling with after a chat outside. If it transpires they're friends then I could buy it though as obviously friendships often grow into more.

 

[Alyce]

No matter what he looks like, I'm convinced Karen left her jacket behind because she thought she'd only be gone a short time and was going back to get it. I find it hard to accept she planned to just rush to Pacteau's flat, have quick sex and rush back. I feel she never intended to have sex with him, personally.

Yes, that makes a lot of sense - just nipping out with him to his car to get something perhaps

 

[Cappuccino]

Could she have went to get some stuff to bring back to the club and party with. Maybe she thought she was only nipping out and that's why she left her coat because she'd every intention of going back. JMO

That sounds plausible - it would explain why she did something so out of character as tell her friends she was popping to the loo and then leave the club.

 

[Alice Bernadette]

I realise how it sounds but IMO it is very plausible. In a perfect world it wouldn't be the case but we don't live in a perfect world. He does not look like the type of guy anybody would rush away from a club and friends to have a quick fling with after a chat outside. If it transpires they're friends then I could buy it though as obviously friendships often grow into more.

I know it sounds awful to say but I have to admit I thought the same thing on seeing his picture. Very mean I know but just being honest. I do agree that it is odd that she left her coat and went off with this bloke. I feel very sad and think it is looking very grim.

 

[Cappuccino]

I know it sounds awful to say but I have to admit I thought the same thing on seeing his picture. Very mean I know but just being honest. I do agree that it is odd that she left her coat and went off with this bloke. I feel very sad and think it is looking very grim.

We might be over estimating the importance of her leaving the coat behind. I read in one report that she'd lent the jacket to her friend, so maybe she never intended to get it back till the next day anyway.

 

[YidArmyRach]

I wonder if there's a possibility AP was actually 'working' with someone else and THEY were the ones responsible for what ultimately happened to Karen? :thinking:

Perhaps someone else had a reason to want something done with her (which would make me think personal or at least someone somehow acquainted with her) and AP's role was to sort of 'deliver' her to him.

It could explain the rumor of 4 am CCTV footage showing her leaving the flat (assuming that's not confusion over the footage of her leaving earlier in the evening).

It could also explain the rumor she was seen getting into (or in) a gray car that was seen in multiple places, and that that person could have been them in the "doing something with her" stage and taking her to wherever they were going to do that (and all of that presumes gray car guy isn't AP)

And if it were someone she knew vaguely that had the actual agenda and brought AP into it, then that could explain her getting into the car (again, if the later gray car bit is accurate) since it wouldn't be a total stranger like a taxi would typically be, plus would actually be something 'AP' worked with gray car guy where his role was to actually "deliver" her into taxi driver's hands that night.

Obviously that's a lot of assumptions, but it seems like the odds of some form of that type of scenario being possible are at least significantly better than the odds of what any other real variation of a non-AP perp scenario would be.

I mean really, the guy has a one night stand with a girl and she just so happens to then mysteriously meet her demise within an extremely, extremely short window of time that supposedly elapsed between her leaving the flat safely and then just being gone that it seems some others are attempting to propose or are inferring is the case.

I'm still open to the possibility that AP wasn't involved - its a small possibility admittedly. I know that it looks bad circumstantially and with all the searches focussed on and around his flat it looks bad for him - but as that was the last place Karen was known to be, then those places would have to be thoroughly searched, just like the houses of missing people are always searched first.

It is not impossible that a predator just happened to be in the park or around that area at 4.00am. Highly unlikely, but statistically not impossible.

I think what makes this so confusing is the fact she went out with friends, left her coat with friend and told them she was going to the toilet ....... then inexplicably left the nightclub with this man (do we know where and when they first met, was it that night?) Then didn't text her friends to let them know where she was going. That screams suspicious to me - but the police say that cctv implies she willingly left the club with this man, so removes the idea she was forcibly taken away. Although that could have come later.

The lack of contact with the friends between leaving the club and apparently leaving AP's flat at 4.00am makes me think that she wasn't in a position to use her phone, as surely you would let your mates know where you are, so they don't worry and spent time searching for you - but that theory lacks some weight when it appears that she chose to leave the club without informing her friends, if what the police have said is correct. Although they may be trying to lull AP into a false sense of security, letting him think they are on his side and believe his story when they suspect otherwise.

However, I agree with others that if she thought she was just going to get something with him, then she would have looked fine on cctv when she left. She would have left willingly - its after that, that the situation could have changed. That's why I find the lack of contact with friends very telling.

Have the friends spoken in public yet? Have they said if Karen was spending a lot of time with this man in the club? Did they go searching for her when the club closed, or was it usual for her to go off on her own like that?

I think the most worrying thing is the location of the handbag. IF she had been attacked on her way home, it seems odd that her bag just happened to be dumped in the opposite direction to where she was going - placing it (and perhaps her) nearer the flat she disappeared from, that the route home.

 

[Cappuccino]

Do we know if she had her phone with her, or had she left it behind in the club?